ACC, PAC-12, and BIG alliance / conference realignment

[HRE Otto IV]

Duke getting Stanford and UVa getting Cal as permanent opponents (if it's 4-4-4-4) would be a natural. Regardless of how the permanent opponents of the schedules are laid out, I'm firmly convinced that the 2024 schedule will have Stanford go to Durham and UVa go to Berkeley.

I agree that they are fits. However, Duke has a long history with UNC, NC State, Wake, GA Tech, and UVA. They would need to put Stanford ahead of two of those games to fit in. Would they want that? Playing those teams only once in 3 years? They already agreed to give up the later 2 with 3+5/5. So maybe. But the 3+5/5 meant 2 games over 4 years vs GA Tech/UVA. A 4+4/4/4 means only 2 games over 6 years. Going from yearly games to once in three years is a big jump.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

While Louisville is our permanent opponent right now, I believe that their fans and administration would like to switch to VPI because Blacksburg is 100 miles closer to Louisville than Charlottesville is.

Having Louisville vs UVA was the ACC being lazy when MD left. But that is why I think they will also be lazy going from 3 perm to 4 perm. I agree that Louisville vs UVA never made sense and that Louisville vs VA Tech makes a lot of sense.

 

[SU68]

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

I thought that the football teams traveled by charter flights. If so, what difference does it make if there are direct flights between cities or not?

 

[SUfaninAZ]

BC
Virginia
Miami
SMU

This would be ideal. I'm so over playing Pitt

 

[Cuse181]

Clemson Tigers

saturdayroad.com

More Rumors swirling about Clemson announcing plans to leave in October

 

[CousCuse]

Just to focus on the Catholic school thing, I think BC could gain more in recruti9ng from playing Pitt annually than SMU. Lots of Catholic school programs that produce talent within PA and border state OH.

There are many catholic prep schools everywhere producing good talent. BC really shouldn't have any problem recruiting, their problem is institutional as far as high level collegiate sports go. They really should go FCS for football.

 

[richmondcuse03]

Don’t when women for lax

I believe for women in basketball.

Men’s lax and Men’s hoops are definite

Women lax do too. I've seen them post about it online. When you get to those size teams, it tends to make sense.

 

[CousCuse]

Clemson Tigers

saturdayroad.com

More Rumors swirling about Clemson announcing plans to leave in October

It seemed like the reason the ACC added Cal,Stan and SMU had something to do with the league knowing that 3 teams were leaving soon. This way the league still meets the media contract requirements.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

It is kinda crazy that the 3rd closest team to SU is UVA. Which is why I wish SU would emphasize playing close games OOC. Looking at schools we have a history with I would rotate the below.

FCS: Colgate (2023), Holy Cross (2024), Fordham (2025 to replace Army?), Georgetown (add to 2027?), Villanova (add to 2028?)

None of those should be a challenge. They are all private schools and if we play them once every 5 years, there will be a hand full of road fans out of curiosity.

G5: Temple (add to 2029/30?), Navy, Army (2024 + ?), UConn (2024/25/26/27), USF, Tulane

Army and Navy will be hard to get. USF and Tulane were added as we have played them historically. Plus Tulane is private. Both Tampa and New Orleans are nice trips. If we have Miami or FSU as a perm, adding USF just means five Florida trips in 6 years. So almost once a year (good for recruiting). And if we don't have one as a perm, even better. Only 3 trips in 6 years.

Really don't get why we don't play Temple more often. Would be nice to play Temple 2 years and then UConn 2 years as a 4 year rotation. Then try to fit in the other 5 schools as your 2nd G5 game.

Alternatively we can play a MAC Ohio team every year if we really think it will help recruiting. Or UMass if it is in Gillette for the nice tailgating option. I wouldn't play any other G5s though. Well maybe UNLV once in a blue moon.

P4: Penn State (2027/28?), West Virginia, Rutgers, Maryland, Cincinnati, Notre Dame (2025/26), Northwestern

ND is part of the ACC contracted games. We have a history with the others and they are close by. Northwestern being a private school and a Chicago trip was included as well. Rotating these teams gives you variety and 17 years of scheduling.

If they ever went to two required P4 OOC, then keep those same teams but just play them more often. That takes care of 7 years of scheduling.


Since there are so many schools that we have a history with outside of the ACC and that are closer to SU than the teams in the ACC, our OOC scheduling should be a piece of cake. No reason to not have games scheduled out for 6 years in advance like most other schools do. The teams above are all winnable games (well maybe not Penn State), and they will draw fan interest more than most other OOC opponents.

