What I See

[cuseincincy]

Nice to see the Orange dominate a team it should. We haven't always done that the last few years even in exhibitions.

• I'm not sure what teams can do to disrupt SU's offense. As stated on broadcast JAB just has to hope 2 of his shooters are hot each game.
• I think the 35-40 minutes of a true 5 man crowd is going to be disappointed. I know we haven't seen it much but the Jimmy, Cole and Benny front line is going to play together for at least 10 minutes per game. Nothing against Jesse or Frank, love to see them involved but Benny is one of the best 5 players on the team now. And with 2 other 6'9" guys on the court we'll still have more size than we did at any point last year. Hey 30 minutes of Jesse/Frank are still 25 minute more than we saw last year also.
• Notice I say size. Rebounding is and will be a challenge. The HOFer could care less but taking Benny aside and asking him to focus on rebounding this year could be a difference maker. He is probably the only one capable of it. Really need Frank and Jesse to be active on the glass.
• Symir Girard III could be one of the best all around PG's in the history of the program. They check every box. Unfortunately they are not a single player. Fortunately they complement each other well and between them our PG play should be adequate.
• I'm less worried about the athleticism than I was. Benny, Symir and even Frank are athletic enough and some of our other guys are deceptive enough (Swider for his size) that when combined with our bench guys we can play with athletic teams.
• Joe, Buddy, Cole, Jimmy and Benny will be our closing lineup. Our 5 best players. Jimmy and Jesse/Frank will alternate offense/defense when possible/needed.

 

[stuckinbig11]

Jesse will get the most minutes at 5.

 

[Jake]

Hmm. Going to need to see Benny play a little more under control before I toss him out there during closing time. Jessie’s ability to knock down FTs gets him the nod in my book with Jimmy and Cole.

but as you mentioned our offense is going to be good. Playing zone against us should be a fireable offense.

 

[cuseincincy]

Jesse will get the most minutes at 5.

Absolutely. My rough guess is
Jesse 20
Frank 10
Jimmy/Cole 10
Looked like Jimmy was manning the middle on D. Doesn't really matter on O.

 

[Orangezoo]

Absolutely. My rough guess is
Jesse 20
Frank 10
Jimmy/Cole 10
Looked like Jimmy was manning the middle on D. Doesn't really matter on O.

Small ball 5-7 minutes max is all I see. Unless it's a smaller team we are playing. Jimmy struggled to play the Marek role defensively somewhat against two D2 teams.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Jimmy is crafty but will have some challenges maneuvering inside against big teams. Clearly outside is the strength, but the ability to get some scoring from the post is important. Symir certainly looks capable at the point and pretty good strength it appears. Like his ability to find others.

 

[ORRange]

Hmm. Going to need to see Benny play a little more under control before I toss him out there during closing time. Jessie’s ability to knock down FTs gets him the nod in my book with Jimmy and Cole.

but as you mentioned our offense is going to be good. Playing zone against us should be a fireable offense.

What on earth are you talking about? Benny has to play a little more under control. Clean your glasses. He had a perfect boxscore last night and played so smooth that I commented that the kid is the next coming of Erich Santifer. Erich was never out of control a game in his life. And after 2 games you determine that Bennie isn't ready for crunch time. Kaleb he isn't.

 

[Cusefan0307]

What on earth are you talking about? Benny has to play a little more under control. Clean your glasses. He had a perfect boxscore last night and played so smooth that I commented that the kid is the next coming of Erich Santifer. Erich was never out of control a game in his life. And after 2 games you determine that Bennie isn't ready for crunch time. Kaleb he isn't.

Might want to look at Kalebs stats from his first two exhibition games.

 

[Windyfly]

What on earth are you talking about? Benny has to play a little more under control. Clean your glasses. He had a perfect boxscore last night and played so smooth that I commented that the kid is the next coming of Erich Santifer. Erich was never out of control a game in his life. And after 2 games you determine that Bennie isn't ready for crunch time. Kaleb he isn't.

