This is a very good team

[two3zone]

i totally overvalued the first 2 wins, obviously...even though I did notice how bad the defensive rotations were even in the lafayette game...but bc that was a big win no one seemed to agree.

if they continue to give up 40 Wide open threes a game...they wont win games and they will give up a lot of offensive rebounds...3s give a lot of crazy bounces.

i still think the team will be a lot better by the end of the year...but it could get real bad...

the issues this team has might not have solutions.

this thing could go in a lot of different directions from here...

Colgate had 19 offensive boards, we all know we’re never a good rebounding team but holy hell we can’t allow that against anyone let alone Colgate.

 

[MDCuse]

i totally overvalued the first 2 wins, obviously...even though I did notice how bad the defensive rotations were even in the lafayette game...but bc that was a big win no one seemed to agree.

if they continue to give up 40 Wide open threes a game...they wont win games and they will give up a lot of offensive rebounds...3s give a lot of crazy bounces.

i still think the team will be a lot better by the end of the year...but it could get real bad...

the issues this team has might not have solutions.

this thing could go in a lot of different directions from here...

I think this team is going to be hard pressed to reach its potential. Benny Williams is so far behind where I think a lot of folks on here thought he'd be. His raw athleticism is off the charts but he has no feel for the game and a jump shot that is worse than Kadary's. They have zero bench. They're in trouble.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I think my stance bears repeating. This teams rebounding will absolutely be an issue this year. That was very evident and now it has shown to be true. They just got outrebounded 44-34 and gave up 19 Offensive Rebounds...to Colgate. I shudder at what is going to happen in ACC play. This team has a high ceiling but also a very low floor. And I think they're much closer to their floor than ceiling. This team has MAJOR holes.

It's early in the season, and this team is still learning the zone. The defense will be much better in a month.

 

[CardiacCuse]

I think this team is going to be hard pressed to reach its potential. Benny Williams is so far behind where I think a lot of folks on here thought he'd be. His raw athleticism is off the charts but he has no feel for the game and a jump shot that is worse than Kadary's. They have zero bench. They're in trouble.

Speaking of Kadary,...seems benny is trying to fit into the system but its not happening. its gotta be testing him mentally to struggle like this...

i know its been ugly so far, but i dont think he is that far away from contributing. the team needs him.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Colgate was better. Flat out.

 

[CardiacCuse]

How much did Symir and Benny score?

Symir is shooting 21% and 0% from three. He's getting 17 minutes a game, but only got 11 minutes when we were behind and needed to score. He's averaging 2 points a game in those 17 minutes. He needs to step it up.

Benny is averaging 20 minutes a game through 3 games, and got his season high 22 minutes vs. Colgate. He scored inside the arc, but only had 7 points and 1 rebound in more than half a game. In case you didn't notice, Colgate beat us on the boards. Jimmy had TEN rebounds. Do you sit him down to give Benny more time?

"Eddie Haskell" has been our best player so far. He's averaging almost 20 points per game on "only" 81% from three. So should he have been given a seat? He's only averaging 28 minutes through 3 games, and only played 34, not 38 or 40, against Colgate - where he was our leading scorer with 27 points. So, sure, sit down Eddie Haskell.

Nobody is happy about losing to Colgate. Our defense was dreadful a couple times in the last few seasons early in the year, and then got better by conference season. I'm hopeful that will happen again this year.

i get what youre saying...eddie was killing it...and when he sat down in the second half after making 2 or 3 shots i was huh??...but the roster seems designed to be shallow depth...perhaps to gaurantee his boys will play a lot regardless. perhaps to preserve precious chemistry. whatever the case, it doesnt really make a lot of sense to choose to have such a shallow roster. thats exactly the choice that was made. in the year of the portal, there were indeed options to have another deep roster. JB even said he turned down a couple players that wanted to come? why?

he chose these players. he chose this mix of players. why?

there are holes in this team. why not bring in more plugs? i know I wuldve...but im just an internet poster not a Hofer

