Tampering

[Ozone!]

 

[Scooch]

The only region that money seems to be a hurdle in is the Northeast.

The northeast is a wasteland for the sport, aside from Penn State. So it stands to reason.

 

[Ithacaorange]

Agree 100%.

I’ll be honest, I don’t even know what the “tampering” rules are at this point.

But if what transpired was against the rules, then out the offender by name. At least do it to the league office if you don’t want to do it via the media. Enough protecting the profession or whatever bullschlit code they follow.

Man up and solve the problem. Otherwise stop whining.

they may be clamming up because they know they may need these guys to get them jobs when they get fired.

 

[elimunelson]

Re: the diminishing interest some of you have cited... there is little evidence of that occurring in a meaningful way. TV and streaming audiences are quite healthy. Attendance is challenged but that's systemic across a variety of sports. And the looming 12-team playoff is almost certain to be a boon for intertest.

I have no doubt that i'm a dinosaur with my beliefs on NIL/Portal. My interest lies in SU health first and foremost

 

[elimunelson]

Yeah, I'm always leery of Congress getting involved for a variety of reasons. But at some point it may be inevitable. I think we're on the precipice given the outsized power that the SEC and B1G have garnered.

I think ultimately it won't be the north east congress/senate folk who will want this it'll be the red state folks who feel like the system is unjust towards their programs.

I would watch for the likes of SEC/BIG senators speaking of this issue. I would gather at some point if a Saban or Harbough retire and list NIL as the main reason there will be scruitny why the sport is forcing good coaching out because of the side show NIL antics.

I want to be clear, it's great players can be compensated in some sort of collegiate model. However, it's a faustian bargain where they are no longer amateurs and will be scrutinized accordingly. It will impact negatively the folks who don't get a dime

 

[Scooch]

However, it's a faustian bargain where they are no longer amateurs and will be scrutinized accordingly.

I agree with this. For years there's been a general sentiment that you shouldn't criticize a "kid" because he's a student athlete. Well, now some of these "kids" are being paid quite handsomely, so it's not unreasonable for the fan expectation to change.

 

[elimunelson]

The northeast is a wasteland for the sport, aside from Penn State. So it stands to reason.

if global warming is any barometer, in 100 years BC and Syracuse will be the places to be once again for football dominance. You won't want to play on the sun at a place like UT Austin or in the panhandle at FSU

 

[Scooch]

if global warming is any barometer, in 100 years BC and Syracuse will be the places to be once again for football dominance. You won't want to play on the sun at a place like UT Austin or in the panhandle at FSU

100? I'm think 8 to 10, given that it was 50 here in CT 2 days ago.

 

[Newhouser]

Bingo. It’s just what degree of tampering. Some are more egregious and I’m sure that’s what bothers BC. But if a booster got them a big transfer before they were in the portal, they wouldn’t be complaining either. Put up or shut up.

and it is that way in every sport. In MLB why was nobody raising the roof about steroids, sign stealing or pitchers grip,...the accusers are in the same pool.

 

[NYCCuse826]

Coaches need to either start outing the other coaches that are doing it or just be quiet. These half measures of coming out but not dropping names isn’t helping matters.

And that’s not directed at your post Bees, I’m just saying I wish these guys would out those who are doing it.

Because they're doing it too.

 

[CbusCuse]

I'm not advocating for that either.

But the situation right now is such that in order to get the student-athlete's proper value determined, tampering is happening.

This isn't the way I would have chosen for things to go down.

I see it as there were two injustices.

1, the NCAA wasn't permitting student-athlete's to benefit from their own identity, which in today's world of physical and digital realities, is something I consider a fundamental human right.

That needed to be fixed. NIL was the path.

2, the sit out penalty for student-athletes transferring was overly punitive relative to the freedom of movement granted to coaches. Yeah yeah yeah, the commitment is to the school, not the coach. Whatever. Student-athletes having their options limited to explore better situations for their competitive eligiblity and academic options needed to be fixed.

Had NIL come first, the 2nd injustice becomes a smaller problem. But it didn't. They changed the transfer eligibility rules first, and that opened Pandora's box.

Anyway, the greater point - the above injustices, bigger picture, matter a whole lot more than a coach like Hafley worrying about losing players.

