I am sure I will get killed for this

[storange]

If we need a new roof to garner excitement we have bigger issues.

Do you know what the football factories have to show recruits, this is just evening the playing field a little

 

[IthacaBarrel]

I don't believe with the sentiment that this is a throwaway season. Every coach is still getting their full salary, the kids are still getting a free education.

If you as a coach are getting paid to do a job, you should damn well do your job. And be accountable for the job you do.

good lord, give it a rest with this stuff, who said anyone wasn’t doing their job? All anyone is saying that you can use this season as a prep for next more than usual. It’s unusual circumstances and almost has an exhibition type feel due to strange schedule, doesn’t mean the kids and coaches aren’t going to try and win every game. You also have opt outs, maybe others missing games due to Covid etc. it’s far from a normal year

 

[GoSU96]

really. It’s always about next year. Lol.

this year, yep

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Wow, I was disappointed but it was one game and we have reason to believe we might have a D this year. The offense may just have to be serviceable, hopefully they improve some. Remember we should be getting some O line back during the season.

We can easily go 6-0 at home. Finding a road W will be hard though. Really wish we had a crowd for those home games.

 

[Chip]

good lord, give it a rest with this stuff, who said anyone wasn’t doing their job? All anyone is saying that you can use this season as a prep for next more than usual. It’s unusual circumstances and almost has an exhibition type feel due to strange schedule, doesn’t mean the kids and coaches aren’t going to try and win every game. You also have opt outs, maybe others missing games due to Covid etc. it’s far from a normal year

We eliminate the FCS win. We replace Rutgers and Western Michigan with UNC and Notre Dame. We have RB1 and RB2 opt out.

WIN 7 GAMES OR YOU’RE FIRED!

Yesterday was frustrating, the mistakes were killer, but come on...

(I reserve the right to use that win 7 games or you’re fired comment in a game thread later because those heat of the moment posts don’t count).

 

[CuseOnly]

good lord, give it a rest with this stuff, who said anyone wasn’t doing their job? All anyone is saying that you can use this season as a prep for next more than usual. It’s unusual circumstances and almost has an exhibition type feel due to strange schedule, doesn’t mean the kids and coaches aren’t going to try and win every game. You also have opt outs, maybe others missing games due to Covid etc. it’s far from a normal year

Good Lord, you give it a rest this! This is not a throwaway exhibition season. I didn't say that you or anyone else said they weren't doing their jobs.

I am saying it. It seems they have the same cavalier attitude that you do about the season. Except they are getting paid to do their jobs.

Having an unprepared team on the field is one example of not doing your job.

See, I can do what you do too.

I am working under different weird circumstances as well and my boss doesn't let me just not do my job. I have to still be accountable.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

Good Lord, you give it a rest this! This is not a throwaway exhibition season. I didn't say that you or anyone else said they weren't doing their jobs.

I am saying it. It seems they have the same cavalier attitude that you do about the season. Except they are getting paid to do their jobs.

Having an unprepared team on the field is one example of not doing your job.

See, I can do what you do too.

I am working under different weird circumstances as well and my boss doesn't let me just not do my job. I have to still be accountable.

Not a good post. You’re not grasping the concept and quite frankly I don’t care about your job it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

 

[GoSU96]

Good Lord, you give it a rest this! This is not a throwaway exhibition season. I didn't say that you or anyone else said they weren't doing their jobs.

I am saying it. It seems they have the same cavalier attitude that you do about the season. Except they are getting paid to do their jobs.

Having an unprepared team on the field is one example of not doing your job.

See, I can do what you do too.

I am working under different weird circumstances as well and my boss doesn't let me just not do my job. I have to still be accountable.

your cavalier is likely their realistic.

fact of the matter is that in order to compete the offense requires timing and volume to make up for the difference in talent with better opponents. That requires conditioning and practice and there hasn’t been enough time and reps to maximize either. add to that losing DDavis Howard and Adams and the offense is behind where they would normally be at the start of the season

 

[NineOneSeven]

If people expect us to be better next year because of the recruits we're bringing in, then they don't really understand college football, especially at Syracuse.

True freshmen will almost never have that big of an impact here.

Why I think we really COULD be better next year is looking at all the players getting time yesterday from the 2019 and 2018 recruiting classes. Defense really should be in good shape.

