What do we do with Dino?

[kcsu]

I've resigned myself to what we are. We're never going to recruit at the level people want and we're going to face injuries just about every year that we don't have enough depth to cover.

Keep Dino, fire Dino and bring in someone else, I think it's all going to be a viscious circle. Dino's teams this year and last year have been very competitive in September and October and then the wheels fall off the bus.

2012, 2018, we managed to stay healthy and look what happened. I think it's all luck at this point.

It's frustrating, but I'd give him more time with this new staff. What I think Wildhack needs to watch closely is the Dino/Anae relationship, make sure there's no there there.

I think the only path to get to where people really want to get to is a whole lot more money. And personally, I'd rather see people give their money to more worthwhile causes than college football.

No we are now in position to hire better talent. The next coach will not be coming from the MAC

 

[HRE Otto IV]

I've resigned myself to what we are. We're never going to recruit at the level people want and we're going to face injuries just about every year that we don't have enough depth to cover.

Keep Dino, fire Dino and bring in someone else, I think it's all going to be a viscious circle. Dino's teams this year and last year have been very competitive in September and October and then the wheels fall off the bus.

2012, 2018, we managed to stay healthy and look what happened. I think it's all luck at this point.

It's frustrating, but I'd give him more time with this new staff. What I think Wildhack needs to watch closely is the Dino/Anae relationship, make sure there's no there there.

I think the only path to get to where people really want to get to is a whole lot more money. And personally, I'd rather see people give their money to more worthwhile causes than college football.

I don't think it would be asking to much for SU to expect its HC to go 7-6 with competitive losses. We have three games left to get there this season, otherwise Dino is 1 for 7 in achieving that mark.

 

[richmondcuse03]

The fans that left near midnight? Who endured a 3+ hour schlacking? They were loud early and they came. I don’t blame anyone for heading home, those players got more support this year than any other squad in probably 25 years.

That's my point. Nobody in person was upset at the last second. Anyone still watching deserves a trophy though. It was a hard fourth quarter.

 

[richmondcuse03]

I've resigned myself to what we are. We're never going to recruit at the level people want and we're going to face injuries just about every year that we don't have enough depth to cover.

Keep Dino, fire Dino and bring in someone else, I think it's all going to be a viscious circle. Dino's teams this year and last year have been very competitive in September and October and then the wheels fall off the bus.

2012, 2018, we managed to stay healthy and look what happened. I think it's all luck at this point.

It's frustrating, but I'd give him more time with this new staff. What I think Wildhack needs to watch closely is the Dino/Anae relationship, make sure there's no there there.

I think the only path to get to where people really want to get to is a whole lot more money. And personally, I'd rather see people give their money to more worthwhile causes than college football.

Agree. But going to school during the GROB era clouds my opinion. I swore when we returned to a bowl with Marrone that I'd be happy with a competitive team and having a chance to go to a bowl. I'm not raising expectations -- nobody in the northeast for football should. Maybe I'm a pessimist.

 

[PhatOrange]

He'd be a middling 500 type coach. Marrone was a middling 500 type coach.

We just finished playing at Clemson, ND, at Pitt and FSU, and people here are acting like it's the Dave Sims Big East era schedule.

That’s all true…my issue with him at this point are all things he hasn’t changed or won’t. Things like rushing your kicker for a career long kick, not playing (developing) your offensive backups, punching yourself in the face over and over with the Hoeh/Mang experiment…and not doing anything to shore up the interior DLine that had a glaring depth issue. I could go on and none of it has to do with playing Clemson, ND, FSU.

 

[richmondcuse03]

That’s all true…my issue with him at this point are all things he hasn’t changed or won’t. Things like rushing your kicker for a career long kick, not playing (developing) your offensive backups, punching yourself in the face over and over with the Hoeh/Mang experiment…and not doing anything to shore up the interior DLine that had a glaring depth issue. I could go on and none of it has to do with playing Clemson, ND, FSU.

All fair complaints. I was livid during the FG decision.