Thus, tiny violin gif.

Lastly, one benefit other than players getting their value, is that coaches, at least some of them, are going to be a lot more accountable for being honest with players now. We know coaches lie to get croots. I remember the Dunkelberger family saying there were a load of unfulfilled promises made to their son, for example.

Gotta be real careful about what you say and what you mean in this bold new world.

Dunkelberger, the Syracuse TE with no catches that transferred to Western Illinois? Just wondering what those promises could have been.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Dunkelberger, the Syracuse TE with no catches that transferred to Western Illinois? Just wondering what those promises could have been.

I want to say they were told that he'd be a big part of the offense and would catch +30 passes.

 

[qdawgg]

100? I'm think 8 to 10, given that it was 50 here in CT 2 days ago.

I’m in the foothills of the Catskills. Every morning I wake up, go outside and spray Aqua Net into the air for a couple minutes. This winter has been great so far. All those places people have retired too and think they’ll retire too in the future. They may need to rethink that.

 

[BKCuse]

Tampering is now beyond enforcement. There are too many booster, NIL agents and proxies that can DM a kid on social.

Unfortunately there’s no putting this genie back in bottle. You can’t have an NIL salary cap the sport is too dirty.
The only possible solution I can see would be for the NCAA to rescind the 1 free transfer rule. And we all know that ain’t happening.

So we’re all going to have to figure out a way to live with it.

 

[tep624]

Tampering is now beyond enforcement. There are too many booster, NIL agents and proxies that can DM a kid on social.

Unfortunately there’s no putting this genie back in bottle. You can’t have an NIL salary cap the sport is too dirty.
The only possible solution I can see would be for the NCAA to rescind the 1 free transfer rule. And we all know that ain’t happening.

So we’re all going to have to figure out a way to live with it.

The fact that the NCAA was even considering making transferring open ended shows how little foresight and thought they put into anything.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Have any of you been asked to work for a client or a customer before?

If the NCAA wanted to cut down on tampering they could. It’s separate from NiL. They won’t do anything though.

 

[Orangepace]

My concern is that it could all backfire on the athlete. NIL dollars may be a limited resource, especially at some smaller schools, and tampering could force those school’s collectives to overcompensate to keep, exposing others to a higher likelihood for an “NIL transfer”.

Worse is that this happens and the “home” school doesn’t step up but the athlete feels they have a higher worth and portals. The tampering team doesn’t step up, never really intended to, and the athlete is stranded in the portal.

This is a big boy game and it will get dirty.

Who’s harmed? The player has to declare (s)he’s in the portal, forfeiting his/her scholarship. You make a choice, you reap the repercussions.

You want more money? Negotiate it. There aren’t some Reverse Draw4’s in NIL.

You want to be an adult, you will be treated like a damn adult. Don’t forget to pay your taxes.

 

[NJCuse97]

Who’s harmed? The player has to declare (s)he’s in the portal, forfeiting his/her scholarship. You make a choice, you reap the repercussions.

You want more money? Negotiate it. There aren’t some Reverse Draw4’s in NIL.

You want to be an adult, you will be treated like a damn adult. Don’t forget to pay your taxes.

The question I am responding to was “how is tampering bad if it sets a value for the athlete?” My response here is; that value may be inflated for several strategic and underhanded people where the athlete is drawn into the portal without any intention of honoring that value. Yes, caveat emptor, but tampering almost invites this scenario. The athlete, in addition to the obvious impact on his or her former team are hurt by tampering in this scenario.

I get it. You don’t like the whole NIL/portal game. I don’t love how it is playing out either.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

I am sure at least one SU coach whispered in the ear of Jared Verse after the Albany game 2 years ago.

 

[Capt. Tuttle]

Who’s harmed? The player has to declare (s)he’s in the portal, forfeiting his/her scholarship. You make a choice, you reap the repercussions.

You want more money? Negotiate it. There aren’t some Reverse Draw4’s in NIL.

You want to be an adult, you will be treated like a damn adult. Don’t forget to pay your taxes.

I agree. All of this kvetching about the poor athlete is really selfish claptrap. 18 year olds can go to war, work on oil rigs, become police and firefighters, but oh no, they might make a mistake transferring colleges. Worse case: life lesson.
Many of these guys are only in college to chase professional money, and would not have gotten into a college but for the hope by the schools that they will help add to the bottom line.

