Syracuse hiring Alex Kline as GM

[hoopsupstate]

A GM might target ten guys and all ten could go elsewhere. We’re all assuming we can fix this with the portal. That is not a guarantee. You should probably keep a lookout for potential JUCO players.

 

[RF2044]

This is how they're doing it. Very few successful teams are built around a pile of 1-year guys.

How To Build A Roster In The Modern Portal Era

A study on the roster construction strategies that lead to success for high majors

blog.evanmiya.com

Great article -- totally makes sense.

And the thing that popped for me: build a roster of good players, and have them account for 50% of the production.

I've seen it speculated in the last few days that the staff is bracing itself for every player on the roster to depart, except for Petar. Yikes, in turns of returning production.

 

[phil77]

Great article -- totally makes sense.

And the thing that popped for me: build a roster of good players, and have them account for 50% of the production.

I've seen it speculated in the last few days that the staff is bracing itself for every player on the roster to depart, except for Petar. Yikes, in turns of returning production.

When I am thinking about current players or players we are chasing in the portal I always think it comes down to two simple questions now that money looks like it wont be that big of an issue across all P4 teams:

-Why should they stay at Syracuse to play for Red?
-Why should they come to Syracuse to play for Red?

Are we putting players in the NBA?
Are we developing players?
Are we playing a fun entertaining style of basketball?
Are game days fun (big crowds student sections)?
Are we winning at a high level?
Are we ranked?
Are we talked about nationally?
Does GameDay or whatever that is called for BBall?
How do we market/sell our program?


Now that all teams have money these are the things that will matter...

 

[ar inj]

and did not prioritize keeping Maliq

Stop.

Maliq did not want to stay. The coach who recruited him left; his friend, who was booed, left; he did not want to be a back-up at SU; he got a great deal for him (and he probably new a lot more about the competency of the staff).

 

[Red2003]

Also don’t forget the $1m NIL bump we get from that Vegas tournament.

I try to keep bringing this up. We are going to know real fast what we got over Thanksgiving this year with that Players Era tourney, it's 18 teams. If we fall into last place we know what's coming cuz we ain't gonna get better.

I really believe the coaching search will be going late December before conference play even starts.

 

[jdubs30]

When I am thinking about current players or players we are chasing in the portal I always think it comes down to two simple questions now that money looks like it wont be that big of an issue across all P4 teams:

-Why should they stay at Syracuse to play for Red?
-Why should they come to Syracuse to play for Red?

Are we putting players in the NBA?
Are we developing players?
Are we playing a fun entertaining style of basketball?
Are game days fun (big crowds student sections)?
Are we winning at a high level?
Are we ranked?
Are we talked about nationally?
Does GameDay or whatever that is called for BBall?
How do we market/sell our program?


Now that all teams have money these are the things that will matter...

disagree. The things you listed all mattered pre-NIL. Now it’s simply about money - how much you have and where you allocate it. Without NIL Eddie Lampkin never comes to Syracuse. The more money you have the better players you will get regardless of your list above.

 

[Red2003]

A GM might target ten guys and all ten could go elsewhere. We’re all assuming we can fix this with the portal. That is not a guarantee. You should probably keep a lookout for potential JUCO players.

I would like to see at least another 1 or 2 overseas portal guys. They need to replace the Westry's on our roster.

 

[phil77]

disagree. The things you listed all mattered pre-NIL. Now it’s simply about money - how much you have and where you allocate it. Without NIL Eddie Lampkin never comes to Syracuse. The more money you have the better players you will get regardless of your list above.

Correct Syracuse will be able to get the Eddie Lampkins of the world if we overpay for them to come. But Syracuse will never win and get back to where we need to be by getting the Eddie Lampkins of the world. Eddie while does good things on one side of the court is a flawed player and highlights one of our major weaknesses defense and rim protection. Unless you surround Eddie with multiple NBA-level prospects you can't win with him as your best player similar to JJ.

Everyone has money and Syracuse will never have the most money.

