ticket pricing thread

[HRE Otto IV]

Jake had a great post in the Viking Stadium thread

I actually think that plan is insane and would cost SU a ton of money. People would drop their FB tickets or move to a cheaper section. So SU shouldn't gain more money in FB. Plus with the reduced money for BBall SU comes away a big loser.

The best solution is to put in real seating in the preferred areas which will reduce capacity and not make it look so bad. It also creates demand having real seats vs benches, while reducing supply.

The non preferred sections should all have different price points. They have a few now but not enough.

There is the possibility of consolidating the preferred sections. So some of the D become regular seats. Some of the C become D. Some of the B become C. Some of the A become B. The problem with that is having no incentive to move. If you are currently in A and your seats become B, why would would move a little closer to mid field to pay A prices when you can keep your seat at a reduced B price? In which case SU loses money.

Which bring sup another point, there is no benefit (especially if you have BBall) to being A vs B vs C vs D. There should be extra incentive to be in each.

 

[Millhouse]

just confirming - so if you get great basketball season tix, you pay 20-45 more for the right to buy football season tickets for about 205? wow

if those seats were used by basketball fans and would go unused by non basketball fans, i can see their logic

scrap the donation and just sell the tickets for 205. the basketball people can still get their seats and people will move out of the upper deck to better seats. on a good day i spend 45 on concessions in the first quarter. then give away the upper deckers to whoever.

there can't be that many $600 donations, look at the seats! toss out donations, you won't need many more upgrades from end zoners to make it worth it. hell, i'd upgrade just to contribute to it looking better on tv. i'm not paying 800 for those seats though

 

[HRE Otto IV]

just confirming - so if you get great basketball season tix, you pay 20-45 more for the right to buy football season tickets for about 205? wow

if those seats were used by basketball fans and would go unused by non basketball fans, i can see their logic

scrap the donation and just sell the tickets for 205. the basketball people can still get their seats and people will move out of the upper deck to better seats. on a good day i spend 45 on concessions in the first quarter. then give away the upper deckers to whoever.

The big question IMO is how many people have FB only donations? If it isn't a significant number, then they should just do away with B, C, D level seats and reduce the number of A level seats.

But if there are 1000s of FB only people, then getting rid of donations entirely could be costing $500+ per seat.

 

[Millhouse]

The big question IMO is how many people have FB only donations? If it isn't a significant number, then they should just do away with B, C, D level seats and reduce the number of A level seats.

But if there are 1000s of FB only people, then getting rid of donations entirely could be costing $500+ per seat.

i doubt there are thousands of fb only people who pony up and then don't go

maybe there are basketball people who do (they're already spending so much , what's a couple hundred more to them) who no show

 

[CuseGoose]

There is no benefit to the donation. No sideline passes, no met life ticket reductions, nothing. The donation is basically a college PSL. A right to buy the seat.

I get a pocket planner every year that goes in the recycling bin! Thats an awesome benefit!

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Another thing they should do is price games differently. My face value for every ticket is $35. Why?

The prices should be:

FSU $50
Louisville $40
VA Tech $40
NC State $30
USF $30
Colgate $20

That is still the same price for the STH and allows for a reduced price of individual game tickets. Why have Colgate which has little demand at the same price as FSU which will have the highest demand (well maybe not anymore but preseason yes). If the STH's Colgate ticket says $35 on it then you have to price the individual game at $35. Good luck with that.

 

[dooey139]

Another thing they should do is price games differently. My face value for every ticket is $35. Why?

The prices should be:

FSU $50
Louisville $40
VA Tech $40
NC State $30
USF $30
Colgate $20

That is still the same price for the STH and allows for a reduced price of individual game tickets. Why have Colgate which has little demand at the same price as FSU which will have the highest demand (well maybe not anymore but preseason yes). If the STH's Colgate ticket says $35 on it then you have to price the individual game at $35. Good luck with that.

I do believe there is variable pricing in effect. I had to buy an extra ticket in my section for LVille and Colgate and it was more for Louisville vs Colgate.

 

[upperdeck]

why do you need to price a ticket at face value?

most every place the season tickets all have the same value even though the demand is far different, it saves on printing cost i suspect.

even if Colgate said $15 you still probably had to sell it for $5 to sell it

 

[Chip]

Another thing they should do is price games differently. My face value for every ticket is $35. Why?

The prices should be:

FSU $50
Louisville $40
VA Tech $40
NC State $30
USF $30
Colgate $20

That is still the same price for the STH and allows for a reduced price of individual game tickets. Why have Colgate which has little demand at the same price as FSU which will have the highest demand (well maybe not anymore but preseason yes). If the STH's Colgate ticket says $35 on it then you have to price the individual game at $35. Good luck with that.

