Great to start with a W. Thoughts going forward.

[SoBeCuse]

Toughest thing for an ex-player to do is actually critique because critique involves some criticism at times. Julian does a pretty phenomenal job of not crushing kids or coaches but very plainly criticizing where he feels there are errors or short-comings. He's got a bright future as a media guy, I would think. We're insanely lucky to have that insight.

I really like him as well. Very articulate, charismatic, etc. It’s also great to hear things from a recent player’s perspective. We have our wannabe coaches all over the board but I’ll take Whigham’s perspective and opinions more seriously than probably anybody else, obviously.

 

[billsin01]

Some Thoughts on the Game

- I would love to see Bradshaw move to the slot corner in place of Cordy, I think his strength is moving laterally and using his quickness to take away short slants (which is very evident in the red zone) but is less effective when fast receivers get to run up on him in the open field. Cordy just struggles in man coverage and is playing out of place.

- My preference would be to see Trill Williams (i.e., Charles Woodson Jr.) on the outside - his quick feet, strength at the line and ability to jam routes is unmatched on this team. I would love the Williams / Frederick combo going forward and hopefully see Meli get a chance against spread sets.

As always, enjoy the post and the insight. A few comments on your observations starting with the above. This is a no-brainer in my mind. Watching Scoop on tight slants and inside routes is like watching a completely different corner than the one who struggles to hang in on the outside. I don't know much of Trill other than the hype, but if he's even adequate outside, moving Bradshaw inside would be accentuating his skill set and minimizing his exposure.

- Too much is being made of the offensive line / running game. We ran for 300 yards with a strong YPC.

- WMU decided to hammer the box and single up on Custis on the outside - and it worked out badly (especially considering a long De Vito pass was called back, Butler failed to run out a streak, and Dungey missed Riley for a TD on a switch route).

- If WMU played two-deep or spent more time in a soft Cover 3, the Syracuse running backs would have been much more successful.

Not sure I agree on these points for a couple reasons. One, I'm just not sure there's a single coach in the ACC that would trade their top two RBs for the Strick/Neal combo. Neal is probably somewhere in the neighborhood of an average starter but isn't going to move a pile or give opponents fits in the open field. He's OK. Strick is probably slightly below average, IMO, at least in terms of carrying the ball. Maybe his blocking and receiving keep him in games, but carrying the ball is a struggle. I think we saw that when you consider he got 11 carries on a night when Neal got nearly 3x as many carries and Dungey kept it himself 15 times.

As far as hammering the box -- I get it and you're probably right (haven't watched the game a second time), but good OLs open up holes. I thought we were OK at times, struggled at others. Would love to see us improve here.

- Really like the use of Dungey in the running game.

- His decision making is as good on the option/reads as any QB that I have seen at Syracuse, including McPherson, Graves, McNabb and Womack.

- Dungey actually reminds me a bunch of Graves and McPherson - really good at running the offense and putting the defense into a 2-to-1 bind on read/options - but passing is more confined to 9 routes and play action seam routes. The QB run will be there all day against an aggressive Florida State team so will be good for Dungey to get a “rest” against Wagner.

Yeah, watched ND Saturday night and Wimbush is a decent player but he's about 50% on those decisions and it just sets that whole offense back. I don't know how Dungey grades out on the film but I'd have to imagine he's pretty close to 90%+ -- Just seems to make the right decision a lot.

- The special teams really showed the increase in talent on the SU roster. Reminded me of the Florida universities where the KO coverage is challenging the returner at the 10 yard line. Cullen and L. Williams are great great special teams players. Strong, fast and fearless.

Easily the biggest positive in my mind from the game was the play of specials. Coverage looked excellent and punting and kicking looked smooth. That would be a HUGE plus if we're strong in specials all year.

 

[RF2044]

If not for the bizarre decision to go with Devito so early and for so long, we might have really hammered these guys. On the road, in game 1.

It is interesting to see how we as a fanbase can wring our hands over the warts we saw [and to be clear, not criticizing anybody for that or suggesting that our team doesn't have room for improvement], but lose sight of the fact that we put up 55 and were in control for essentially 3 quarters of the game.

LOTS of room for improvement, but a far cry from that Villanova game a few years ago.

WMU looked like a bowl team to me, and we handled them. Bodes well for our chances this year. If not for that mini-collapse, this would have been a 20+ point cakewalk -- which I don't think too many people expected.

