FSU vs The ACC

[HRE Otto IV]

That would be a legal analysis

At the end of the day chancellors,
Presidents and states will want this ended and not dragged on. Thats the emotional part of this. We lost being in the acc in 2003 because of emotions and politics. Feel like that will pop up again

No, they wouldn't. Why would 13 of the ACC schools vote to allow other schools out knowing that said vote would cause damages to your won school?

BC, Cal, Duke, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, SMU, Stanford, SU, Wake have incentive to vote NO. GA Tech might find a home in the B18 but I think they prefer staying in the ACC for as long as possible. NC State and VA Tech I suppose could find a home in the SEC. But what if UNC and UVA go to the SEC instead? None of those three schools I just mentioned want out so they can go to the B12. Same thing with Miami, they need an invite to vote YES.

So you think 9 or more of the above schools would vote YES just for the hell of it? When it negatively impacts their school financially? Because of sympathy towards those who want to leave? There is no emotional reason to end things quickly.

 

[Toga]

How is it in the ACC's best interest to end this sooner? Or even ESPN's?

At the very least the ACC should hang on until after the new B18 TV contract. That makes it less likely that the B18 grabs teams before the end of the ACC GOR. It also makes it easier for the SEC/ESPN to grab teams first. Additionally the ACC will want to hang onto schools until the end of the B12 contract. At that point the ACC could be in a position to raid the B12 if things break right.


The B18 TV contract ends in 2030. Ideally they want to grab schools just prior to the new TV contract negotiations. They only took Oregon and Washington because the PAC was dying. Otherwise they would have waited at least another 5 years. The same would be the case for any ACC teams. They rather take a school in 2035 than 2031. Why allow schools out before 2030 if your conference can survive a B18 raid until 2035?

The B12 TV contract ends in 2031 so why let schools out prior and weaken the ACC? If the B12 contract is poor, then the ACC will be in a position to raid the B12. Why let ACC schools out before 2032 in this case?

The SEC contract ends in 2034. Ideally they would want to add a school just before the next contract negotiation. So if the SEC is not looking to raid the ACC until that time, why allow schools an out before then?


IMO it is in the ACC's best interest to NOT negotiate a settlement until 2032 at the very earliest. Anything before that will jeopardize the conference's long term survival. It is also in the SEC's and ESPN's best interest to NOT negotiate a settlement until 2032. ESPN gets cheap content that way. The SEC has no reason to expand before 2032 and waiting helps block a B18 move.

Sure the B18 wants a settlement before 2030 so they could raid the ACC. Sure the B12 wants a settlement before 2030 so the ACC is weakened. Sure the schools looking to leave want a settlement before 2030. But why would the ACC want to aid any of the above knowing it hurts the ACC?

Thank you. Seems pretty obvious.

 

[elimunelson]

No, they wouldn't. Why would 13 of the ACC schools vote to allow other schools out knowing that said vote would cause damages to your won school?

BC, Cal, Duke, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, SMU, Stanford, SU, Wake have incentive to vote NO. GA Tech might find a home in the B18 but I think they prefer staying in the ACC for as long as possible. NC State and VA Tech I suppose could find a home in the SEC. But what if UNC and UVA go to the SEC instead? None of those three schools I just mentioned want out so they can go to the B12. Same thing with Miami, they need an invite to vote YES.

So you think 9 or more of the above schools would vote YES just for the hell of it? When it negatively impacts their school financially? Because of sympathy towards those who want to leave? There is no emotional reason to end things quickly.

this isn’t going to linger to 2030. To say otherwise is naive.

Television will have a say ultimately, politics will interject and common sense.

If we take 100% of the exit fee and the GOR money we still are without fsu and Clemson. Conference crumbles and we are more enriched now. In 20 years the entire house of cards will change again.

I think this won’t be as cut throat as you think. Tv could nudge bc and Syracuse and add us to nbc w nd as an affiliation. Anything is possible when live sports are only reason to have cable.

I hope you guys are right and we become very rich as a result of this move. I just have my doubts

 

[elimunelson]

No, they wouldn't. Why would 13 of the ACC schools vote to allow other schools out knowing that said vote would cause damages to your won school?