 

[DilemaCuse]

in the year of the portal, there were indeed options to have another deep roster. JB even said he turned down a couple players that wanted to come? why?

he chose these players. he chose this mix of players. why?

there are holes in this team. why not bring in more plugs? i know I wuldve...but im just an internet poster not a Hofer

Did he really say that??? thats almost coaching malpractice to intentionally only use 10 of 13 scholarships. It sort of explains why they only recruited Goodine and Alan Griffin who they played at instead of guard while Buddy has been here.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Did he really say that??? thats almost coaching malpractice to intentionally only use 10 of 13 scholarships. It sort of explains why they only recruited Goodine and Alan Griffin who they played at instead of guard while Buddy has been here.

yep. im surprised anyone is surprised though.

last year did not go well with all the defections.

a big class is coming next year...he already knows who is playing this year.

probably doesnt wanna waste time on more players who will just leave (in his mind)

sure would be nice about now if there were indeed more options on the bench...

 

[DilemaCuse]

yep. im surprised anyone is surprised though.

last year did not go well with all the defections.

a big class is coming next year...he already knows who is playing this year.

probably doesnt wanna waste time on more players who will just leave (in his mind)

sure would be nice about now if there were indeed more options on the bench...

it just proves he isnt 100% committed to maximizing the roster like other many other coaches like Chris Beard, Oates, Eric Mussellman, Calipari, etc.

 

[rrlbees]

it just proves he isnt 100% committed to maximizing the roster like other many other coaches like Chris Beard, Oates, Eric Mussellman, Calipari, etc.

He wants to lose.

 

[DilemaCuse]

He wants to lose.

Ha, that response made me laugh

Its not that he wants to lose, its a different level of commitment towards winning

Its similar to football, SU's level of commitment compared to SEC schools

Wildhack doesnt want to lose but some might question the schools commitment to winning

 

[Gotothehole]

Ha, that response made me laugh

Its not that he wants to lose, its a different level of commitment towards winning

Its similar to football, SU's level of commitment compared to SEC schools

Wildhack doesnt want to lose but some might question the schools commitment to winning

Thats what happens when you hold on to the first chair, when its time to go

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Did he really say that??? thats almost coaching malpractice to intentionally only use 10 of 13 scholarships. It sort of explains why they only recruited Goodine and Alan Griffin who they played at instead of guard while Buddy has been here.

Depends on who wanted to come play.

 

[Trueblue25]

There’s rational, and then theres irrational.

Im not sure how you can question SU basketballs commitment to winning.

We have 50 straight winning seasons.

The team will grow from this loss. This wasnt a rag tag colgate team.

 

[RoatanCuse]

The question with this team is going to be defense. Lack of quickness and athleticism will show up in transition defense and covering the corners and behind the arc. That has not been an issue with the low level of teams we have played so far. We'll get a better idea at Atlantis tourney when we see a vast step up in the athletes we will be up against. But offensively no doubt this team is better than last year.

Colgate agrees.

 

[kcsu]

I still like this team but as pointed out before the season our weak link is our PG position. Joe and Symir both have elements that our good but neither is a true ACC level point. As in football if you dont have a good QB or point G you are going to be hard pressed to win games. Unless JB can figure out away around this weakness we will be hard pressed to beat the better teams on our schedule.
It is a shame that Kadary left as it looks like both him and JB would like a do over.
Depending on tonights game Jim might want to start giving Symir more run. You cant start your O with ten seconds left on the clock and expect to compete. Joes inability to beat his man off the dribble isnt going to change against better ACC players and i would rather role the dice with Symir as we dont need a point that can shoot we need one that can run the O.

