Concerning comment from HCDB | Page 2 | Syracusefan.com

Concerning comment from HCDB

OttoinGrotto said:
That we had a well rounded team at a time when our conference was down and we were able to leverage elite special teams into consistently favorable field position for us and unfavorable field position for opponents, an opportunistic defense good at forcing turnovers and getting off the field on 3rd down, and the most explosive offense our program has seen in decades, with a surprising number of players perform far above their recruiting rankings in all three phases of the game and this collection produced a ten win season.
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Hmmn.

And now the conference is suddenly “up?”

Not sure that’s widely known.

Our special teams are still good, with the same guys essentially.

Defense is good, except for MD.

Stock answer would have been to question OL, which is legit.

Arguably better RBs, similar WR’s.

But biggest difference is QB.

This can’t be that hard to see, right?
 
The legend that is ED continues to grow. In a couple of years, he will be a multiple-time Heisman Trophy winner. Lead us to multiple bowl games and a college playoff appearance and well as a HOF NCAA career.
 
No, he had a relief pitcher in two of them.

But we won 10 games.

Now you need to answer my question.

How many wins do you expect this year?
 
hungrychuck said:
Hmmn.

And now the conference is suddenly “up?”

Not sure that’s widely known.

Our special teams are still good, with the same guys essentially.

Defense is good, except for MD.

Stock answer would have been to question OL, which is legit.

Arguably better RBs, similar WR’s.

But biggest difference is QB.

This can’t be that hard to see, right?
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No, the conference is still down. I didn't say it was up.

Our special teams are still good, but we're not enjoying the same advantages in field position we consistently benefitted from last season. Partly because the offense isn't performing as well (we also came away with points on a very high percentage of drives last season, plus the slow starts, and offensive line being incapable of generating any kind of running game factor in here), partly the defense isn't performing as well and isn't as successful getting off the field on 3rd down as it was last season. That all limits the impact of special teams.

Look, you want to worship Dungey and the simpler explanation satisfies you, fine. But last season was a perfect storm of advantageous defense + productive offense + flawless special teams + schedule. We have not performed to the same level this season as last season in any of those aspects and it's showing up in the game results, even though the schedule is pretty similar.

I think people want the problem to be not having Dungey because in theory it's a simpler solution. "We just needta finda dual threat QB!!!" That's a lot more comforting thought than to figure out how to fix a whole busted offensive line and also recognize that maybe on defense and specials it turns out we clicked in an unusual way that's not super easy to repeat.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
No, the conference is still down. I didn't say it was up.

Our special teams are still good, but we're not enjoying the same advantages in field position we consistently benefitted from last season. Partly because the offense isn't performing as well (we also came away with points on a very high percentage of drives last season, plus the slow starts, and offensive line being incapable of generating any kind of running game factor in here), partly the defense isn't performing as well and isn't as successful getting off the field on 3rd down as it was last season. That all limits the impact of special teams.

Look, you want to worship Dungey and the simpler explanation satisfies you, fine. But last season was a perfect storm of advantageous defense + productive offense + flawless special teams + schedule. We have not performed to the same level this season as last season in any of those aspects and it's showing up in the game results, even though the schedule is pretty similar.

I think people want the problem to be not having Dungey because in theory it's a simpler solution. "We just needta finda dual threat QB!!!" That's a lot more comforting thought than to figure out how to fix a whole busted offensive line and also recognize that maybe on defense and specials it turns out we clicked in an unusual way that's not super easy to repeat.
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Well, it could equally be said that it’s easier to worship a system or a coach than to understand that this is 11-man tackle football won or lost by players, not by concepts.
 
Every position group on this team is as good or better with two exceptions. OL and QB.
The staff has to try and scheme around this. The majority of football experts say that one way to mask a weak OL is to spread the D out and play with tempo which is essentially Dinos offense. I realize he wants to run the ball to take pressure off Tommy but because it has been a complete and total failure he has put Tommy in 3rd and long all season long. This strategy has failed and will continue to fail. At this point he needs to spread Ds out, play fast, and get the ball out quickly.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
That we had a well rounded team at a time when our conference was down and we were able to leverage elite special teams into consistently favorable field position for us and unfavorable field position for opponents, an opportunistic defense good at forcing turnovers and getting off the field on 3rd down, and the most explosive offense our program has seen in decades, with a surprising number of players perform far above their recruiting rankings in all three phases of the game and this collection produced a ten win season.
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with great senior leadership which I will add has been a key ingredient to any good Syracuse football over the past 20 years
 
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he needs to finish strong,very strong to recruit better and show recruits he is not a one hit wonder. we do not have very good talent period. questionable coaching makes it worse.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
That we had a well rounded team at a time when our conference was down and we were able to leverage elite special teams into consistently favorable field position for us and unfavorable field position for opponents, an opportunistic defense good at forcing turnovers and getting off the field on 3rd down, and the most explosive offense our program has seen in decades, with a surprising number of players perform far above their recruiting rankings in all three phases of the game and this collection produced a ten win season.
Expand...
a lot of people seem to think losing conway , heckel, and martin didn't hurt us at all, which is nuts.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
No, the conference is still down. I didn't say it was up.

