Marrone's tenure here...

[GoSU96]

Right, that's one way to look at it.

Another way is, it's the University's problem, since, you know, that donor wasn't stroked enough and they probably could have used more of the donor's support.

But whatever - MARRONE IS A GOD, PEOPLE.

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said. You're whole theme is strawman BS.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Yeah, because that's exactly what I said. You're whole theme is strawman BS.

My whole thing is that some people go overboard on Marrone. It can't even be argued otherwise.

 

[GoSU96]

My whole thing is that some people go overboard on Marrone. It can't even be argued otherwise.

And some people are wilfully ignorant who can't begrudge an ounce of credit to the job done to turn around the program.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

And some people are wilfully ignorant who can't begrudge an ounce of credit to the job done to turn around the program.

Oh man, I'm so glad I'm not in that camp since I've given Coach Marrone credit for all sorts of things and am at least a little informed. Sure would be terrible to be lumped in with those shlubs you described.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

 

[SWC75]

no.

its not.

and dont interupt bees here, hes rolling.

"imo: the best case scenario for Cuse is SS holds the fort with a couple of 6-6, 7-5 seasons then off a 5-7 where he loses the last one, we can him and spend that ACC $$$ on a big hire."

So you'd rather go 5-7 and lose the last one so we can can the coach than win the last one or maybe go 8-4 or 9-3 instead, because then we'd have to keep the coach. How is that not rooting for failure?

 

[RandygoCuse]

Maybe Marrone lied about Cuse being his dream job. Maybe he did promise not to take any of the coaching staff with him and did it anyway. However, if you told me (before he was hired) that those would be the worst things he would do and he would get us to where we were at the end of his tenure, I would have no problem taking the deal.

 

[KaiserUEO]

"imo: the best case scenario for Cuse is SS holds the fort with a couple of 6-6, 7-5 seasons then off a 5-7 where he loses the last one, we can him and spend that ACC $$$ on a big hire."

So you'd rather go 5-7 and lose the last one so we can can the coach than win the last one or maybe go 8-4 or 9-3 instead, because then we'd have to keep the coach. How is that not rooting for failure?

becauseNEVER ONCE have I EVER NOT rooted for the ORANGE toWIN and NO WHERE in there did i SAY that is my PREFERRED option. youve been here long enough to know that those truths should be self evident.

but to the line in question...if you had any reading comprehension skills at all and had at least a slight grasp of the english language, you wouldve caught the idea that i was stating that i was fearful that the SS regime is not going to end pretty or that he his not the guy to give the program a 'bump'. i then posted a best case scenario for an early exit. 1 where we witnessed a few fairly succesful seasons, the last of which is a just miss bowl one...and then the trigger is pulled.

because lets be serious, if all we get from SS is 'a couple of 6-6, 7-5 seasons then off a 5-7 where he loses the last one'...then his arse should be canned.

if you think that line you quoted is me stating that im going to go all adam schein or coachpmustgo on any coach, then you should stick to bingo nights in the church basement.

as you were.

im done.

 

[chakka3421]

SWC75 - welcome aboard you've been Kaiserized!!!!!

 

[RandygoCuse]

Bored Historian, Board Historian. I literally just got that.

 

[GoSU96]

Oh man, I'm so glad I'm not in that camp since I've given Coach Marrone credit for all sorts of things and am at least a little informed. Sure would be terrible to be lumped in with those shlubs you described.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk 2

I still don't know what camp deified Marrone. Who are those people?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I still don't know what camp deified Marrone. Who are those people?

Oh man, this is going to get awkward.

 

[SanDiegoCuse]

Wow. Great thread everyone. I haven't logged in for quite a while but this was awesome.

 

[NashvilleOrange]

Not worthy of its own thread so I'll post here. Was listening to the radio this morning in Tennessee and they were heaping on the praise for Marrone. They were saying what an amazing job he's doing winning with a 3rd string QB; their guest from Pro Football Talk agreed. It's a very nice contrast to have a former Syracuse coach do well in the NFL next to the trainwreck that is Schiano.

 

[SWC75]

becauseNEVER ONCE have I EVER NOT rooted for the ORANGE toWIN and NO WHERE in there did i SAY that is my PREFERRED option. youve been here long enough to know that those truths should be self evident.

but to the line in question...if you had any reading comprehension skills at all and had at least a slight grasp of the english language, you wouldve caught the idea that i was stating that i was fearful that the SS regime is not going to end pretty or that he his not the guy to give the program a 'bump'. i then posted a best case scenario for an early exit. 1 where we witnessed a few fairly succesful seasons, the last of which is a just miss bowl one...and then the trigger is pulled.

because lets be serious, if all we get from SS is 'a couple of 6-6, 7-5 seasons then off a 5-7 where he loses the last one'...then his arse should be canned.

if you think that line you quoted is me stating that im going to go all adam schein or coachpmustgo on any coach, then you should stick to bingo nights in the church basement.

as you were.

im done.