 

[Cusefan69]

Bayside that is effin funny as hell. I have not seen that one before. Ahh man...good stuff.

 

[orangecuse]

He'd be a middling 500 type coach. Marrone was a middling 500 type coach.

We just finished playing at Clemson, ND, at Pitt and FSU, and people here are acting like it's the Dave Sims Big East era schedule.

Quoting a great line, "opinions vary." Who knows? What do you think Babers would be doing at a place like UConn? Do you think Babers gets this UConn team (any for that matter) to a bowl with all of the aforementioned head winds, etc. and being left without a chair when the music stopped?

And, with all due respect, I don't know how you can say, intelligently, Marrone was "middling," considering the deep abyss the University had fallen into after Grob. The fact that he was able to get SU to that "middling" level and back to respectability was a monumental feat in and of itself.

Furthermore, the immense head winds he faced relative to the university's lack of commitment to infrastructure, facility improvements, etc. Marrone begged and pleaded for an IPF and he was basically told yeah, some day, when it was already a day late and a dollar short.

Meanwhile, Babers has been afforded, let's just say, a night and day difference in that regard.

No doubt the schedule the last four games has been much more difficult. That's why I remained guarded at 6-0 due to the favorable schedule to that point, along with considering the last second escape against a bad UVA team, and Purdue's self implosion at game's end.

However, I don't think losing these last 4 games is what is causing some folks to lose perspective as much as in the way in which we've lost. Our offense (where we haven't been affected by as many injuries) appears completed disfunctional, especially the past two weeks where we failed to even score one TD. The lack of personnel at the TE and WR positions, etc. in year 7 of Babers. Moreover, the fact that every year (sans the Dungey 10-3 season) Babers' teams consistently go into the late October and November swoons.

 

[cusefan88]

If the team was 6-4 and hadn't started 6-0 people would be pretty happy to be in this spot. I read a stat that Wake is 10-18 in November under Clawson I think so just like Cuse...the smaller schools don't have depth and suffer late.

 

[FrancoPizza]

If the team was 6-4 and hadn't started 6-0 people would be pretty happy to be in this spot. I read a stat that Wake is 10-18 in November under Clawson I think so just like Cuse...the smaller schools don't have depth and suffer late.

Yes and no. If we beat a couple of ND, FSU, Clemson... we'd be crucifying Dino for the W-T-F Virginia loss and blowing a 10 pt 4th qtr lead to a middling Purdue team. It would be kind of Pasqualoni-esque.

 

[David332]

It’s not losing the last four straight that is so devastating, it’s being dominated for the last 14 quarters of ball. And not being able to get first downs on Saturday was disturbing.

 

[Millhouse]

I've resigned myself to what we are. We're never going to recruit at the level people want and we're going to face injuries just about every year that we don't have enough depth to cover.

Keep Dino, fire Dino and bring in someone else, I think it's all going to be a viscious circle. Dino's teams this year and last year have been very competitive in September and October and then the wheels fall off the bus.

2012, 2018, we managed to stay healthy and look what happened. I think it's all luck at this point.

It's frustrating, but I'd give him more time with this new staff. What I think Wildhack needs to watch closely is the Dino/Anae relationship, make sure there's no there there.

I think the only path to get to where people really want to get to is a whole lot more money. And personally, I'd rather see people give their money to more worthwhile causes than college football.

There will be so many opportunities for a guy with northeastern ties who knows the air raid well (not just at SU)

It's still the easiest way to competitiveness. I just don't think the corny ohana crap is helping

Why is it so hard for us to get average blockers, I'm not asking for that much

 

[Millhouse]

I don't think it would be asking to much for SU to expect its HC to go 7-6 with competitive losses. We have three games left to get there this season, otherwise Dino is 1 for 7 in achieving that mark.

