WWE Thread

[Alsacs]

Here is the problem.
I honestly haven’t watched a second this week.
I watched the post-SS Raw didn’t watch SD though.
As Vince treats that show like the B show because Smarks used to prefer it.

The problem with uncreative is that they currently only care about 3 wrestlers and getting them over.
1. Roman Reigns
2. Charlotte Flair
3. Ronda Rousey.

The first one because Vince is convinced he is the only star on the roster because he has the look.
The last two because Vince and Steph want them developed into superior talents so they can main event WM 35.
That is going to be the main event of WM 35 Charlotte vs. Ronda so they have be superwomen and be booked super strong.
The problem is Bayley, Sasha, Becky and Asuka are all better but because Charlotte has Ric as her dad and Stephaine has to try and create Stone-Cold/Vince 2.0 with her and Ronda it’s hurting other wrestlers.

Vince-Stone Cold was awesome and both sides got wins even though Austin always won in the end. Stephaine gets beat up only by Ronda but she always comes back without being humbled and she gets hers.

Stephaine is the head of uncreative. Her husband does an excellent job with NXT. He is waiting for Vince to leave to make a move and force his changes on his wife.

Until Vince allows creative to let more wrestlers who are over get a chance it will just be 50/50 booking for everyone not in the top 3 and various tag matches each week.

 

[Symphony Steve]

I don't agree with your analysis of 'uncreative'. Vince is the head and he changes his mind every 30 seconds. Stephanie's key job is as the corporate spokesperson, she's not really doing creative any more, hasn't for awhile. The end of 2013, to be exact, when she was promoted to 'Chief Brand Officer'.


And here's why we won't know if Triple H will turn the tide until/unless he's in a position to do so: Booking an hour show once a week, especially when you have a loaded roster, is easy contrasted with booking AT LEAST 5 hours of TV every week while trying to build angles both short-term and long-term. They're burned out. It's about turning out 'product', and with a $2 billion-plus contract for TV product, I don't look for the on-air product to consistently improve any time soon.

 

[OrangeDW]

Ever heard an interview with Jericho? He is as astute on the business as anybody. He loves to reinvent himself and, right now, he has so many irons in the fire, including touring with his band Fozzy, organizing a wrestling cruise, and doing some niche TV programming, not to mention writing his next book, that he has little desire to do any one thing for an extended period of time.

Yes. I read his first 3 books, and used to listen to his podcast regularly.

Even if it ended up brief( like when Shawn Michaels won the title in 2002, or even Hogan earlier in 2002), I still think he time was right for him to win the title as face. It fit the storyline perfectly, he was white hot with the fans, and I prefer payoffs to Storylines at Wrestlemania that built up for a long time, especially for the title.

Even if it was a transitional title run, it would’ve been cool to see him win the title at Mania as a face off Owens and carry it until the next PPV at least.

If I recall, that’s basically what they did with the US title and him anyway? Should’ve been the world title. Putting that on a 50 year old returner who hadn’t wrestled in forever like Goldberg just really didn’t come off well to me.

 

[Alsacs]

I don't agree with your analysis of 'uncreative'. Vince is the head and he changes his mind every 30 seconds. Stephanie's key job is as the corporate spokesperson, she's not really doing creative any more, hasn't for awhile. The end of 2013, to be exact, when she was promoted to 'Chief Brand Officer'.


And here's why we won't know if Triple H will turn the tide until/unless he's in a position to do so: Booking an hour show once a week, especially when you have a loaded roster, is easy contrasted with booking AT LEAST 5 hours of TV every week while trying to build angles both short-term and long-term. They're burned out. It's about turning out 'product', and with a $2 billion-plus contract for TV product, I don't look for the on-air product to consistently improve any time soon.

Stephaine is the chief branding officer and head writer.
She has Vince’s ear more than anyone.
Kevin Dunn is a yes man who is head of production.
Stephaine is the head of creative.
HHH is the CFO and head of development.
HHH is doing his job. He has stocked the women’s division with insane talent and brought in good male talent.
Creative has done a horrible job.

