Tyus to test draft... without agent ...

[jncuse]

About 10 years ago, when analytics started ramping up, statistical analysis showed that one of the largest indicators of success when comparing top prospects was steal %. (This is not to say that you took the a non prospect with a good steal %... but if you were comparing two good prospects steal % was a huge indicator who would do better).

One of the advantages for Syracuse guards is that the Syracuse 2-3 defence creates more steals for guards than other defences. Now whether those into analytics capture that is unknown. But I often wonder if it was a reason why Dion Waiters was drafted quite high.

 

[Knicks411]

About 10 years ago, when analytics started ramping up, statistical analysis showed that one of the largest indicators of success when comparing top prospects was steal %. (This is not to say that you took the a non prospect with a good steal %... but if you were comparing two good prospects steal % was a huge indicator who would do better).

One of the advantages for Syracuse guards is that the Syracuse 2-3 defence creates more steals for guards than other defences. Now whether those into analytics capture that is unknown. But I often wonder if it was a reason why Dion Waiters was drafted quite high.

I would bet almost anything playing the zone inflates the steal% numbers, but i don't want to do any research. This is a really good point though, our guards always have good steal numbers, and I've seen the same thing about steal (block rates too I think) as indicators for success

 

[jncuse]

Being a good and committed student is not easy. Especially not in the NCAA, where the system is more concerned about getting you through the "school process" with the least distraction to your basketball efforts as possible. This is a system that will get you through school... it is not a system that allows you to fully seize and dive into the academic experience -- or at least not easily.

When you are very serious about excelling in academics for some it is a big mental toll. It is on their mind all the time, and they feel the need to commit to it harder. Not all good or great students have this difficulty, but many do.

Battle wants to be a good student. He wants to excel in academics -- and he has. And he has a desire to excel as a basketball player. But excelling in both takes quite a bit of time and effort. Overcoming this distraction for many players is quite easy... they embrace the model of putting limited effort into academics and focusing on basketball.

But for Tyus it may not be as easy as that -- he probably feels he can't put all the time he wants into academics and into growing as a basketball player. Essentially he feels pressure to pick one over the other if he wants to take advantage of his basketball talents. So to grow as a basketball player he may feel the need to distance himself from academic pursuits. He can always come back and focus on his academic dream fully if his basketball dream fails.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Cuse bench had a similar reaction on one of Donovan Mitchell’s many ridiculous dunks against us.


Mitchell is a perfect example of how drafting is such an inexact science. Just one year after he got drafted, you can argue that he should’ve been the first pick.

Oh god. Jesus Mitchell went off there, yep. Thing is with Mitchell, while I didn’t think he would be ROY contender, I knew he would be a good player in the league. His defense was always tenacious playing in Pitino’s system. Obviously a freak athlete. But when he showed he could be a very good PG and made his shooting solid then it was a wrap.

 

[SoBeCuse]

About 10 years ago, when analytics started ramping up, statistical analysis showed that one of the largest indicators of success when comparing top prospects was steal %. (This is not to say that you took the a non prospect with a good steal %... but if you were comparing two good prospects steal % was a huge indicator who would do better).

One of the advantages for Syracuse guards is that the Syracuse 2-3 defence creates more steals for guards than other defences. Now whether those into analytics capture that is unknown. But I often wonder if it was a reason why Dion Waiters was drafted quite high.

Could be re: Waiters but I also remember Chad Ford talking about how Waiters was destroying people at the Combine or in the 3 on 3 workouts when they visit teams.

 

[SoBeCuse]

Re: defense. I think length is one thing but you have to show quick feet and obviously the desire to play good M2M. Length and athleticism is one thing but some of these long striders without quick feet/quick change of direction ability/quick bursts probably suffer in M2M.

Frank Howard can get in passing lanes and make some plays there but can anybody see him doing remotely well in agility drills at the Combine? Any sprints? No way.

 

[jdubs30]

Re: defense. I think length is one thing but you have to show quick feet and obviously the desire to play good M2M. Length and athleticism is one thing but some of these long striders without quick feet/quick change of direction ability/quick bursts probably suffer in M2M.

Frank Howard can get in passing lanes and make some plays there but can anybody see him doing remotely well in agility drills at the Combine? Any sprints? No way.

Not quite sure why you're bringing up Frank. jn's point was probably in the tie-breaking scenario they look at steal percentage. Regardless, I think Frank would probably measure better in the hand size, wing span, etc. than Tyus. But I agree with you in the actual athletic drills I would assume Tyus blows him away

 

[SoBeCuse]

Not quite sure why you're bringing up Frank. jn's point was probably in the tie-breaking scenario they look at steal percentage. Regardless, I think Frank would probably measure better in the hand size, wing span, etc. than Tyus. But I agree with you in the actual athletic drills I would assume Tyus blows him away

I brought him up because he is a good zone defender. Really good in passing lanes and sometimes anticipating passes. But, I think he would struggle in M2M and his testing numbers would be really rough. Wingspan and hand-size, excluded, like you said.

 

[JarHeadJim]

Any word on how Tyus did today?

 

[rrlbees]

Any word on how Tyus did today?

don't think there is anymore scrimmaging. think today was just more interviews.

