something is very wrong......

newmexicuse

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#1
i have long been a big coach d supporter, but all of these recent flips is making me think something is very wrong with the program.i would like to see some accountability.
 

OrangeXtreme

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#5
flips to nd, virginia, mich and princeton. i think they would all have as high or higher tuitions than does su.
Michigan offered Zawada a full scholarship, while we only offered a partial. And the Ivies come up with a ton of need based aid depending on your income (and it doesn't hurt to be a great student).
 
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#9
I agree with those listing the obvious reasons these flips would occur. If something is really wrong, then what could it be??? That's a question for the original poster or anyone else.
 

Whitey23

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#11
It certainly looks like an out of touch group from the outside. As others have pointed out, the lack of a social media presence is a good example of where the staff is falling behind. Other teams are constantly pushing out content for their fanbases and prospects. This month on twitter (which included signing day) the team pushed out 2 thanksgiving tweets and an ad for their December prospect camp. Their Instagram hasn't posted anything since October.

On a side note I found real irony in the team wanting prospects to pay $135 for the chance to come play in front of them. I'm sure every program does it but lately it seems particularly bothersome.
 
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#12
It certainly looks like an out of touch group from the outside. As others have pointed out, the lack of a social media presence is a good example of where the staff is falling behind. Other teams are constantly pushing out content for their fanbases and prospects. This month on twitter (which included signing day) the team pushed out 2 thanksgiving tweets and an ad for their December prospect camp. Their Instagram hasn't posted anything since October.

On a side note I found real irony in the team wanting prospects to pay $135 for the chance to come play in front of them. I'm sure every program does it but lately it seems particularly bothersome.
True. Although, it is actually one of the cheaper one's that I have seen. Most are $150-$175
 
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#14
Michigan offered Zawada a full scholarship, while we only offered a partial. And the Ivies come up with a ton of need based aid depending on your income (and it doesn't hurt to be a great student).
I have some doubts about whether Michigan is really giving Zawada a full scholarship. Michigan is recruiting
pretty well. In the 2019 class, the have #23 Bonami and #29 Schriber ranked above Zawada. MIchigan has a number of other good recruits, who will get something.

Michigan has 9 4-star recruits, 3 ranked in the top 40 in their 2020 class. I believe Ty Xanders recently announced that they had also added the #28 recruit to that class.

Michigan is recruiting just like one of the better lacrosse schools now, so it is hard to see them being able to give man full scholarships.
 
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#15
Michigan offered Zawada a full scholarship, while we only offered a partial. And the Ivies come up with a ton of need based aid depending on your income (and it doesn't hurt to be a great student).
I also find that hard to believe but IF Zawada was truly given a full ride then a few things come to mind. 1) Michigan is obviously fully funded and they have "managed their payroll" and roster well as lead players and seniors Noseworthy, Curran, Sutherland, DeCaprio, and Borda roll off the books at year end and free up monies 2 ) Many players come from well to do families and scholarship monies are secondary to lax getting them into a top school 3) Cuse is a larger squad and still relatively young so rolloff of monies for 19' and beyond is more limited restricting ability to match offers 4) A few of our better contributors who dont come from monies and could start for Michigan may be getting short changed and might consider transferring to Michigan if they have the grades.
 

Orangelax

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#16
I also find that hard to believe but IF Zawada was truly given a full ride then a few things come to mind. 1) Michigan is obviously fully funded and they have "managed their payroll" and roster well as lead players and seniors Noseworthy, Curran, Sutherland, DeCaprio, and Borda roll off the books at year end and free up monies 2 ) Many players come from well to do families and scholarship monies are secondary to lax getting them into a top school 3) Cuse is a larger squad and still relatively young so rolloff of monies for 19' and beyond is more limited restricting ability to match offers 4) A few of our better contributors who dont come from monies and could start for Michigan may be getting short changed and might consider transferring to Michigan if they have the grades.
Getting a full ride doesn't necessarily mean that all of the money is coming from the athletics. I know for a fact that most of the SoCon schools blend Academic/Athletic packages when putting together offers for their Student Athletes. Maybe Michigan put together a combo offer combined with some promises of early playing time.
 