 

[OrangeDW]

Here is the problem.
I honestly haven’t watched a second this week.
I watched the post-SS Raw didn’t watch SD though.
As Vince treats that show like the B show because Smarks used to prefer it.

The problem with uncreative is that they currently only care about 3 wrestlers and getting them over.
1. Roman Reigns
2. Charlotte Flair
3. Ronda Rousey.

The first one because Vince is convinced he is the only star on the roster because he has the look.
The last two because Vince and Steph want them developed into superior talents so they can main event WM 35.
That is going to be the main event of WM 35 Charlotte vs. Ronda so they have be superwomen and be booked super strong.
The problem is Bayley, Sasha, Becky and Asuka are all better but because Charlotte has Ric as her dad and Stephaine has to try and create Stone-Cold/Vince 2.0 with her and Ronda it’s hurting other wrestlers.

Vince-Stone Cold was awesome and both sides got wins even though Austin always won in the end. Stephaine gets beat up only by Ronda but she always comes back without being humbled and she gets hers.

Stephaine is the head of uncreative. Her husband does an excellent job with NXT. He is waiting for Vince to leave to make a move and force his changes on his wife.

Until Vince allows creative to let more wrestlers who are over get a chance it will just be 50/50 booking for everyone not in the top 3 and various tag matches each week.

I don’t even have a problem with Charlotte/Rousey being the end game. But Sasha should clearly be the “other one” that’s right there in the mix IMO.

Rousey is Rousey. They obviously have to push her while they have her.

I personally prefer Sasha, but I can understand Charlotte as “the one”. It’s at least close and they’re both great.

But Sasha hasn’t even been in the mix for a long time. I don’t get it.

 

[Alsacs]

I don’t even have a problem with Charlotte/Rousey being the end game. But Sasha should clearly be the “other one” that’s right there in the mix IMO.

Rousey is Rousey. They obviously have to push her while they have her.

I personally prefer Sasha, but I can understand Charlotte as “the one”. It’s at least close and they’re both great.

But Sasha hasn’t even been in the mix for a long time. I don’t get it.

I don’t have a problem with a strong women’s main event at WM as I am sick of Roman WM main events but again just like Roman they preannoint whom they want in the top spots.
It used to be you had to get over and work your way up.
Ronda was going to get a top spot sure but she was rushed to the belt and now any feud she has till WM she is going to eat that person up and that isn’t good. Ronda should have chased the belt a lot longer.

Charlotte is total nepotism. Again she has talent and is a legit star but no way should she have 7 title reigns this early in her career. Sasha, and Becky are both being shunned. I didn’t watch this week but after her attack at Summerslam I would have booked. Becky like Stone Cold in 1997. She is super over and will get cheered as a heel.

 

[OrangeDW]

Ok, just turned on Royal Rumble 91. While I’m quite familiar with Wrestlemania 7(91) as my childhood friend had it on tape and we watched it often, I don’t remember watching this Rumble, which at this point is AWESOME to find a major PPV from “my” era that I’ve never seen...


So the PPV starts by instantly going into the national anthem...numerous close ups of kids with bowl cuts(Vince... What???) , numerous closeups of American flags(ok, its the national anthem but, cmon this is a little extra but...what??...oh yeah)...Desert Storm had just started.

Wow. This is like some national artifact for war and ‘Merica! propoganda. Crazy seeing this through adult eyes. All setting up for that sudden turncoat Iraqi sympathizer Sgt. Slaughter to win the title(Good Lord), only for that American hero Hulk Hogan to win the title back from him at Mania)Double Good Lord). Even as a young child, I really didn’t give a crap about all that.

Holy crap with the bowl cut closeups though. Was it supposed to be more “touching” because they were kids? Wow. Brutal start. All I was hoping for was a good friggin Mr. Perfect match and Hart Foundation match. Can I get that?

 

[Alsacs]

Ok, just turned on Royal Rumble 91. While I’m quite familiar with Wrestlemania 7(91) as my childhood friend had it on tape and we watched it often, I don’t remember watching this Rumble, which at this point is AWESOME to find a major PPV from “my” era that I’ve never seen...


