Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

[shandeezy7]

The Cyclones are already in Coney Island. I could see them along the Hudson or in Long Island.

The stadium will always be doomed because of its piss poor location. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it isn't accessible by Centro. The politicians who didn't put it Downtown to begin with really screwed the pooch here. With Downtown seeing the revitalization it currently is, that would have been a nice attraction for the area.

There are bus stops outside the parking lot for the stadium, so it is accessible via Centro, more or less.

At this point, I don't think downtown proper is a viable location without tearing down a number of structures and placing the stadium in a questionable area. The only real undeveloped spot with space for a baseball stadium in "downtown" would be the Kennedy Square site.

 

[OttoMets]

The Cyclones are already in Coney Island. I could see them along the Hudson or in Long Island.

The stadium will always be doomed because of its piss poor location. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it isn't accessible by Centro. The politicians who didn't put it Downtown to begin with really screwed the pooch here. With Downtown seeing the revitalization it currently is, that would have been a nice attraction for the area.

I could see pros and cons for the Mets moving the Cyclones to Triple-A and relocating the existing team to another area in a nearby market.

Regarding Centro and the Chiefs, I believe they've run a dedicated game-day service in the past but I don't know if that exists today. But the train station is on a line with frequent buses and I think there's another line that's also within a five-minute walk.

Either way, accessibility is something that's not heavily considered by the county (I agree with you that it should be). I can't emphasize enough how little faith anyone should have in the public stakeholders: the governor only cares about throwing money at the region so he can have "$X million invested" talking points to use in future campaigns, and the county legislature is made up of yokels. Bill Fisher's a smart man who knows what he's doing, but as far as his ability to effect progressive development throughout the county, the proof is in the pudding. No positive results there.

 

[Trueblue25]

To build a stadium downtown, the first thing they have to do is tear down the overhead train bridges that separate downtown from the near West Side. That's the corner where the stadium was proposed - where Clinton and Onondaga Streets meet, around there.

A stadium between tipp and downtown, if at all possible, would be glorious

 

[shandeezy7]

A stadium between tipp and downtown, if at all possible, would be glorious

I'm assuming this post was in jest, because there is literally nowhere between Tipp Hill and Downtown that is suitable for a baseball stadium. There probably isn't even a site suitable for a Little League field.

 

[Trueblue25]

I'm assuming this post was in jest, because there is literally nowhere between Tipp Hill and Downtown that is suitable for a baseball stadium. There probably isn't even a site suitable for a Little League field.

It was not a suggestive post, i was just saying it’d be cool and the best location if possible. Which its not.

 

[Marty McFly]

I am a fan of an Inner Harbor stadium in theory. Plenty of examples - where it worked and helped build a dynamic and fun greater downtown experience. The only thing is, there would need to be an entertainment district of sorts to make it truly successful. To do it right, you gotta have foot traffic and an "experience" to bring repeat non-die hard fans (or folks who go just for the inner harbor amenities.) Just my 2 Cents.

 

[City of Cuse]

I'm assuming this post was in jest, because there is literally nowhere between Tipp Hill and Downtown that is suitable for a baseball stadium. There probably isn't even a site suitable for a Little League field.

Well, the old mental health facility is probably about 40ish acres of land near the zoo. Without talking about roads and other problems with infrastructure in the area, there is plenty of land there and could be a great thing to add to the area on the west side.

 

[MG44]

How much economic impact does triple a ball have in syracuse? I lived 25-30 miles away for most of my life, and probably went to 4 games between the time i was 8 and 48. Is it really worth $25,000,000 to the community?

 

[MG44]

I am a fan of an Inner Harbor stadium in theory. Plenty of examples - where it worked and helped build a dynamic and fun greater downtown experience. The only thing is, there would need to be an entertainment district of sorts to make it truly successful. To do it right, you gotta have foot traffic and an "experience" to bring repeat non-die hard fans (or folks who go just for the inner harbor amenities.) Just my 2 Cents.

I agree 100%...there needs to be way more than mediocre baseball to have any real impact

 

[SmilinBob]

It makes too much sense so of course it’ll never even be floated.