I'm concerned that the offense is going to take longer than we want. We can point to some players who can hold their own in the ACC, but as a unit, just too many weak spots. I'd rather see us giving a guy like Q. White or A. Red snaps at guard vs Elmore in a season like this. Not sure where those guys are. Or why P. Davis is the backup to both guard spots instead of a starter (injury?).

If we can't get an RB past the line of scrimmage on an up the middle run against a 4 man front, then nothing else on the offense is going to work. 5 wide with this QB isn't the answer.

The last sentence.

Said this in game thread. What advantage does 5 wide give us? Teams rush 3 or 4 and get to the QB and we haven’t shown we have a QB that can quickly scan the field for the secondary and tertiary options. Even if you want to be 4 wide, at least put someone in the backfield to maybe give extra protection.

Were we 5 wide from inside the red zone too? I hate the goalline formations we seemed to have every play for years but there’s middle ground between that and 5 wide. Not saying we went 5 wide often, but it’s a strange formation for the personnel I see imo.

 

[orangecuse]

Yeah acting like this season is an whatever is crazy. I know the circumstances but there is a freaking global pandemic and every sport on the planet is having odd training / routine. Also everybody and every sport has no crowds.

It all counts. We need wins and like you said... a winning culture.

I couldn't agree more. This is year 5, again year 5 of the Dino era, using Covid as an excuse is convenient and weak as hell...all teams have been and are dealing with it. Just as last year when Dino cried about not having any tape on that Maryland debacle. A frigging joke. Put on your big boy pants Dino and take ownership, you are 100% responsible as the captain of the ship for your team's personnel and the ensuing results...period!

Just as Ithaca stated, losing becomes a habit. And, one thing you'll typically always find with losing, there isn't any shortage of excuses.

 

[Chip]

Were we 5 wide from inside the red zone too? I hate the goalline formations we seemed to have every play for years but there’s middle ground between that and 5 wide. Not saying we went 5 wide often, but it’s a strange formation for the personnel I see imo.

I know we did it once on 3rd and goal. Hope you’re sitting down for this, but the primary lock was covered, TD flushed out to his right and threw it out of bounds.

I do hold out hope that we have more of a true QB coach now and they just need more time to work with each other. And also to get a feel for the WRs. That stuff I do think will improve. (Gulp). But the ability to run the ball, I just don’t have much hope. Maybe when Dakota is back but who knows if he’ll really be 100%, including conditioning.

 

[JeremyCuse]

I couldn't agree more. This is year 5, again year 5 of the Dino era, using Covid as an excuse is convenient and weak as hell...all teams have been and are dealing with it. Just as last year when Dino cried about not having any tape on that Maryland debacle. A frigging joke. Put on your big boy pants Dino and take ownership, you are 100% responsible as the captain of the ship for your team's personnel and the ensuing results...period!

Just as Ithaca stated, losing becomes a habit. And, one thing you'll typically always find with losing, there isn't any shortage of excuses.

The we didn't have the tape line was the first time I went "uh oh" with this staff. The continued mistakes with penalties, undisciplined play, red zone play calling and clock management have become a theme and one of the concerns I have with Babers

 

[RF2044]

If people expect us to be better next year because of the recruits we're bringing in, then they don't really understand college football, especially at Syracuse.

True freshmen will almost never have that big of an impact here.

Why I think we really COULD be better next year is looking at all the players getting time yesterday from the 2019 and 2018 recruiting classes. Defense really should be in good shape.

I'm concerned that the offense is going to take longer than we want. We can point to some players who can hold their own in the ACC, but as a unit, just too many weak spots. I'd rather see us giving a guy like Q. White or A. Red snaps at guard vs Elmore in a season like this. Not sure where those guys are. Or why P. Davis is the backup to both guard spots instead of a starter (injury?).

If we can't get an RB past the line of scrimmage on an up the middle run against a 4 man front, then nothing else on the offense is going to work. 5 wide with this QB isn't the answer.

White and Red are both currently OUT due to injuries. It was reported that Pat Davis is also injured, but was closest to being able to play. He supposedly played two series yesterday, but couldn't go anymore [he's reportedly at like 65%] -- just to give us a sub for a few plays. Bad situation.