So the PPV starts by instantly going into the national anthem...numerous close ups of kids with bowl cuts(Vince... What???) , numerous closeups of American flags(ok, its the national anthem but, cmon this is a little extra but...what??...oh yeah)...Desert Storm had just started.

Wow. This is like some national artifact for war and ‘Merica! propoganda. Crazy seeing this through adult eyes. All setting up for that sudden turncoat Iraqi sympathizer Sgt. Slaughter to win the title(Good Lord), only for that American hero Hulk Hogan to win the title back from him at Mania)Double Good Lord). Even as a young child, I really didn’t give a crap about all that.

Holy crap with the bowl cut closeups though. Was it supposed to be more “touching” because they were kids? Wow. Brutal start. All I was hoping for was a good friggin Mr. Perfect match and Hart Foundation match. Can I get that?

Vince wanted to stoke patriotism as. A way to fill up the LA collesium for WM7.
Sgt. slaughter had nuclear heel heat by becoming pro-Iraqi. They were getting legit bomb threats wherever he went because fans were pissed. Vince wanted Sgt. to burn an American flag but he drew the line and said no.
However this push ended up failing as people didn’t want to support it and the idea of WM7 at the collesium was scraped and it was held at the LA Sports Arena.
The 91 Royal Rumble wasn’t a great show but I loved Roddy Piper’s over the top face commentary and how crazy he was when Sgt. ended up winning the belt thanks to Macho Man.

That setup the start of the Macho-Warrior retirement match at WM 7. Which was a great match.
The rest of the card was meh. Rockets-Orient Express was the best match next.

 

[OrangeDW]

Vince wanted to stoke patriotism as. A way to fill up the LA collesium for WM7.
Sgt. slaughter had nuclear heel heat by becoming pro-Iraqi. They were getting legit bomb threats wherever he went because fans were pissed. Vince wanted Sgt. to burn an American flag but he drew the line and said no.
However this push ended up failing as people didn’t want to support it and the idea of WM7 at the collesium was scraped and it was held at the LA Sports Arena.
The 91 Royal Rumble wasn’t a great show but I loved Roddy Piper’s over the top face commentary and how crazy he was when Sgt. ended up winning the belt thanks to Macho Man.

That setup the start of the Macho-Warrior retirement match at WM 7. Which was a great match.
The rest of the card was meh. Rockets-Orient Express was the best match next.

Rockers were also a cant miss at the time! They put on a great opener against Barbarian/Haku at Mania 7!

Like I said, I was watching regularly at this time. Just my parents(or anyone else I knew) didn’t shell out for the PPV at the time. So I know what happened but don’t think I’ve ever seen it beyond highlights. But thinking back to all the highlights they showed at Mania 7...Virgil’s face turn is coming!

Seriously though... still hoping for a good Mr. Perfect(IC champ)and Hart Foundation( tag champ) match as they were my two favorites at the time. *Mr. Perfect was the one heel I rooted for as a kid

 

[NineOneSeven]

Ok, just turned on Royal Rumble 91. While I’m quite familiar with Wrestlemania 7(91) as my childhood friend had it on tape and we watched it often, I don’t remember watching this Rumble, which at this point is AWESOME to find a major PPV from “my” era that I’ve never seen...


So the PPV starts by instantly going into the national anthem...numerous close ups of kids with bowl cuts(Vince... What???) , numerous closeups of American flags(ok, its the national anthem but, cmon this is a little extra but...what??...oh yeah)...Desert Storm had just started.

Wow. This is like some national artifact for war and ‘Merica! propoganda. Crazy seeing this through adult eyes. All setting up for that sudden turncoat Iraqi sympathizer Sgt. Slaughter to win the title(Good Lord), only for that American hero Hulk Hogan to win the title back from him at Mania)Double Good Lord). Even as a young child, I really didn’t give a crap about all that.

Holy crap with the bowl cut closeups though. Was it supposed to be more “touching” because they were kids? Wow. Brutal start. All I was hoping for was a good friggin Mr. Perfect match and Hart Foundation match. Can I get that?

