Coach P

[Townie72]

MacPherson failed miserably when he left Syracuse too. He was completely overmatched with the Patriots. Laughably so.

I don't know why we're so embarassed by P's success. He fizzled out at the end but to fizzle out you need to have been successful.

Not sure it's desperation. I think it's appreciation of a wonderful era for Syracuse football.

The reason it's desperation is it makes it look like it's the only thing we have to celebrate. Drawing attention to the 1990's makes the current struggles look worse by comparison.

I'm not sure "Tradition" sells like it used to.

We've forgiven and feted the players who quit the team in 1970. We've renamed things after Ernie and we've recognized everyone from Jim Brown to Jim Ridlon and up to McNabb. And it doesn't appear to have helped all that much.

 

[Townie72]

The game, and society, may have started to pass by Ben toward the end, too. But that didn't diminish his accomplishments, nor should it those of Pasqualoni.

You are comparing P to Schwartzwalder?

They aren't even in the same universe as SU figures of importance.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

The reason it's desperation is it makes it look like it's the only thing we have to celebrate. Drawing attention to the 1990's makes the current struggles look worse by comparison.

I'm not sure "Tradition" sells like it used to.

We've forgiven and feted the players who quit the team in 1970. We've renamed things after Ernie and we've recognized everyone from Jim Brown to Jim Ridlon and up to McNabb. And it doesn't appear to have helped all that much.

Agreed, we have been doing shite like this for 15 years now it just wreaks of desperation, so sick of it.

 

[orangenirvana]

By the way, I don't think you'll see SU honor Coughlin because his response would be "stuff it".

He was not a happy camper when he was fired at the end of the Maloney-era.

Based on what I've read about Coughlin re: SU, I find this extremely hard to believe.

 

[br801]

You are comparing P to Schwartzwalder?

They aren't even in the same universe as SU figures of importance.

I was noting that neither ended their time at SU on the highest of notes. And while he was no Schwartzwalder, Pasqualoni was an important figure in the history of SU football.

 

[Townie72]

Based on what I've read about Coughlin re: SU, I find this extremely hard to believe.

What sticks in my mind was Coughlin's comments after being fired as Macpherson came in. The Dome had just been completed and the Maloney staff, of which he was a member, had resurrected the program from the wreckage of the early and mid 1970's"

It was something like, "Well, now that things are looking up, we get the axe. This coaching staff has been the one to steer the program through the dark times and now we get fired?"

And he was, IMO, right. The 79 team that played all its games on the road with Hurley and Monk and Joe Morris and Craig Wolfley was pretty good. These guys deserved better.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Based on what I've read about Coughlin re: SU, I find this extremely hard to believe.

Agreed.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

What sticks in my mind was Coughlin's comments after being fired as Macpherson came in. The Dome had just been completed and the Maloney staff, of which he was a member, had resurrected the program from the wreckage of the early and mid 1970's"

It was something like, "Well, now that things are looking up, we get the axe. This coaching staff has been the one to steer the program through the dark times and now we get fired?"

And he was, IMO, right. The 79 team that played all its games on the road with Hurley and Monk and Joe Morris and Craig Wolfley was pretty good. These guys deserved better.

That was freaking almost 40 years ago... my god. DO you think he will hold present staff responsible for this? My god

 

[Townie72]

I was noting that neither ended their time at SU on the highest of notes. And while he was no Schwartzwalder, Pasqualoni was an important figure in the history of SU football.

One was a major figure, who built the program from nothing into a National champion.

The other was a minor figure, who inherited a very good program.

 

[Townie72]

That was freaking almost 40 years ago... my god. DO you think he will hold present staff responsible for this? My god

Well, he IS of Irish extraction.

But I don't think SU ought to recognize him either.

Too much dwelling on the past. And I'm a guy who loves the SU past.

Nobody cares anymore.

I'm not sure even P would agree to it. He was, after all, fired. And one of the first questions he would get would be, "Did you think you deserved to be fired?"

And if you can remember, P isn't a guy comfortable being grilled by the press on sensitive subjects. He doesn't do well.

 

[RF2044]

One was a major figure, who built the program from nothing into a National champion.

The other was a minor figure, who inherited a very good program.

I couldn't care less whether P gets honored or not, but he wasn't some "minor figure" in program history as you assert--he's the second winningest coach in program history, amassing more than 100 wins in about half the time that it took Schwartzwalder to win 153.

By no measure was Pasqualoni a "minor figure" at SU.

 

[MSOrange]

I couldn't care less whether P gets honored or not, but he wasn't some "minor figure" in program history as you assert--he's the second winningest coach in program history, amassing more than 100 wins in about half the time that it took Schwartzwalder to win 153.

By no measure was Pasqualoni a "minor figure" at SU.

That's how I feel. I don't feel strongly one way or the other about honoring him but there's no need to downgrade his accomplishments.

