ACC, PAC-12, and BIG alliance / conference realignment

[sutomcat]

Saw this on another board I visit as a proposed scheduling system for the new ACC. It's a 4-4-4-4 system, 4 permanent opponents and 3 slates of 4 opponents that rotate after home-and-home. Each team would get to play every other in a 6-year cycle. This keeps the conference schedule at 8 games, so the teams with SEC rivals don't lose an OOC game. IT IS NOT PODS, One poster proposed a swap so that NC State gets Clemson and Wake gets FSU to keep the Textile Bowl going. Going to this system also would allow the ACC to keep from having to choose whether UVa or NCSU is UNC's second permanent opponent in 2-7-7 and the resumption of the Duke-Ga Tech. match-up which had been continuous since 1937 until this year.

UVA: VPI, Ga Tech, Cal, UNC
UNC: Carolina 3, UVA
NC St: Carolina 3, FSU
Wake: Carolina 3, Clemson
Duke: Carolina 3, Ga Tech
Ga Tech: Clemson, Duke, UVA, Stan
Clemson: Ga Tech, Miami, FSU, Wake
FSU: Clemson, Miami, NC St, SMU
VPI: UVA, Pitt, Lou, Miami
Miami: FSU, VPI, Clemson, Syracuse
Syracuse: Pitt, BC, Miami, Stan
Pitt: BC, VPI, Cuse, Lou
BC: Lou, Cuse, Pitt, Cal
Lou: Pitt, VPI, SMU, BC
Stanford: Cal, Ga Tech, SMU, Cuse
Cal: Stan, UVA, SMU, BC
SMU: Cal, Stan, FSU, Lou

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

 

[CousCuse]

And that talent isn't going to SU just because we play SMU in DFW 3 times in 6 years vs only 1x.

You invite recruits and their parents to the game when you play there, personal contact with the coaches and team.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

BC, Pitt, UVA are the three closest schools to us (only 3 within 375 miles). It would be nice to have them and one distance game. I think Miami given our history and current recruiting ties (which take years to develop), makes the most sense. Then GA Tech. Cal and Stanford given the distance and time zone change make the least sense. SMU is stuck in the middle. I want nothing to do with playing FSU which is in Alabama. Or Clemson who is too good.

1. Miami
2. GA Tech
3. SMU
4. Clemson
5. FSU
6. Stanford
7. Cal

 

[HRE Otto IV]

You invite recruits and their parents to the game when you play there, personal contact with the coaches and team.

1. It takes years to develop recruiting ties.

2. What you are saying is like Kansas wanting to play UCF every year for Florida recruits. Those kids will want to go to the SEC first, and then the ACC.

 

[sutomcat]

BC, Pitt, UVA are the three closest schools to us (only 3 within 375 miles). It would be nice to have them and one distance game. I think Miami given our history and current recruiting ties (which take years to develop), makes the most sense. Then GA Tech. Cal and Stanford given the distance and time zone change make the least sense. SMU is stuck in the middle. I want nothing to do with playing FSU which is in Alabama. Or Clemson who is too good.

1. Miami
2. GA Tech
3. SMU
4. Clemson
5. FSU
6. Stanford
7. Cal

From a Syracuse perspective, I agree. BC, Pitt, UVa and Miami would be ideal.

Pitt and BC are givens.

We have a lot of alums/fans in the DC metro area and we recruit that area hard. UVa would be great for us. It is even a somewhat reasonable drive.

Miami is great for recruiting purposes and again, we have a strong presence with fans and alums close by. Also great for us.

In a situation like this, we are going to get Pitt and BC. Maybe we get one of UVa or Miami. No way we get everything we want. I am sure a lot of schools want Miami and UVa as rivals.

We surely are going to get someone we don't want. That has historically been UL. I suspect it will be SMU now. I would be really surprised if any ACC school without direct flights to San Francisco is made a rival of Stanford or Cal.

If we have to play a school we don't have a strong alum presence or strong recruiting ties to, that is not geographically nearby, SMU makes sense. Now I know SU is targeting students in California and wants to expand its presence there. So maybe the chancellor's office will intervene here and lobby for Stanford for student recruiting purposes. I know we have a lot of monied and influential alums in California too that will probably lobby hard for a California rival for Syracuse.

 

[kcsu]

You really want 4 trips to San Fran every 6 year vs only 2 trips?

Yes absolutely. I think we can recruit the west coast better than texas

 

[richmondcuse03]

From a Syracuse perspective, I agree. BC, Pitt, UVa and Miami would be ideal.

Pitt and BC are givens.

We have a lot of alums/fans in the DC metro area and we recruit that area hard. UVa would be great for us. It is even a somewhat reasonable drive.

Miami is great for recruiting purposes and again, we have a strong presence with fans and alums close by. Also great for us.