 

[JazzNC]

I haven't seen too much of the combine footage. What I'm reading is that Tyus hasn't done as well as hoped. I wish him well, and hope he can have a prosperous career. Great kid, and a high character guy too. That hitch in his shot is an issue, and during this season he pushed off an awful lot to create space for himself. I actually think he's a better defensive player than he is an offensive player. I think he's in a tough spot. If he keeps his name in the draft he's likely a mid 2nd rounder. If he returns to Syracuse, and his game is not vastly improved, he'd be another year older, and less likely to get drafted in 2019. Selfishly I'd love to have him back in Syracuse next year, but I want what's best for him too. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

 

[br801]

Being a good and committed student is not easy. Especially not in the NCAA, where the system is more concerned about getting you through the "school process" with at least as distraction as possible. This is a system that will get you through school... it is not a system that allows you to fully seize and dive into the academic experience... or at least not easily.

When you are very serious about excelling in academics for some it is a big mental toll. It is on their mind all the time, and you feel the need to commit to it harder... not all good or great students have this difficulty, but many do.

Battle wants to be a good student. He wants to excel in academics... and he has. And he has a desire to excel as a basketball player. But excelling in both takes quite a bit of time. Overcoming this distraction for many players is quite easy... they embrace model of putting of somewhat limited effort into academics and focusing on basketball.

But for Tyus it is not easy at that -- he probably feels he can't put all the time he wants into academics and into growing as a basketball player. So to grow as a basketball player he may feel the need to distance himself from academic pursuits. He can always come back and focus on his academic dream fully if his basketball dream fails.

That's an interesting take, and unlike anything I have read here before. Good post.

 

[jncuse]

That's an interesting take, and unlike anything I have read here before. Good post.

Thank you. Tyus is an interesting case, because typically with a very good student athlete you would suspect the desire would be to come back if you are not a first rounder. He seems like a mature kid, and I was trying to think somewhat out of the box to make sense of where his mind could be at.

Trying to rationalize his decision beyond first round = good, and second round = bad.

But it is purely a speculative post, and it may not even be a consideration for him.

 

[SoBeCuse]

I haven't seen too much of the combine footage. What I'm reading is that Tyus hasn't done as well as hoped. I wish him well, and hope he can have a prosperous career. Great kid, and a high character guy too. That hitch in his shot is an issue, and during this season he pushed off an awful lot to create space for himself. I actually think he's a better defensive player than he is an offensive player. I think he's in a tough spot. If he keeps his name in the draft he's likely a mid 2nd rounder. If he returns to Syracuse, and his game is not vastly improved, he'd be another year older, and less likely to get drafted in 2019. Selfishly I'd love to have him back in Syracuse next year, but I want what's best for him too. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.

I could see him being a better defensive player as well. He did push off an awful lot looking for separation. A lot of that was due to our offense being so piss poor that all he was doing often is ISO bailout crap anyways. But, like you said, he’s a terrific and high character kid. Gotta support him of course.

 

[IthacaMatt]

too bad they keep the kids on the same teams. he's on a horrible team. got crushed yesterday, getting crushed again today. no pg's and no rebounders. his first 5 min rotation he was 0-1 with a block.

Well, I think may want to see whether Tyus can play some PG.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Whose stock rose or fell after the NBA draft combine?

They have tyus falling outside top 40

That was rough.

 

[kcsu]

I dont see him coming back. My guess is he ends up mid second round.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Re: defense. I think length is one thing but you have to show quick feet and obviously the desire to play good M2M. Length and athleticism is one thing but some of these long striders without quick feet/quick change of direction ability/quick bursts probably suffer in M2M.

Frank Howard can get in passing lanes and make some plays there but can anybody see him doing remotely well in agility drills at the Combine? Any sprints? No way.

I think Tyus did pretty well defensively. I think the issue is that he didn't blend in well offensively on a team of 3 guards who all wanted the ball. Nobody set each other up, and he kind of faded into the background.

 

[rrlbees]

Well, I think may want to see whether Tyus can play some PG.

He played a few possessions at PG both games. He’s not a PG.

 

[rrlbees]

I think Tyus did pretty well defensively. I think the issue is that he didn't blend in well offensively on a team of 3 guards who all wanted the ball. Nobody set each other up, and he kind of faded into the background.

I don’t know what the faded into the background statement even means. A journalist used it too. The 2nd game he led the team in scoring. And that was without jacking up ridiculous shots like others were doing.

 

[AZOrange]

I dont see him coming back. My guess is he ends up mid second round.

Not coming back

 

[IthacaMatt]

He played a few possessions at PG both games. He’s not a PG.

Neither was Dion, but he could create for other people. In today's NBA, they want to see versatility.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don’t know what the faded into the background statement even means. A journalist used it too. The 2nd game he led the team in scoring. And that was without jacking up ridiculous shots like others were doing.

Well, that's good then. These NBA guys are not listening to what some journalist says.
The question is whether it's the journalist's own opinion, or what he's hearing said around him by NBA guys.
He's probably gone, so I hope he does well. That's all you can hope for. But we've had better guys not make it.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don’t know what the faded into the background statement even means. A journalist used it too. The 2nd game he led the team in scoring. And that was without jacking up ridiculous shots like others were doing.

Going stretches without getting touches. That's what it means.
Sometimes people coast through stretches of games while other guys make plays.

 

[KaiserUEO]

Does the DLeague have a DLeague??

If so, that’s where Battle is going.