Need those guys to get healthy SOON.

And those aren't the only interior OL who are out [Froumy, and 1 or 2 others].

 

[NineOneSeven]

The we didn't have the tape line was the first time I went "uh oh" with this staff. The continued mistakes with penalties, undisciplined play, red zone play calling and clock management have become a theme and one of the concerns I have with Babers

I was actually okay with penalties yesterday. The block that took the touch down clearly sucked and the jumps early, but overall it was okay.

 

[syrBossHogg]

We all want Dino to succeed but he shouldn't be immune to valid criticism. As others stated this is year 5, we're nearing the end of the rebuild phase. The program should expect bowl games and winning records every year going forward IMO.

But every season the team has improved from Game 1 to Game 12 outside of 2017 where we got too banged up. I don't see any reason why this team won't either.

 

[Bayside44]

Yes, it's a crazy year. Yes, the O line is disjointed. Yes, two RB's opted out. But what troubles me, is that the offense has looked horrific with Devito at the helm.

In Babers first two years, even though they only won four games, you could see improvements all over the field. Sure they were losing, but the offense was exciting and fun to watch. You knew, or at least I thought I knew, it was just a matter of time.

I'm no expert, but I have not seen improvements on the offensive side over the past two years and the offense has not been exciting or fun to watch.

As SuRaider documented above, Sean Lewis, in hindsight, was a sorely underrated OC. Dino should have realized that and tried to move Heaven and Earth to keep him. I don't know, maybe he did try, I have no inside knowledge. But the loss of Sean Lewis was more significant than I think most thought. I think that, combined with the now obvious fact that SU cannot find success without a dual threat quarterback, makes me worry for the near future.

Who knows, maybe Gilbert will be a miracle worker. But, spring ball or no, short camp or no, how does an OC call a game like yesterday's? Unrelated, is the QB that SU needs to succeed in the locker room or even in the pipeline?

Yesterday felt like the worst of the Scott Shafer era all over again. Maybe that's harsh, irrational or even stupid, but it's how i feel. I felt after the game yesterday like I did after the Rutgers game in 2012. That was a good year (8-5, 5-2), but I remember that I just couldn't believe how terrible the offense played. The defense did all they could be asked to do, but the offense was just non-existent.

So many times in the Scott Shafer era, the defense did enough to win, but the offense just couldn't do its part. Is that now our future again? People are saying it's a throw away year. I'm too old; I can't afford throw away years.

I don't need Syracuse football to win the ACC or a National Championship or even to have a winning season, but I do need the team to play hard every down and for them to put on the field an offense that is fun to watch.

I love Dino *cking Babers, but I think he has three problems. One, pointed out in another thread yesterday and has probably been pointed out elsewhere around here, is that "Orange is the New Fast" is no longer a competitive advantage. Lots of teams are doing it and SU hasn't done it particularly well over the past two years.

Second, after five years (FIVE YEARS), SU still doesn't have the players on the offensive side of the ball to compete in the ACC. The defensive side is in a little bit better shape, but the 3-3-5 is a defensive scheme used to overcome personnel disadvantages.

Third is the most dangerous. Dino is trying to build the program the right way. He's trying to rebuild the team from the ground up. The problem is that it has been five years and, even with this "throw-away year," this is modern, major conference college football. How much more time will he be given? (I'm not implying or advocating that he be replaced.) What I am wondering is simply whether the powers that be are going to give him the time to complete his vision for SU. Even if they do, is that vision going to succeed?

I'm a simple man. I just want to enjoy watching Syracuse play football and basketball. I don't care about winning and losing, but what I saw yesterday, however you care to describe it, was not enjoyable.

Mass has ended, go in peace.

Ha - I started your post right before I left for mass.

To your last and most important point - yes, building from the ground up, and yes, he'll get all the time declared needed.

 

[nzm136]

Yes, it's a crazy year. Yes, the O line is disjointed. Yes, two RB's opted out. But what troubles me, is that the offense has looked horrific with Devito at the helm.

In Babers first two years, even though they only won four games, you could see improvements all over the field. Sure they were losing, but the offense was exciting and fun to watch. You knew, or at least I thought I knew, it was just a matter of time.

