2023 NY Mets thread

[sutomcat]

"Van Wagenen is getting a bit choosy with this comparison. As many pointed out to him, if we take Alonso’s 2018 season, Vientos is no match for the pure power. Only statistics which make Vientos look comparable were included."

"Roc Nation is where Van Wagenen works and they represent Vientos. It’s not unusual for agents to pump up their prospects early on. This only feels a little funny because we know that if Van Wagenen stuck around long enough in Queens he would have traded Vientos for a relief pitcher rental."

I hated Brody being the Mets GM. He was a disaster.. Dislike defending him for any reason.

That said. I think if one looks objectively at the minor league stats of Vientos and Alonso, it is hard to argue that Alonso is/was the better prospect.

The problem with Mark’s minor league stats are his first couple of years, when he just got out of HS and was making the transition to pro ball. Those stats are not very good.

It really wasn’t until he got to AA at Binghamton that he stepped up his performance to interesting levels.

Alonso was attending Florida during this same time period so we have no comparable stats for him during this time.

Anyway, let’s listen to whoever was making the argument that Brody was being ’choosy’ with the stats he chose to use and focus only on the best year Pete had in the minors, 2018, which he spilt between AA and AAA. (Pete also has 47 ABs in Binghamton in his AA stats from 2017 which are included in the AA numbers because they were not easy to pull out. He hit .311 for Bingo with 2 HRs that year so his performance was consistent with what he did in 2018).

So how does what Pete did at the highest levels of minor league ball compare to what Mark has done in AA and AAA to date?

Mark’s stats:

Pete’s stats:

Vientos has hit more home runs per at bat than Pete did at the AA level.

Pete hit for more HRs per plate appearance or at bat at the AAA level but he played at Las Vegas, at a ballpark that greatly inflates power hitting statistics. Mark has played at Syracuse, at a ballpark that at best is neutral for power. Further, the International League as a whole is a tougher place to hit HRs than the PCL.

I think their numbers are very comparable. Pete didn’t get to the big leagues until he was 24. Mark is still 23. And Mark seems to be improving his numbers every season. This year is his best.

If he stays with Syracuse all season, I think he has a good chance to be the MVP of the IL. Again, his numbers indicate he will be a fine power hitter in MLB.

Mark Vientos Minor Leagues Statistics | Baseball-Reference.com

Mark Vientos Minor Leagues Statistics including batting, fielding, prospect rankings and more on Baseball-Reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

Pete Alonso Amateur, College, Minor & Fall Leagues Statistics | Baseball-Reference.com

Pete Alonso Amateur, College, Minor & Fall Leagues Statistics including batting, fielding, prospect rankings and more on Baseball-Reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

 

[sutomcat]

Good article by one of us on what it is like being a Met fan.

Opinion | Why I Still Love the New York Mets (Published 2023)

We don’t watch sports for happiness; we watch for the human drama.

www.nytimes.com

 

[SWC75]

Such a great few wins! Team seems to be clicking all of a sudden which I’m happy about. Then I look at the standings and see they are still 6.5 out of a wildcard spot and need to temper my expectations. They put themselves in such a hole that they would need to extend this win streak to ten just to get to .500. Hoping they can slowly chip away the gap between them and the other wildcard teams. Ugh. They sucked me back in.

The key is that we are 27-5 when we get 6 innings from our starter. Our starting staff, which has never really been together due to injuries, is starting to come together. That suggests that a strong second half is possible.

 

[SWC75]

I hated Brody being the Mets GM. He was a disaster.. Dislike defending him for any reason.

That said. I think if one looks objectively at the minor league stats of Vientos and Alonso, it is hard to argue that Alonso is/was the better prospect.

The problem with Mark’s minor league stats are his first couple of years, when he just got out of HS and was making the transition to pro ball. Those stats are not very good.

It really wasn’t until he got to AA at Binghamton that he stepped up his performance to interesting levels.