 

[Grbac]

disagree. The things you listed all mattered pre-NIL. Now it’s simply about money - how much you have and where you allocate it. Without NIL Eddie Lampkin never comes to Syracuse. The more money you have the better players you will get regardless of your list above.

Sad but true. Too many examples to count. Rutgers getting two lottery picks. St John’s pulling together a top 25 team. Vanderbilt huge turnaround. Not your typical college powerhouses.
Like Jim Carrey in the Mask so famously and eloquently said “Can’t make the scene without the green”

 

[Fly Rodder]

Stop.

Maliq did not want to stay. The coach who recruited him left; his friend, who was booed, left; he did not want to be a back-up at SU; he got a great deal for him (and he probably new a lot more about the competency of the staff).

A) That's not the point. It's not the specific individual. Syracuse's best recruit was coming into play the same position as their best returning player. And not surprisingly, they only ended up with one of them and the one they kept was likely (and still is) here for just one season. So they gave up a probably four year player, their best player on the roster, for one potential season from a HS recruit. That's exactly the situation that the article indicates good teams look to avoid.

B) It was unexpected since Brown had planned to return for his junior season and someone, maybe Jake, reported to this board that Freeman was coming off the bench. Prioritize your best players and build around them. HS recruits, unless you're Duke, are not the way.

 

[GHLF]

Did they do a deep dive on why Mizzou sucked last season and are good this season? I assume not.

Last year Mizzou lost 2 of their 3 starting guards (including their best player this season) in the beginning of the season, plus had a slew of other injuries to primary guys. They were in a tough SEC (not as tough as this season, but still very good) and they had a some middling transfers. Gates kept the guys that did well and added a boatload of talent.

Gates at least had a track record of developing a program. Cleveland St hadn't had a winning program in 5 years. Gates put them in the tourney in his 2nd year there. Won 2 regular season conference championships in 3 seasons. He put Mizzou back in the tourney in his first season there after they had only been there 2 out of the previous 9 seasons.

Syracuse does not have the talent base that Gates had last season and Red doesn't have the track record Gates has.
A comment from a Mizzou fan: "Honestly, I feel like the fact that this team never stopped playing their asses off is a testament to how good of a coach Gates is. He just didn't have enough healthy talent left ..."

Can anyone say the same about Red's teams with a straight face? They're not two sides of the same coin.

I utterly disagree, Injuries? JJ, DF, EL, Counting on Chance, which they were as recently as last year prior to injury, let alone attrition and drama. Did we quit last year? No, this year, massive talent deficiencies in addition to all of the above. Missou sit very similar now? yes, Cuse possibly even worse. We want to be objective right without throwing anyone out right?

 

[Scooch]

You should probably keep a lookout for potential JUCO players.

JUCO?! As if it hasn't been bad enough with the Colonial League all-stars on this team.

 

[baggerbob]

I try to keep bringing this up. We are going to know real fast what we got over Thanksgiving this year with that Players Era tourney, it's 18 teams. If we fall into last place we know what's coming cuz we ain't gonna get better.

I really believe the coaching search will be going late December before conference play even starts.

That's another reason why Red needs to be gone and start over.
The last ten years are an embarrassment for the program. We don't need to go to that tournament and be embarrassed anymore.

 

[atlanticuse]

This is how they're doing it. Very few successful teams are built around a pile of 1-year guys.

How To Build A Roster In The Modern Portal Era

A study on the roster construction strategies that lead to success for high majors

blog.evanmiya.com

Evan Miya has a great analytics site and has done a great job at using that to recommend how to build a good team.
It's probably imperfect, because chemistry, culture, and fit are intangibles (qualitative), but it makes sense.

Retain, recruit, transfer in = winning.

 

[Idiocuse22&]

disagree. The things you listed all mattered pre-NIL. Now it’s simply about money - how much you have and where you allocate it. Without NIL Eddie Lampkin never comes to Syracuse. The more money you have the better players you will get regardless of your list above.

