Frost update to UCF

[jgeorge322]

Yes it does. Outbid doesn't have to mean monetary FYI. UCF offered him a better deal. Coyle said no to his demands. I'm very happy he did, too.

please. you inferred that ucf offered more money then spun it to say no deal could be reached with cuse, which is stating the obvious. give me a break.

 

[RMH44]

And I do the same thing. Your budget is based in the worth of the position but if you're bringing someone in with little experience and market value for the position and paying them that budgeted amount, you're doing bad business.

Agreed...and I've hired people that were great candidates with amazing credentials by offering a signing bonus that I could hide in the next fiscal year's commission budget.

 

[jgeorge322]

If Frost was our first choice and we lost him to UCF, we are in a lot of trouble.

not if frost ends up flopping... then we dodged a bullet...

 

[Finwad32]

Why isn't it realistic? That job might open up as early as next season.

And maybe he doesn't eventually end up at Nebraska--I'm sure that a kid like Frost with no ties to the NE has his sights set higher than a mid-tier P5 program.

I understood what you meant about the facilities, but let's be honest--for a guy accustomed to more, it could be a factor in his decision making. Especially if he plans on being a short timer at his next job. That's all I was saying.

I'm not saying Nebraska isn't realistic. I'm saying he's not looking at UCF and saying that job puts me in a better position for Nebraska. Any coach I've ever met does not think that way. He's thinking I'm going to go turn UCF into a gd powerhouse and then slap the flight attendant on the rear and yell woooh into his fiance's ear. I think he just may look at UCF as a better situation. Amongst many other factors.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

It's not worth getting mad at SU yet until we find out the circumstances. If they truly dropped the ball there will be years to b!tch and moan about it.

And lots of great coaches didn't get their respective job's first offer. So let's not abandon ship just yet.

If the new coach is successful, I fully expect him to leave for greener pastures in 4-5 years.

But if Frost told Coyle up front that he would only be killing time here until Nebraska called...

 

[jgeorge322]

If the new coach is successful, I fully expect him to leave for greener pastures in 4-5 years.

But if Frost told Coyle up front that he would only be killing time here until Nebraska called...

right and he could say as much by the structure of his contract. he could also have demanded too high of a buyout for a guy who has never been a hc and we aren't 100% sure calls his own plays as an oc.

 

[Toga]

If Nebraska went 10-2 this year with a top 10 recruiting class coming in, I think we wouldn't be having this conversation since a 1-2 year timeframe for a new Huskers coach wouldn't be an issue.

 

[Crusty]

7 years ago we offered 2 different coaches $2m. So I'm sure we know what the position is worth. That doesn't mean every coach we offer gets that amount.

I think we do also, we are just not willing to pay it. BTW offering $2 million to the coaches of your choice and striking out means you were below the market for those coaches as well.

 

[Jeepers]

So what? Quality guys leave, that's the danger of hiring a quality guy. That's like marrying the safe bet, because she'll never leave you. Screw that, give me the 10 and lets go on a crazy ride.

 

[Alsacs]

If Frost was our first choice and we lost him to UCF, we are in a lot of trouble.

Dasher I respect your level headed this but on this one I disagree.
Frost was probably our top choice but he wasn't our all-in choice.
Frost wanted an easy buyout. Money wasn't the issue. He wants one foot out. Frost is a gamble you don't give a gamble an easy out if you are paying for his on the job training.
Herman at Houston was given less than Frost was offered. Frost can go to the American and show what he is worth.

If the top hand I get in a tournament is pocket 10s and we are still at level 2 and I am not short stacked I am not going all in with 10s. We are still in the early levels. When Maryland/Rutgers/Virginia are all filled up and we are stuck then I will say we ar ein trouble.

 

[AAM62]

If Frost was our first choice and we lost him to UCF, we are in a lot of trouble.[/QU
If we lost him because UCF was willing to give him a 2 year deal then so be it. Again, these issues are not black and white.

 

[RF2044]

I'm not saying Nebraska isn't realistic. I'm saying he's not looking at UCF and saying that job puts me in a better position for Nebraska. Any coach I've ever met does not think that way. He's thinking I'm going to go turn UCF into a gd powerhouse and then slap the flight attendant on the rear and yell woooh into his fiance's ear. I think he just may look at UCF as a better situation. Amongst many other factors.

Agree to disagree. Frost wants to be as successful as possible in his first gig, to position himself for the next gig. No way does he view UCF as a permenant stop. And one of the factors that allegedly hung him up here was the buyout terms / conditions -- which does suggest to me that he's looking down the road.

So in that regard, you're right--UCF is a "better situation," because they're more amenable to giving him buyout flexibility, amongst other factors.

