JB's 'Whipping Boy' Technique

[Eric15]

If Mike Rice had 1,000 wins, would that have justified HIS behavior?

Townie stood up for Mike Rice after that incident.

 

[iommi]

Townie stood up for Mike Rice after that incident.

You're serious?

 

[Toga]

Dion had NBA talent so it worked with him. Same deal with Rony Seikaly. The others? Like trying to get water from a stone.

I've heard the animosity he held for Seikaly was real. May have been mutual.

 

[Toga]

Townie wanted me to give a "why" for what JB has been doing. I have no idea why he's been doing it. So I give a possible explanation and he says he's it is to justify my position. I was never trying to figure out why. I just know he's been doing it and it hasn't worked.

I hate using the ignore button but I guess I'm close to having no recourse. It's painfully obvious Townie offers zero value other than unintentional humor.

It's worked for me for some time.

 

[Alsacs]

I've heard the animosity he held for Seikaly was real. May have been mutual.

Seikaly was at the 03 NC game he supported the team and coach.
So while he may have been frustrated he supported the program when it mattered.

 

[Eric15]

You're serious?

My only comment on the Mike Rice situation.

 

[Toga]

Seikaly was at the 03 NC game he supported the team and coach.
So while he may have been frustrated he supported the program when it mattered.

Time heals as does a NC game. Just saying what I was told long ago by someone friendly with JB.

 

[Townie72]

This isn't a trophies and juice box situation. It's called you look like a dipshit being an bitter old man when you constantly pick on the same person over and over justified and sometimes not.

That's your opinion.

Why root for a team with a coach that's a dipshit and a bitter old man?

Don't you find that off putting?

The school is easing JB out. They announced his retirement publicly 2 years ago.
I love what JB has done for SU Hoops. However I can say his attitude in public critical of players who aren't paid is a joke.
The players don't rip him for getting suspended last year and putting the program thru a tough situation.'
I appreciate JB but don't ballwash away his faults.

Minor complaints that you can't wait to share with the world or at least with this board.

I find most of the criticism of JB to be either poorly founded or the product of subset of SU fans who personally dislike the guy. He's too tough and too caustic for them. And most of these people are from the self-esteem generation based on what I read on here.

Of course, what fun is it to praise the guy for 98% of what he is done here and what he has done for SU? Frequently this is triggered by fan frustration and the "search for the guilty" that follows disappointment. They don't like to lash out at a bunch of 20 year olds, so who can be the target?

JB, of course.

 

[iommi]

My only comment on the Mike Rice situation.

Wow.

 

[two3zone]

That's your opinion.

Why root for a team with a coach that's a dipshit and a bitter old man?

Don't you find that off putting?

I root for them because I have for a long time and love the kids that come in to play here. Yes, I do find it off putting as well.

Can you tell me the gain that the player, program, school, and future gets from him acting like this?

 

[JoeySimz]

Wow, you needed him to type that post? That's what we all think. You have to be trolling. You just have to be. Well done.

"We"? Who are you speaking for? That's certainly not a view I share.

 

[retro44]

JB is not in the Military nor is he a drill Sergeant... He is a coach that uses a roundball,not a flat one as Labrons buddy likes to claim

 

[two3zone]

"We"? Who are you speaking for? That's certainly not a view I share.

I'm sure the we is the large amount of people who are sharing his thoughts in this thread.

 

[Townie72]

I root for them because I have for a long time and love the kids that come in to play here. Yes, I do find it off putting as well.

Can you tell me the gain that the player, program, school, and future gets from him acting like this?

He's acting like a coach.

His job is to win games. That's what he thinks he's doing. Teams he has played against have lost over 1,000 games to him.

That you don't like his approach or demeanor doesn't matter.

Just like when you were complaining about him being tough on the Press.

You didn't get any participation trophies for youth sports did you? Just curious.

 

[JoeySimz]

In JB's defense, the system is used by the military at boot camps as drill sergeants try to jolt new recruits into line. However, the system changes after boot camp.

It has been JB's thing from the beginning, but to keep this post shorter, I'll just discuss his targets over the last decade. They include Paul Harris, Mookie Jones, Dion Waiters and now Tyler Roberson.

There is commonality here. All come from tough inner city neighborhoods and so are not used to taking lip from anyone (obstinate?). All were top prospects - 4 or 5 star (high expectations?). All were hotly pursued (high egos?). All nearly went elsewhere (unsure?).

The problem with the technique is that it really didn't change the kids. Praise, smoke blowing, encouragement, would surely have yielded more positive results.

While disturbing at times, it can also be amusing. In a recent game, Tyler Lydon made a bad TO and JB exploded and called time. As Tyler approached, he looked right past him and began screaming at TR. For what reason? Only Jimmy knows.

JB hates to be challenged about this technique. He gets very angry at just the mention of it. Too bad, I'd like to hear him explain why he thinks it works.