Box score against d2 competition doesn’t sell a direct correlation of someone’s control on the floor, to your point. Benny indeed has to play with a “little” more under control, there’s nothing wrong with that statement, at all. Against bigger, stronger and more athletic players, he will definitely need to have a bit more control and fluidity with his moves and in his movement and shouldn’t be too big of an issue. I think we are all extremely pleased and excited with how Benny looks so far, but I don’t think he gets away with everything he’s shown if this was P5 competition. There’s nothing wrong with this either, he’s a young player who’s playing his first collegiate minutes and is still growing into his body and will look more comfortable with increased game/practice reps. I don’t think he is quite used to just how immensely athletic he his at this stage and might take a little bit of seasoning to adjust. Benny has had dramatic growth and changes to his physical ability over the last few years and I thought it was pretty clear he needs to become a little bit more fluid in his step. And honestly man apart from all that, your response is a just a ‘little’ overly aggressive and I think it might be nice to take it down a notch next time you don’t agree with someone and also maybe go take another look for yourself before you demand someone else to.

There’s my piece anyway. Let’s all try to get along for the new season and not get so offensive about each other’s opinions. There’s lots of reasons to be optimistic with this team, but there’s also enough reasons to be cautious, across the board. Perceptions are bound to shift, not much is yet set in stone.

 

[jdubs30]

Marek was incredible but has to be the exception, not the norm. Just because Marek played the 5 id hate having JB just automatically assume our biggest 4 can also play the 5. We had to do it the last few years and we were lucky that Marek is about the only guy willing to play the 5, take charges, and throw his body around against ACC big men even though he was like 185lbs.

Other than last shot situations or times where we are extremely desperate on offense, Jimmy should never see the 5 - especially now that we have 2 healthy bigs who have potential and are clearly capable.

 

[ORRange]

Might want to look at Kalebs stats from his first two exhibition games.

What does this post even mean and why would I bother?

 

[Cusefan0307]

What does this post even mean and why would I bother?

Because he had great exhibition games like Benny. The hyperbole for Benny is off the charts by some fans. He’s going to be good and likely better with Kaleb, but some of the comparisons are crazy.

 

[Orangezoo]

Box score against d2 competition doesn’t sell a direct correlation of someone’s control on the floor, to your point. Benny indeed has to play with a “little” more under control, there’s nothing wrong with that statement, at all. Against bigger, stronger and more athletic players, he will definitely need to have a bit more control and fluidity with his moves and in his movement and shouldn’t be too big of an issue. I think we are all extremely pleased and excited with how Benny looks so far, but I don’t think he gets away with everything he’s shown if this was P5 competition. There’s nothing wrong with this either, he’s a young player who’s playing his first collegiate minutes and is still growing into his body and will look more comfortable with increased game/practice reps. I don’t think he is quite used to just how immensely athletic he his at this stage and might take a little bit of seasoning to adjust. Benny has had dramatic growth and changes to his physical ability over the last few years and I thought it was pretty clear he needs to become a little bit more fluid in his step. And honestly man apart from all that, your response is a just a ‘little’ overly aggressive and I think it might be nice to take it down a notch next time you don’t agree with someone and also maybe go take another look for yourself before you demand someone else to.

There’s my piece anyway. Let’s all try to get along for the new season and not get so offensive about each other’s opinions. There’s lots of reasons to be optimistic with this team, but there’s also enough reasons to be cautious, across the board. Perceptions are bound to shift, not much is yet set in stone.

This is all good stuff except expecting a fanbase heavy on New Yorkers to get along is a tall order lol.

 

[hoopsupstate]

Benny might be our best rebounder and defensive forward, but he’s still a little challenged offensively. His best skill might be his passing. It was good to see him knock down his three free throws. He will only get better. He’s lucky that he’s playing with veteran players and can just fit in.