In a situation like this, we are going to get Pitt and BC. Maybe we get one of UVa or Miami. No way we get everything we want. I am sure a lot of schools want Miami and UVa as rivals.

We surely are going to get someone we don't want. That has historically been UL. I suspect it will be SMU now. I would be really surprised if any ACC school without direct flights to San Francisco is made a rival of Stanford or Cal.

If we have to play a school we don't have a strong alum presence or strong recruiting ties to, that is not geographically nearby, SMU makes sense. Now I know SU is targeting students in California and wants to expand its presence there. So maybe the chancellor's office will intervene here and lobby for Stanford for student recruiting purposes. I know we have a lot of monied and influential alums in California too that will probably lobby hard for a California rival for Syracuse.

Newhouse pulls in a ton of Cali kids. I can see merits.

 

[richmondcuse03]

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

The athletes will be flying chartered flights most likely so I doubt it matters that much, even for the non rev teams. It matters more for the fans.

 

[CousCuse]

1. It takes years to develop recruiting ties.

2. What you are saying is like Kansas wanting to play UCF every year for Florida recruits. Those kids will want to go to the SEC first, and then the ACC.

You have to start somewhere. If the choice SMU or Stanford, I think SMU is better for Syracuse,

Yes absolutely. I think we can recruit the west coast better than texas

How many people do you think will show up for a Syracuse game in Palo Alto?

 

[sutomcat]

The athletes will be flying chartered flights most likely so I doubt it matters that much, even for the non rev teams. It matters more for the fans.

For football, I agree. Does SU charter planes for any other sports? Maybe men's basketball for a handful of games?

Still not sure what the plan is for Olympic sports. If there are 4 rival schools for football, I assume that will also be the case for men's and women's basketball.

What about men's and women's soccer? Women's lacrosse? Softball? Volleyball? Tennis?

 

[Bayside44]

For football, I agree. Does SU charter planes for any other sports? Maybe men's basketball for a handful of games?

Still not sure what the plan is for Olympic sports. If there are 4 rival schools for football, I assume that will also be the case for men's and women's basketball.

What about men's and women's soccer? Women's lacrosse? Softball? Volleyball? Tennis?

Hoops and lax are all charter.

 

[sutomcat]

Hoops and lax are all charter.

Women and men? Even to California?

Wow. Impressive.

 

[longtimefan]

I believe it's the same studio used by PTI & it's located in the ABC operations in D.C.

The PTI hosts are out of that studio much more than they are in it.

 

[Bayside44]

Women and men? Even to California?

Wow. Impressive.

Dunno on the ladies. They should.

 

[JRHEETER]

Women and men? Even to California?

Wow. Impressive.

Don’t when women for lax

I believe for women in basketball.

Men’s lax and Men’s hoops are definite

 

[atom58]

Interesting article. Looks like Texas and Oklahoma are getting out for free? So much for the B12 GOR and B12 exit fee.

If true, they are forgoing B12 revenue for next year, which makes no sense. They won't be in the conference! Why would they get paid? The B12 got completely hosed.

Also the 4 team addition this year means payouts are divided by 14 vs 10, which is less money for all the schools. So if they paid out $40M last year, this year teams will only get $33M instead (the 4 new teams are only getting $18M and not a full share).

And why would the B12 count that reduced $7M as part of the exit agreement when it is applied to every team?

Also interesting Texas/Oklahoma will miss out on most of the SEC money in year 1. In the ACC, SMU will give up money for several years and Stanford/Cal are taking reduced shares for several years. Same as Oregon/Washington to the B18. But in the B12? They had to give a $2.5M bonus to Colorado to get them to leave the PAC! That should tell you about where the B12 stands.

Yormark isn't looking to be the genius some have made him out to be.

This is interesting if the report is true. The ACC is still 3rd due to it's TV network which the B12 does not have. I think the Pac2 will backfill with MWC teams in a reverse merger for the same reason. They do have a TV network which they own outright and with more teams they could float a "request for proposal" to Fox Sports, CBS Sports, NBC, and ESPN/ABC and go with highest bidder. Whether there will remain a P5 is uncertain. A chart I saw recently however did show a downward trend line for cable and even broadcast TV viewership and upward for streaming so that gravy train will end some time in the future.

 

[JRHEETER]

Women and men? Even to California?

Wow. Impressive.

Women bball are charter flights from what I can tell by looking through their insta

 

[FloridaCuse]

The PTI hosts are out of that studio much more than they are in it.

Tony has said he'll never be in the studio again.

 

[WoadBlue]

Yes, and if Syracuse played there every other year and made contacts and friends there with the high school football people, they could get some great recruits. Syracuse and BC, though I don't see BC wanting to play SMU every year, need that more than any of the other teams in the ACC because of the lack of high school talent in their regions.

Just to focus on the Catholic school thing, I think BC could gain more in recruti9ng from playing Pitt annually than SMU. Lots of Catholic school programs that produce talent within PA and border state OH.