Good.

I guess I confused "best case scenario" for "preferred option", as anyone would.

 

[kcsu]

I think it is unreasonable not to give Doug his due. He did turn the program around and while the .500 record and poor conference performances are fact, there is no factual basis to believe that he didn’t leave the program better than he found it. We can reasonably disagree about the degree but not about the direction.

I give Coach Marrone his due and am thankful for the job he did but, it is clear to me now, he was never going to be a Frank Beamer. He is an NFL coach and not College coach. Best wishes and now move on.

Shafer vs Marrone
These are two very different personalities. One wears it on his sleeve and the other hides it deep down. They are, however, very similar in certain things. They are both players’ coaches. They never throw their guys under the bus and while it is boring to hear them say “it’s on me” after every loss, I guarantee you that if your son played for either of them you would love them.

I doubt anyone would disagree that Shafer is more a college coach and Marrone more an NFL one. Shafer has spent his life in the college game and Doug has not. Experience dictates your perspective and I think these two are a good example of that.

Talent Evaluation – Anyone that doesn’t think Marrone is good – no, great – evaluator of football talent hasn’t been paying attention. It is the one thing at which he was head and shoulders above other coaches. From all accounts Shafer is a good evaluator as well - Marrone was on offensive players and Shafer defensive ones. I doubt Shafer will prove to be as good as Dougie at player evaluation but he doesn’t have to be if he proves to be a much better recruiter.

Player Development – Here, again, Marrone was excellent. A .500 coach in the Big East puts a good number of players in the NFL. I have no doubt that DM will turn around the Bills because, in the NFL, putting together a team requires superior talent evaluation. He has already started to show that ability at the pro level.

From all the evidence, Shafer also excels in this area as well but he is probably no Doug Marrone.

Game Planning - Doug was good at game planning but not great. He got outcoached by Big East coaches far too often. Sorry, but that is what I remember.

Shafer is a good defensive game planner – just ask Geno Smith and Teddy Bridgewater. The jury is still out on offense.

Game Management – This was not and is not a Marrone strength. He got better over the years at SU but he will never be considered to have been a top game manager. Being a good game planner requires that you buy into a certain approach and if things go wrong during the game it is hard to throw those strong feelings in the waste basket and do something different. Trying to wear down a team with the run game pays off in the 4th quarter making it tough to give up on that line until it is too late. That said, it seemed as if Doug’s team’s rarely made effective adjustments until halftime.

Shafer is an unknown so far but it looks like he needs some experience in this area. We will need to see how he does.

Overall Management – Doug is viewed as having taken a CEO approach and Shafer is trying to emulate him in that respect. However, while many think Doug was good at this I am not so sure, I think he gets good but not great marks. Marrone’s teams were very undisciplined and his special teams were terrible. (We lost two games in a row to Rutgers on a blocked extra point and a blocked FG.)

Doug put together a pretty good staff and made changes where necessary. He let the guys doing well run their business and jumped in where guys were no cutting it. I think he gets pretty good marks here.

Of course we don’t yet know about Shafer’s staff. The rest of the season will reveal a lot. While I like many of his hires, I just don’t know about Bullough and Reed. Most importantly Shafer needs to show the skill Doug demonstrated managing the staff, including making changes.

Recruiting – While Doug was great at finding the diamonds in the ruff, his recruiting classes were always big development ones. I don’t recall all that many of Doug’s freshman or even RS freshman seeing the field. All evidence suggests that Doug hated recruiting and that he tried to delegate it to his staff.

Just a word about the star system. We all know it is not perfect and there are plenty of 4 and 5 star busts and 2 and 3 star successes. However, having to live on finding players that are under recruited is living on the edge and defying the odds. Sooner or later the cupboard will be bare or the majority of your 2 stars will prove to be two stars. Tough way to live.

Shaf has been in the college game all his life and he gets it. His personality is more suited to recruiting than Doug’s and I think it shows. Shafer went out and hired George McDonald not because he thought he was the greatest OC, he hired him because he can recruit.

Personally, I think many are missing the big picture here. We are so anxious to get back to the top 25 (which is the football seal of approval) that we are impatient. This season will be what it will be - Shafer doesn't own this one - Marrone does. It doesn't matter - the recruiting class does.

Many don’t understand that a sea change is taking place. We have a HC that understands that old axiom, “90% of coaching is recruiting”. This staff is going to stock the shelves with more good players than we have had here in decades. We won’t need much patience as it started last year under very difficult circumstances.

Lastly, Shafer’s personality will prove to be much better at dealing with the administration, the press and the fans.

Doug is in the NFL, Shafer is our HC - all is right in the force.
Go Orange!
OK, Go Bills

Great post spot on thanks