I'm no expert, but I have not seen improvements on the offensive side over the past two years and the offense has not been exciting or fun to watch.

As SuRaider documented above, Sean Lewis, in hindsight, was a sorely underrated OC. Dino should have realized that and tried to move Heaven and Earth to keep him. I don't know, maybe he did try, I have no inside knowledge. But the loss of Sean Lewis was more significant than I think most thought. I think that, combined with the now obvious fact that SU cannot find success without a dual threat quarterback, makes me worry for the near future.

Who knows, maybe Gilbert will be a miracle worker. But, spring ball or no, short camp or no, how does an OC call a game like yesterday's? Unrelated, is the QB that SU needs to succeed in the locker room or even in the pipeline?

Yesterday felt like the worst of the Scott Shafer era all over again. Maybe that's harsh, irrational or even stupid, but it's how i feel. I felt after the game yesterday like I did after the Rutgers game in 2012. That was a good year (8-5, 5-2), but I remember that I just couldn't believe how terrible the offense played. The defense did all they could be asked to do, but the offense was just non-existent.

So many times in the Scott Shafer era, the defense did enough to win, but the offense just couldn't do its part. Is that now our future again? People are saying it's a throw away year. I'm too old; I can't afford throw away years.

I don't need Syracuse football to win the ACC or a National Championship or even to have a winning season, but I do need the team to play hard every down and for them to put on the field an offense that is fun to watch.

I love Dino *cking Babers, but I think he has three problems. One, pointed out in another thread yesterday and has probably been pointed out elsewhere around here, is that "Orange is the New Fast" is no longer a competitive advantage. Lots of teams are doing it and SU hasn't done it particularly well over the past two years.

Second, after five years (FIVE YEARS), SU still doesn't have the players on the offensive side of the ball to compete in the ACC. The defensive side is in a little bit better shape, but the 3-3-5 is a defensive scheme used to overcome personnel disadvantages.

Third is the most dangerous. Dino is trying to build the program the right way. He's trying to rebuild the team from the ground up. The problem is that it has been five years and, even with this "throw-away year," this is modern, major conference college football. How much more time will he be given? (I'm not implying or advocating that he be replaced.) What I am wondering is simply whether the powers that be are going to give him the time to complete his vision for SU. Even if they do, is that vision going to succeed?

I'm a simple man. I just want to enjoy watching Syracuse play football and basketball. I don't care about winning and losing, but what I saw yesterday, however you care to describe it, was not enjoyable.

Mass has ended, go in peace.

FWIW, SS' offenses his last year was a better offense than Dino's first year and probably 2nd year as well. Dino's teams just failed drives faster and had more possessions. But offenses fundamentally have to do 3 things: (i) consistently score points when they get the ball, (ii) consistently move the ball down the field, and (iii) consistently hold on to the ball long enough to give the defense time to rest.

Dino's 1st and 2nd year offenses scored points and got yards, but they did so on a higher number of possessions than the SS teams, which means they were less likely to score when they had the ball, they were probably less likely to get yards when they had the ball (I never did the math, so I can't say for sure), and they were way worse at giving the defense a breather. I never did the math, but my guess is that the standard deviation of the above was higher, too, which means they were less consistent.

IMHO, his system works when some combination of the above is true: (i) nobody else is doing it, so defense aren't prepared for it and don't have the right pieces to stop it, (ii) it leads to higher quality recruits, and/or (iii) your team has a talent advantage vs the other team.

Otherwise, tempo offenses are a trainwreck from a mathematical perspecitve. More possessions make games more predictable, which is an advantage for the favored team. (see the concept of small sample size variance)

SU needs to run an offense that fits the recruiting realities of the staff/school, or we need to run an offense that is truly innovative and unique. I don't know what that offsense is (and if I did, I'd make several million a year to say), but I fear that running a Baylor retread offsense isn't the answer.

Still, you don't knock off a ranked VPI team, a #2 Clemson team, and score a 10 win season in 3 consecutive years by sheer luck. I have faith that Dino can turn the offensive boat around. One standout player can do wonders. We aren't that far away. But recruiting does need to pick up. Being out-recruited by Kansas, Kansas State, Memphis, Kentucky, Boston College, and Rutgers is a problem, as is having fewer 4 star recruits than those teams (sans Memphis), plus Northwestern (who has 3 4 star recruits, btw), Indiana, and Purdue. (I'm listing 4 star recruits because we need more impact players, so we need some difference makers at the top of the class to bring us to the next level IMO.)

