UCLA basketball players arrested in China

[Ozcuse]

Steeling is against the law everywhere. It's something you instinctively know is wrong from the time you understand the concept of possessions. Sure the penalties vary but it's still a crime and the surely knew better.

We hosted a French foreign exchange student for a month back when I was in high school. He and his French buddies who stayed with other local families would steal crap from every store they could. One time we took them to Carousel Mall and I have no idea how these kids didn’t get caught they were so brazen about it. It was stupid stuff too, a bunch of crap from the Disney Store and Hot Topic.

Not sure if it was a cultural thing, disrespect for the US or they just didn’t think they could get in trouble in a foreign country.

 

[Frozen]

Steeling is against the law everywhere. .

 

[Zelda Zonk]

If true, I don't understand how they could possibly think they could get away with this. A swarm of 'giant black teenagers' in a Vuitton store isn't going to be under tremendous surveillance scrutiny?

And, okay, maybe you get ONE knucklehead (MCW), thinking he can outsmart security measures, but how do three or more people collude in such stupidity? How is it possible that, when formulating this Master Plan, not one of the scheme's invitees didn't say, "hmmm, this might not work."

I admit, i did a couple of 'not good' things at that age. One out of necessity, and one a little less so. So, i get the immaturity thing. But, both 'solo.' I don't get the whole 'groupthink' thing. I guess it's just probably true that a LOT of people do a lot of stupid things, and it's just a matter of a small percentage of them getting caught. And when you're in the spotlight, it's both an incentive for the catchers to catch you, and for the media to make it a major deal. That's why it's so much of a shock when someone in the spotlight does something. They should have realized the consequences are infinitely greater.

 

[Briancuse]

Lavar better shut up. China is not something LaVar can be crazy about.
These kids can held 30+ days before being in front of a judge.

The players better pray Trump and the US consultant can get these kids out.

If your looking for Trump to bail you out, your in trouble.

 

[Alsacs]

If your looking for Trump to bail you out, your in trouble.

On this one a Presidential visit to China at the same time of this incident helps these players a lot.
The Chinese government will want thenstory out of the news and will be a lot more lenient most likely because Trump for the luck is visiting the country.

 

[PeteCalvin]

If true, I don't understand how they could possibly think they could get away with this. A swarm of 'giant black teenagers' in a Vuitton store isn't going to be under tremendous surveillance scrutiny?

And, okay, maybe you get ONE knucklehead (MCW), thinking he can outsmart security measures, but how do three or more people collude in such stupidity? How is it possible that, when formulating this Master Plan, not one of the scheme's invitees didn't say, "hmmm, this might not work."

I admit, i did a couple of 'not good' things at that age. One out of necessity, and one a little less so. So, i get the immaturity thing. But, both 'solo.' I don't get the whole 'groupthink' thing. I guess it's just probably true that a LOT of people do a lot of stupid things, and it's just a matter of a small percentage of them getting caught. And when you're in the spotlight, it's both an incentive for the catchers to catch you, and for the media to make it a major deal. That's why it's so much of a shock when someone in the spotlight does something. They should have realized the consequences are infinitely greater.

The "group think" tactics have been rampant in local malls here in CNY, and the kids who do it are brazen about it. They know the store employees aren't allowed to pursue or engage. The old maternity store near Kaufmann's at Carousel was a very popular one with the underage pregnancy crowd. The employees would see a group of girls walk in and would know something was up. Two or three were decoys to distract the employees, sometimes drawing them into arguments about profiling. Meanwhile, the other two girls would load up and make a bee line to the mall exit across the way. When my wife was pregnant we used to shop there, and one time we got there right after a theft. The employees just started telling us their horror stories and how they are helpless to do anything. They can be fired for taking action. And by the time mall security gets there, the thieves are long gone.

There was a known group that continually hit Great Northern Mall. A friend of ours worked in one of the trendy children's clothing stores that was a favorite of the "gang". Even if they got caught in the parking lot, they would come back the next week and try again. The employees at the stores were always scared and frustrated. They just had to stand there and watch the kids steal, laugh at them, and leave.

 

[pfister1]

This really puts stuff in perspective for me. I was feeling sorry for myself after watching the first half of the last game. It could be worse though, our players could be in a Chinese prison.

Just wait, by the mid point of the season people may be wishing some of our players were in a Chinese prison.

 

[two3zone]

The "group think" tactics have been rampant in local malls here in CNY, and the kids who do it are brazen about it. They know the store employees aren't allowed to pursue or engage. The old maternity store near Kaufmann's at Carousel was a very popular one with the underage pregnancy crowd. The employees would see a group of girls walk in and would know something was up. Two or three were decoys to distract the employees, sometimes drawing them into arguments about profiling. Meanwhile, the other two girls would load up and make a bee line to the mall exit across the way. When my wife was pregnant we used to shop there, and one time we got there right after a theft. The employees just started telling us their horror stories and how they are helpless to do anything. They can be fired for taking action. And by the time mall security gets there, the thieves are long gone.