 

[CardiacCuse]

I still like this team but as pointed out before the season our weak link is our PG position. Joe and Symir both have elements that our good but neither is a true ACC level point. As in football if you dont have a good QB or point G you are going to be hard pressed to win games. Unless JB can figure out away around this weakness we will be hard pressed to beat the better teams on our schedule.
It is a shame that Kadary left as it looks like both him and JB would like a do over.
Depending on tonights game Jim might want to start giving Symir more run. You cant start your O with ten seconds left on the clock and expect to compete. Joes inability to beat his man off the dribble isnt going to change against better ACC players and i would rather role the dice with Symir as we dont need a point that can shoot we need one that can run the O.

i agree.

speaking of running the O...this team should shoot more 3 pointers than opponents every single game.

by my count, theyve only shot more 3s than opponents 1 out of 6 games so far...which makes zero sense to me. this team is designed to be a 3 point shooting team.

a big problem is there is no one that can create shots for teammates out there most of the time.

dribble penetration is non-existant and the offense is a lot of iso ball against decent defense.

there's gotta be a way to manufacture some 3s. inside out passing and stop with the 1 on 1...JB has instructed Buddy and Swider to drive...but they only do it with their heads down and shoot every single time. its fine but not ideal.

if this team loses the 3 point battle...its not good news...the 3 pointer is the equalizer this team needs but so far isnt really using.

how can you start buddy swider and joe but not shoot more 3s than opponents?

maaybe JB is trying to get a lot of tape out there of them driving...but its not what is going to lead to wins. they need to either pass to get 3s or get offensive boards or transition or something. the ball pressure doesnt help in this regard.

have swider set pick and roll or something...theres gotta be a way to get these shooters open looks...driving isnt the answer to that.

 

[jncuse]

Don't put me down as a big Joe fan, but I don't see the biggest issue with this team / or "the" weak link being Joe's play on offence. He is certainly not a classic point guard, and when things are going bad my experience has been that fans like to go after these types of points. Every team has crappy possessions -- but when you are mediocre, in close games, these are more memorable and the non-classic PG is a marked man

We are 14th in p5 offence per KP (out of 65)
We are 62nd in p5 defence per KP

Our problem is our defence in general not a component of our offence. Now I know Joe contributes at least his fair share to our defensive woes, and is a big part of that problem. But I just have a problem labelling his offensive play (and not being a classic point) as our weakest link.

And it's not something unique to this board or this team. My favourite NBA team is FVV, and the Raptors have been similarly mediocre to the Orange. And FVV has a bit of JG in him, on offence that he is not a classic point or great at running the offence. He is however a very good defender.

Raptors are 10th out of 30 on offence
Raptors are 24th out of 30 in defence

And yet everybody's favourite whipping boy is FVV because he can't run the offence. It just seems like a very similar situation to Syracuse. The big problem is the team D, and not the PG who is not a classic PG.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Don't put me down as a big Joe fan, but I don't see the biggest issue with this team / or weak link being Joe's play on offence. He is certainly not a classic point guard, and when things are going bad my experience has been that fans like to go after these types of points. Every team has crappy possessions -- but when you are mediocre, in close games, these are more memorable and the non-classic PG is a marked man

We are 14th in p5 offence per KP (out of 65)
We are 62nd in p5 defence per KP

Our problem is our defence in general not a component of our offence. Now I know Joe contributes at least his fair share to our defensive woes, and is a big part of that problem. But I just have a problem labelling his offensive play (and not being a classic point) as our weakest link.

And it's not something unique to this board or this team. My favourite NBA team is FVV, and the Raptors have been similarly mediocre to the Orange. And FVV has a bit of JG in him, on offence that he is not a classic point or great at running the offence. He is however a very good defender.

Raptors are 10th out of 30 on offence
Raptors are 24th out of 30 in defence

And yet everybody's favourite whipping boy is FVV because he can't run the offence. It just seems like a very similar situation to Syracuse. The big problem is the team D, and not the PG who is not a classic PG.

I take offense to our defense.

And Joe will never be my favorite.

 

[CousCuse]

I take offense to our defense.

And Joe will never be my favorite.

Take that dislike you scoundrel.