 

[Consigliere]

From a practical standpoint, pairing Syracuse and Stanford does not make sense. There are no direct flights. Half the ACC schools have direct flights to San Fran, including Raleigh, so I think Stanford's rivals should all be schools with direct flights.

I think we should be paired with SMU instead (Syracuse does have a direct flight to Dallas). It would save a lot of money and be a lot easier on the athletes.

Of course the teams charter, so the direct flights would only be something that would be good for fans who travel,

From a legacy perspective I would like to see our permanent rivals in a 4-4-4-4 (in my best Moses Malone voice) series be BC, Pitt, Va. Tech and Miami (or Louisville). But would be happy swapping out the fourth with SMU.

 

[SURules]

Of course the teams charter, so the direct flights would only be something that would be good for fans who travel,

From a legacy perspective I would like to see our permanent rivals in a 4-4-4-4 (in my best Moses Malone voice) series be BC, Pitt, Va. Tech and Miami (or Louisville). But would be happy swapping out the fourth with SMU.

For me as someone else said I believe: BC and Pitt are obvious then add UVA as they are close, a solid team with great academics, good recruiting area, alumni in the area, and it would be great for the school to associate with UVA more. Then #4 is either Miami, GT, Stanford, or Cal. I want no part of Louisville at all as they do nothing for SU. Give FSU to someone else too.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

At this point it looks like we will have a P4 and G5, so only 9 conferences. The playoff is staying at Top 6 conference champs. Why not go all in with everyone conference champs, while also adding more at larges? We can have the below:

Top 3 conference champs make the Quarterfinals
Next 3 conference champs and Top 3 at larges make the 2nd round
Last 3 conference champs and next 5 at larges play in the 1st round

Based off of last season...

1st Round
17. Western Kentucky at 10. Tennessee
16. Toledo at 11. K State
15. Troy at 12. USC
14. Washington at 13. Penn State

2nd Round
Washington/Penn State at 4. TCU
Troy/USC at 5. Ohio State
Toledo/K State at 6. Bama
WKU/Tennessee at 7. Utah
9. Tulane at 8. Oregon State

Quarterfinals
Tulane/Oregon State at 1. UGA
WKU/Tennessee/Utah at 2. Michigan
Toledo/K State/Bama at 3. Clemson
Troy/USC/Ohio State at 4. TCU

Semis
4. Ohio State vs 1. UGA
3. Bama vs 2. Michigan

Final
2. Bama vs 1. UGA

 

[Hoo's That]

Let me toss out some thoughts: I really like UVA with Cal, and I think along those lines that Stanford should play UNC or Dook annually. Incorporate that pair right into the heart of the original ACC with an annual rival that is also an Elite school.

{snip}

Duke getting Stanford and UVa getting Cal as permanent opponents (if it's 4-4-4-4) would be a natural. Regardless of how the permanent opponents of the schedules are laid out, I'm firmly convinced that the 2024 schedule will have Stanford go to Durham and UVa go to Berkeley.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

For me as someone else said I believe: BC and Pitt are obvious then add UVA as they are close, a solid team with great academics, good recruiting area, alumni in the area, and it would be great for the school to associate with UVA more. Then #4 is either Miami, GT, Stanford, or Cal. I want no part of Louisville at all as they do nothing for SU. Give FSU to someone else too.

I think it would be bad for the team competitively to make all those trips to San Fran. Too taxing physically. I think it is best to have BC, Pitt, one of the VA schools (UVA is best option IMO), and one of Miami/GA Tech/SMU.

 

[Hoo's That]

These are the current 3 perms. I doubt much will change for this. We are more likely to see one team added to each.

BC- Miami, Pitt, SU
Clemson- FSU, GA Tech, NC State (add Wake?)
Duke- UNC, NC State, Wake (add GA Tech?)
FSU- Clemson, Miami, SU (keep SU or add BC?)
GA Tech- Clemson, Louisville, Wake (add Duke?)
Louisville- GA Tech, Miami, UVA
Miami- BC, FSU, Louisville (add Pitt?)
UNC- Duke, NC State, UVA (add Wake?)
NC State- Clemson, Duke, UNC (add Wake?)
Pitt- BC, SU, VA Tech (add Miami?)
SU- BC, FSU, Pitt (just don't add Louisville)
UVA- Louisville, UNC, VA Tech
VA Tech- Pitt, UVA, Wake (add Miami?)
Wake- Duke, GA Tech, VA Tech (add Clemson, UNC, NC State?)


That is your starting template. There won't be a lot changed from those. The bold are the games that I think definitely stay. Then you will need to add some of the teams to Cal, Stanford, SMU.

While Louisville is our permanent opponent right now, I believe that their fans and administration would like to switch to VPI because Blacksburg is 100 miles closer to Louisville than Charlottesville is.