JB at it again

[CuseFaninVT]

When the ball goes to the high post the immediate reaction of the forward has to be to drop to the baseline to cut that drive off then the guard on that side slides over to the shooter on that wing that the forward was covering and the other guard slides to cover the guard that was just released.

And two passes are much faster than a forward trying to cover 20 feet, especially when that forward has to stop his momentum and change direction.

 

[rrlbees]

And two passes are much faster than a forward trying to cover 20 feet, especially when that forward has to stop his momentum and change direction.

We've executed it successfully before. It's easier when a team plays a standard high low with 2 wings and the point. But it can also be defended better than we did when the other team is basically running a 4 out offense. It's all about anticipation and effort. They ran it some in the first half and we had some success. Second half not so much.

 

[kuethstheman]

I didn't watch the presser. Let me state that up front.

Exactly how do you think JB would react to this question - "Coach, how do you expect Richardson, Lydon or Roberson to be able to defend the three point shooters at the foul line extended or further and then be expected to rotate back to defend a cutter in the lane on their side of the court?"

Cause that's the question I want asked.

I'm guessing his answer would be something like: You don't know what you're talking about. Next!

I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about because I agree, that's what it looks like he's asking but it's a complicated system. I don't think he'd bother to answer the question. You'd do better to ask what the forwards are supposed to do in that situation.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

We've executed it successfully before. It's easier when a team plays a standard high low with 2 wings and the point. But it can also be defended better than we did when the other team is basically running a 4 out offense. It's all about anticipation and effort. They ran it some in the first half and we had some success. Second half not so much.

The way I look at it, it's an ether or proposition. You're either going to give up threes or the layups. They shot 18% from 3 with this defense, so that's a win. Expecting these guys to be able to stop the three and rotate back quickly enough to cover the lane is a losing bet. I think Roy adjusted by keeping the ball on the same side of the lane - exposing that wing for being so high.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

I'm guessing his answer would be something like: You don't know what you're talking about. Next!

I'm not saying you don't know what you're talking about because I agree, that's what it looks like he's asking but it's a complicated system. I don't think he'd bother to answer the question. You'd do better to ask what the forwards are supposed to do in that situation.

I'm curious how JB would respond to that.

 

[CuseHulk]

I love it when Coach B or any coach puts the media or a member of the media on blast.

Group of frustrated wannabe jocks, journalist nerds who ran the school news paper.

 

[Madbiker]

I didn't watch the presser. Let me state that up front.

Exactly how do you think JB would react to this question - "Coach, how do you expect Richardson, Lydon or Roberson to be able to defend the three point shooters at the foul line extended or further and then be expected to rotate back to defend a cutter in the lane on their side of the court?"

Cause that's the question I want asked.

Same way guys who played in the program before them did it. Coleman, Addison, Bergan, Wallace, Carmelo, Warrick, Johnson, Grant all did it. Not saying 100% but a hell of a lot better than what we've seen lately. The system works. It has for a long time. It just needs to be played correctly and with the right horses.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

Same way guys who played in the program before them did it. Coleman, Addison, Bergan, Wallace, Carmelo, Warrick, Johnson, Grant all did it. Not saying 100% but a hell of a lot better than what we've seen lately. The system works. It has for a long time. It just needs to be played correctly and with the right horses.

There have been a few more educated folks than me who correctly observed that this extension is relatively new. We are trying harder than ever to contest 3s and we leave the lane essentially unguarded. That's why I call it a 4-1 now and not a 2-3.

 

[Madbiker]

There have been a few more educated folks than me who correctly observed that this extension is relatively new. We are trying harder than ever to contest 3s and we leave the lane essentially unguarded. That's why I call it a 4-1 now and not a 2-3.

It seems they have extended the wings after the St. John's game where we got destroyed by Euro-dudes hitting 3's. Too bad they didn't do it that game because it might have been effective there.

 

[Col. Bleep]

There ought to be trepidation on the part of the Press because JB -- at this point in his career --- has stopped trying to answer leading and generally stupid questions. And he has the stature to bring them up short and point out how what they are asking is either obvious, dumb or not something he can answer.

It's been a long time since I've been at one of Boeheim's post game news conferences...back in the Big East days at some point.
And I have no idea about local Syracuse reporters and their supposed ignorance.
But generally national reporters (some of whom may be stupid, as well) couldn't care less about his demeanor.
In fact, the worse it is... the better material he gives them for tv, print and the web.

 

[jec1521]

Same way guys who played in the program before them did it. Coleman, Addison, Bergan, Wallace, Carmelo, Warrick, Johnson, Grant all did it. Not saying 100% but a hell of a lot better than what we've seen lately. The system works. It has for a long time. It just needs to be played correctly and with the right horses.

I love JB, but it would be nice for the program to not be so system based. How about molding a system around its players, and not the other way around. I believe this is what makes the likes of coach K, izzo, and pitino to be a step above JB, and the reason that JB only has one championship while those guys have multiple.

This isn't a very good team, but they are much better than what they are showing.

 

[rrlbees]

There have been a few more educated folks than me who correctly observed that this extension is relatively new. We are trying harder than ever to contest 3s and we leave the lane essentially unguarded. That's why I call it a 4-1 now and not a 2-3.

We've extended the zone more over the past few years as the zone has transformed some. It also includes more trapping out of it than it used to.

But we don't play a 4-1 and that's just become a lazy meme. A still photograph would sometimes show a 4-1, but it would also show a 2-3, 3-2 and 1-3-1. All depends upon where the offensive player is and where the ball is or is going. The 2-3 has constant movement.