 

[721Comstock]

Marek was incredible but has to be the exception, not the norm. Just because Marek played the 5 id hate having JB just automatically assume our biggest 4 can also play the 5. We had to do it the last few years and we were lucky that Marek is about the only guy willing to play the 5, take charges, and throw his body around against ACC big men even though he was like 185lbs.

Other than last shot situations or times where we are extremely desperate on offense, Jimmy should never see the 5 - especially now that we have 2 healthy bigs who have potential and are clearly capable.

This is ALL true.

That said - you know how Boeheim do.

He's been using a F at the 5 since forever.
Going back to DC, and more recently with guys like CJ, Jerami, Rico, and Marek.
(CJ and Jerami were more "emergency 5's" - whereas with Rico and Marek he had options, but still went with them)

He absolutely, positively will play JBIII at the 5 for > 0 minutes this season.

 

[ar inj]

Coaches say what they are going to say, but watch the press conference from last night, even JB said III at the 5 is not a good luck and not to expect it. Would be a big bonus if the team could have Sidibe available for those 5 or 7 potential minutes

 

[General20]

Nice to see the Orange dominate a team it should. We haven't always done that the last few years even in exhibitions.

• I'm not sure what teams can do to disrupt SU's offense. As stated on broadcast JAB just has to hope 2 of his shooters are hot each game.
• I think the 35-40 minutes of a true 5 man crowd is going to be disappointed. I know we haven't seen it much but the Jimmy, Cole and Benny front line is going to play together for at least 10 minutes per game. Nothing against Jesse or Frank, love to see them involved but Benny is one of the best 5 players on the team now. And with 2 other 6'9" guys on the court we'll still have more size than we did at any point last year. Hey 30 minutes of Jesse/Frank are still 25 minute more than we saw last year also.
• Notice I say size. Rebounding is and will be a challenge. The HOFer could care less but taking Benny aside and asking him to focus on rebounding this year could be a difference maker. He is probably the only one capable of it. Really need Frank and Jesse to be active on the glass.
• Symir Girard III could be one of the best all around PG's in the history of the program. They check every box. Unfortunately they are not a single player. Fortunately they complement each other well and between them our PG play should be adequate.
• I'm less worried about the athleticism than I was. Benny, Symir and even Frank are athletic enough and some of our other guys are deceptive enough (Swider for his size) that when combined with our bench guys we can play with athletic teams.
• Joe, Buddy, Cole, Jimmy and Benny will be our closing lineup. Our 5 best players. Jimmy and Jesse/Frank will alternate offense/defense when possible/needed.

I came into these games thinking we would use the "small ball" line up often, because as you said, a feontcourt of three 6'9 players isn't actually that small at all, and you would think our best offensive line up would not include a center. But these two exhibition games changed my mind. SU looked noticeably worse on both offense and defense with Jimmy at the 5.

It needs to be taken into account that we are practicing this line up for a reason, and it's not to beat LeMoyne. In this game and the Pace game playing Jimmy at the 5 means giving up our best shot blocker and maybe rebounder in exchange for Jimmy going from being guarded by a forward who is slightly smaller than him to another forward who is slightly smaller than him. In otherwords there is no upside.

Against a team with a true center, you'd get the upside of Jimmy being able to pull him away from the basket and negate his shot blocking. Then you could have Jimmy beat him off the dribble or perhaps post up Cole (especially against teams with a 3 guard line up) and let him score over a smaller guy without worrying about help D from the center.

Still I'm having trouble getting over having no rim protection whatsoever. Dolezaj was a decent shot blocker. Some centers were too big and strong for him, but he did offer rim protection. Jimmy offers none.

And at least in the exhibitions the threat of a lob to Edwards or Anselem kept the D more honest than having Jimmy posting up did because he's harder to get the ball to.

 

[ORRange]

Because he had great exhibition games like Benny. The hyperbole for Benny is off the charts by some fans. He’s going to be good and likely better with Kaleb, but some of the comparisons are crazy.