Alonso was attending Florida during this same time period so we have no comparable stats for him during this time.

Anyway, let’s listen to whoever was making the argument that Brody was being ’choosy’ with the stats he chose to use and focus only on the best year Pete had in the minors, 2018, which he spilt between AA and AAA. (Pete also has 47 ABs in Binghamton in his AA stats from 2017 which are included in the AA numbers because they were not easy to pull out. He hit .311 for Bingo with 2 HRs that year so his performance was consistent with what he did in 2018).

So how does what Pete did at the highest levels of minor league ball compare to what Mark has done in AA and AAA to date?

Mark’s stats:
View attachment 229123

View attachment 229124

Pete’s stats:

View attachment 229125

Vientos has hit more home runs per at bat than Pete did at the AA level.

Pete hit for more HRs per plate appearance or at bat at the AAA level but he played at Las Vegas, at a ballpark that greatly inflates power hitting statistics. Mark has played at Syracuse, at a ballpark that at best is neutral for power. Further, the International League as a whole is a tougher place to hit HRs than the PCL.

I think their numbers are very comparable. Pete didn’t get to the big leagues until he was 24. Mark is still 23. And Mark seems to be improving his numbers every season. This year is his best.

If he stays with Syracuse all season, I think he has a good chance to be the MVP of the IL. Again, his numbers indicate he will be a fine power hitter in MLB.

Mark Vientos Minor Leagues Statistics | Baseball-Reference.com

Mark Vientos Minor Leagues Statistics including batting, fielding, prospect rankings and more on Baseball-Reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

Pete Alonso Amateur, College, Minor & Fall Leagues Statistics | Baseball-Reference.com

Pete Alonso Amateur, College, Minor & Fall Leagues Statistics including batting, fielding, prospect rankings and more on Baseball-Reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

I certainly hope Mark is 'the real deal' and if he becomes a second Alonso, I'm all in favor of it. I like Buck but his failure to gie Vientos the fulltime DH job, instead sending Vogelbleech up there, was a major missed opportunity to get Mark acclimated to MLB pitching.

That said, Who's Who in Baseball, (I've got them from the late 50's until they stopped publishing it), was always full of guys whose minor league numbers were never duplicated in the major leagues.

 

[sutomcat]

I certainly hope Mark is 'the real deal' and if he becomes a second Alonso, I'm all in favor of it. I like Buck but his failure to gie Vientos the fulltime DH job, instead sending Vogelbleech up there, was a major missed opportunity to get Mark acclimated to MLB pitching.

That said, Who's Who in Baseball, (I've got them from the late 50's until they stopped publishing it), as always full of guys whose minor league numbers were never duplicated in the major leagues.

Agree. Performance in the minors is not a guarantee of future performance in MLB.

Mark strikes out too much and right now is a defensive liability.

Long term excellence in MLB requires more than raw talent. To be great, you need to be really competitive and have to be able to make continual adjustments over time.

That stuff is hard to quantify but I think Pete has proven to be very competitive, tough and able to adapt.

Hopefully, Mark has the same intangibles.

 

[MSOrange]

 

[SWC75]

Imagine if he was hitting .270. Or .313.

Francisco Lindor Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Rookie Status & More | Baseball-Reference.com

Check out the latest Stats, Height, Weight, Position, Rookie Status & More of Francisco Lindor. Get info about his position, age, height, weight, draft status, bats, throws, school and more on Baseball-reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

 

[SWC75]

Isn't it about time the Mets batted Alvarez behind Alonso to give Pete some serious 'protection'?

 

[SWC75]

MSN

I'm not ready to give up on the season. But the real reason I posted this is the accompanying picture:

I couldn't help but think of this:

 

[Orangezoo]

Another nice win with some clutch hitting. Easy to forget Alvarez is only 21.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Isn't it about time the Mets batted Alvarez behind Alonso to give Pete some serious 'protection'?