Speaking of floating...Put it right in the middle of Onondaga Lake and have people walk to it via a bridge.

 

[Newhouser]

The loss of AAA baseball in Syracuse was set in stone when the self-proclaimed saviors of baseball took over the team from the Simone debacle. The play was always, cut the debt, find an MLB club that wanted to own it and make some cash. Mets want no part of up here for their top team and this is all smoke and mirrors to help sell the move.
The County is desperate as they think baseball is an economic driver (I don't see it) and will pony up. Let's hope more rational heads in Albany say "no way". I can't believe I am counting on that last sentence. There is no way that this investment makes sense for anyone other than the Mets.

 

[shandeezy7]

Well, the old mental health facility is probably about 40ish acres of land near the zoo. Without talking about roads and other problems with infrastructure in the area, there is plenty of land there and could be a great thing to add to the area on the west side.

Right, but I don't think there is much value added with that site versus the current stadium location. The best things about the current stadium are how easy it is to get to and the abundance of parking. You lose that accessibility with a Tipp Hill location and it does nothing at all to enhance the fan experience, unless you want to have between inning tiger races or something.

 

[OttoMets]

Right, but I don't think there is much value added with that site versus the current stadium location. The best things about the current stadium are how easy it is to get to and the abundance of parking. You lose that accessibility with a Tipp Hill location and it does nothing at all to enhance the fan experience, unless you want to have between inning tiger races or something.

Yeah, Burnet Park is a prettier site, but other than adding a walkable option for maybe a few hundred more neighborhood people with more disposable income, it wouldn't improve the location for the masses in any tangible way.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Appreciate this tidbit. Didn't know the exact location.

Although the Amphitheater is there, could that also be a location for a new stadium? I'm not familiar with the availability of land and size of the Inner Harbor.

There's no question that the Inner Harbor would be a much better location. I believe a bunch of that land is under the control of COR, and much of it used to be under the control of Congel, but I'm not certain if that's still true. This was public land that the redevelopers needed to improve by certain deadlines in order to retain their rights in the land.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Appreciate this tidbit. Didn't know the exact location.

Although the Amphitheater is there, could that also be a location for a new stadium? I'm not familiar with the availability of land and size of the Inner Harbor.

The Ampitheater is out at the Fairgrounds, not in the Inner Harbor. It's entrance is in the farthest parking lot across 690 from the Fairgounds, bordering on the lake.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I am a fan of an Inner Harbor stadium in theory. Plenty of examples - where it worked and helped build a dynamic and fun greater downtown experience. The only thing is, there would need to be an entertainment district of sorts to make it truly successful. To do it right, you gotta have foot traffic and an "experience" to bring repeat non-die hard fans (or folks who go just for the inner harbor amenities.) Just my 2 Cents.

Well, you've got Destiny Mall at one end of the Inner Harbor and the new COR multi-use block going in on the other end, so you've got much of what you're looking for. Frankline Square is also within reasonable walking distance.

 

[NJCuse97]

Or Coney Island or Newark. Or maybe Uniondale?

I honestly think the Mets are going to make a good-faith effort to stay in Onondaga County. But they'll be quick to jump if they don't get exactly what they want.

I might think Newark. City on the rise, downtown stadium, access to transit, close to Citi Field, (and may actually be closer to Midtown Manhattan than the big league park).

 

[upperdeck]

red sox just dumped pawtucket after years and years, they all move sometime.

 

[sutomcat]

I might think Newark. City on the rise, downtown stadium, access to transit, close to Citi Field, (and may actually be closer to Midtown Manhattan than the big league park).

You put a AAA team too close to your core market area, you might lose some of of your fans. Newark is also a problem because their ballpark is slated to be knocked down for a commerical/residential project.

Bears & Eagles Riverfront Stadium - Wikipedia

The Mets already have their AA team in Binghamton. There will be regular traffic from their AAA club to and from their AA club and from the AAA club and CitiField. You want a location close to the AA club and close but not too close to the major league location.