 

[David321]

This guy is saying it’s happening

https://x.com/marcryanonair/status/1707046468631101929?s=46

 

[WoadBlue]

While Louisville is our permanent opponent right now, I believe that their fans and administration would like to switch to VPI because Blacksburg is 100 miles closer to Louisville than Charlottesville is.

I think so too. More Louisville fans would drive to Blacksburg than to Charlottesville, and more VPI fans than UVA fans would drive to Louisville.

 

[WoadBlue]

It seemed like the reason the ACC added Cal,Stan and SMU had something to do with the league knowing that 3 teams were leaving soon. This way the league still meets the media contract requirements.

There were only 3 that made even partial sense to add without paying hefty GOR/buyout. . Plus if you stand at 17, then you again make the case to ND that unless the ACC remains a truly Major conference. ND will be 'forced' to join the BT. So it is better for ND to play a few more ACC football games than to be in the BT.

SEC, BT, ESPN, and Fox people all want it to be always about how they are going to gain at the expense of th ACC. They have very strong biases and wish fulfillment desires.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

This guy is saying it’s happening

https://x.com/marcryanonair/status/1707046468631101929?s=46

That is cute. Didn't UConn officials say the B12 was a done deal too? Where are they now?

There is zero reason for the SEC to add Clemson now. The SEC contract is locked in until 2034. They cannot get paid more for adding Clemson. Even more so with the CFP keeping only 6 at larges, it will be a net loss. That is assuming Clemson even had the votes. Why would UGA, SC, Florida want even more competition for local recruits?

This makes zero sense for right now. Eight years from now, sure. But not now.

 

[Bayside44]

This guy is saying it’s happening

https://x.com/marcryanonair/status/1707046468631101929?s=46

Meh. Maybe but it's super vague.

 

[David321]

That is cute. Didn't UConn officials say the B12 was a done deal too? Where are they now?

There is zero reason for the SEC to add Clemson now. The SEC contract is locked in until 2034. They cannot get paid more for adding Clemson. Even more so with the CFP keeping only 6 at larges, it will be a net loss. That is assuming Clemson even had the votes. Why would UGA, SC, Florida want even more competition for local recruits?

This makes zero sense for right now. Eight years from now, sure. But not now.

I don’t know if this guy is right or not, just seems like a real bold move for him to put this out so confidently. I hope it’s not true.

 

[WoadBlue]

Having Louisville vs UVA was the ACC being lazy when MD left. But that is why I think they will also be lazy going from 3 perm to 4 perm. I agree that Louisville vs UVA never made sense and that Louisville vs VA Tech makes a lot of sense.

Cards replacing Maryland was done because that would be the only change. Adding 3 makes for big changes - there is no possible one for one swap. So now is the time to readjust everything including the 3 annual rivals deal.

If we all get 4, I do NOT want Wake added to UVA, Dook, and NCSU (all of which I and almost other UNC football fans would want to keep). I would want Clemson as our 4th, and if not, Miami or FSU. Then I would want GT.

 

[Bayside44]

I don’t know if this guy is right or not, just seems like a real bold move for him to put this out so confidently. I hope it’s not true.

He's just a guy. All the Twitter / X prediction stuff is just upside. Someone can take their internet glory ride if true and if not who cares.

 

[WoadBlue]

Meh. Maybe but it's super vague.

Super vague indeed.

Cal, Stanford, and especially SMU giving up money to join buys time for the rest of the league. Part of that time will be used to get everyone to agree that a portion of the TV revenue must be distributed to those schools that draw the most TV viewers. Wake and BC certainly will always oppose that, but even for them, it is better to do that than to have the most valuable 4 -6 or even 8 members leave.

So how does a school like Syracuse guarantee it draws TV audiences that are larger than those it has been drawing (other than having back to 10-2 teams)? Improve OOC scheduling, with a focus on large student body state school foes. Cincy, UCF, USF are all that, and also are located in areas with huge numbers of recruits. Even FAU has 30K students. Temple certainly is large.

 

[DocFlanders]

Do Clem and FSU even have landing spots right now? I know conferences won't tip their hand publicly right now and this is all done through backchannels, but I hope FSU bolts and has to go indy (or Big12) because SEC and Big10 do not bite...

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Super vague indeed.

Cal, Stanford, and especially SMU giving up money to join buys time for the rest of the league. Part of that time will be used to get everyone to agree that a portion of the TV revenue must be distributed to those schools that draw the most TV viewers. Wake and BC certainly will always oppose that, but even for them, it is better to do that than to have the most valuable 4 -6 or even 8 members leave.

So how does a school like Syracuse guarantee it draws TV audiences that are larger than those it has been drawing (other than having back to 10-2 teams)? Improve OOC scheduling, with a focus on large student body state school foes. Cincy, UCF, USF are all that, and also are located in areas with huge numbers of recruits. Even FAU has 30K students. Temple certainly is large.