True, but if 2 teams are offering similar $ then the other things become important.

 

[Red2003]

That's another reason why Red needs to be gone and start over.
The last ten years are an embarrassment for the program. We don't need to go to that tournament and be embarrassed anymore.

How big is your checking account? cuz right now they're going to play the what if game unless someone puts their money where their mouth is

 

[tptcuse]

Stop.

Maliq did not want to stay. The coach who recruited him left; his friend, who was booed, left; he did not want to be a back-up at SU; he got a great deal for him (and he probably new a lot more about the competency of the staff).

Maliq leaving was a no-brainer for anyone who actually looked at the situation with an open mind. The fact that the staff was surprised is concerning. They promised the starting 4 spot to a freshman, plus all the other factors you mention.

 

[Oakland]

I used to love watching when they were in the dome practicing. Learned so much just from watching. Really miss how open it was back then. I often wonder if they could even have anything in the Melo Center comparable to making players run the steps up up up up in the dome just not for conditioning but if someone messed up. There was so much room in the dome they could have stations with baskets in the dome for the different player positions. Bernie Fine could be working with, for example, Reafsnyder, Lazor and Wallace, Hill on rebounding on a side basket while a full court scrimmage could be going on the main court. Then some others working on free throws at another temp basket. Loved seeing when they had an actual full intrasquad scrimmage. Met Igor at one of those practices back then.

Was that during our 3 NCs in 5 years run?

 

[CardiacCuse]

the way out of this mess is finding portal daimonds in the rough

mailq was lowly recruited, so it can be done

thats where the value of the GM comes in...and dont forget international players...i prefer to go that route as much as possible. those guys just play hard and take it more as an opportunity with less of a sense of entitlement...all of the recent international players have been fan favorites.

so...the GM can make a huge contribution to the program by finding under the radar portal guys and international players

forget the 5 star HS players (unless they are melo or cooper flagg level good...and will those come to SU right now???) and go for portal gems and international players.

carlos was one of these guys (supposedly lol) so still have to be careful. rd has shown he doesnt have a good eye for talent so hopefully kline can cover for him there (if red is even bback next year)

 

[Cheriehoop]

Was that during our 3 NCs in 5 years run?

I started going from the 1987 season through the 2008 season. Some years I’d get to attend 2 or 3 times, some years I didn’t get to go at all or they moved the practice to Manley or at a time I couldn’t make it. I worked full time in a neighboring county and could only go on days I had off or had a city appt. Did see the 87 and 96 year teams but not the 2003 one year Melo team practice unfortunately.

 

[Scooch]

the way out of this mess is finding portal daimonds in the rough

I'd argue the way out of this mess is to pay superior talent in the portal.

 

[CardiacCuse]

I'd argue the way out of this mess is to pay superior talent in the portal.

if that was easy why arent they doing it now?

and also...I dont want to contribute to the portal arms race and runaway salaries of these guys, in general...theyre already overpaid as it is

 

[Cusefan0307]

A GM might target ten guys and all ten could go elsewhere. We’re all assuming we can fix this with the portal. That is not a guarantee. You should probably keep a lookout for potential JUCO players.

Kline knows what’s going on better than we do. If we look for Juco just fold the program.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Do people here realize Wisconsin lost their two best players to Louisville and and Kansas this past offseason and have almost matched last years win total already? We really need to stop crying poverty. It’s not impossible to build a winner here. With Red it could be, who knows.

 

[Scooch]

if that was easy why arent they doing it now?

and also...I dont want to contribute to the portal arms race and runaway salaries of these guys, in general...theyre already overpaid as it is

We didn't have the money. That's been made abundantly clear by multiple people over the past few months. We had an NIL budget of ~$2 million and we spent a huge chunk of it on Lampkin, Starling and Bell. Oopsie.

Now we're being assured that we'll have all the money we need to acquire just about anyone we target this offseason. So they should do that.

If you don't want the program to spend in the portal then SU is going to suck. We just will. Like suck worse than we do this season.