NBA Playoffs

[Alsacs]

Anything opinion based is fun. I don't take offense to other opinions. If people use logic anything is fine these type of opinions are completely subjective.
I love Carmelo for 2003 and him being Orange I just think the guy has fallen out of the top 20. Blame the triangle but the guy isn't as good as he rep IMO,

 

[OrangeDW]

Green is the one guy I would fight you on. He can do so much. Golden State can play the death lineup because he can play the 5, at least in spurts.

Yeah, defensively he'd be a beast anywhere.

And while he does a ton for that team offensively too, I don't think that side of his game would translate as well in a different system with different teammates. He does a lot well, but he's also in the perfect situation on that end of the court.

 

[OrangeDW]

Anything opinion based is fun. I don't take offense to other opinions. If people use logic anything is fine these type of opinions are completely subjective.
I love Carmelo for 2003 and him being Orange I just think the guy has fallen out of the top 20. Blame the triangle but the guy isn't as good as he rep IMO,

This is where I disagree. I feel the narrative on him has become so negative(because his team sucks) that he's now becoming underrated. I don't think he's declined much at all. He's just playing on a team with a bunch of retreads and rookies. While they weren't good with him, they were 0-10 when he didn't play. That's a Philly level roster, other than Melo.

 

[OrangeDW]

Wes Mathews?

Didn't even notice that. I liked him a lot in Portland and that achilles injury was very unfortunate, and maybe he'll bounce back. But he wasn't even a good player this year.

 

[Knicks411]

Yeah, defensively he'd be a beast anywhere.

And while he does a ton for that team offensively too, I don't think that side of his game would translate as well in a different system with different teammates. He does a lot well, but he's also in the perfect situation on that end of the court.

I do agree that he's in a great system for him offensively (is he a 39% 3 point shooter on most teams? I'd doubt it) but I also think he's a large (not the largest, of course) part of the reason that offense is so damn great. There aren't a lot of dudes that can both guard centers defensively and initiate offense as much as he does. Dude was 7th in the NBA in assists per game!

If I had to win a game tomorrow and I was drafting a roster from scratch, I would take Draymond over Melo.

 

[longislandcuse]

Y'all need to put some respek on Melo's name.

 

[Cusefan0307]

What are Melo's shooting %s?
Klay Thompson is the Warriors Scottie Pippen 2nd banana. He isn't as a tall but he is pretty good.

If you asked the 30 NBA GMs who would you pick right now between Carmelo and Klay you can only have one I think more would take Klay Thompson.

I'm mixed on this. I think Klay is great. What is he 2nd or 3rd team NBA this year? Anyway Melo was great in the Olympics in a standstill jumpshooting role, but they are trending in opposite directions. You can't debate that, but Melo actually finished with a higher PER than Klay this year.

 

[longislandcuse]

Better than Melo:

1. Lebron -yes
2. Steph Curry -yes
3. Kevin Durant -yes
4. Russell Westbrook - yes
5. Anthony Davis - yes
6. Kwahi Leonard - yes
7. Chris Paul -yes
8. DeMarcus Cousins - eh
9. Marc Gasol - no
10. John Wall - no
11. Klay Thompson - no
12. Blake Griffin -probably
13. Draymond Green -no (Draymond Green on NYK isn't doing a d**n thing)
14. Paul George -eh
15. Jimmy Butler -eh
16. Kevin Love -no
17. James Harden -no
18. Damien Lillard -no
19. Andre Drummond -no, but could be soon
20. Dwayne Wade -no

Then you got guys like Kyle Lowry (What, no), Hassan Whiteside (no). I think Melo has fallen down.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Draymond is the best player in the NBA that isn't a wing or guard IMO. Klay is just a great scorer/shooter than can play defense. His rebounding, assist and defensive metrics are below average. I take Melo over Klay.

 

[Knicks411]

I think Butler and George are better. They are really good two way players.

Marc Gasol is really good but you can make some of the same arguments against him that you can for Melo (both guys are getting old and aren't as good as they used to be).

Green is the one I am fighting to t he death on. To me it's a no brainer. He's like 100 times better on defense than Melo and he's a dynamite offensive player as well. He's not as good on that end as Melo, but he more than makes up for it on defense if you ask me.

Harden is an odd one because he's one of the few guys where if Melo is better, it's because of the defensive end. He's not as good offensively, but Harden is so eh on defense plus there's the chemistry factor.

 

[longislandcuse]

I think Butler and George are better. They are really good two way players.

Marc Gasol is really good but you can make some of the same arguments against him that you can for Melo (both guys are getting old and aren't as good as they used to be).

Green is the one I am fighting to t he death on. To me it's a no brainer. He's like 100 times better on defense than Melo and he's a dynamite offensive player as well. He's not as good on that end as Melo, but he more than makes up for it on defense if you ask me.

Harden is an odd one because he's one of the few guys where if Melo is better, it's because of the defensive end. He's not as good offensively, but Harden is so eh on defense plus there's the chemistry factor.

I can't put Green ahead of Melo when Draymond needs 2-3 other All-Star players around him in order for his talent to shine. He's not putting the team on his back and winning a game without Steph and Klay.

 

[OrangeDW]

I think Butler and George are better. They are really good two way players.

Marc Gasol is really good but you can make some of the same arguments against him that you can for Melo (both guys are getting old and aren't as good as they used to be).

Green is the one I am fighting to t he death on. To me it's a no brainer. He's like 100 times better on defense than Melo and he's a dynamite offensive player as well. He's not as good on that end as Melo, but he more than makes up for it on defense if you ask me.