 

[FrancoPizza]

I'm curious as to what this means. It would be physically impossible for Lydon or Roberson to contest at three at the foul line extended and then get back to the lane in time to contest the shot. UNC went guard to big at foul line to big slashing to the hoop and kept the ball on the same side of the floor. Coleman (or whoever was playing the center) has to come up to contest that big at the foul line because they were lights out from that spot last night. That leaves the wing on the other side, and if he rotates over to the opposite side, the big at the foul line will just find a guy cutting to the spot our other big wing has left.

JB has to give up something - either stop the big wings from extending out so far (which is what should have happened when you have the other team shooting 18 percent) or not complain about the layups and dunks. He needs to expect more from the guards up top to contest those shots as well as the pass to the foul line, and not put all the blame on the wings. In my opinion.

You're not going to stop an entry pass to the post when they are flashing 6'10" bodies. Any other ideas?

 

[FrancoPizza]

When the ball goes to the high post the immediate reaction of the forward has to be to drop to the baseline to cut that drive off then the guard on that side slides over to the shooter on that wing that the forward was covering and the other guard slides to cover the guard that was just released.

Yes sounds nice in print but when the forwards are overextended they are out of position to recover from the high post... especially when the opponent is decisive and knows where to attack.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Same way guys who played in the program before them did it. Coleman, Addison, Bergan, Wallace, Carmelo, Warrick, Johnson, Grant all did it. Not saying 100% but a hell of a lot better than what we've seen lately. The system works. It has for a long time. It just needs to be played correctly and with the right horses.

Wrong. The forwards only started "helping" or doubling the strong side when JB went all in on the zone (2009-2010). And with Keita JB added the 4-1 wrinkle where the center has to cover the corner 3 on an overload. Prior to 2009 the 2-3 was a lot more conservative.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

You're not going to stop an entry pass to the post when they are flashing 6'10" bodies. Any other ideas?

I'm thinking 1-2-2 zone for next year instead.

Honestly, I've got no frickin' clue other than to adjust the zone and not extend so far when their shooters are obviously off like the were last night. Which would likely mean they would heat up from 3 after that and we'd lose by 25.

 

[Kowbelkat]

We've extended the zone more over the past few years as the zone has transformed some. It also includes more trapping out of it than it used to.

But we don't play a 4-1 and that's just become a lazy meme. A still photograph would sometimes show a 4-1, but it would also show a 2-3, 3-2 and 1-3-1. All depends upon where the offensive player is and where the ball is or is going. The 2-3 has constant movement.

And they all don't work , maybe against Cornell but even Roy adjusted to it now that is saying something

 

[rrlbees]

And they all don't work , maybe against Cornell but even Roy adjusted to it now that is saying something

Sure.

 

[Madbiker]

Wrong. The forwards only started "helping" or doubling the strong side when JB went all in on the zone (2009-2010). And with Keita JB added the 4-1 wrinkle where the center has to cover the corner 3 on an overload. Prior to 2009 the 2-3 was a lot more conservative.

The forward wings always came up to guard the arc, it didn't start in 2009. But JB used it more extensively as the 3 point shot became a bigger part of the game.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

The forward wings always came up to guard the arc, it didn't start in 2009. But JB used it more extensively as the 3 point shot became a bigger part of the game.

Yeah, but they came out way further than they used to. It's not uncommon to see them nearly at the top of the key extended. It's too far.

 

[Cuse Action]

There ought to be trepidation on the part of the Press because JB -- at this point in his career --- has stopped trying to answer leading and generally stupid questions. And he has the stature to bring them up short and point out how what they are asking is either obvious, dumb or not something he can answer.

Take the absolutely stupid line of questioning about whether JB thought that his presence on the bench was an added boost to the team effort.

If the Press wants to not be embarrassed, they should ask better questions.

If they cannot, then they should be reassigned back to writing Obits and put somebody in the Press Conferences with half a brain. That's called making the Press "accountable".

This is a huge opportunity for the Press to do a good job. They have a guy who is actually willing to explain things to them and help them to a better job by forcing them to ask the right questions and to ask them properly.

But he answers the same dumb questions in a respectful tone when asked by the national media. He treats the locals like crap, and it's not becoming. He looks like a bully, and I for one would love to see one of the locals call him out.

 

[Orangeman]

We've executed it successfully before. It's easier when a team plays a standard high low with 2 wings and the point. But it can also be defended better than we did when the other team is basically running a 4 out offense. It's all about anticipation and effort. They ran it some in the first half and we had some success. Second half not so much.

It's outdated

Things have changed

Players are better

Coaches are better

2-3 zone has its place, as a 100% strategy there is no one that would do that

 

[tbonezone]

if JB doesn't like doing the pressers then just stop. or better yet let the press boycott and just stop showing up to deal with his open disdain. let coach grumpus walk into an empty press room , grumble a bit and leave.
he rarely offers any meaningful insights in these brief exchanges anyways.

 

[two3zone]

if JB doesn't like doing the pressers then just stop. or better yet let the press boycott and just stop showing up to deal with his open disdain. let coach grumpus walk into an empty press room , grumble a bit and leave.
he rarely offers any meaningful insights in these brief exchanges anyways.

I think he's forced to do them. But yeah, I used to enjoy these but every year there getting worse and worse and his attitude is shot. At least he's seemed to calm down with throwing his players under the bus.

 

[realorange]

But he answers the same dumb questions in a respectful tone when asked by the national media. He treats the locals like crap, and it's not becoming. He looks like a bully, and I for one would love to see one of the locals call him out.

they cut their own throat when it comes to SU BB if they do that.