 

[UnderHisOwnPower]

Sounds like an incredibly stupid idea to me.

SU has to search around in it's attic to find the last FB coach they can say something good about?

It smacks of desperation. Like something Rutgers would do because they don't have any tradition.

And it's not like P covered himself in glory after he left and SU would want to associate themselves with this coaching icon.

Why would the school want to do this? That is other than to appease the few P-apologists on this board who still feel he got a rotten deal.

 

[supp]

Don't mind him. He's channeling "miserable old fart" pretty hard today. I mean what kind of person gets up at 7AM ready to spew venom? Wouldn't want to meet them.

 

[TheCusian]

The idea that you do this for perception is where Townie is all messed up. Truth is that someone is either deserving of being honored or not. How it plays or how it makes your current place in the world look is beside the point.

 

[RandygoCuse]

I don't think he should get a statue or anything, but a halftime ceremony? Sure!

 

[GoSU96]

I'm still waiting for them to honor Tom Coughlin.

They should

 

[SWC75]

Do you think the school will ever honor him?

I was not a big fan of Coach P but I respect what he did while here

I think to truly exorcise the Gerg demons, we should honor Coach P

They should. He's our second leading winner as a coach and governed the program over one of it's most successful eras. He was also a good guy and a solid representative of the school and his profession. I had some criticisms of him but none of that can be denied. The constant debates over him shouldn't create any ill feelings toward the man.

 

[Chip]

They should. He's our second leading winner as a coach and governed the program over one of it's most successful eras. He was also a good guy and a solid representative of the school and his profession. I had some criticisms of him but none of that can be denied. The constant debates over him shouldn't create any ill feelings toward the man.

That's pretty much where I am.

But if we're going to do it, it needs to be genuine. I'll never forget Gross' 2005 where he would just honor people as a means to try to get people in the building. Felt so cheap. Let's retire #44 at halftime of the USF game in what's shaping up to be our worst season in ages. Because when I think of the storied #44, I think of games against the USF Bulls and 1-7 records.

 

[NKR1978]

Don't mind him. He's channeling "miserable old fart" pretty hard today. I mean what kind of person gets up at 7AM ready to spew venom? Wouldn't want to meet them.

Most people spew a lot of s*** at about that time of day.

 

[Townie72]

This isn't real, folks. There is no plan or proposal to do this that anyone here is aware of.

Oangenauburn asked about opinions on whether they think the University should honor "P" somehow. He admitted to not being a "P" fan.

Some of you don't like opinions that are different from yours. So much so that name-calling and insults are thrown at those with different opinions.

Those who think that the University or the Yankees or whoever don't do this sort of recognition to draw fans or to make statements (like Gross and the 1970 team quitters) are out of touch with the reality of filling seats.

And rather than distract attention from the Gerg era as Orangenauburn suggests, it would likely draw attention to it by inviting comparison. And that why SU won't do it.

 

[KaiserUEO]

P won 107 games here and went to 9 bowls winning 6 of them.

but since this is the land of make believe lets look at it this way...

taken as the current college set up now is...I think we can add 13 more d1aa wins which makes him 120-59-1.

and obviously that moves his top years up to 3 seasons of 11 and 10 and 1, 9.

he also would've gone to a total of 13 bowls.

back to reality:

COLLEGE FOOTBALL HALL OF FAME

Criteria for coach nominees

1. While each nominee's football achievements are of prime consideration, his post-football record as a citizen is also weighed. He must have proven himself worthy as a citizen, carrying the ideals of football forward into his relations with his community and his fellow man with love of his country. CHECK
2. A coach becomes eligible three years after retirement or immediately following retirement provided he is at least 70 years of age. Active coaches become eligible at 75 years of age. P is 67
3. The nominee must have held a head coaching position at the collegiate level for at least ten years. CHECK
4. The nominee must hold at least a .600 career record over the course of 100 games or more. CHECK

Syracuse, can ignore him all it wants.

P is going to Atlanta...

 

[cuseguy]

I'm still waiting for them to honor Tom Coughlin.

Coughlin played at SU and had a successful coaching career?

You'd never know it at SU.

 

[cuseguy]

By the way, I don't think you'll see SU honor Coughlin because his response would be "stuff it". He was not a happy camper when he was fired at the end of the Maloney-era.

I think there's something to this.

It's not like Coughlin has endeared himself to SU.

I sometimes forget he has any ties at all. He's ignored the university.

 

[cuseguy]

The reason it's desperation is it makes it look like it's the only thing we have to celebrate. Drawing attention to the 1990's makes the current struggles look worse by comparison. I'm not sure "Tradition" sells like it used to. We've forgiven and feted the players who quit the team in 1970. We've renamed things after Ernie and we've recognized everyone from Jim Brown to Jim Ridlon and up to McNabb. And it doesn't appear to have helped all that much.

The P era was probably the most successful period in SU history outside of the Ben era from the late 50s to the late 60s.