 

[althea]

Don't put me down as a big Joe fan, but I don't see the biggest issue with this team / or weak link being Joe's play on offence. He is certainly not a classic point guard, and when things are going bad my experience has been that fans like to go after these types of points. Every team has crappy possessions -- but when you are mediocre, in close games, these are more memorable and the non-classic PG is a marked man

We are 14th in p5 offence per KP (out of 65)
We are 62nd in p5 defence per KP

Our problem is our defence in general not a component of our offence. Now I know Joe contributes at least his fair share to our defensive woes, and is a big part of that problem. But I just have a problem labelling his offensive play (and not being a classic point) as our weakest link.

And it's not something unique to this board or this team. My favourite NBA team is FVV, and the Raptors have been similarly mediocre to the Orange. And FVV has a bit of JG in him, on offence that he is not a classic point or great at running the offence. He is however a very good defender.

Raptors are 10th out of 30 on offence
Raptors are 24th out of 30 in defence

And yet everybody's favourite whipping boy is FVV because he can't run the offence. It just seems like a very similar situation to Syracuse. The big problem is the team D, and not the PG who is not a classic PG.

IMO our biggest defensive woes are at the forward position - In the past we have been fortunate to have some wings that could cover a lot of ground - Kris Joseph, CJ Fair etc. - Swider and JB are just not the same kind of player. Plus they are still learning this system, which doesn't help.

 

[Scooch]

I respect that this thread was bumped by the OP.

I'm in hysterics, but I respect it.

 

[jncuse]

I respect that this thread was bumped by the OP.

I'm in hysterics, but I respect it.

It's probably a lot easier to bump your post when 27 others people liked it, and it was not an obnoxious over the top post. Still some respect from me to bump it though.

But typically the posts made by others that get bumped are either over the top or have some condescending tone to them when posted - so KCSU is safe in that regard as his was neither.

 

[OrangeDW]

I take offense to our defense.

And Joe will never be my favorite.

Joe would probably be my favorite….if he was the 3rd guard.

I love his moxie and potential to get hot and make stupid shots….as a 3rd guard that stuff is awesome. It’s fun. I freakin loved Eddie House. Come in and spark us and fill it up and talk your crap and set the Dome on fire. That’s what his role would be if he was here pre-2015.

He’s a decent ball handler and passer too, and can even anticipate and get some steals - a skill that is amplified when your minutes are capped and you can just come in and empty the tank.

But full time 30+mpg PG in the ACC?? For 4 years???!!! Cmon. And this is not his fault at all. Kid is giving it his all and he’s a good player. We need to get some studs in here.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Don't put me down as a big Joe fan, but I don't see the biggest issue with this team / or "the" weak link being Joe's play on offence. He is certainly not a classic point guard, and when things are going bad my experience has been that fans like to go after these types of points. Every team has crappy possessions -- but when you are mediocre, in close games, these are more memorable and the non-classic PG is a marked man

We are 14th in p5 offence per KP (out of 65)
We are 62nd in p5 defence per KP

Our problem is our defence in general not a component of our offence. Now I know Joe contributes at least his fair share to our defensive woes, and is a big part of that problem. But I just have a problem labelling his offensive play (and not being a classic point) as our weakest link.

And it's not something unique to this board or this team. My favourite NBA team is FVV, and the Raptors have been similarly mediocre to the Orange. And FVV has a bit of JG in him, on offence that he is not a classic point or great at running the offence. He is however a very good defender.

Raptors are 10th out of 30 on offence
Raptors are 24th out of 30 in defence

And yet everybody's favourite whipping boy is FVV because he can't run the offence. It just seems like a very similar situation to Syracuse. The big problem is the team D, and not the PG who is not a classic PG.

well yeah if you compare which problem is worse...yeah the defense is worse...and Joe is a huge part of that.

the biggest problem with the offense, though, is lack of a PG, imo...so Joe there too.

scoring in the 50s and 60s vs vcu and auburn shows the offense is indeed a problem, btw.