Seeing all of those WMU players get injured throughout the game reminds me our team the previous 5 years, getting banged up playing bigger counterparts on ACC teams.

Now we have a tuneup game to work out a few kinks [WRs, LBs, getting some youngsters some developmental PT, etc.], and then a potentially vulnerable opponent coming into our house.

Really like how this season is setting up. Feels like the program is on the verge -- warts and all.

 

[All4SU]

I thought JerseyOrange was only in the pay side. Is this one of those member recruitment free offer periods?

 

[Trueblue25]

My arms and legs for another thread like this after Ohio

 

[orangefog]

My arms and legs for another thread like this after Ohio

Hold up, how the hell did you dig this up?

 

[Chip]

My arms and legs for another thread like this after Ohio

Hopefully it will be Shrader’s arm and legs that did it. It gives me more hope than DeVito’s arm and panic scrambles.

 

[LeMoyneCuse]

It gives me more hope than DeVito’s arm and panic scrambles.

The prospect of another season means another year of my favorite line about DeVito. He handles stress like my mother-in-law. Not productively.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Miss the JO threads. Feels like they have been once a year since moving to this board. Sadly his last post here was about things that needed to be addressed by Dino and they still haven't been addressed. That thread was early November 2019 and we still haven't hit the portal hard for OL, DL, or deep threat WR. Heck QB depth wasn't addressed till just this offseason.

 

[Chip]

The prospect of another season means another year of my favorite line about DeVito. He handles stress like my mother-in-law. Not productively.

I love that line. I’d steal it but my mother-in-law handles stress like a champ. I wish her daughter inherited it. (Was that out loud?)

 

[RF2044]

Hopefully it will be Shrader’s arm and legs that did it. It gives me more hope than DeVito’s arm and panic scrambles.

Honestly, I hope that the staff bringing Shrader in pushed DeVito to take his game up another level. Competition is a great thing for the QB room.

And if it still isn't enough, then I hope he's on a short leash and that Shrader gets the bulk of the PT swiftly.

Doesn't matter to me which one of them is the guy, so long as one of them emerges as a bowl-caliber QB.

May the best player win.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Honestly, I hope that the staff bringing Shrader in pushed DeVito to take his game up another level. Competition is a great thing for the QB room.

And if it still isn't enough, then I hope he's on a short leash and that Shrader gets the bulk of the PT swiftly.

Doesn't matter to me which one of them is the guy, so long as one of them emerges as a bowl-caliber QB.

May the best player win.

I don't think TD can succeed given what is around him. We might not need the best player to win but the best player for the given talent around him.

Having no deep threat really hinders this O. Doesn't matter who is QB or how serviceable our OL play is. This O scheme needs that deep threat to function. Otherwise you need a playmaker and TD is not that guy.

The OL will be serviceable at best. If you look at Sacks and YPC the OL was bad in 2016, bad in 2017, and serviceable in 2018. Yes 2016 and 2017 weren't 2019 and 2020 bad but they weren't good enough for TD to have success in.

You can even make the argument that the 2018 OL wasn't good enough for TD to be successful. Dungey's scrambling and running ability helped the OL and even then our numbers were below average. Yes TD had some success in 2018 but that was off the bench and our opponent's game plan was for Dungey. So even if the 2021 OL is as good as the 2018 OL (which is wishful thinking), it might not be enough for a drop back passer to succeed in. So we need a guy who can run around and TD is not that guy.

I think TD is clearly the best passer and he might be one of the best pure passers to ever play here. But being a QB in CFB is a lot more than just throwing. And at SU the ability to run the ball will likely be the most important attribute to having success given what we surround a QB with. TD is not that guy.

IMO if TD is starting by that Albany game we aren't making a Bowl this year.

 

[Orangepace]

I love the comments about Devito… you all realize that Michael Vick wouldn’t have been able to do anything given the time Devito had in the pocket last season right?

PFF rated only Elmore in the top 15 of ACC lineman at any position last year. That’s incredibly horrible.

 

[syrBossHogg]

Miss the JO threads. Feels like they have been once a year since moving to this board. Sadly his last post here was about things that needed to be addressed by Dino and they still haven't been addressed. That thread was early November 2019 and we still haven't hit the portal hard for OL, DL, or deep threat WR. Heck QB depth wasn't addressed till just this offseason.

