NBA Playoffs

[cuseattle]

I really don't think it is over until the Cavs lose at home. LBJ can win a couple.

 

[Fireball Jr.]

I must be having deja vu. Lebronagists throwing the Cleveland supporting cast under the bus like it was 2009 all over again. I could buy that the first time around, but not this time. LeBron assembled this team, it's on him.

This just in: LeBron's not "the" or "a" problem. You just like to use the word LeBronagists. Do you feel better now (btw, please, original, not cut-and-paste posts. are preferable...this one's a re-run).

 

[Fireball Jr.]

It's all Durant's doing, Cavs shoulda been goin' up 2-0 over the Thunder last night ay home. BTW, wondered how long it would be before Love got hurt. Went longer than I thought.

 

[RF2044]

I have to assume that the Cavs won't get swept, although that is a distinct possibility.

After they lose game 3, I'd expect a really lopsided officiated game in their favor at home that enables them to eke out a close win. One of those games were Green picks up 3 fouls in the first quarter, and is forced to spend more than half the game on the bench, etc.

 

[RF2044]

Btw. I agree, Cav's never had a chance in the finals weather it was OKC, GST or SAS. They just don't have enough and Irving and Love are second tier players.

Prior to the Finals starting last week, I was listening to ESPN radio the afternoon before game 1. The entire coverage was about Lebron, and how well the Cavs were playing versus how the Warriors struggled in the WCS, how the Cavs smelled blood in the water and were going to take it to them, how it would be different this year with a healthy Love / Irving.

I wonder what those same radio personalities would have to say now after two drubbings.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Prior to the Finals starting last week, I was listening to ESPN radio the afternoon before game 1. The entire coverage was about Lebron, and how well the Cavs were playing versus how the Warriors struggled in the WCS, how the Cavs smelled blood in the water and were going to take it to them, how it would be different this year with a healthy Love / Irving.

I wonder what those same radio personalities would have to say now after two drubbings.

This is why I think the Warriors want to bury the Cavs, and why I think it will be over quick. They are 170-34 since the start of last year. They are an all time great team. The offense is great and the defense is stifling.

 

[cuseattle]

Let's see what the Cavs do at home before we have a coronation.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Well, whatever they are, their payroll is insane and they let Lebron play GM while assembling a team around him.

Not sure why Love and Irving are of all a sudden equivalent to role players in some people's eyes. (Not saying you)

You can say that about me though. I've always believed that Love is a great numbers on a bad team player. Irving I think is a good, but he's all over the place a bit. Those guys have talent, I just don't think they're a great fit. It was Lebron's choice to have those guys as his running mates.

It's hard to be more than a role player when you're an enormous liability on one end of the floor.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Let's see what the Cavs do at home before we have a coronation.

The Warriors are who we thought they were.

 

[cuseattle]

The Warriors are who we thought they were.

I want to see the next game before I say this isn't a series.

 

[Alsacs]

Also, they traded two 1st round draft picks to get Mozgov.

Cleveland has first round picks to trade. The Mozgov trade was their 2016 first round pick and the picks Cleveland got for Dion Waiters from OKC this year in the late 20s.

 

[longislandcuse]

You can say that about me though. I've always believed that Love is a great numbers on a bad team player. Irving I think is a good, but he's all over the place a bit. Those guys have talent, I just don't think they're a great fit. It was Lebron's choice to have those guys as his running mates.

It's hard to be more than a role player when you're an enormous liability on one end of the floor.

So what does he need then? I mean c'mon, the dudes supposed to be all-time great. Now we have to pretend his supporting cast of Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, JR Smith, Tristan Thompson (all guys he wanted) are trash?

Assuming GSW, OKC and SAS stay themselves for the next 3-4 years. What does Lebron need to win a ring?

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This just in: LeBron's not "the" or "a" problem. You just like to use the word LeBronagists. Do you feel better now (btw, please, original, not cut-and-paste posts. are preferable...this one's a re-run).

I think Lebron the player is absolutely not a problem. I do think though that part of coming back to Cleveland was because he wanted to see if he could win without Riley, he wanted to call the shots, Cleveland would give him that authority, and they had the raw materials to make moves. It's hard for me to believe he hasn't been behind or at least 100% on board with everything they've done putting that team together.

They're still time for this series to turn around for them, but they look really limited. Beating up on the East hides some stuff that gets exposed pretty quickly in the West.

 

[Cusefan0307]

So what does he need then? I mean c'mon, the dudes supposed to be all-time great. Now we have to pretend his supporting cast of Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, JR Smith, Tristan Thompson (all guys he wanted) are trash?

Assuming GSW, OKC and SAS stay themselves for the next 3-4 years. What does Lebron need to win a ring?

Join the Warriors, Spurs, or OKC.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

So what does he need then? I mean c'mon, the dudes supposed to be all-time great. Now we have to pretend his supporting cast of Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, JR Smith, Tristan Thompson (all guys he wanted) are trash?