BC, Cal, Duke, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, SMU, Stanford, SU, Wake have incentive to vote NO. GA Tech might find a home in the B18 but I think they prefer staying in the ACC for as long as possible. NC State and VA Tech I suppose could find a home in the SEC. But what if UNC and UVA go to the SEC instead? None of those three schools I just mentioned want out so they can go to the B12. Same thing with Miami, they need an invite to vote YES.

So you think 9 or more of the above schools would vote YES just for the hell of it? When it negatively impacts their school financially? Because of sympathy towards those who want to leave? There is no emotional reason to end things quickly.

Holding someone hostage will push a judge to get both sides to agree to a settlement. Contracts are broken all the time.

 

[elimunelson]

Be

No, they wouldn't. Why would 13 of the ACC schools vote to allow other schools out knowing that said vote would cause damages to your won school?

BC, Cal, Duke, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, SMU, Stanford, SU, Wake have incentive to vote NO. GA Tech might find a home in the B18 but I think they prefer staying in the ACC for as long as possible. NC State and VA Tech I suppose could find a home in the SEC. But what if UNC and UVA go to the SEC instead? None of those three schools I just mentioned want out so they can go to the B12. Same thing with Miami, they need an invite to vote YES.

So you think 9 or more of the above schools would vote YES just for the hell of it? When it negatively impacts their school financially? Because of sympathy towards those who want to leave? There is no emotional reason to end things quickly.

it would be funny if the BIG invited bc and Syracuse before Clemson and FSU. How would we handle that?

 

[Hoo's That]

Will Clemson turn into Neb is the question. Teams who have elite runs think it goes on forever. Ala fans forget those down years as well.

All good running towards money but Clemson could easily slip back to irrelevant Clemson in a tougher conf and become Rutgers.

Clemson is now on an up-cycle. They, like Nebraska, had a down period and did not win a conference championship from 1992 to 2011. What happened in 1992? $U became eligible for the football championship. Will they be able to maintain the "up" when Dabo leaves? They couldn't when Danny Ford did. He resigned in 1989. They won in 1991 and then 20 years in the wilderness.

 

[Cusefan0307]

No, they wouldn't. Why would 13 of the ACC schools vote to allow other schools out knowing that said vote would cause damages to your won school?

BC, Cal, Duke, Louisville, Notre Dame, Pitt, SMU, Stanford, SU, Wake have incentive to vote NO. GA Tech might find a home in the B18 but I think they prefer staying in the ACC for as long as possible. NC State and VA Tech I suppose could find a home in the SEC. But what if UNC and UVA go to the SEC instead? None of those three schools I just mentioned want out so they can go to the B12. Same thing with Miami, they need an invite to vote YES.

So you think 9 or more of the above schools would vote YES just for the hell of it? When it negatively impacts their school financially? Because of sympathy towards those who want to leave? There is no emotional reason to end things quickly.

Don’t bother. He’s been posting the same drivel for half a decade. By the time he’s right we all may be dead.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

this isn’t going to linger to 2030. To say otherwise is naive.

Television will have a say ultimately, politics will interject and common sense.

If we take 100% of the exit fee and the GOR money we still are without fsu and Clemson. Conference crumbles and we are more enriched now. In 20 years the entire house of cards will change again.

I think this won’t be as cut throat as you think. Tv could nudge bc and Syracuse and add us to nbc w nd as an affiliation. Anything is possible when live sports are only reason to have cable.

I hope you guys are right and we become very rich as a result of this move. I just have my doubts

Everything you just said is an argument for it to stay together longer, not shorter.

TV (ESPN) doesn't want it to change yet.

Politics doesn't want it to change. You think NC politicians want the ACC to die? Think about all the money the ACC brings to the state. Or for NC State, Duke, and Wake to get left behind? Same for VA with VA Tech. Or any of the other schools in MA, NY, PA, KY, CA who would all be negatively impacted.

Common sense? How is it common sense to help other schools while making your school worse off?

 

[All4SU]

All the posturing and lawsuits by Clemson and FSU do direct damage to the conference. Let’s face it, in college sports perception is a big part of success. I’m tired of these teams ragging on their own family - which is essentially what a conference is from a school’s perspective.