How many programs do that consistently? P5 only
Last 4 full seasons Georgia Michigan Alabama Ohio State Notre Dame Oklahoma Michigan St Wisconsin Utah Oklahoma Clemson Wake Forest Penn State aTm Iowa Iowa State Kentucky Arizona State Oregon

Not that many

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Quoting a great line, "opinions vary." Who knows? What do you think Babers would be doing at a place like UConn? Do you think Babers gets this UConn team (any for that matter) to a bowl with all of the aforementioned head winds, etc. and being left without a chair when the music stopped?

And, with all do respect, I don't know how you can say, intelligently, Marrone was "middling," considering the deep abyss the University had fallen into after Grob. The fact that he was able to get SU to that "middling" level and back to respectability was a monumental feat in and of itself.

Furthermore, the immense head winds he faced relative to the university's lack of commitment to infrastructure, facility improvements, etc. Marrone begged and pleaded for an IPF and he was basically told yeah, some day, when it was already a day late and a dollar short.

Meanwhile, Babers has been afforded, let's just say, a night and day difference in that regard.

No doubt the schedule the last four games has been much more difficult. That's why I remained guarded at 6-0 due to the favorable schedule to that point, along with considering the last second escape against a bad UVA team, and Purdue's self implosion at game's end.

However, I don't think losing these last 4 games is what is causing some folks to lose perspective as much as in the way in which we've lost. Our offense (where we haven't been affected by as many injuries) appears completed disfunctional, especially the past two weeks where we failed to even score one TD. The lack of personnel at the TE and WR positions, etc. in year 7 of Babers. Moreover, the fact that every year (sans the Dungey 10-3 season) Babers' teams consistently go into the late October and November swoons.

The fact that we lost the last 4 games isn't what is concerning. It is the below...

2nd half Clemson
0 points 119 yards

ND 1st half
7 points <100 yards

Pitt
9 points 145 yards

FSU
3 points 160 yards

Really the last 2 games is what sticks out. I would expect Colgate to be able to get more than 12 points and 305 yards.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

How many programs do that consistently? P5 only
Last 4 full seasons Georgia Michigan Alabama Ohio State Notre Dame Oklahoma Michigan St Wisconsin Utah Oklahoma Clemson Wake Forest Penn State aTm Iowa Iowa State Kentucky Arizona State Oregon

Not that many

That is about 1/3 of the P5 teams. A HC can have a 4-8 season if it is an outlier. The 7-6 should be the norm not an outlier. 2020 was weird because no one had FCS or G5 games. That is 2-3 more wins. How many P5 schools have averaged 7 Ws not counting 2020?

 

[FRANKIEFAN]

I think we should worry about losing Tony White I see no reason for him to stick around if he doesn't have a direct line to the HC job. There is no way that 6-0 start didn't get him attention and raise his stock.

If Wake goes poorly I think a 5 game losing skid is enough to make the change and White coaches against BC and has a full offseason to reload the roster. $$ shouldn't be an issue because we aren't going to be locking ourselves into a massive deal to win a bidding war for a coach.

 

[Bayside44]

Quoting a great line, "opinions vary." Who knows? What do you think Babers would be doing at a place like UConn? Do you think Babers gets this UConn team (any for that matter) to a bowl with all of the aforementioned head winds, etc. and being left without a chair when the music stopped?

And, with all do respect, I don't know how you can say, intelligently, Marrone was "middling," considering the deep abyss the University had fallen into after Grob. The fact that he was able to get SU to that "middling" level and back to respectability was a monumental feat in and of itself.

Furthermore, the immense head winds he faced relative to the university's lack of commitment to infrastructure, facility improvements, etc. Marrone begged and pleaded for an IPF and he was basically told yeah, some day, when it was already a day late and a dollar short.

Meanwhile, Babers has been afforded, let's just say, a night and day difference in that regard.

No doubt the schedule the last four games has been much more difficult. That's why I remained guarded at 6-0 due to the favorable schedule to that point, along with considering the last second escape against a bad UVA team, and Purdue's self implosion at game's end.

However, I don't think losing these last 4 games is what is causing some folks to lose perspective as much as in the way in which we've lost. Our offense (where we haven't been affected by as many injuries) appears completed disfunctional, especially the past two weeks where we failed to even score one TD. The lack of personnel at the TE and WR positions, etc. in year 7 of Babers. Moreover, the fact that every year (sans the Dungey 10-3 season) Babers' teams consistently go into the late October and November swoons.