Actually, the way we looked against Louisville, you might have to flip it. Charge a premium for the Colgate and NC State games because we have the best shot at winning. Lower the ticket prices from there.

Louisville should have been everyone gets in free night.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

why do you need to price a ticket at face value?

most every place the season tickets all have the same value even though the demand is far different, it saves on printing cost i suspect.

even if Colgate said $15 you still probably had to sell it for $5 to sell it

Face on the STH is the starting point. The individual game tickets aren't being sold for under the STH amount. So the Colgate game can only be $35 and up. That is an issue. For FSU you most likely will go above $35 for individual games since they are a better draw. The issue isn't so much the good games (FSU, Louisville, VA Tech) as those you can price above STH prices. The issue is the bad games being priced at too high a starting price point. $35 for Colgate, NC State, and USF is already too expensive.

 

[Millhouse]

Actually, the way we looked against Louisville, you might have to flip it. Charge a premium for the Colgate and NC State games because we have the best shot at winning. Lower the ticket prices from there.

Louisville should have been everyone gets in free night.

you'd lose tens of dollars from the louisville contigent

 

[690West]

you'd lose tens of dollars from the louisville contigent

You accidentally put an "s" at the end of ten.

 

[Chip]

you'd lose tens of dollars from the louisville contigent

If you had a nickel for every away fan that has come to the Dome in the first 3 games this year, you'd have about 47 nickels.

 

[rrlbees]

I do believe there is variable pricing in effect. I had to buy an extra ticket in my section for LVille and Colgate and it was more for Louisville vs Colgate.

I think the Colgate game was cheaper but all the rest were $35 in the ticket itself. I don't have my Colgate stub but u think it was like $25.

 

[Chris02M]

my colgate ticket was $15 with the rest all the same at $22 a piece

 

[Jake]

Fwiw. From the SU website, I tried to determine how many seats/ season tickets are available for each donation level.

FB A = 4,050
FB B = 3,250
FB C = 2,850
FB D = 2,600
Students = 2,600 (designated)
Upper sides = 16,000
Corners = 9,100
End zone = 7,200 ($125)


I've determined that sell outs of every season ticket and every game would generate about $12M for a 6 game season at the current pricing levels pricing every ticket at $35 a seat.

To really figure this out you need to know the # of FB only, BB only and combined season ticket holders.

I ballparked available hoops season tickets @

BB A = 6,000 seats
BB B = 2,000 seats
BB C = 2,000 seats
BB D = 3,000 seats

I estimated 7,500 BB only season tickets, 7,500 FB only and 7,500 dual tickets. (This could be waaaay off).

The current structure is

. FB only BB only. Both
A level $650. $820. $865
B level. 425. 610. 640
C level. 270. 380. 395
D level. 190. 260. 295


Based on the breakdown assumptions I made above, you could generate the exact same revenue with the following price structure.

. FB only. BB only. Both
A level. $350. $515. $865
B level. 225. 415. 640
C level. 145. 250. 395
D level. 110. 185. 295

Now, I've made some large assumptions and this is a very rough outline, but this basic concept can be tweaked to the actual breakdown of season tickets. You can also tweak this to ensure that there are safeguard to prevent a large dump of season tickets.

I also think you would need to combine this with a shrinking of the end zone cheap seats and increase the number of price breaks.

It's just one idea of a plethora of potential adjustments...

 

[Millhouse]

Fwiw. From the SU website, I tried to determine how many seats/ season tickets are available for each donation level.

FB A = 4,050
FB B = 3,250
FB C = 2,850
FB D = 2,600
Students = 2,600 (designated)
Upper sides = 16,000
Corners = 9,100
End zone = 7,200 ($125)


I've determined that sell outs of every season ticket and every game would generate about $12M for a 6 game season at the current pricing levels pricing every ticket at $35 a seat.

To really figure this out you need to know the # of FB only, BB only and combined season ticket holders.

I ballparked available hoops season tickets @

BB A = 6,000 seats
BB B = 2,000 seats
BB C = 2,000 seats
BB D = 3,000 seats

I estimated 7,500 BB only season tickets, 7,500 FB only and 7,500 dual tickets. (This could be waaaay off).

The current structure is

. FB only BB only. Both
A level $650. $820. $865
B level. 425. 610. 640
C level. 270. 380. 395
D level. 190. 260. 295


Based on the breakdown assumptions I made above, you could generate the exact same revenue with the following price structure.