For OL they brought in

Bleich
Bradford

And they recruited Tyler who won't make it but they tried to hit the portal

 

[Chip]

I love the comments about Devito… you all realize that Michael Vick wouldn’t have been able to do anything given the time Devito had in the pocket last season right?

I think he probably would have done something.

 

[Goin' Deep]

OK...it's a given that last year's Oline was an abomination.
Devito had the look in his eye that told me he had no idea how to take
the offense down the field. He was hoping- not managing.
Enter the new OLINE coach that knows how to get his line to pound the ball.
Tucker, Howard, Lutz and others bring different styles to the RB position.
I hope the Oklahoma transfer shows us what he's got.
Point is the pressure is no longer on Devito to WIN the game.
Keep the penalties, turnovers and injuries below average(whatever that may be)
and we just might be allright...

 

[Orangepace]

I think he probably would have done something.

He would have been running for his life. Probably would have cleared 1500 rushing yards, but I doubt we would have won many more games.

 

[syrBossHogg]

I love the comments about Devito… you all realize that Michael Vick wouldn’t have been able to do anything given the time Devito had in the pocket last season right?

PFF rated only Elmore in the top 15 of ACC lineman at any position last year. That’s incredibly horrible.

Maybe Elmore should stay on the OL lol.

 

[syrBossHogg]

OK...it's a given that last year's Oline was an abomination.
Devito had the look in his eye that told me he had no idea how to take
the offense down the field. He was hoping- not managing.
Enter the new OLINE coach that knows how to get his line to pound the ball.
Tucker, Howard, Lutz and others bring different styles to the RB position.
I hope the Oklahoma transfer shows us what he's got.
Point is the pressure is no longer on Devito to WIN the game.
Keep the penalties, turnovers and injuries below average(whatever that may be)
and we just might be allright...

The penalties are something I really hope they focus on in training camp, we've been a very undisciplined team under Dino and it's maddening. Can't afford to take so many penalties with how bad we've been on offense these past two years.

 

[AngryOtto]

I love the comments about Devito… you all realize that Michael Vick wouldn’t have been able to do anything given the time Devito had in the pocket last season right?

PFF rated only Elmore in the top 15 of ACC lineman at any position last year. That’s incredibly horrible.

That may be true if Vick was a true pocket passer but he was not. He would have used his legs to burn the D which would caused the D not bring so much pressure. Similar to how the O ran with Dungey.

 

[NineOneSeven]

He would have been running for his life. Probably would have cleared 1500 rushing yards, but I doubt we would have won many more games.

So he would have done something.

 

[tep624]

I love the comments about Devito… you all realize that Michael Vick wouldn’t have been able to do anything given the time Devito had in the pocket last season right?

PFF rated only Elmore in the top 15 of ACC lineman at any position last year. That’s incredibly horrible.

It’s pretty depressing our only top 15 lineman is the guy that wasn’t even supposed to be playing on the line.

 

[Cusester]

It’s pretty depressing our only top 15 lineman is the guy that wasn’t even supposed to be playing on the line.

Also, the guy that hadn't been coached for 2 or 3 years by our previous O line coach.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

That may be true if Vick was a true pocket passer but he was not. He would have used his legs to burn the D which would caused the D not bring so much pressure. Similar to how the O ran with Dungey.

What Orangepace doesn't get is that TD is not a fit for what surrounds him. What good is a cannon arm if he has no one to throw long to? What point is a good pocket passer if they are required to constantly move around the pocket and extend plays? The latter has been the case at SU just about every year outside of 2012. We don't have OLs that can create a consistent pocket. TD is a square peg for SU's round hole.

As to Vick you made the point that I kinda was as well. The OL wasn't good under Dungey. But he made their jobs easier. Run blocking is easier when the D cannot crash down on those inside runs for fear of the QB keeping it. Pass blocking is easier when the D brings less people for fear of the QB getting away. Even with that help our OL was below average in 2018. This year's OL is not as good as that 2018 OL and will not have the benefit of a running QB. Can TD succeed with a 2016 like OL? Because that is likely what we see this year. Yes, that is better than the 2019 and 2020 OL but it is still a poor OL. IMO that answer is no.

 

[donniesyracuse]

He would have been running for his life. Probably would have cleared 1500 rushing yards, but I doubt we would have won many more games.