 

[All4SU]

A reality of NIL - as well as the portal to some degree - for me is this. I used to follow recruiting closely. I hoped top players, good players, good students, good people, wanted to attend my university. My connection with my alma mater created a bind between me and those players and I cheered for their success, within the boundaries of sport, and without. I knew almost all would never be NFL or NBA players, but I hoped for them to achieve whatever it was in life they desired.

Under the new paradigm, the relationship between me and these players has become transactional. Of course there are some players who are still student/athletes, and I hope they are wise enough to take advantage of the opportunities afforded them while they are at SU. But for most, I sense it’s a revolving door of kids who establish no bond with my school beyond a few dollars in their pockets. They play or they don’t play. They stay or they don’t stay. Far more are looking for money, far fewer will achieve anything that is life changing.

Most no longer represent my alma mater beyond that of a mercenary in athletic footwear.

 

[All4SU]

if global warming is any barometer, in 100 years BC and Syracuse will be the places to be once again for football dominance. You won't want to play on the sun at a place like UT Austin or in the panhandle at FSU

In 100 years, or maybe even 50 or 20, it will be electronic gaming, and the players will alll be geeks in thick glasses and with quick little thumbs.

 

[NYCCuse826]

I agree. All of this kvetching about the poor athlete is really selfish claptrap. 18 year olds can go to war, work on oil rigs, become police and firefighters, but oh no, they might make a mistake transferring colleges. Worse case: life lesson.
Many of these guys are only in college to chase professional money, and would not have gotten into a college but for the hope by the schools that they will help add to the bottom line.

I don't like where this is going and what it implies so I'm going to add this. Colleges and universities, SU included, have made it easier for prospective students to get in by lowering admission standards. There are quite a number of high school grads that aren't prepared to do university level work that's not on a curve.

 

[PhatOrange]

they may be clamming up because they know they may need these guys to get them jobs when they get fired.

That was my thought to. If you start ratting on everyone your available opportunities to work the next job decreases.

 

[Admiral Koga]

A reality of NIL - as well as the portal to some degree - for me is this. I used to follow recruiting closely. I hoped top players, good players, good students, good people, wanted to attend my university. My connection with my alma mater created a bind between me and those players and I cheered for their success, within the boundaries of sport, and without. I knew almost all would never be NFL or NBA players, but I hoped for them to achieve whatever it was in life they desired.

Under the new paradigm, the relationship between me and these players has become transactional. Of course there are some players who are still student/athletes, and I hope they are wise enough to take advantage of the opportunities afforded them while they are at SU. But for most, I sense it’s a revolving door of kids who establish no bond with my school beyond a few dollars in their pockets. They play or they don’t play. They stay or they don’t stay. Far more are looking for money, far fewer will achieve anything that is life changing.

Most no longer represent my alma mater beyond that of a mercenary in athletic footwear.

Come on..when everybody is that age...they are looking to get paid and get laid. As it relates to tampering...I think that it was always going on. Before coaches had to call friends of friends whereas now it's out in the open and straightforward. I know that it is no consolation in the short term but look at how the Florida situation turned out. The word is out that their 'offer' was bogus. That kid can't be/won't be the only one stiffed. It may take a five or so years but things will eventually settle down.

What can schools like SU do? Well, while recruiting may have always been this way, but it seems that it is a lot like an MLB draft. They have 40 rounds..sign 2/3rds...and maybe three make the big leagues in 5 years. If five or more make it..it was considered a pretty good draft. In college football...you'll sign 15 to 20 kids...and at least half will transfer within three years. But guess what, so will everybody else's class. A school like SU should funnel resources into group of 'team advisers' that do nothing but scout other teams and compile a database of potential transfers.

IMO, that's why guys like Saban are starting to cry. Yes, they get talent. But a big reason they win so much is their depth. Lose a 5 star to injury? Plug another one in. Well, a lot of that depth is going to get siphoned off. In the past...a 4th stringer might not transfer because he was still getting a decent bag o cash...even if he wasn't starting/just special teams. Now, he can get the same bag and play somewhere else.