 

[44cuse]

I never liked this guy. Not even a little as far as im concerned he is like the rb or QB from a system powerhouse that throws for a ton of yards or runs for a slew and gets to the NFL and is a bust.

That's our basketball program.

44cuse

 

[elimunelson]

Reasonably speaking, the longer this goes the worse it is. There is a direct correlation to not having a coach right now and to recruiting. This is a time we need to be out there recruiting. Every hour we have zero coaches (and that's the situation, zero coaches) we have uncertainty.

 

[phil77]

Ouch

 

[Alsacs]

To Dasher Frost isn't even pocket 10s he is probably A-Q suited. A good looking hand but not a made hand or even A-K.

I am not going all-in with A-Q this early.

 

[dasher]

To Dasher Frost isn't even pocket 10s he is probably A-Q suited. A good looking hand but not a made hand or even A-K.

I am not going all-in with A-Q this early.

I don't disagree with that. He might now be even as good as Ace Queen. My point is that we couldn't even get the Ace Queen to sign here. We get beat by 8 10 off suit in UCF. That is my point.

 

[Crusty]

And I do the same thing. Your budget is based in the worth of the position but if you're bringing someone in with little experience and market value for the position and paying them that budgeted amount, you're doing bad business.

All of that assumes that your budget is realistic. If it results in substandard results, then fire the guy making the budget. Besides, budgets have to be flexible as market conditions change and in CFB the market is changing.
Getting results is what is good business, not some arbitrary budget guess. Budgets have revenue elements as well and nobody seems to worry about that with a substandard (below market) coaching budget.

The notion that the AD can just magically determine a worth of a position when the people are commodities is not realistic. You pay the market or go home.

 

[OrangeMojo]

I'm ok with this. Guy is an unknown commodity as a head coach. I was excited about the possibility of an exciting offense, but at the same time I'm really hoping for successful HC experience. Plus, I always hated those Nebraska teams in the 90s

 

[44cuse]

Agree to disagree. Frost wants to be as successful as possible in his first gig, to position himself for the next gig. No way does he view UCF as a permenant stop. And one of the factors that allegedly hung him up here was the buyout terms / conditions -- which does suggest to me that he's looking down the road. So in that regard, you're right--UCF is a "better situation," because they're more amenable to giving him buyout flexibility, amongst other factors.

Absolutely. Hard to see an up-and-coming coach viewing UCF (or SU for that matter) as a long term stop regardless of what we want to believe ourselves. We aren't playing big boy football and if you want to play big boy football (long term) you either have to have that job or be working towards that job.

44cuse

 

[rrlbees]

I think we do also, we are just not willing to pay it. BTW offering $2 million to the coaches of your choice and striking out means you were below the market for those coaches as well.

Nope because they took less elsewhere. It was other things not the per year.

 

[rrlbees]

All of that assumes that your budget is realistic. If it results in substandard results, then fire the guy making the budget. Besides, budgets have to be flexible as market conditions change and in CFB the market is changing. Getting results is what is good business, not some arbitrary budget guess. Budgets have revenue elements as well and nobody seems to worry about that with a substandard (below market) coaching budget. The notion that the AD can just magically determine a worth of a position when the people are commodities is not realistic. You pay the market or go home.

You're going way off course. The only point was that not every coach will be offered the same amount of money for the job. You don't offer Shafer the same as Saban for the same position.

 

[Crusty]

Mope because they took less elsewhere. It was other things not the per year.

Same difference. Price is always the total contract value. How much staff budget, buyouts etc. From what I recall Edsall countered us and we passed. Skippy's dad advised against us.

 

[Alsacs]

I don't disagree with that. He might now be even as good as Ace Queen. My point is that we couldn't even get the Ace Queen to sign here. We get beat by 8 10 off suit in UCF. That is my point.

UCF isn't 8-10 off suit if that is the case we are 7-2 off suit.

UCF is a way easier job to get to 6-6 next year than Syracuse. They play in the weaker American Division and Temple is losing their entire D for the most part. UConn/ECU/Temple/USF/Cincinnati is not a scary tough division and you can recruit 2nd tier guys in your backyard.

We should go after a mid-pocket pair i.e MAC/CUSA HC and hope to flop a set. Then hire a coordinator A/J, A/Q and hope to hit a pair.

 

[Crusty]

You're going way off course. The only point was that not every coach will be offered the same amount of money for the job. You don't offer Shafer the same as Saban for the same position.

I think the point was more than that, which is self-evident. My point is that we never seem to willing to pay the market price for those we want, whatever it is. When we hire an experienced coach with credentials on par with other good ACC coaches I will applaud.