There was a known group that continually hit Great Northern Mall. A friend of ours worked in one of the trendy children's clothing stores that was a favorite of the "gang". Even if they got caught in the parking lot, they would come back the next week and try again. The employees at the stores were always scared and frustrated. They just had to stand there and watch the kids steal, laugh at them, and leave.

I'm in the private security industry, we have a contract with an extremely high end store in the forum shops here in Vegas, the parent company sent me the contract with the working orders of the site and it explicitly says not to even engage with somebody that stole. This store has $30,000 purses and $1,000 t-shirts. It's insane.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I'm in the private security industry, we have a contract with an extremely high end store in the forum shops here in Vegas, the parent company sent me the contract with the working orders of the site and it explicitly says not to even engage with somebody that stole. This store has $30,000 purses and $1,000 t-shirts. It's insane.

That is insane. Speaking of insane have you seen Darius Bazley's handle. Now that is insane.

 

[OrangeDW]

Sentence them each to a year of playing for the Shanghai Dragons for free, and move on!

 

[llandz]

I'm in the private security industry, we have a contract with an extremely high end store in the forum shops here in Vegas, the parent company sent me the contract with the working orders of the site and it explicitly says not to even engage with somebody that stole. This store has $30,000 purses and $1,000 t-shirts. It's insane.

So when I come to Vegas in Dec. to see the SU women play, I have to make sure I don't shoplift in any stores that you cover!! By the way, do you know that the women play there on Dec. 21 and 22? Have to skip out on work and come join us.

 

[AlaskaSU]

If your looking for Trump to bail you out, your in trouble.

If you are looking to take a dig at Trump you might learn to speak English first.

 

[two3zone]

So when I come to Vegas in Dec. to see the SU women play, I have to make sure I don't shoplift in any stores that you cover!! By the way, do you know that the women play there on Dec. 21 and 22? Have to skip out on work and come join us.

My last day with the company is tomorrow so feel free hahaha. I'm actually getting married Saturday then driving back to Syracuse Monday to move. Future wife lives there and doesn't want to leave her family so I'm forced to move back.

 

[AlaskaSU]

If you are looking to take a dig at Trump you might learn to speak English first.

Hilarious that some people seriously think that Trump and Li Keqiang would be concerned about this shoplifting incident because they are college basketball players. How about a little perspective; N Korea wants to enslave S Korea, (not they ever stopped their pursuit), China and Russia are both engaged in territorial expansion, and the United States is running a massive trade deficit with China, yet some people think that 3 shoplifting teens will garner discussion. They will probably be tried and sentenced, serve some token time and then be pardoned. If we argue that it is unjust to try them we would no longer have the moral authority to try foreigners that commit domestic crimes; oh wait - wrong argument...

 

[CaptainJ]

Report: LiAngelo Ball Among UCLA Players Arrested for Shoplifting in China

Does anyone find this interesting given that Trump is on his way there? Do you really think these guys did not know better especially in a communist country?

Sont worry about not having a single "like" for a rather epic point(while the next one has 11 already). I'm used to it, and you have one now, even though I'm reserving judgment. It's certainly worth consideration, without the mind unconsciously shutting off due to prejucides, unconscious or otherwise. I mean just a short while earlier, we had a neighbor viciously attack a sitting Senator and former Presidential candidate, Rand Paul, from behind while Paul was mowing his lawn(Imagine that, a Senator mowing his own lawn). Paul suffered 5 or 6 broken ribs(depending on the report, as well as other serious internal injuries). The media tried to spin it as a "landscaping dispute", which all 7 neighbors who were interviewed vehemently claimed was false. It makes one wonder why the media was purposefully being false about the event, possibly even more than what the man's real motives were.

So yes, there is a sickness in this country, and we would be remiss to write every event off as a coincidence by default, even if we are not personally aware of correlation, as it does not mean that none exist. It's not that difficult for people to be influenced into doing things subconsiously, especially by highly trained people who are about 50 years beyond the technology of the now declassified MK-Ultra, and other Manchurian Candidate(no pun intended) techniques. Some people are arrogant enough to think they fully comprehend both individual and group psyche fully, as well as macro-reality. As time progresses we see the folly of these beliefs, including that we've actually lost a large degree of wisdom over the ages.

While the dissenters may be correct, I appreciate folks who think outside the box and don't allow everything to fly under their radar, regardless if they are always correct. If only more Americans were like that, instead of desensitized to a great many things of actual importance.

 

[CaptainJ]

Lucky not Singapore/Malaysia!

I havent read the whole thread yet, but I will guess this is the post of the thread, possibly even a post of the week nomination. lol, surprised you didnt get 40 likes, unless folks have bad memories.