You are making huge assumptions. Is "whipping boy" an actual technique used by the military in boot camp as you've described? Why are you ascribing this to the Syracuse basketball program?

Then you go on to name players and make huge assumptions about the psychology of race and class.

You keep mentioning "technique". Can you cite when JB got angry at the mention of this so-called technique?

 

[iommi]

"We"? Who are you speaking for? That's certainly not a view I share.

I'm sure the we is the large amount of people who are sharing his thoughts in this thread.

Yes, I was referring to the people who were on my side in this thread, not everyone on this board or all Syracuse fans, of course.

 

[JoeySimz]

I'm sure the we is the large amount of people who are sharing his thoughts in this thread.

Thanks. That's what I thought but I wanted to be clear. I certainly don't feel that way and I don't post nearly as often those who do.

 

[OrangeAl]

The only whipping boy of this thread is a dead horse. It's gotten way too personal, gentlemen.

 

[Brooky03]

That would be your uneducated opinion based on what you see on TV.

Right?

I wouldn't call it uneducated but, yes, it's based on what I see on TV and on the sidelines at home games.

 

[orange2win]

Corey Maggette didn't start in college and got drafted high and had a long, solid pro career. Probably many other examples too.

Corey Maggette only played his Fr. year for Duke and then went pro. He played behind Elton Brand and Shane Battier. Even so, he still started several times.

Get your facts right before you make silly statements.

 

[Toga]

Corey Maggette only played his Fr. year for Duke and then went pro. He played behind Elton Brand and Shane Battier. Even so, he still started several times.

Get your facts right before you make silly statements.

Corey Maggette Was a pro at Duke. Still waiting on results of NCAA investigation.

 

[AZOrange]

My only comment on the Mike Rice situation.

Look Townie is old. And angry. If you're thinking you can "convince" him to see life through a different prism, you're wrong. The best part of that thread is him saying the Don Imus thing was overblown...lol.

EDIT: using the collective "you" here.

 

[orangedave]

I would not place much stock in that quote.

Can you come up with a better narrative for use in your highly competitive day job, in response to locker room banter "Hey Dion, I heard you never were good enough to make the starting line-up once at college. Hee, hee, hee. Is that true?"

Not nice what JB did to that kid.

Just wondering why you would not place much stock in the quote from Dion? What reason would he have for making an untrue comment?
I'm not going to take the time to look it up but I remember reading a quote from Dion in which he gave JB credit for his development. Said he thought about not coming back for his second season but his grandmother(?) pushed him. He had a sit down with JB who told him he could come back but he would not start but would get plenty of minutes. To paraphrase his final statement "I came to Syracuse as a boy and I left as a man; and for that I owe Coach Boeheim"
I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion on JB; only on how Dion perceived him. "Not nice what JB did to that kid"??

 

[orange2win]

Just wondering why you would not place much stock in the quote from Dion? What reason would he have for making an untrue comment?
I'm not going to take the time to look it up but I remember reading a quote from Dion in which he gave JB credit for his development. Said he thought about not coming back for his second season but his grandmother(?) pushed him. He had a sit down with JB who told him he could come back but he would not start but would get plenty of minutes. To paraphrase his final statement "I came to Syracuse as a boy and I left as a man; and for that I owe Coach Boeheim"
I'm not trying to change anyone's opinion on JB; only on how Dion perceived him. "Not nice what JB did to that kid"??

Thought my explanation was clear.

Once committed to SU, Dion's professional prospects were entirely at the mercy of JB. Even though he knew he was being shafted, he had to return. If he did not, his pro career prospects would be gone. He was wisely advised.

He's now in his 5th year and averaging 15 ppg, but was never good enough to start at SU! What explanation can he use? Should he say he was JB's whipping boy and then be asked to explain why? Or should he continue the fable that it was all part of the coaches noble plan to help him develop - which of course is hogwash. Which story would you use?

 

[orangenirvana]

Thought my explanation was clear.

Once committed to SU, Dion's professional prospects were entirely at the mercy of JB. Even though he knew he was being shafted, he had to return. If he did not, his pro career prospects would be gone. He was wisely advised.

He's now in his 5th year and averaging 15 ppg, but was never good enough to start at SU! What explanation can he use? Should he say he was JB's whipping boy and then be asked to explain why? Or should he continue the fable that it was all part of the coaches noble plan to help him develop - which of course is hogwash. Which story would you use?

Please explain how not starting = "getting shafted"

Waiters was not nearly the same player as an immature frosh that he would become as a sophomore. He reportedly had a piss-poor attitude.

So why would Boeheim have begun the season inserting Waiters into the starting lineup over any one of the two returning backcourt starters? And even after it was apparent that Waiters was much improved, why would JB change anything in the starting lineup when all that team did was win?