Love watching attitude era ppvs

 

[Alsacs]

Love watching attitude era ppvs

I was just watching Backlash 2000.
Great show.
Rock-HHH rematch after WM 2000.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Ever heard an interview with Jericho? He is as astute on the business as anybody. He loves to reinvent himself and, right now, he has so many irons in the fire, including touring with his band Fozzy, organizing a wrestling cruise, and doing some niche TV programming, not to mention writing his next book, that he has little desire to do any one thing for an extended period of time.

Jericho is one of the most underrated ever imo. I think he’s top 10. His debut was unreal and his ability to juggle different careers and still perform to the level he has, in ring and character wise is truly amazing.

One of my favorites ever alongside Kane, angle, Christian, Austin.

 

[OrangeDW]

Rockers were also a cant miss at the time! They put on a great opener against Barbarian/Haku at Mania 7!

Like I said, I was watching regularly at this time. Just my parents(or anyone else I knew) didn’t shell out for the PPV at the time. So I know what happened but don’t think I’ve ever seen it beyond highlights. But thinking back to all the highlights they showed at Mania 7...Virgil’s face turn is coming!

Seriously though... still hoping for a good Mr. Perfect(IC champ)and Hart Foundation( tag champ) match as they were my two favorites at the time. *Mr. Perfect was the one heel I rooted for as a kid

Also - I remember I even tried to convince my childhood friends that Mr. Perfect was the “good guy” in his feud against the Big Boss Man. I completely ignored how the whole Heenan family targeted Boss Man and even regularly insulted his mother and focused on how Boss Man often resorted to using weapons(night stick, his belt at Mania 7, and how Perfect was obviously the better athlete and wrestler. In the back of my mind I both knew that I was BS’in but also thought I had a point. Lol. Regardless, Perfect was so good that he even had this kid who otherwise rooted for all the faces pulling for him. Though once he went against Bret Hart at summerslam(my number 1 favorite), I had to distance myself from Mr. Perfect a bit.

 

[OrangeDW]

I was just watching Backlash 2000.
Great show.
Rock-HHH rematch after WM 2000.

When Austin comes out hammering everybody in his way with chairshots? Gotta be one of the top 5 crowd reactions of all time. Maybe number 1?

 

[NineOneSeven]

When Austin comes out hammering everybody in his way with chairshots? Gotta be one of the top 5 crowd reactions of all time. Maybe number 1?

Definitely top 5 pop ever.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Love the wwe talk on here. Ironically a lot of the same people who post in the nba thread.

 

[OrangeDW]

Jericho is one of the most underrated ever imo. I think he’s top 10. His debut was unreal and his ability to juggle different careers and still perform to the level he has, in ring and character wise is truly amazing.

One of my favorites ever alongside Kane, angle, Christian, Austin.

Jericho and Bret Hart are my two all time favorites.

I was watching WCW way more than WWF at the time when Jericho really made his name in 98. I thought he was absolutely hilarious and a good wrestler. When he came to WWF in ‘99 it was a situation where I wasn’t really watching much on my own anymore but most of my friends were, so I caught his act on a lot of Monday nights by accident...and still thought he was hilarious.

I got back into watching wrestling right around the time he came back in 07-08 and really got into his angle with Michaels. Maybe the best angle ever. He pretty much single handidly kept me watching/following numerous times since then.

 

[OrangeDW]

The 91 Royal Rumble wasn’t a great show but I loved Roddy Piper’s over the top face commentary and how crazy he was when Sgt. ended up winning the belt thanks to Macho Man.
.

Piper...my God. Calm down. Stop screaming at me. Hard to believe they ever thought putting him on regular commentary was a good idea. Way too loud. Small doses, if that. My man is SCREAMING on me every time he talks! Lol.

Brings to mind those post Mania 7 days. Randy Savage had seemingly turned face at Mania 7 when Sherri started kicking him and then Elizabeth saved him after he lost. But on commentary(remember he lost a “retirement match” to Warrior at Mania and couldn’t wrestle anymore), he was staying true to the storylines and rooting against Warrior, still rooting against Hogan since they had major beef a couple years earlier. I feel like you’d never see that now.

 

[Alsacs]

Piper...my God. Calm down. Stop screaming at me. Hard to believe they ever thought putting him on regular commentary was a good idea. Way too loud. Small doses, if that. My man is SCREAMING on me every time he talks! Lol.