Assuming GSW, OKC and SAS stay themselves for the next 3-4 years. What does Lebron need to win a ring?

A stronger owner, general management group, and coach in my opinion.

But yeah, the personnel doesn't fit. Players generally aren't very good at picking their own teammates.

 

[Alsacs]

Cleveland will not get swept. They will not lose 2 home games in a row. Now I think it is pretty obvious the Warriors are the better team. When Richard Jefferson's corpse is your 2nd best player on the floor in a Finals game then your team isn't going to win.

Cleveland's hasn't been able to muck up the game because of Kyrie Irving's defense is awful. The Cavs against this Warriors team would be better off the dirty Delleadova playing the lion share of the PG minutes.

Cleveland has invested heavily on stopping Curry and the rest of the team has just stepped up. Game 1 it was Shaun Livingston Game 2 it was Draymond Green and Lebron has been frustrated by Andre Iguadola. They are pick and rolling a lot to get Iguadola off Lebron.

 

[Alsacs]

I still think Cleveland would have beaten Oklahoma City because of HCA. Only the Spurs or Warriors would have beaten Cleveland for sure.

Both SA and GS have elite Lebron stoppers in Leonard and Iguadola. Plus, both teams as a result don't have to double Lebron and leave his shooters wide open. It doesn't help that Cleveland doesn't have any lockdown defenders either as Iman Shumpert doesn't play as much anymore.

Irving and Love are subpar defenders. Thompson is active but is a rich man's Baye Moussa Keita. Cleveland is 3rd best team in the league because of Lebron James greatness. Miami was perfect roster for him. Dwayne Wade was the perfect 2nd banana and was a good defender. Chris Bosh could defend and stretched the floor. Mike Miller/Shane Battier were the good role players. Mario Chalmers/Chris Anderson role players.

This Cleveland team is not that good without Lebron James.

 

[Cusefan0307]

What seed would the Cavs have been in the West?

 

[Melancer46]

Cleveland has first round picks to trade. The Mozgov trade was their 2016 first round pick and the picks Cleveland got for Dion Waiters from OKC this year in the late 20s.

I suppose they could offer their 2018 draft pick, but they can only offer it protected 11-30 (they've already traded it protected 1-10 to Portland). Same goes for the 2019 pick if Portland doesn't get the 2018. As far as I understand the way trading draft picks work, they can't trade their 2017 pick due to the fact that they already traded the 2018/2019 pick, so for all intents and purposes, they have no picks to offer.

 

[Melancer46]

What seed would the Cavs have been in the West?

If we simply gave them the same record in the West, or if they played all year in the West? If we just give them the same record, they would have been the 3 seed.

 

[Cusefan0307]

If we simply gave them the same record in the West, or if they played all year in the West? If we just give them the same record, they would have been the 3 seed.

Except they would have been stuck playing at least 3 or 4 games against everyone out west (instead of 2), so they would have had more losses.

 

[Knicks411]

Except they would have been stuck playing at least 3 or 4 games against everyone out west (instead of 2), so they would have had more losses.

For whatever it's worth, they had a better record against the west (22-8, 73.3% win) than the east (35-17, 67.3%). If you assume the same win% against the west as the east (not sure you can but it's as good a guess as anything else) they go 58-24 as opposed to 57-25, so not really a difference. The west overall wasn't really any better than the east; though obviously the top level teams were. OKC won 55, so I think Cle is likely the three seed.

 

[jordoo]

Prior to the Finals starting last week, I was listening to ESPN radio the afternoon before game 1. The entire coverage was about Lebron, and how well the Cavs were playing versus how the Warriors struggled in the WCS, how the Cavs smelled blood in the water and were going to take it to them, how it would be different this year with a healthy Love / Irving.

I wonder what those same radio personalities would have to say now after two drubbings.

I just don't understand how professional sports people who follow the NBA regularly could feel that the Cavs had a legit shot in the finals before the playoffs or at any time during them. My thoughts were always more along the line of how many games could they push the series to 5 or 6 and who their opponent would be. Just watching the east and west playoffs it was glaringly obvious that the level of play was very different.

 

[jordoo]

So what does he need then? I mean c'mon, the dudes supposed to be all-time great. Now we have to pretend his supporting cast of Kyrie Irving, Kevin Love, JR Smith, Tristan Thompson (all guys he wanted) are trash?

Assuming GSW, OKC and SAS stay themselves for the next 3-4 years. What does Lebron need to win a ring?

Some of us never thought it was a good supporting cast to begin with. I have not thought LeBron has a chance to win a ring with the roster in Cleveland since he has been there. I don't think Curry wins with that roster either. Look at how much more multidimensional the Warriors roster is than the Cavs. That is the really big issue, the Cavs can keep switching guys but they are always at a disadvantage on one end or the other because they have so many one way players and very few players who can create offense for themselves and others regularly.

 

[RF2044]

Let's see what the Cavs do at home before we have a coronation.

C'mon...

You are technically right--the series isn't over, but it will be soon.