 

[Chip]

No way to prove this of course, but if we had..

1. A normal spring practice session
2. A normal summer conditioning session and preseason camp
3. Dakota and Bleich
4. Adams and Howard
5. Opener at BC

Are we 1-0 right now? I'm not sure, but BC would be working in a lot of new pieces too (where UNC already had a lot of key pieces in place). I bet we'd have looked a lot better.

 

[bnoro]

The state of this thread after a single loss on the road against a ranked team.
Some of you are just unreasonable.

 

[Orangejet]

So many excuses why our offense is horrible and other teams are having the same issues. Feel bad for the defense for they ran out of gas. I remember playing the ‘Noles 1978 opener when Hurley got injured early and with FSU leading 7 - 0 into the 4Q, our defense (me included) tired out due to ZERO offense (Dave Farneski & Tim Wilson @ QB) and we let up three scores and lost 28 - 0.

 

[Orangello]

Our guards and center are getting blown up, we are down our two likely starting RB's, the QB is still holding onto the ball too long and making questionable throws/decisions and the play calling was really weak IMHO. Fix any two of those things and we're not Clemson but we'd have a punchers chance in most, not all, of the remaining tilts. Hats off to the defense and the future. I am very encouraged by the young guys starting to get some run.

 

[TheCusian]

I'm really disappointed with how they folded after Tommy's interception at 17-6, with 3 TDs coming in only five minutes and game over. I can't believe how small we look on the lines again. Am I hallucinating?
Our D line held up surprisingly well until the 4th Quarter. We look small all over the field, but we were quick and the secondary made several big plays.

The O line was horrendous. Jordan as our feature back is a disaster. He's talented but he's still too small and shouldn't be forced into this role right now. If we had Adams to offset him, it would be so much better.

DeVito had a touchdown dropped, and a few other balls not secured. We left at least 17 points on the field in the first half alone, and were still only down 10-6 and had the ball mid-to-late in the third quarter.

But he missed several open guys, too. He was more effective running. He stepped up in the pocket well at times. But this teams looks awful, and all we play are ACC teams plus Liberty. We don't get 4 OOC games this year.

We're toast. I'm very disappointed. What the hell happened?

Our LB looked the part. Iffy and Cisco are elite. Our DL is experienced and ACC caliber.

 

[CuseOnly]

your cavalier is likely their realistic.

fact of the matter is that in order to compete the offense requires timing and volume to make up for the difference in talent with better opponents. That requires conditioning and practice and there hasn’t been enough time and reps to maximize either. add to that losing DDavis Howard and Adams and the offense is behind where they would normally be at the start of the season

Every team is dealing with the same thing. Every team has players that opted out or declared for the draft.

Every team had less practices and no spring ball.

Its kind of like when it rains, both teams have to deal with it and play in it.

The 3 DB's that UNC didn't have yesterday didn't seem to affect their secondary, but naturally ours were "bigger" losses right?

 

[CuseOnly]

Not a good post. You’re not grasping the concept and quite frankly I don’t care about your job it has nothing to do with the topic at hand.

Frankly I care as much about your opinion as you do about my job.

 

[GoSU96]

He’s proven quality? What’s his overall record at SU, that includes blow out losses - quite a few and losses to some pretty low competition. Since he’s been here we’ve been atrocious on 3rd downs, both on offense and defense.

Where’s the quality? We’re starting to sound like Rutgers. We’ll still be talking about that 10 win season 12 years from now after a game we couldn’t score a TD... again and a 20-30 point loss.

If he took over a functional program you might have a point about his record. In 2015 SU was 119th in total offense and 99th in total defense. Not as bad as what Gerg left Marrone, but not much better. Before he got here SU was atrocious at EVERYTHING.

To ignore a 10-3 season like it's ancient history instead of the season before last is absurd. The guy is obviously a quality coach in the midst of building a program.

How in the world does anyone think that SU is in a position to fire a coach that went 10-3 and finishing ranked in the top 15 this recently. You want to finish off the program, that's the move to make.