Harden is an odd one because he's one of the few guys where if Melo is better, it's because of the defensive end. He's not as good offensively, but Harden is so eh on defense plus there's the chemistry factor.

Harden has some really good offensive skills, but he's the kind of guy that would make me leave a pickup run early if he was on my team. He's very good offensively, but a tough watch. Funny how Melo would get the ball-stopper and bad defender comments, but Harden is way worse in both regards(more of a ball pounder than a ball stopper though) from my observations.

 

[Knicks411]

I can't put Green ahead of Melo when Draymond needs 2-3 other All-Star players around him in order for his talent to shine. He's not putting the team on his back and winning a game without Steph and Klay.

I think that's a very narrow way of looking at things. Iso scoring is not the only way to win games. The guy is one of the best (and most versatile) defensive players and best passers in the league and he can score as well.

Harden has some really good offensive skills, but he's the kind of guy that would make me leave a pickup run early if he was on my team. He's very good offensively, but a tough watch. Funny how Melo would get the ball-stopper and bad defender comments, but Harden is way worse in both regards(more of a ball pounder than a ball stopper though) from my observations.

Harden definitely has the soft factors, so to speak, working against him. The guy is a really good passer though.

I was curious, I wanted to see how Draymond did without Steph on the court.

per 36 minutes, Green averaged 14/10/8 with Steph on the court, 59% true shooting.
With Steph off the court, he averaged 16/12/9, 56% true shooting.
You've got issues with sample size, but those numbers with Steph off the court are pretty damn great in their own right. Like I said, he's not a volume scorer, but that's not the only way to win games.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I think Butler and George are better. They are really good two way players.

Marc Gasol is really good but you can make some of the same arguments against him that you can for Melo (both guys are getting old and aren't as good as they used to be).

Green is the one I am fighting to t he death on. To me it's a no brainer. He's like 100 times better on defense than Melo and he's a dynamite offensive player as well. He's not as good on that end as Melo, but he more than makes up for it on defense if you ask me.

Harden is an odd one because he's one of the few guys where if Melo is better, it's because of the defensive end. He's not as good offensively, but Harden is so eh on defense plus there's the chemistry factor.

Agree about George and butler. They are top ten.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

I think that's a very narrow way of looking at things. Iso scoring is not the only way to win games. The guy is one of the best (and most versatile) defensive players and best passers in the league and he can score as well.



Harden definitely has the soft factors, so to speak, working against him. The guy is a really good passer though.

I was curious, I wanted to see how Draymond did without Steph on the court.

per 36 minutes, Green averaged 14/10/8 with Steph on the court, 59% true shooting.
With Steph off the court, he averaged 16/12/9, 56% true shooting.
You've got issues with sample size, but those numbers with Steph off the court are pretty damn great in their own right. Like I said, he's not a volume scorer, but that's not the only way to win games.

Steph may be the Warriors' superstar and glamour boy, but I think Draymond's their MVP. He's the swizzle stick that stirs that drink.

 

[Knicks411]

Steph may be the Warriors' superstar and glamour boy, but I think Draymond's their MVP. He's the swizzle stick that stirs that drink.

I can't go that far. Steph is still their MVP (his shooting makes everything go), but I've gotten into a few arguments wiht my brother and a buddy; I think Draymond is clearly better and more important to them than Klay.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

I can't go that far. Steph is still their MVP (his shooting makes everything go), but I've gotten into a few arguments wiht my brother and a buddy; I think Draymond is clearly better and more important to them than Klay.

I'm with you on that one. Draymond also is the team leader.

 

[longislandcuse]

Indiana is playing so far over their ability that it's getting annoying.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Griffin out rest of playoffs, likely Paul too.

 

[longislandcuse]

One of my favorite things about Toronto is watching Drake go super saiyan fan mode.

 

[OrangeDW]

Griffin out rest of playoffs, likely Paul too.

Wow. Awful news. After a regular season where very few stars got hurt, they are dropping like flies in the playoffs.

 

[NineOneSeven]

Yeah Paul George is definitely a top ten player in this league

 

[OrangeDW]

Yeah Paul George is definitely a top ten player in this league

When he's not playing like he's half asleep and when he's hot from 3, he's probably borderline top 5. He can be too up and down though.

Good 3 point shooter, good passer, great athlete. But I would say his driving/ball handling/shot creation is a notch below the top go to guys. He can't quite get to the rim or create space the way the truly elite offensive players can, and he's not really strong enough to do a lot of damage in the post.

I would also say that he doesn't have a ton of help either. His teammates are inconsistent. Way better than what Melo has though.

Defensively, he's top notch.

 

[Knicks411]

When he's not playing like he's half asleep and when he's hot from 3, he's probably borderline top 5. He can be too up and down though.

Good 3 point shooter, good passer, great athlete. But I would say his driving/ball handling/shot creation is a notch below the top go to guys. He can't quite get to the rim or create space the way the truly elite offensive players can, and he's not really strong enough to do a lot of damage in the post.

I would also say that he doesn't have a ton of help either. His teammates are inconsistent. Way better than what Melo has though.

Defensively, he's top notch.

I would agree he might not be quite top echelon offensively, though he's improved a lot with the ball in his hands off the pick and roll. (and to think he shattered his leg a few summers ago). Defensively the dude is a monster.

 

[SUintheVille]

Ugh, Celtics are done for another year. Bradley not being hurt would have helped. But they need a top FA for next year, or make wise 1st round picks, and/or pull off a big trade.