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#17
Michigan also frees up its goalie Heidt, who is there for a graduate year. Still, Curran was the only top 50 recruit of that group, Borda was #86. Noseworthy has developed into a star, but wasn't considered a big recruit.
Michigan has 46 players on its roster now, after dropping a few players.

Looking at 2020, Michigan should have Buckanavage and Mack back as juniors, and brought in the #39 freshmen Bryce Clay this fall, who would be a sophomore.
 
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#18
I guess what bothers me about the Zawada situation is, if it really was about money - SU just had three decommitments from players who I assume were made scholarship promises of some sort. A top recruit decides to commit somewhere based *solely* on financial reasons - and the coaches don't offer any of $$ that has just presumably opened up? I remain skeptical that it was only a financial decision. Good luck to him, but it sounds like we are tying to give the coaching staff a pass for this, and for me it doesn't add up.
 
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#19
I guess what bothers me about the Zawada situation is, if it really was about money - SU just had three decommitments from players who I assume were made scholarship promises of some sort. A top recruit decides to commit somewhere based *solely* on financial reasons - and the coaches don't offer any of $$ that has just presumably opened up? I remain skeptical that it was only a financial decision. Good luck to him, but it sounds like we are tying to give the coaching staff a pass for this, and for me it doesn't add up.
Yeah I agree. Seems odd. Obviously a full ride makes a difference but the kid was going to the Hill Academy which I am guessing wasn't free.
 
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#20
Lacrosse works off equivalency where 12.6 scholarships are spread amongst many players that were likely deemed top notch coming in and little is distributed to some that may be even better but without the billing.

Dont believe Z was even in top 100 a year ago so not sure why Cuse should have extended any offering more than most core players get or dont get. Because one college may, does not mean that another should. Circumstances are different for all schools and families.

Not even sure what counts against that 12.6 in the haze of NCAA calculations. May not be just athletic monies but also any academic or financial aid that is part of a scholarship. Perhaps someone here can expound on what monies are counted agaisnt the total cost of attendance which is appts 70-75k at Cuse

Finally, the 19' made a decision to switch very late, right before signing NLI's unlike the 2020's who gave us plenty of lead time to replenish. Suggests to me that shopped to extract the best deal. Their right but everything gets valued in its context . If so, time to move on and concentrate on the prospects that are actually coming
 

newmexicuse

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#21
I guess what bothers me about the Zawada situation is, if it really was about money - SU just had three decommitments from players who I assume were made scholarship promises of some sort. A top recruit decides to commit somewhere based *solely* on financial reasons - and the coaches don't offer any of $$ that has just presumably opened up? I remain skeptical that it was only a financial decision. Good luck to him, but it sounds like we are tying to give the coaching staff a pass for this, and for me it doesn't add up.
Yes, good post, what bothers me isn't the flips per se. That happens. It is the fact that we haven't flipped anybody to us. As you point out, we have to have some unexpected scholie $$$ available.

One directional flips still begs back to my OP on staff accountability. I see no excuse why we should lose 4 top recruits & not be able to flip at least one or two others back to us.
 
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#22
I guess what bothers me about the Zawada situation is, if it really was about money - SU just had three decommitments from players who I assume were made scholarship promises of some sort. A top recruit decides to commit somewhere based *solely* on financial reasons - and the coaches don't offer any of $$ that has just presumably opened up? I remain skeptical that it was only a financial decision. Good luck to him, but it sounds like we are tying to give the coaching staff a pass for this, and for me it doesn't add up.
We are all ignorant of the reasons for these de-coms. We have no data, no reports, no intelligence, just conjecture. Where are the investigative reporters. Where is Xanders on this stuff. I am tired of the emphasis on recruit rating and the lack of depth in lacrosse reporting. Coaches won't talk, even retired coaches who could delineate much of the crap that goes on among college recruiters. I'd like to see in depth confidential interviews with coaches, recruits, families, college administrators, retired players, etc. We, the supporters of this game, lovers of this game who spend time and money on it should demand of anyone who claims to report to us in magazines, tweets, etc. that he or she take risks to discover the basis for important events or trends. I have already described the way I think a good recruiting system might work on this forum. For all I know it was a swing and miss. Let's hold people like Xanders accountable for more than just "a quick leftie attack man" blurbs. For god's sake do some real work.
 