I don't think about UConn. I am sorry for anyone who does.

In four years HCDM had a 500 record, partly because he suffered the same depth issues anyone here will. I agree he worked for idiots and likely would've done better with ADJW. He also never coached in the ACC with this current grind (which should lighten up just a bit in the new scheduling world).

As far as the games teams have 100% sold out on Tucker and Shrader, and our WRs minus Gadsen cannot break free of single coverage. I agree that WR recruiting isn't what we hoped.

 

[Millhouse]

That is about 1/3 of the P5 teams. A HC can have a 4-8 season if it is an outlier. The 7-6 should be the norm not an outlier. 2020 was weird because no one had FCS or G5 games. That is 2-3 more wins. How many P5 schools have averaged 7 Ws not counting 2020?

Averaging seven is pretty common because there are so many horrible teams

We average 6 in 17, 18, 19, 21 I'm tossing covid year which might be cherry picking but I think it's fair because it was such a dumb mess.

If you have a good season once in a while, it's ready to be average overall because everyone schedules easy wins

 

[HRE Otto IV]

I might have screwed up. I'll fix

Just looking at the recent ACC HCs...

Dabo worst season 6-7 (4-4)
Doeren after 1st year, only 1 season worse than 7-6 (3-5)
Satterfield worst non 2020 season 6-7 (4-4)
Clawson after 1st two seasons, worst non 2020 7-6 (3-5)
Hafley before this season 6-6 (2-6)
Addazio had one season worse than 7-6
Brown worst season 6-7 (3-5)
Cutcliffe before 2019 he had an 7 year stretch where he had only 1 season with less than 6 Ws
Narduzzi only 1 non 2020 season with less than 7 Ws which was 5-7 (3-5)
Diaz worst season 6-7 (4-4)
Johnson over 11 season only had 2 with less than 6 Ws one of which was 5-6 (4-4)
Bronco after year 1 his worst season was 6-7 (3-5)
Fuente worst season 6-7 (4-4)

13 of the 14 ACC programs have been able to achieve 7-6 for a good stretch of years recently. The only school who hasn't is SU.

 

[orangecuse]

I don't think about UConn. I am sorry for anyone who does.

In four years HCDM had a 500 record, partly because he suffered the same depth issues anyone here will. I agree he worked for idiots and likely would've done better with ADJW. He also never coached in the ACC with this current grind (which should lighten up just a bit in the new scheduling world).

As far as the games teams have 100% sold out on Tucker and Shrader, and our WRs minus Gadsen cannot break free of single coverage. I agree that WR recruiting isn't what we hoped.

Ha. Well, that's practically the entire board. I mean, this place is seemingly obsessed with UConn in addition to Rutgers, as there are dedicated (open tab) type threads about them.

In my inquiry, the only reason I mentioned UConn is because it would be very hard to reasonably argue that there are any places more difficult to win in today's present landscape based upon its current circumstances and being left chair-less when the music stopped. Yet, here they are, somehow, someway, going bowling. And, how coaching matters first and foremost regardless of the headwinds, etc.

Although Syracuse faces challenges, obstacles, etc. (which you've repeatedly opined/believe being the proximate cause of their destined fate) in today's football realm, in my opinion, SU can certainly do better. Especially, with being in a P5 conference and reaping the considerably amount of coin that comes along with it.

 

[kcsu]

Just looking at the recent ACC HCs...