Didn’t they try it for a while leading to a pretty big slump?

 

[SWC75]

Didn’t they try it for a while leading to a pretty big slump?

Per "Batting Order Positions", he's batted 5th in two games. They seem to like batting him batting 9th for some reason.

Francisco Alvarez 2023 Batting Splits | Baseball-Reference.com

Francisco Alvarez 2023 Batting splits statistics including season totals, platoon splits, home and away stats, clutch situations and more on Baseball-Reference.com

www.baseball-reference.com

 

[sutomcat]

Like so many Met starting pitchers, Verlander struggled early and a big error by Guillorme almost crushed him. But Verlander battled through early adversity and kept the Mets in the game.

Big games for Lindor and Alvarez, who have both brought their batting averages close to .250. Vogelbach is even showing signs of life.

Peterson starts tonight. With some off days coming and Quintana expected back soon, this might be his last start for the Mets for a while.

The Met brain trust is apparently discussing going to a 4 man rotation. Though they are also thinking about a 6 man rotation. The Eppler Era has been a very confused time.

Mets could use four-man rotation as pitching staff gets closer to full health

 

[OrangeFoo]

Like so many Met starting pitchers, Verlander struggled early and a big error by Guillorme almost crushed him. But Verlander battled through early adversity and kept the Mets in the game.

Big games for Lindor and Alvarez, who have both brought their batting averages close to .250. Vogelbach is even showing signs of life.

Peterson starts tonight. With some off days coming and Quintana expected back soon, this might be his last start for the Mets for a while.

The Met brain trust is apparently discussing going to a 4 man rotation. Though they are also thinking about a 6 man rotation. The Eppler Era has been a very confused time.

Mets could use four-man rotation as pitching staff gets closer to full health

A 4 man rotation with a bunch of older pitchers and a pretty poor bullpen seems… not the best idea?

 

[sutomcat]

A 4 man rotation with a bunch of older pitchers and a pretty poor bullpen seems… not the best idea?

And a pitcher who just came from Japan, where he has been pitching once a week his whole career….

Senga has pitched poorly on 4 days rest. That great effort he had a couple of days ago was with the 6 days of rest he has had his whole career until now…

 

[Orangezoo]

And a pitcher who just came from Japan, where he has been pitching once a week his whole career….

Senga has pitched poorly on 4 days rest. That great effort he had a couple of days ago was with the 6 days of rest he has had his whole career until now…

Make it make sense... I just don't get it.

 

[SWC75]

Like so many Met starting pitchers, Verlander struggled early and a big error by Guillorme almost crushed him. But Verlander battled through early adversity and kept the Mets in the game.

Big games for Lindor and Alvarez, who have both brought their batting averages close to .250. Vogelbach is even showing signs of life.

Peterson starts tonight. With some off days coming and Quintana expected back soon, this might be his last start for the Mets for a while.

The Met brain trust is apparently discussing going to a 4 man rotation. Though they are also thinking about a 6 man rotation. The Eppler Era has been a very confused time.

Mets could use four-man rotation as pitching staff gets closer to full health

Pete is stuck at .215, lunging for bad pitches with violent swings. If you are off-balance after the swing it should tell you that it's not a very good swing and that the pitch wasn't worth swinging at. The longest home runs come from smooth, balanced swings. Pete's looking like a weekend golfer at this point.

 

[SWC75]

You think we're having a frustrating season?

One run games: Mets 13-16, Padres 5-15

Extra Inning games: Mets 5-1, Padres 0-8. OH for 8!!!

 

[sutomcat]

Pete is stuck at .215, lunging for bad pitches with violent swings. If you are off-balance after the swing it should tell you that it's not a very good swing and that the pitch wasn't worth swinging at. The longest home runs come from smooth, balanced swings. Pete's looking like a weekend golfer at this point.

Agree. He has been lost for at least a month.