Brings to mind those post Mania 7 days. Randy Savage had seemingly turned face at Mania 7 when Sherri started kicking him and then Elizabeth saved him after he lost. But on commentary(remember he lost a “retirement match” to Warrior at Mania and couldn’t wrestle anymore), he was staying true to the storylines and rooting against Warrior, still rooting against Hogan since they had major beef a couple years earlier. I feel like you’d never see that now.

My favorite Piper on commentary story is he literally hated the Ulimate Warrior.
He started commentating at Summerslam 1990. He was a face commentator and rooted for the good guys in every match.
He would predict every face to win and he had just finished a program with Ravishing Rick Rude but because he hated the Warrior so much when he was asked who was picking in the Summerslam 1990 main event he picked his enemy Rude because he couldn’t stand Warrior.

Warrior was hated by the other wrestlers because he wasn’t good to them. Piper was the over top but that RR 1991 match he was off the hook yelling about not wanting Slaughter to win.

 

[OrangeDW]

My favorite Piper on commentary story is he literally hated the Ulimate Warrior.
He started commentating at Summerslam 1990. He was a face commentator and rooted for the good guys in every match.
He would predict every face to win and he had just finished a program with Ravishing Rick Rude but because he hated the Warrior so much when he was asked who was picking in the Summerslam 1990 main event he picked his enemy Rude because he couldn’t stand Warrior.

Warrior was hated by the other wrestlers because he wasn’t good to them. Piper was the over top but that RR 1991 match he was off the hook yelling about not wanting Slaughter to win.

LOL! This could be my mind playing tricks on me(no geto boys song reference intended lol), but I swear that Savage was rooting for Undertaker to put Warrior in the casket in that segment where they made it look like Warrior was going to die. Savage, after recently reuniting with Elizabeth to the tears of all the women in the audience, was all “he beat me at Wrestlemania! Stuff him in there, Taker!!” LMAO.

 

[OrangeDW]

A downside of the 80s-early 90s era...limited PPV per year. You can’t necessarily just click on a random PPV from that era and see a good match from your favorite wrestler.

Now, my one beef with WWE Network: how is WWE Primetime still only updated to July 24, 1989? That’s where it was the last time I was subscribed which was a good 5-6 months ago.

Primetime 1990-1992 was MY era. Where’s it at? Figured it would be there by now, anyone know what the holdup is?

 

[Symphony Steve]

Stephaine is the chief branding officer and head writer.
She has Vince’s ear more than anyone.
Kevin Dunn is a yes man who is head of production.
Stephaine is the head of creative.
HHH is the CFO and head of development.
HHH is doing his job. He has stocked the women’s division with insane talent and brought in good male talent.
Creative has done a horrible job.

She's not the head of creative any more. She was from 2007 to 2013.

 

[cuseinseattle]

I was just watching Backlash 2000.
Great show.
Rock-HHH rematch after WM 2000.

I watched 1999 Backlash last night myself. It was the Austin-Rock title re-match with Shane and ref. Such a great match. The video package before was awesome too. I had forgotten about the whole burying the smoking skull belt and the Austin comes out and hits the Rock and knocks him in the whole for the casket. With JR yelling the rattlesnake just knocked the rock six feet under. Classic stuff.

 

[cuseinseattle]

She's not the head of creative any more. She was from 2007 to 2013.

The way I have understood it is that Vince is really the head and HHH is actually the guy he most closely listens to. I don't think Stephanie is really the one driving the creative train but I could be wrong.

 

[cuseinseattle]

Jericho and Bret Hart are my two all time favorites.

I was watching WCW way more than WWF at the time when Jericho really made his name in 98. I thought he was absolutely hilarious and a good wrestler. When he came to WWF in ‘99 it was a situation where I wasn’t really watching much on my own anymore but most of my friends were, so I caught his act on a lot of Monday nights by accident...and still thought he was hilarious.

I got back into watching wrestling right around the time he came back in 07-08 and really got into his angle with Michaels. Maybe the best angle ever. He pretty much single handidly kept me watching/following numerous times since then.

Welcome to Monday Night Jericho!! He was always so good on the mic.