 

[elimunelson]

All the posturing and lawsuits by Clemson and FSU do direct damage to the conference. Let’s face it, in college sports perception is a big part of success. I’m tired of these teams ragging on their own family - which is essentially what a conference is from a school’s perspective.

And divorces happen because of it.

I don’t want this to happen. It’s bad. But I think people want to get to a solution sooner rather than later . I hope I’m wrong.

 

[310Pigpen]

College football fans on Reddit are odd. On one hand they cheer on the demise of the ACC and then on the other hand they clamor for the days of the conferences from 20-30 years ago.

 

[HtownOrange]

And divorces happen because of it.

I don’t want this to happen. It’s bad. But I think people want to get to a solution sooner rather than later . I hope I’m wrong.

In this instance, if FSU can break the GOR, all GORs are useless and there are no conferences to go to. Further, GORs are important in entertainment, entertainment as we know it will change. Base on case law, FSU should fail miserably.

What is then left is for FSU to wait out the present agreement and leave them. Aside from the financial logic I posted previously, and the simple fact that FSU cannot even raise the $100MM they offered to the ACC let alone $500MM+, a reasonable understanding of law should result in FSU ceasing the lawsuit.

As USC and UCLA did, the end of the present agreement is a fixed date. UT and OU attempted to buy their way out but it was too expensive for two schools that could write the check without batting an eye. Only when the Big12 was able to garner new teams and an assured TV deal going forward did they agree to work with UT and OU, who them paid the equivalent of 2.1X the TV deal.

Essentially, FSU has no hope other than to annoy everyone. Enter an ambulance chaser who takes cases knowing he will get something who thinks he is actually "winning" every case and can do no wrong, who then jumps into the realms of corporate law, corporate contracts, entertainment law and dealing with highly educated and skilled partners and opponents in matters to great for his miniscule undeveloped legal mind. His experience is "winning" against insurance companies that will settle anyway versus partners and opponents who have everything to lose and have the law. He is in a battle of wits in which his only weapon is a 75 IQ.

I understand your perspective and the fact that if Alford holds on to 2036 FSU is likely to leave lead you to believe this inevitable. The reality is that the SEC and the B1G are in far less control than advertised. The networks hold the money and the majority of the real power. Any analysis that ignores the dominance of power from the networks is incomplete. FSU's lawsuit false to include ESPN (whom holds FSU's TV rights!).

 

[HtownOrange]

College football fans on Reddit are odd. On one hand they cheer on the demise of the ACC and then on the other hand they clamor for the days of the conferences from 20-30 years ago.

These same fans cannot understand that if the GOR is trashed by the courts, there are no GORs. Without GORs, all conferences have no deal to guarantee their revenue.

 

[TexanMark]

Overall FSU fans are pretty unlikable

I live in North Florida and have quite a few around. Some are decent, normal fans.

Most are smug A holes too good for the ACC. Very insecure fan group.

FSU baseball is petty, eliminating more ACC teams at MCWS than the SEC

The FSU Seminoles are taking no prisoners lately. They are suing the ACC to leave the conference and have eliminated more ACC teams from the MCWS than the SEC.

chopchat.com

 

[orangecuse]

Winning cures all. Think positive as we are on an up swing. If you think negative, that is exactly where you will be. Think Positive and WIN.

There's also a thing called reality. It's a place in which the planet we live on is indeed round vs. flat.

Realistic thinking is based in the likelihood that something could happen – positive, negative, or neutral. Focusing exclusively on negative consequences is only partially realistic. Considering only overly positive outcomes is not realistic thinking either. Being realistic is about considering both types of results.

Don’t Confuse Realistic Thinking with Negative Thinking - Jim Seibold

Negative thinking is often disguised as "realistic thinking". This is both dishonest and harmful. Read on for an honest approach to problem-solving.

jimseibold.com

 

[orangecuse]

I do have a question?, Lets go back in time, the year is 1998, what was the type of viewership/draw for Syracuse University, particularly meaning football and basketball as it relates to TV viewership. With the way I trust the ship is turning finally, those are the eyeballs you need to look at and those are the eyeballs that ADJW and the Chancellor certainly will be pushing concerning our ability to compete. It ridiculously took this long to turn the boat, it has not completely turned yet, however, it is and I trust no longer taking on water.

Comparing the landscape today, et al to what it was in 1998 is like comparing dial-up to fiber broadband...night and day.