Our special teams are still good, but we're not enjoying the same advantages in field position we consistently benefitted from last season. Partly because the offense isn't performing as well (we also came away with points on a very high percentage of drives last season, plus the slow starts, and offensive line being incapable of generating any kind of running game factor in here), partly the defense isn't performing as well and isn't as successful getting off the field on 3rd down as it was last season. That all limits the impact of special teams.

Look, you want to worship Dungey and the simpler explanation satisfies you, fine. But last season was a perfect storm of advantageous defense + productive offense + flawless special teams + schedule. We have not performed to the same level this season as last season in any of those aspects and it's showing up in the game results, even though the schedule is pretty similar.

I think people want the problem to be not having Dungey because in theory it's a simpler solution. "We just needta finda dual threat QB!!!" That's a lot more comforting thought than to figure out how to fix a whole busted offensive line and also recognize that maybe on defense and specials it turns out we clicked in an unusual way that's not super easy to repeat.
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How bout that turnover margin this year.
 
OrangeDW said:
Wake last year and NC State this year weren’t preseason top 25 teams though.

Most people thought we’d be good. This season has been tough to take.
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Yep. No argument with that. I think our preseason ranking was justified. The OL and early LB problems torpedoed it.

I'm over it.
 
Coach Mac was able to put forth a consistent quality once his players were the framework. It could be that Coach Babers will need more time. What concerns me most is play-calling and OL. Certainly, the big uglies are the most difficult to recruit. However, his attempt to establish the run will not work without openings for our RB's. This staff must be more creative in finding ways to get yards, in the run game, until the OL is able to be more effective, at the point of attack.
 
hungrychuck said:
Hmmn.

And now the conference is suddenly “up?”

Not sure that’s widely known.

Our special teams are still good, with the same guys essentially.

Defense is good, except for MD.

Stock answer would have been to question OL, which is legit.

Arguably better RBs, similar WR’s.

But biggest difference is QB.

This can’t be that hard to see, right?
Expand...

1. We haven't played the rest of the conference. We've played the best team and a team like us that we lost to by 6.

2. Yup. OL is the right answer. But even digging a bit deeper, it's run blocking and blitz pickup.

3. QB bears some responsibility, yes. He holds the ball, gets panicky when blitzed, and is not a runner like Eric. But you cannot look at his performances and put it all on him. He's on pace to have the 2nd best passing output in the last 20 years.
 
Newhouser said:
It's year 4. We should be better. Dino has a lot to prove.
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This is kind of lame analysis.

"We know you beat a ranked VA Tech in year 1, #2 Clemson in year 2, and led the team to a 10-3 record in year 3 - but you sit at 3-3 in year 4 and you know what? You have a lot to prove."

C'mon. The "we should be better" part is fair, I guess. But we can't let a disappointing start poison the whole thing. If we finish 4-8, then year 5 will be important for the longterm outlook.
 
Janner said:
I'm confused, hes been here 4 years? How is this year 1? At a minimum, if going by his recruiting classes which is what I'm guessing he's gauging this by, wouldn't this be year 3 or at very worst year 2 with a very very large complement his players? I'm honestly confused at what he is trying to say here
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Year 1 "with a new group"...implying we are starting over with this group.
 
TheCusian said:
This is kind of lame analysis.

"We know you beat a ranked VA Tech in year 1, #2 Clemson in year 2, and led the team to a 10-3 record in year 3 - but you sit at 3-3 in year 4 and you know what? You have a lot to prove."

C'mon. The "we should be better" part is fair, I guess. But we can't let a disappointing start poison the whole thing. If we finish 4-8, then year 5 will be important for the longterm outlook.
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To each his own. For every Va Tech and Clemson I can counter with a Maryland or NC State. IMHO no rebuild should take four years without showing a level of consistency and an identity. What is our identity? Please don't sell me "fast".
 
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