What? Kaleb was the worst starter I've ever seen that ever played here. Even worse than Mike Edwards and your putting him in the same sentence as Benny. Now that's off the charts bad comparison. Laughable.

 

[Cusefan0307]

What? Kaleb was the worst starter I've ever seen that ever played here. Even worse than Mike Edwards and your putting him in the same sentence as Benny. Now that's off the charts bad comparison. Laughable.

Nobody thought that after the 2 exhibition games. Kaleb was the best player on the court for us those 2 games.

 

[Orangezoo]

I came into these games thinking we would use the "small ball" line up often, because as you said, a feontcourt of three 6'9 players isn't actually that small at all, and you would think our best offensive line up would not include a center. But these two exhibition games changed my mind. SU looked noticeably worse on both offense and defense with Jimmy at the 5.

It needs to be taken into account that we are practicing this line up for a reason, and it's not to beat LeMoyne. In this game and the Pace game playing Jimmy at the 5 means giving up our best shot blocker and maybe rebounder in exchange for Jimmy going from being guarded by a forward who is slightly smaller than him to another forward who is slightly smaller than him. In otherwords there is no upside.

Against a team with a true center, you'd get the upside of Jimmy being able to pull him away from the basket and negate his shot blocking. Then you could have Jimmy beat him off the dribble or perhaps post up Cole (especially against teams with a 3 guard line up) and let him score over a smaller guy without worrying about help D from the center.

Still I'm having trouble getting over having no rim protection whatsoever. Dolezaj was a decent shot blocker. Some centers were too big and strong for him, but he did offer rim protection. Jimmy offers none.

And at least in the exhibitions the threat of a lob to Edwards or Anselem kept the D more honest than having Jimmy posting up did because he's harder to get the ball to.

Yep. The experiment also lent itself to showing that Jimmy is much more deliberate than "quick" and that doesn't create the advantages you got with Marek. Defensively though, Jimmy is more limited than even Marek was. Marek got bullied but he had more length and bounce.

One minor nitpick of Jimmy is that for a left handed jump shooter, he doesn't use it frequently enough in the paint. He could have had a couple buckets switching to the left and he instead went into the defender or too far wide using his right.

 

[ORRange]

Nobody thought that after the 2 exhibition games. Kaleb was the best player on the court for us those 2 games.

Don't put words in my mouth, never said Bennie was. Enough of this BS with you. Kaleb stunk, Bennie doesn't. I know you'll want the last word so have it

 

[jsshap]

What on earth are you talking about? Benny has to play a little more under control. Clean your glasses. He had a perfect boxscore last night and played so smooth that I commented that the kid is the next coming of Erich Santifer. Erich was never out of control a game in his life. And after 2 games you determine that Bennie isn't ready for crunch time. Kaleb he isn't.

What on earth are you talking about? Benny has to play a little more under control. Clean your glasses. He had a perfect boxscore last night and played so smooth that I commented that the kid is the next coming of Erich Santifer. Erich was never out of control a game in his life. And after 2 games you determine that Bennie isn't ready for crunch time. Kaleb he isn't.

So to summarize - you draw definitive conclusions after 2 games and then, when it’s pointed out that they are a bit premature, break out the piss and vinegar and take issue with anyone drawing conclusions after 2 games that are counter to your conclusions after 2 games. On the flip side, if you actually made the santifer comment then that changes everything.

 

[pearl31]

Don't put words in my mouth, never said Bennie was. Enough of this BS with you. Kaleb stunk, Bennie doesn't. I know you'll want the last word so have it

your style of argumentation is... well, not so conducive to productive dialogue

 

[Goin' Deep]

Looks like we have to wait for the Battle for Atlantis to see what we have.
One thing is for sure...CUSE can shoot.

 

[ORRange]

your style of argumentation is... well, not so conducive to productive dialogue

Well Pearl I use to love sparring with Moqui, what ever happened to him?