Even if the boat is no longer taking on water as you allude, results on the field is what matters first and foremost. So, until there is actual data on that front in regards to Coach Fran's on field results, at this moment in time, I think that is still to be determined. Of course, as a lifelong fan of Syracuse University sports, I'm certainly routing for it.

That said, even if Coach Fran can get us back to those McNabb years type success, it still doesn't preclude Syracuse University for all of its borne dilemmas as a relatively small private type, non Flagship institution in today's landscape. ND and USC are obvious exceptions, even with both not being that relevant from a national championship standpoint with ND's last being 1988 and USC 2004.

Although, Just as the Corvette could never be confused with the Buick Skylark, either can Syracuse vs. ND/USC.

 

[Shoym]

College football fans on Reddit are odd. On one hand they cheer on the demise of the ACC and then on the other hand they clamor for the days of the conferences from 20-30 years ago.

Classic "what have you done for me lately" mentality.

 

[Dinkyspond]

Overall FSU fans are pretty unlikable

I live in North Florida and have quite a few around. Some are decent, normal fans.

Most are smug A holes too good for the ACC. Very insecure fan group.

FSU baseball is petty, eliminating more ACC teams at MCWS than the SEC

The FSU Seminoles are taking no prisoners lately. They are suing the ACC to leave the conference and have eliminated more ACC teams from the MCWS than the SEC.

chopchat.com

I live in Tampa and completely agree, FSU fans are tools.

 

[dasher]

And divorces happen because of it.

I don’t want this to happen. It’s bad. But I think people want to get to a solution sooner rather than later . I hope I’m wrong.

The ACC doesn't want a solution sooner rather than later. There is nothing to be gained by the ACC to a deal. They lose their league if the settle early. No amount of money can make up for that.

 

[Willy75]

Neither FSU nor Clemson (especially Clemson) are going to be winning 9-12 games a year in a reconstituted SEC or BiG; these characters should be careful what they wish for. In a similar vein (?) these schools are both state institutions with huge budgets, yet are going nuts over not so large conference revenue discrepancies .

 

[richmondcuse03]

The ACC doesn't want a solution sooner rather than later. There is nothing to be gained by the ACC to a deal. They lose their league if the settle early. No amount of money can make up for that.

Bingo. And a lot of schools, like Syracuse, are run by lawyers. These are not emotional actors in many cases. They’re methodical. Dragging this out benefits the acc and Syracuse. Lot will transpire in next few years and I can easily see a scenario where some of the conference stuff will end up being meaningless for football.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

And divorces happen because of it.

I don’t want this to happen. It’s bad. But I think people want to get to a solution sooner rather than later . I hope I’m wrong.

The solution is stick to the deal that was made.

 

[GHLF]

We are in agreement then. I still think we may be further enhanced by our affiliation w ND somehow doesn’t enter the big 2.

What would that affiliation be?

 

[DoctorBombay]

And divorces happen because of it.

I don’t want this to happen. It’s bad. But I think people want to get to a solution sooner rather than later . I hope I’m wrong.

You're wrong.
Why would "people", ie; the ACC, want a quick solution? What exactly is the rush here?
Please elaborate. Thx
.

 

[GHLF]

Comparing the landscape today, et al to what it was in 1998 is like comparing dial-up to fiber broadband...night and day.

Even if the boat is no longer taking on water as you allude, results on the field is what matters first and foremost. So, until there is actual data on that front in regards to Coach Fran's on field results, at this moment in time, I think that is still to be determined. Of course, as a lifelong fan of Syracuse University sports, I'm certainly routing for it.

That said, even if Coach Fran can get us back to those McNabb years type success, it still doesn't preclude Syracuse University for all of its borne dilemmas as a relatively small private type, non Flagship institution in today's landscape. ND and USC are obvious exceptions, even with both not being that relevant from a national championship standpoint with ND's last being 1988 and USC 2004.

Although, Just as the Corvette could never be confused with the Buick Skylark, either can Syracuse vs. ND/USC.

I guess we disagree, and Syracuse University certainly is not the car you referenced with all due respect. Audi Q series or higher, even presently. Certainly needs to go higher. Syracuse University Alumnus proud!! And many thanks