 

[CaptainJ]

This really puts stuff in perspective for me. I was feeling sorry for myself after watching the first half of the last game. It could be worse though, our players could be in a Chinese prison.

On the other hand, if some Chinese prisoners were familiar with the Cuse of the past and were allowed(or forced?) to watch the game, they might appreciate their situation a bit more.

 

[CaptainJ]

It is wrong of me to hope they throw the book at them. And, for the record, I wasn't on board with the handling of MCW's robegate.

I'm not sure. It may be wrong for you to apparently assume they are guilty, however.

And would you care what "the book" is for a different culture, including the ones where the tradition is to cut one's hands off, or worse? Ever watch Midnight Express? Also, what are your motives for hoping they throw the book at them? Is that what those presidential "Hope" posters symbolized to you?

Reading this thread reminds me how much I appreciate what's left of the Constitution our founding fathers gifted us with, that hasn't been lost due to the extreme lack of vigilance by the majority of Americans who have fallen prey to the mainstream media.

 

[CaptainJ]

Wierd how millions of other 19 year olds have visited China over the years and this has never happened or happened at such a low rate it's not calculated. Apparently, college basketball players need special attention.

Have you considered you may have no idea what rate it's happened at?

Let me go further and ask you where you set the bar for "low".

Let me take it even a step further and ask an open ended question about how some of these athletes' financial and educational backgrounds may have differed from the backgrounds of whatever other 19 year olds that have gone to China in the past? Certainly our national has been morally degrading over time due to the media, and this isn't something that happened overnight. How different is this than what happened at the Olympics, where foreigners likely now think of us as the Urine-Nation(tm)? It's interesting, and somewhat amusing, to observe the reactions to this being Ball's kid is involved.

 

[CaptainJ]

Steeling is against the law everywhere. It's something you instinctively know is wrong from the time you understand the concept of possessions. Sure the penalties vary but it's still a crime and the surely knew better.

Except in Pittsburgh.

 

[CaptainJ]

If true, I don't understand how they could possibly think they could get away with this. A swarm of 'giant black teenagers' in a Vuitton store isn't going to be under tremendous surveillance scrutiny?

And, okay, maybe you get ONE knucklehead (MCW), thinking he can outsmart security measures, but how do three or more people collude in such stupidity? How is it possible that, when formulating this Master Plan, not one of the scheme's invitees didn't say, "hmmm, this might not work."

I admit, i did a couple of 'not good' things at that age. One out of necessity, and one a little less so. So, i get the immaturity thing. But, both 'solo.' I don't get the whole 'groupthink' thing. I guess it's just probably true that a LOT of people do a lot of stupid things, and it's just a matter of a small percentage of them getting caught. And when you're in the spotlight, it's both an incentive for the catchers to catch you, and for the media to make it a major deal. That's why it's so much of a shock when someone in the spotlight does something. They should have realized the consequences are infinitely greater.

From my observation and experiences(such as riots after NFL and NHL championships), it can also be the opposite of what you said, where there is a greater sense of security in numbers. Not all of us have the same preferences in life. I could make some great analogies, but unfortunately I have to post with great restraint. Think sadomasochism. I actually would be surprised if people were more brazen by themselves as you say, than when others are doing it with them, as can be seen even in cases of inaction like the classic Kitty Genovese murder in NYC. While some may think that group think in NYC is different than elsewhere because it is somewhat more of a moral cesspool than many other random dartboard targets on a map, the concept of diminished responsibility due to numbers is not unique to the big apple. I appreciate you reminding me how much differently folks can make a handfull of assumptions, even if they agree on most things.

 

[CaptainJ]

I'm in the private security industry, we have a contract with an extremely high end store in the forum shops here in Vegas, the parent company sent me the contract with the working orders of the site and it explicitly says not to even engage with somebody that stole. This store has $30,000 purses and $1,000 t-shirts. It's insane.

I'm asking sincerely, because it's not my line of expertise, what do they pay you to do then? Deter? Keep records of theft?

I can imagine the multiple reasons for the Prime Directive(tm, for Star Trek fans), such as not wanting to disrupt the experience of the actual high rollers(lol, it could be traumatizing to them), but am not coming up with what they are paying you for quite as quickly.

On a different note, any idea what the mark-up/actual loss on those examples you cited was?

Thanks to this thread, I think I have my inspiration for my first parody of the season, "Arrest U-CLA", based on "God Bless The USA".

 

[CaptainJ]

Hilarious that some people seriously think that Trump and Li Keqiang would be concerned about this shoplifting incident because they are college basketball players. How about a little perspective; N Korea wants to enslave S Korea, (not they ever stopped their pursuit), China and Russia are both engaged in territorial expansion, and the United States is running a massive trade deficit with China, yet some people think that 3 shoplifting teens will garner discussion. They will probably be tried and sentenced, serve some token time and then be pardoned. If we argue that it is unjust to try them we would no longer have the moral authority to try foreigners that commit domestic crimes; oh wait - wrong argument...