That is a silly take. You don't give more money now to a school who will eventually leave anyway.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Just think about this...

-Why would ESPN want to pay more money for content that they already own long term? In the future, sure but not now.

-Clemson in the ACC is worth more to ESPN than Clemson in the SEC. In one conference they are just another team. In the other they elevate interest in the game and make it marketable. Why would ESPN want to devalue the ACC now?

-ESPN owns Clemson's TV rights, so they cannot go to the B18.

-Why would the SEC want Clemson? They don't get more money. It makes it harder for every team to make the playoffs. It makes it harder to recruit GA and FLA.


So who besides benefits besides just Clemson? ESPN is worse off, as is the SEC.

 

[longtimefan]

These are the current 3 perms. I doubt much will change for this. We are more likely to see one team added to each.

BC- Miami, Pitt, SU
Clemson- FSU, GA Tech, NC State (add Wake?)
Duke- UNC, NC State, Wake (add GA Tech?)
FSU- Clemson, Miami, SU (keep SU or add BC?)
GA Tech- Clemson, Louisville, Wake (add Duke?)
Louisville- GA Tech, Miami, UVA
Miami- BC, FSU, Louisville (add Pitt?)
UNC- Duke, NC State, UVA (add Wake?)
NC State- Clemson, Duke, UNC (add Wake?)
Pitt- BC, SU, VA Tech (add Miami?)
SU- BC, FSU, Pitt (just don't add Louisville)
UVA- Louisville, UNC, VA Tech
VA Tech- Pitt, UVA, Wake (add Miami?)
Wake- Duke, GA Tech, VA Tech (add Clemson, UNC, NC State?)


That is your starting template. There won't be a lot changed from those. The bold are the games that I think definitely stay. Then you will need to add some of the teams to Cal, Stanford, SMU.

Re: FSU as a "permanent" SU opponent--

FSU president went public confirming that they were lobbying for a regular opponent in the Northeast because of their large alumni base up here. Considering the way they have whined, demanded a larger piece of the pie, and made it abundantly clear they will leave the conference as soon as it is feasible, why should the ACC do them any favors? Give them the worst matchups you can come up with.

 

[baggerbob]

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

The only school in the ACC that I wouldn't mind never Playing is FSU, let them play BC and Pitt. We have nothing in common with them in any way.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Re: FSU as a "permanent" SU opponent--

FSU president went public confirming that they were lobbying for a regular opponent in the Northeast because of their large alumni base up here. Considering the way they have whined, demanded a larger piece of the pie, and made it abundantly clear they will leave the conference as soon as it is feasible, why should the ACC do them any favors? Give them the worst matchups you can come up with.

That is very true.


If we break it down by location...

Louisville
No reason to have them yearly. Not a good location. Not a like school. No real history.

UVA/VA Tech
We really should have one of these two as a perm. But not both. Four games in 6 years is enough. UVA makes more sense IMO. A tad closer. More similar athletically and fanbase wise. We have a history with VA Tech but the 90s and 00s aren't coming back for either program.

UNC/NC State/Duke/Wake
We don't want any of these schools. Four trips in 6 years is plenty. No need to play there every year by having a perm.

Clemson/GA Tech
Two games in 6 years is probably enough for the area. We don't really need four.

FSU/Miami
Only 2 games in 6 years is a bit light. Would be better to have four. Then again we could play OOC vs a Fla school to make up for it. Playing FSU yearly makes little sense.

Stanford/Cal
Two games in 6 years is enough for the area. We don't need four. That is a long trip for the players to recover from. Our West Coast alumni have a game every 3 years vs 0.0 they get now. Having two in 3 years is greedy.

SMU
I think it would be too hard to be a real player in Texas recruiting. One game in 6 years is probably enough to get a random kid. We have in the past with zero games. Having three games in 6 years won't open the flood gates.


So I think it has to be BC, Pitt, a VA school, and then one of Miami, GA Tech, or SMU. If it is GA Tech or SMU we should schedule OOC USF or FAU to get a 3rd Fla game over that 6 year period.

I think anyone else as a perm would be bad for the program.

 

[sutomcat]

I thought that the football teams traveled by charter flights. If so, what difference does it make if there are direct flights between cities or not?

I am still not convinced the soccer teams travels by charter flights. Or women's lacrosse, field hockey or softball. I will flat out say there is no way this is the case.

Even for the sports that do usually fly via charter, I am pretty sure it is far more expensive to charter a flight to San Francisco than to say Charlottesville. And I suspect that teams that normally travel by charter might take commercial flights if the cost to do so is significantly less than chartering. Which it will be for flying to San Francisco.

I guess we will find out soon enough.