. FB only. BB only. Both
A level. $350. $515. $865
B level. 225. 415. 640
C level. 145. 250. 395
D level. 110. 185. 295

Now, I've made some large assumptions and this is a very rough outline, but this basic concept can be tweaked to the actual breakdown of season tickets. You can also tweak this to ensure that there are safeguard to prevent a large dump of season tickets.

I also think you would need to combine this with a shrinking of the end zone cheap seats and increase the number of price breaks.

It's just one idea of a plethora of potential adjustments...

wild guess is that there are more dual tickets than football only - i gotta figure that we'd have better attendance from football only (more no-shows among the dual crowd and there are a lot of no-shows, it appears)

 

[SU2NASA]

Unless I'm reading their chart wrong, their tix are generally more expensive than SU's. Twice as much in some areas.

I'm talking the highest priced seats specifically. That anyone would pay $180 for an SU football ticket blows my mind.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Fwiw. From the SU website, I tried to determine how many seats/ season tickets are available for each donation level.

FB A = 4,050
FB B = 3,250
FB C = 2,850
FB D = 2,600
Students = 2,600 (designated)
Upper sides = 16,000
Corners = 9,100
End zone = 7,200 ($125)


I've determined that sell outs of every season ticket and every game would generate about $12M for a 6 game season at the current pricing levels pricing every ticket at $35 a seat.

To really figure this out you need to know the # of FB only, BB only and combined season ticket holders.

I ballparked available hoops season tickets @

BB A = 6,000 seats
BB B = 2,000 seats
BB C = 2,000 seats
BB D = 3,000 seats

I estimated 7,500 BB only season tickets, 7,500 FB only and 7,500 dual tickets. (This could be waaaay off).

The current structure is

. FB only BB only. Both
A level $650. $820. $865
B level. 425. 610. 640
C level. 270. 380. 395
D level. 190. 260. 295


Based on the breakdown assumptions I made above, you could generate the exact same revenue with the following price structure.

. FB only. BB only. Both
A level. $350. $515. $865
B level. 225. 415. 640
C level. 145. 250. 395
D level. 110. 185. 295

Now, I've made some large assumptions and this is a very rough outline, but this basic concept can be tweeted to the actual breakdown of season tickets. You can also tweak this to ensure that there are safeguard to prevent a large dump of season tickets.

I also think you would need to combine this with a shrinking of the end zone cheap seats and increase the number of price breaks.

It's just one idea of a plethora of potential adjustments...

Are you assuming a near sell out in FB? That isn't happening with this product even if you "fix" the ticket prices to the optimal price whatever that may be.

I would think that in reality there would be more BBall only preferred than BBall/FB combos, which would be more than FB only preferred. So if true that would be a major issue in the preferred sections.

Now just using A section how do you generate the same revenue?

Let's say there are 500 A level BBall only STHs. They are going from paying $820 each ($410k total) to $515 each ($257.5k total). How in the heck would SU recover that missing $152.5k in BBall revenue?

Next let's look at the BBall/FB A level STHs. People who have FB tix aren't going because of the product and are eating the ticket. They don't care to show up. They keep their tickets for two reasons: 1. they are cheap and 2. if SU gets good again they have good seats. If you increase the cost of the FB tickets then it is more likely that those people give up their FB tickets than show up to games. Currently this is what they see:

For $45 more in donation and $205 tickets you can get six A level game tickets. So you can go to the 2 big games for the equivalent of $125 each (cheaper than the current single game price of $142.50) and the 4 games you miss are "free." No big deal not going. Also if/when SU gets good again at FB you are guaranteed a seat.

Now if you use your price structure above:

For $350 more in donation and $205 tickets you get six A level game tickets. So if you only go to the 2 big games you are essentially paying $277.50 per game. At that point the ticket isn't worth it. Wouldn't that person then become BBall only and buy the two single game tickets at $92.50 each (new price of single game ticket)? That way they save $370 in football tickets on the year. You lose your guarantee at seating if SU is good again but an extra $370 a year isn't worth the investment. Also now since the BBall price has gone down from $820 to $515 they are saving more money in BBall as well. That person would be going to all the BBall games and 2 football games just like before but pay $675 less to do so. In which case how does SU recover the $675 per seat they just lost?

Finally you have the FB only A level STHs. They are going from $650 to $35o per seat. If there are 250 FB onlies, SU loses $75k in football revenue on the year. How does that get recovered?

Your "solution" woudl bring in less revenue in both FB and basketball. It wouldn't fix the "no show" problem. It may help in overall FB attendance but it would be at way too high a cost.

