unbelievable refereeing

[Day2]

I was excited to join the ACC at first. I now loathe this league. Cuse will never get a fair shake against the the old necks in this league and most definitely not against the state of Carolina...

I think the move to the ACC has hurt recruiting as well.

 

[MikeSU02]

Our offense was way too reliant on jump shots for the first 24 minutes of this game, hence the limited FTs.

Our offense is way too simplistic and it took a herculean effort by Tyus in the second half to keep us in the game (and there is no way he'll have the energy to do that for a full game).

This is nothing to say of our defense/rebounding which is really inconsistent (to put it mildly).

 

[OrangeDW]

Even things like Battle being called for a kicked ball which blew it dead and reset the shot clock, when he actually deflected the pass with his hand.

The ref who called it was 30 feet away and on the baseline. He obviously couldn’t see if the ball was kicked, he just assumed.

Or Battle initially being given 2 points when it was a clear 3. Yes, they fixed that one. Just seems like their default mode was pro Tar Heel.

One game after not even getting calls at home in front of the biggest crowd in history, it was extra frustrating.

 

[xc84]

Our offense was way too reliant on jump shots for the first 24 minutes of this game, hence the limited FTs.

Our offense is way too simplistic and it took a herculean effort by Tyus in the second half to keep us in the game (and there is no way he'll have the energy to do that for a full game).

This is nothing to say of our defense/rebounding which is really inconsistent (to put it mildly).

I agree they were reliant on jump shots but they moved the ball well early-on and the shots were there. There were also a few good drives by Marek. However, UNC tightened up and so SU needs to change their strategy too when that happens. I'd prefer Battle be PG and keep Howard on the wing. When Howard is square and open, he makes shots. Battle can create better even at PG and is a better passer.

 

[Newhouser]

It's a bigger issue - the game becomes unwatchable. I also don't care what anyone says - the good stripes want it even (in number of fouls called). Luckey went in at halftime and said wow that is ugly the other two boobs continued the trend early in the second half and he starts making calls out of position.

Game grinds down with the stoppages and the FT's. How much more enjoyable was the Duke first half when neither team was in the bonus. The dwindling skill level makes the college game hard enough to watch - overr officiating just adds to the misery.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

My problem with the refs was mostly about them calling too many fouls on us in the first half.

There was zero consistency. See Marek’s offensive foul vs. White running Boeheim over and it being a block.

See Chukwu being called for a foul for diving on the player who was on the floor with the ball...yet Sidibe was getting killed in the same situation with no foul called.

14 fouls in a half when you’re not playing pressure defense, not fouling to stop the clock, not playing some super aggressive defense to try to come back, etc. is insane. It’s like they wanted us to just get out of the way or something.

We should’ve been up double digits at half.

Agreed about Marek's offensive. That was a terrible call. I'd love for the ref to explain to me exactly what advantage was gained with MD leaning his 180 pound frame against the guy without actually dislodging him from the position. Terrible.

Completely disagree about PC. He dove on top of the pile when he couldn't even see the ball. I want that called exactly the same way regardless of team the player is on. I don't recall the Sidibe play so you'll have to forgive me on that.

While I hear you on the defense and all, when they continuously attack, of course they will get the calls.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Even things like Battle being called for a kicked ball which blew it dead and reset the shot clock, when he actually deflected the pass with his hand.

The ref who called it was 30 feet away and on the baseline. He obviously couldn’t see if the ball was kicked, he just assumed.

Or Battle initially being given 2 points when it was a clear 3. Yes, they fixed that one. Just seems like their default mode was pro Tar Heel.

One game after not even getting calls at home in front of the biggest crowd in history, it was extra frustrating.

More than a couple assumption calls from the ref not in the proper position were absolutely made last night. That's a legit gripe.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Part of the issue is I think Battle especially has built a reputation as a whiner with officials and sometimes doesn't get the calls other guys get.

The charge/block rule is atrocious.

We actually had more points in the paint than UNC for a good portion of the game.

I am amazed at the amount of times officials call touch fouls, but then don't call anything when someone gets hammered.

 

[OrangeDW]

Agreed about Marek's offensive. That was a terrible call. I'd love for the ref to explain to me exactly what advantage was gained with MD leaning his 180 pound frame against the guy without actually dislodging him from the position. Terrible.

Completely disagree about PC. He dove on top of the pile when he couldn't even see the ball. I want that called exactly the same way regardless of team the player is on. I don't recall the Sidibe play so you'll have to forgive me on that.

While I hear you on the defense and all, when they continuously attack, of course they will get the calls.

Chukwu’s was absolutely a foul. That wasn’t my point.

Sidibe went to the ground to get a rebound in the first half, got fouled about 7 different times, and then Howard ended up diving for the ball and then it went out of bounds.

They often don’t call fouls in those situations when they should. Sure enough they got our guy though. Of course they did.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

I wonder if the person who puts the ref teams together considers the athletic condition of the refs who do UNC games. No way should that chubby guy have been out there. He couldn't possibly keep up, even if he was 1 of 3.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Chukwu’s was absolutely a foul. That wasn’t my point.

Sidibe went to the ground to get a rebound in the first half, got fouled about 7 different times, and then Howard ended up diving for the ball and then it went out of bounds.

They often don’t call fouls in those situations when they should. Sure enough they got our guy though. Of course they did.

Oh, the one where Sid was on his knees. Yeah, you're right, definitely a foul there.

One thing about that play. Wasn't that a travel by Sid? It sure looked like he got up from the floor with the ball. At least to his knees.