Dabo worst season 6-7 (4-4)
Doeren after 1st year, only 1 season worse than 7-6 (3-5)
Satterfield worst non 2020 season 6-7 (4-4)
Clawson after 1st two seasons, worst non 2020 7-6 (3-5)
Hafley before this season 6-6 (2-6)
Addazio had one season worse than 7-6
Brown worst season 6-7 (3-5)
Cutcliffe before 2019 he had an 7 year stretch where he had only 1 season with less than 6 Ws
Narduzzi only 1 non 2020 season with less than 7 Ws which was 5-7 (3-5)
Diaz worst season 6-7 (4-4)
Johnson over 11 season only had 2 with less than 6 Ws one of which was 5-6 (4-4)
Bronco after year 1 his worst season was 6-7 (3-5)
Fuente worst season 6-7 (4-4)

13 of the 14 ACC programs have been able to achieve 7-6 for a good stretch of years recently. The only school who hasn't is SU.

Dino is not a good coach

 

[djorange1989]

I think it's fair to expect us to consistently go bowling. even if that doesn't mean every year, at least 3 out of every 4. Depth will always be an issue, but here is the thing: the offense hasn't had a lot of injuries, obviously Shrader being banged up is big and we believe Sean has been banged up all season. However, the issue on offense is our starting 11 just isn't good beyond the big 3. Our OL is full of upperclassmen and has completely underachieved, our TEs are dismal, our WRs beyond OG3 (and yes, we did lose Jones) stink. that isn't lack of depth, that is lack of recruiting and development. The defense has absolutely been crushed by injuries, the staff has done a good job with depth and development there, we knew a green and smaller than small DL(yes, even by Tony White standards) could be an Achilles Heel, and recently it has been. Basically, they have done a half good job bringing in talent and developing it, what is crazy is the half that is allegedly Dino's strength has been the dismal half. 2018 is the only year the offense has been excellent, otherwise it has been alright to downright awful(mostly the latter).

I know Dino isn't getting fired after this season, so I won't even go there, but to me, next year, with the kids we have coming back(hopefully everyone we expect to come back who are valuable do come back) and the chance to upgrade talent via the portal, 7 wins should be the floor next year or we should move on. Purdue is the only tough OOC game(Army can be pesky so we better get the run D fixed) and with BC/Wake/Pitt all coming to the JMA and drawing Va Tech and Ga Tech, 7 wins should not be a crazy ask. Clemson, at NC State, at FSU, at NC are all really tough, but beyond that every game is for the taking.

 

[OrangePA]

At what point is stability not the overriding factor for you? If Dino's contract expires in 2024 as rumors indicate, do you give him another one for stability?

Few were calling for Dino to be fired when we were 6-0 - and one play away from being 7-0.

I just can't subscribe to the knee-jerk fire the coach comments. I also can't subscribe to the "injuries don't matter" observations.

A program like Syracuse University has never had the kind of depth necessary to withstand substantial loss in personnel that has occurred in the recent past - by injury or by COVID 19.

We are obviously not the same team now that reached No. 14 in the polls.

I have never seen a team so decimated by injury.

Shrader played on Saturday, but couldn't use his greatest asset - his feet. We didn't have Garrett Williams - a soon to be NFL player.

It seems that the youngest players on this team are our best players and the quality of our coaching staff seems to have improved a lot.

The stability at head coach is in fact improving the program - we are getting better.

So, yes, I would keep Dino.

 

[David332]

I’m not calling for Dino to be fired but I have liked several posts that have, so I definitely understand the frustration. The last few games have just been epic collapses, particularly the last two. It’s not being able to even drive the ball up the field that drives me nuts.

I just don’t know which is the greater risk; terminating Dino for an unknown person, and the transfer/ recruiting fallout/ rebuild that comes with it? Or keeping him long term and settling for some of his quirks that most of us would agree are not acceptable; clock management issues, not getting up for big games, struggling in the face of adversity etc.

Honestly I just don’t know what to think. But I am furious with him right now for not calling the timeout and punching in that TD while on the 1 yard line on senior night. That was straight up wrong.

 

[CousCuse]

In business I will structure contracts with iffy vendors or clients in position to make a decision if they want to continue the business relationship. That way the decision is theirs to make. I would do the same with Dino. but only if he had a good year. If so, make a fair offer but one that is based on performance. If he doesn't agree to the terms, it is his decision. Put him in a position to decide.

It's not a client relationship. he is your COO.