 

[Millhouse]

Are you assuming a near sell out in FB? That isn't happening with this product even if you "fix" the ticket prices to the optimal price whatever that may be.

I would think that in reality there would be more BBall only preferred than BBall/FB combos, which would be more than FB only preferred. So if true that would be a major issue in the preferred sections.

Now just using A section how do you generate the same revenue?

Let's say there are 500 A level BBall only STHs. They are going from paying $820 each ($410k total) to $515 each ($257.5k total). How in the heck would SU recover that missing $152.5k in BBall revenue?

Next let's look at the BBall/FB A level STHs. People who have FB tix aren't going because of the product and are eating the ticket. They don't care to show up. They keep their tickets for two reasons: 1. they are cheap and 2. if SU gets good again they have good seats. If you increase the cost of the FB tickets then it is more likely that those people give up their FB tickets than show up to games. Currently this is what they see:

For $45 more in donation and $205 tickets you can get six A level game tickets. So you can go to the 2 big games for the equivalent of $125 each (cheaper than the current single game price of $142.50) and the 4 games you miss are "free." No big deal not going. Also if/when SU gets good again at FB you are guaranteed a seat.

Now if you use your price structure above:

For $350 more in donation and $205 tickets you get six A level game tickets. So if you only go to the 2 big games you are essentially paying $277.50 per game. At that point the ticket isn't worth it. Wouldn't that person then become BBall only and buy the two single game tickets at $92.50 each (new price of single game ticket)? That way they save $370 in football tickets on the year. You lose your guarantee at seating if SU is good again but an extra $370 a year isn't worth the investment. Also now since the BBall price has gone down from $820 to $515 they are saving more money in BBall as well. That person would be going to all the BBall games and 2 football games just like before but pay $675 less to do so. In which case how does SU recover the $675 per seat they just lost?

Finally you have the FB only A level STHs. They are going from $650 to $35o per seat. If there are 250 FB onlies, SU loses $75k in football revenue on the year. How does that get recovered?

Your "solution" woudl bring in less revenue in both FB and basketball. It wouldn't fix the "no show" problem. It may help in overall FB attendance but it would be at way too high a cost.

obviously his numbers would change if the breakdown was different, he said that in his post. the logic is what's important, the numbers just come out to what they are if the assumptions change

 

[UnknownOrange]

Ah preferred seating..

 

[Jake]

As I said, its weighted dependent on the breakdown of FB only, Bb only and Boths.

So that's accounted for depending on where the pricing structure falls. Essentially it's just a reassignment of the same revenue.

The risk is it incentivized people to own just one set of tickets...and if you discover that 90% of your season ticket holders own both, you might initially lose a bunch, but if you make it more enticing to own good seats, for just a few dollars more than endzone seats, you get a better outcome.

It's really difficult not knowing the breakdown.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

obviously his numbers would change if the breakdown was different, he said that in his post. the logic is what's important, the numbers just come out to what they are if the assumptions change

I am not seeing the logic though. How does reducing the donation for BBall bring in close to the same amount? How does reducing the donation for FB bring is close to the same amount. While the combo is the same, it makes FB tix more expensive. If you are a BBall guy then paying an extra $45 for A level is spare change so why not get them. However $350 is a lot of money, so you likely pass on FB tix entirely.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

So that's accounted for depending on where the pricing structure falls. Essentially it's just a reassignment of the same revenue.

How?

Let's use your assumption that 90% of FB A level people are also BBall people.

So for FB A level (assuming all tickets sold) has 3645 FB/Ball and 405 FB only. The FB onlies are paying $300 less each so SU loses $121500 in football revenue. The 3645 are paying the same so no difference.

The BBall onlies will be 6000 A level seats minus 3645 FB/BBall which comes out to 2355 STHs. They are going from $820 to $515 so SU loses $718,275 in BBall revenue.

Just using A level alone your plan costs $839,775 in total revenue. And that is assuming that you don't lose a single BBall/FB combo STH.

 

[Millhouse]

I am not seeing the logic though. How does reducing the donation for BBall bring in close to the same amount? How does reducing the donation for FB bring is close to the same amount. While the combo is the same, it makes FB tix more expensive. If you are a BBall guy then paying an extra $45 for A level is spare change so why not get them. However $350 is a lot of money, so you likely pass on FB tix entirely.

because bball people aren't going to the games. the why not crowd are presumably no shows. get people in those seats. who cares about 45 bucks. people in seats will buy beer and make tv look less stupid