When he is right, he hits the ball where it is pitched and hits to all fields. Right now, it looks like he is trying to pull almost everything and swinging at bad pitches way too much.

To me, the key for him is plate discipline. He has periods where he takes balls and swings at strikes and when he is doing that, he is at his best. Seems like right now, he takes great pitches to hit thrown right down the middle to fall behind in the count and then swings at a pitch out of the strike zone to get another strikeout. He has developed an awful habit of hitting weak popups in foul territory near first base with amazing regularity.

Way too many ground balls to the left side. A lot of them are hit hard but right at the SS or 3B and become easy double plays.

Agree it looks like he is trying to hit the ball too hard, and makes no adjustments when he gets two strikes. He has regressed as a hitter and desperately need to change his approach.

 

[OrangeFoo]

Agree. He has been lost for at least a month.

When he is right, he hits the ball where it is pitched and hits to all fields. Right now, it looks like he is trying to pull almost everything and swinging at bad pitches way too much.

To me, the key for him is plate discipline. He has periods where he takes balls and swings at strikes and when he is doing that, he is at his best. Seems like right now, he takes great pitches to hit thrown right down the middle to fall behind in the count and then swings at a pitch out of the strike zone to get another strikeout. He has developed an awful habit of hitting weak popups in foul territory near first base with amazing regularity.

Way too many ground balls to the left side. A lot of them are hit hard but right at the SS or 3B and become easy double plays.

Agree it looks like he is trying to hit the ball too hard, and makes no adjustments when he gets two strikes. He has regressed as a hitter and desperately need to change his approach.

I think it’s mental with Pete… when the stress is on he loses all plate discipline. It’s why I question whether he can be the heart of a batting order that plays into November and wins.

 

[Frozen]

Question about Citifield’s clubs: which clubs have complimentary food and soft drinks? I have tix to Sunday’s game vs LA and have DeltaSky, Caesars, Piazza and Hudson club access.
Thanks.

 

[SWC75]

Mets end first half in an all-too-familiar way: ‘We’re going to try to refocus’

Once again the Mets fell behind early to end the first half on a sour note with two straight defeats after a six-game winning streak.

theathletic.com

Mets surprised as draft unfolds, ‘super excited’ with their early fortune

New York needed to wait a while before doing anything Sunday but liked how it all played out.

theathletic.com

(With Lindor locked in, we keep getting shortstops.)

 

[OrangeFoo]

Mets end first half in an all-too-familiar way: ‘We’re going to try to refocus’

Once again the Mets fell behind early to end the first half on a sour note with two straight defeats after a six-game winning streak.

theathletic.com

Mets surprised as draft unfolds, ‘super excited’ with their early fortune

New York needed to wait a while before doing anything Sunday but liked how it all played out.

theathletic.com

(With Lindor locked in, we keep getting shortstops.)

This kid is in high school though... who knows what he turns out to be in the future. If nothing else than trade bait?

Given all of the 7 to 10 year contracts we are seeing handed out these days across baseball, I'm really curious how this will impact player development. FWIW I think the Cubs also drafted a SS even though they have Swanson locked in for 7 years.

 

[ScrabbCuse]

Question about Citifield’s clubs: which clubs have complimentary food and soft drinks? I have tix to Sunday’s game vs LA and have DeltaSky, Caesars, Piazza and Hudson club access.
Thanks.

The Hyundai Club has complimentary food and soft drinks. Not sure about the ones you have access to. I think Delta has exclusive access to the Pat LaFrieda Steakhouse.

 

[Frozen]

The Hyundai Club has complimentary food and soft drinks. Not sure about the ones you have access to. I think Delta has exclusive access to the Pat LaFrieda Steakhouse.

Thanks.
Yeah, I asked on Reddit and they said the clubs i mentioned don’t have complimentary food. The tickets are from SNY, so I’m kind of surprised. But I shouldn’t complain since the tickets are free.