JeremyCuse

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#23
Yes, good post, what bothers me isn't the flips per se. That happens. It is the fact that we haven't flipped anybody to us. As you point out, we have to have some unexpected scholie $$$ available.

One directional flips still begs back to my OP on staff accountability. I see no excuse why we should lose 4 top recruits & not be able to flip at least one or two others back to us.
Well that top 100 D player in the 2020 class is a former North Carolina Committ who de-committed. Also keep in mind there are several SU players on the roster who came to SU after decommitting elsewhere, a certain starting midfielder from Oregon leads the pack.
 
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#24
We are all ignorant of the reasons for these de-coms. We have no data, no reports, no intelligence, just conjecture. Where are the investigative reporters. Where is Xanders on this stuff. I am tired of the emphasis on recruit rating and the lack of depth in lacrosse reporting. Coaches won't talk, even retired coaches who could delineate much of the crap that goes on among college recruiters. I'd like to see in depth confidential interviews with coaches, recruits, families, college administrators, retired players, etc. We, the supporters of this game, lovers of this game who spend time and money on it should demand of anyone who claims to report to us in magazines, tweets, etc. that he or she take risks to discover the basis for important events or trends. I have already described the way I think a good recruiting system might work on this forum. For all I know it was a swing and miss. Let's hold people like Xanders accountable for more than just "a quick leftie attack man" blurbs. For god's sake do some real work.
Xanders' strength is definitely not in writing. His strength is marketing. I've been critical of his lack of coverage of HS lacrosse in the spring, but it's obvious that summer and fall tournaments will help him travel to attend the tournament, and HS teams won't do that, so he doesn't cover HS games outside the MD/DC/VA area. And he really doesn't cover much of them either. There are a ton of good HS teams playing on the east coast multiple times each week for 3 months each spring, but it hardly gets covered. But lucky for us he keeps putting out his weekly top 25 of the same HS teams adjusted by a couple positions based on their recent results. :eyeroll:
 
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#25
We are all ignorant of the reasons for these de-coms. We have no data, no reports, no intelligence, just conjecture. Where are the investigative reporters. Where is Xanders on this stuff. I am tired of the emphasis on recruit rating and the lack of depth in lacrosse reporting. Coaches won't talk, even retired coaches who could delineate much of the crap that goes on among college recruiters. I'd like to see in depth confidential interviews with coaches, recruits, families, college administrators, retired players, etc. We, the supporters of this game, lovers of this game who spend time and money on it should demand of anyone who claims to report to us in magazines, tweets, etc. that he or she take risks to discover the basis for important events or trends. I have already described the way I think a good recruiting system might work on this forum. For all I know it was a swing and miss. Let's hold people like Xanders accountable for more than just "a quick leftie attack man" blurbs. For god's sake do some real work.
You are not wrong Sholokov - unfortunately conjecture is all I have right now in trying to parse out why the team is suffering these recruiting losses. Other major sports have a wealth of information, unfortunately Lacrosse, for all its popularity, seems to have regressed in terms of coverage. Inside Lacrosse is an absolute shell of itself (and not like it was setting the world on fire previously). The Post Standard copy/pastes most of its articles from SU press releases. The most consistent coverage I can find nowadays is from the student newspaper. In fact, the best actual place to find news and information is on message boards, which I am thankful for, but shouldn't be the main service of the site. The guys at Nunes Magician wrote the only bit of news on the recruiting losses, but there were no actual quotes or opinions from different people - it was essentially a message board post.

Alas, as fans, I'm not sure what we do here but try and engage more (respectfully of course) - twitter, instagram whatever, I think we can all try and do better to show the big wigs out there that there is an interest in this sport.
 


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