 

[HOFCeluck]

They didn’t take advantage of the callas they DID get. 13-23 FFS.

FTs are like one of the easiest and most basic skills in basketball. The officiating was obviously not good but damn let’s master the controllable variables here.

 

[Scooch]

We don't regularly attack the tin, our defense looks not that aggressive until we need to be late.

We get jobbed in any conference when teams come out and play in your shirt defense for 40 minutes and aggressive screen and go hoop from the opening whistle.

This.

There was a TON of griping about officiating when we were in the Big East. It has nothing to do with the league office having it out for a school. That's idiotic.

It has everything to do with (a) poor officiating overall, where sometimes it nets out even and sometimes one team benefits for a stretch, and (b) style of play that leads to refs calling a game a certain way.

I don't recall a lot of complaints about bad calls when we're pressing effectively. Hmmmmm?

 

[MikeSU02]

I agree they were reliant on jump shots but they moved the ball well early-on and the shots were there. There were also a few good drives by Marek. However, UNC tightened up and so SU needs to change their strategy too when that happens. I'd prefer Battle be PG and keep Howard on the wing. When Howard is square and open, he makes shots. Battle can create better even at PG and is a better passer.

But it's too one-dimensional even if we are moving the ball. You just cannot take that many jump shots (especially guys that shouldn't be taking them), imo. The Marek slips on the PnRs were great, bu that's not a real part of our offense (at least not yet).

There has to be more focus on Tyus earlier and have him work to drive sooner. Those shots will be there but Tyus has to be more selfish (or JB has to push him to drive earlier).

I agree with you on Battle as PG.

 

[PhatOrange]

We don't regularly attack the tin, our defense looks not that aggressive until we need to be late.

We get jobbed in any conference when teams come out and play in your shirt defense for 40 minutes and aggressive screen and go hoop from the opening whistle.

thing is, just call it consistently both ways . The non-charge vs charge calls have been egregious.

 

[Orangello]

ACC refs all take fake refresher classes each year at UNC. Not sure why anyone is ever surprised by this garbage.

 

[pfister1]

thing is, just call it consistently both ways . The non-charge vs charge calls have been egregious.

I think this is the biggest issue with the officiating, the seeming inconsistency in how certain things are called game to game or even within games. I think it’s also why players gripe so much, they aren’t always sure what they can get away with and what will be called a foul.

As an example after a defensive player secured a rebound, there is almost always one opposition player that will take a poke at the ball and try to dislodge it, oftentimes creating contact with the rebounder. Typically only whistled if the rebounder is knocked off balance.

 

[xc84]

I think this is the biggest issue with the officiating, the seeming inconsistency in how certain things are called game to game or even within games. I think it’s also why players gripe so much, they aren’t always sure what they can get away with and what will be called a foul.

As an example after a defensive player secured a rebound, there is almost always one opposition player that will take a poke at the ball and try to dislodge it, oftentimes creating contact with the rebounder. Typically only whistled if the rebounder is knocked off balance.

Very true. IMO, when an offensive player is moving, lowers his shoulder and rams the defensive player who is standing still, to me...that should be a charge

 

[orangehomer]

Part of the issue is I think Battle especially has built a reputation as a whiner with officials and sometimes doesn't get the calls other guys get.

where are you coming up with this?

 

[Cuseregular]

where are you coming up with this?

Because battle has the temerity to act in real time in response to the screw job he's getting

 

[orangehomer]

They didn’t take advantage of the callas they DID get. 13-23 FFS.

FTs are like one of the easiest and most basic skills in basketball. The officiating was obviously not good but damn let’s master the controllable variables here.

it's just a stupid argument that you can't complain about uneven officiating because you missed free throws. cmon man.

 

[orangehomer]

Because battle has the temerity to act in real time in response to the screw job he's getting

i'm just not seeing this whole thing that battle is some kind of whiner compared to 90% of the sport. watch the coaches for crissakes they act like babies over even minorly questionable calls. i'm not sure where this "battle is a whiner" narrative started. all of the players complain. and a big part of it is that the refs are bad.

 

[HOFCeluck]

it's just a stupid argument that you can't complain about uneven officiating because you missed free throws. cmon man.

No you cmon

 

[xc84]

it's just a stupid argument that you can't complain about uneven officiating because you missed free throws. cmon man.

Most who complain infer that SU lost the game due to bad officiating. However, SU would have won if they just made a decent % of FTs instead of the atrocious % they did. It's not that you can't complain about the officials in this case, it's that you shouldn't. SU FT shooting lost the game, the the refs.

 

[CardiacCuse]

Most who complain infer that SU lost the game due to bad officiating. However, SU would have won if they just made a decent % of FTs instead of the atrocious % they did. It's not that you can't complain about the officials in this case, it's that you shouldn't. SU FT shooting lost the game, the the refs.

the refs unilaterally shrunk the margin of error between the teams - enough to tilt the outcome - not enough to be the only reason unc won - but merely impacting the margin of error is infuriating - to many fans and i'm sure to the team as well.

SU isn't good enough to play uphill and win. they are good enough to play as equals and win, though! they seem, as a team, to be a bit fragile mentally - and when the calls start going against them - they mostly disappear. they are a team that can be more influenced by the circumstances of the game i.e. reffing than most, imo. how many of those missed free throws might have been at least partially caused by feeling cheated by the refs???

yes, if they had just made their FT they probably win - but still, that doesn't and shouldn't excuse the poor refereeing.

just because the refs didn't screw them enough to not give them any chance to win - they left the door open a crack - doesn't mean they aren't culpable for the outcome of the game.