Wait, how many countries have China and Russia recently invaded, vs us in the last decade?(mind you, this is coming from someone who has protested outside the Chinese consulate, and watched weeping Tibetans kick and then burn an effigy in the street...all after Bill Clinton pulled a Trump and reversed a campaign pledge, granting China most Favored Nation Trade Status[tm] in 1994). Your post was painful to read, because I think youre far from alone with these beliefs. If that weren't the case, I would exercise more restraint and let this one go. Seriously though, this is not a rhetorical question, I'd like to illustrate some shocking numbers on the scoreboard.

I actually risk being disliked for loving up upholding American principles, which our media has obviously poisoned beyond belief. When I was a kid watching Star Wars, I used to think of us as The Rebels, but after watching the pre-quels and how well they aligned with fairly current events, it was painfully self-evident that those who control our politicians are The Empire(tm). Yeah, it's a bitter pill to swallow at first, but you dont have to be remain complicit if you dont want to.

So to answer your question, how many times in the past have American politicians spoken with foreign leaders about Americans held prisoner? Are you seeing this as something somehow unique? I agree there are FAR more important things going on in the world, even if I think you could have used better examples. I'm all for making America great again, but this "American exceptionalism"(at least in the current day) is nonsense, and we'd do well to be mindful of the parable of seeing the speck in someone else's eye while ignoring the plank in our own. Heck, just writing that makes me want to take it easier on folks the rest of the night. Dont take this personally, as I said before, I wouldnt have replied if the media didnt make such stuff so pervasive. I try not to even look at the names of whom I reply to, and stay focused on the message. I believe you mean well, and agree with your sentiment about the wrongful focus of the establishment media. G*d have mercey on all of us.

 

[texascpa]

Have you considered you may have no idea what rate it's happened at?

Let me go further and ask you where you set the bar for "low".

Let me take it even a step further and ask an open ended question about how some of these athletes' financial and educational backgrounds may have differed from the backgrounds of whatever other 19 year olds that have gone to China in the past? Certainly our national has been morally degrading over time due to the media, and this isn't something that happened overnight. How different is this than what happened at the Olympics, where foreigners likely now think of us as the Urine-Nation(tm)? It's interesting, and somewhat amusing, to observe the reactions to this being Ball's kid is involved.

We're talking about Ball's financial and educational background. There's no indication he suffered in either area. Additionally, why is it when we talk athletes, black athletes in particular, the "financial and educational" background is dropped as the excuse? First, not all black athletes suffer. Second, even if they did, the vast majority do not commit crimes. Third, I'm not sure what that has to do with my point. Are you saying that because a black athlete grew up poor or had a poor education, they need 24 hour supervision?

 

[texascpa]

Wait, how many countries have China and Russia recently invaded, vs us in the last decade?(mind you, this is coming from someone who has protested outside the Chinese consulate, and watched weeping Tibetans kick and then burn an effigy in the street...all after Bill Clinton pulled a Trump and reversed a campaign pledge, granting China most Favored Nation Trade Status[tm] in 1994). Your post was painful to read, because I think youre far from alone with these beliefs. If that weren't the case, I would exercise more restraint and let this one go. Seriously though, this is not a rhetorical question, I'd like to illustrate some shocking numbers on the scoreboard.

I actually risk being disliked for loving up upholding American principles, which our media has obviously poisoned beyond belief. When I was a kid watching Star Wars, I used to think of us as The Rebels, but after watching the pre-quels and how well they aligned with fairly current events, it was painfully self-evident that those who control our politicians are The Empire(tm). Yeah, it's a bitter pill to swallow at first, but you dont have to be remain complicit if you dont want to.

So to answer your question, how many times in the past have American politicians spoken with foreign leaders about Americans held prisoner? Are you seeing this as something somehow unique? I agree there are FAR more important things going on in the world, even if I think you could have used better examples. I'm all for making America great again, but this "American exceptionalism"(at least in the current day) is nonsense, and we'd do well to be mindful of the parable of seeing the speck in someone else's eye while ignoring the plank in our own. Heck, just writing that makes me want to take it easier on folks the rest of the night. Dont take this personally, as I said before, I wouldnt have replied if the media didnt make such stuff so pervasive. I try not to even look at the names of whom I reply to, and stay focused on the message. I believe you mean well, and agree with your sentiment about the wrongful focus of the establishment media. G*d have mercey on all of us.

We haven't invaded anyone in the last decade. Russia invaded Ukraine just a few years ago. China is rouge expanding it's territory into international waters without any oversight or much condemnation from the international community.