Syracuse is well located. I think they want to make money from their AAA club though and to do that, people have to attend the games. I will attend more once the vile National vermin prospects are evicted at the end of this season.

 

[SmilinBob]

How much economic impact does triple a ball have in syracuse? I lived 25-30 miles away for most of my life, and probably went to 4 games between the time i was 8 and 48. Is it really worth $25,000,000 to the community?

I'd rather they give $10,000 of the poorest 1000 people in the area. Let the rich owners of the Mets pay for it
.I'm sick of funding the rich so they can make/save more money. The state and country are in debt, they are not.

 

[shandeezy7]

I'd rather they give $10,000 of the poorest 1000 people in the area. Let the rich owners of the Mets pay for it
.I'm sick of funding the rich so they can make/save more money. The state and country are in debt, they are not.

I believe the county is rather healthy financially, but your overall point regarding public subsidizing of private sports stadiums is certainly not without merit.

 

[GoSU96]

Best moments:
JeremyCuse dad melting down during the Louisville game 2011

DCCuse challenges JeremyCuse to a drunken pop a shot game during the North Carolina hoops beat down at MSG.

A syrfan hoops game watching incident involving sutomcat and “the lady of Rosie’s” who wandered into the bar at noon already drunk.

That last one was classic

I don't think I was there for that NC game, but that seems to be a pattern for DC

 

[OttoMets]

You put a AAA team too close to your core market area, you might lose some of of your fans. Newark is also a problem because their ballpark is slated to be knocked down for a commerical/residential project.

Bears & Eagles Riverfront Stadium - Wikipedia

The Mets already have their AA team in Binghamton. There will be regular traffic from their AAA club to and from their AA club and from the AAA club and CitiField. You want a location close to the AA club and close but not too close to the major league location.

Syracuse is well located. I think they want to make money from their AAA club though and to do that, people have to attend the games. I will attend more once the vile National vermin prospects are evicted at the end of this season.

'Like' for the gratuitous shot at the Natinals. Love it. Glad Murph's out of there now, too.

I agree with your assessment of core market area (though I still have no idea what the Braves are thinking) and was already second-guessing my Uniondale speculation because of that - there are probably people in Nassau and eastern Suffolk counties who currently will drive to Citi Field but would reduce their annual trips to Flushing if there were a nearby AAA option. So Uniondale is probably less likely for that reason.

As far as Newark or Albany, though, the Wilpons have access to data that the rest of us never see. Syracuse is a great spot, no doubt about it. But if they get some hard numbers that show that a wealthier East Coast city might be a penetrable market for them, they'll jump for it.

I really hope New York and Onondaga County slow down and make a smart decision to help the Mets stay up here for decades.

 

[IthacaMatt]

'Like' for the gratuitous shot at the Natinals. Love it. Glad Murph's out of there now, too.

I agree with your assessment of core market area (though I still have no idea what the Braves are thinking) and was already second-guessing my Uniondale speculation because of that - there are probably people in Nassau and eastern Suffolk counties who currently will drive to Citi Field but would reduce their annual trips to Flushing if there were a nearby AAA option. So Uniondale is probably less likely for that reason.

As far as Newark or Albany, though, the Wilpons have access to data that the rest of us never see. Syracuse is a great spot, no doubt about it. But if they get some hard numbers that show that a wealthier East Coast city might be a penetrable market for them, they'll jump for it.

I really hope New York and Onondaga County slow down and make a smart decision to help the Mets stay up here for decades.

I hate to say it, but Albany has a better and more sustainable economy, thanks to the capital being there, and all the nearby recreational attractions. It's also closer to NYC. I would not be shocked to see the Mets move the franchise there.

 

[OttoMets]

I hate to say it, but Albany has a better and more sustainable economy, thanks to the capital being there, and all the nearby recreational attractions. It's also closer to NYC. I would not be shocked to see the Mets move the franchise there.

There must be a reason that Albany's had no pro baseball at this level for decades. I don't know what that is.

But if the Mets commission a study that shows they could get 6,500 people a night at a higher price point there than in Syracuse, they will be out of here.