The committee finally annoyed the talking heads

[Alsacs]

The SEC East was mediocre this year. Most of the attention given to the SEC was with the SEC West. They went 28-0 out side their conference. Plenty of cupcakes but they did beat Wisc, KSt, Boise State, WVa to name a few.

The only other P5 team that Division beat which you neglected was Texas Tech.
The SEC is not that great this year.
Mississippi State played nobody in the OOC and played Kentucky/Vanderbilt From the East and somehow is going to a Big Six bowl. That is garbage
LSU/Auburn lost 4 games.
Ole Miss was legit until injuries but they lost 3 games.
Arkansas is good but finished 6-6.
Texas A&M went 7-5 and couldn't stop anybody.
SEC is not as good as people think.

 

[TheCusian]

You have a short memory. Auburn rolled up and down the field last year on FSU when they actually had a very good defense. Auburn's problem is their defense is suspect but their offense could move at will against any ACC team this year. SEC Serially overrated? How can you make that claim when they've won 7 of the last 8 NCs, had 36% of all first rounders in the NFL in the last five years and have won 71% of their bowl games in the same period. Listening to you guys denigrate the SEC is kinda like somebody trying to make the case that Kate Upton has a small rack. Laughable.

Last year doesn't count, remember? In deciding who makes the playoffs - number of NFL draftees is not considered. Last years bowl wins don't count either.

Onto this year... Tell me what win out of conference is the most impressive for any SEC team? LSU over Wiscy? Bama over WVU?

How do we know how good the SEC is this year?

 

[TheCusian]

This past weekend a 2-6 UK team took one of the ACC powers in Louisville to the brink at the Ville. Meanwhile a very mediocre Florida squad with a really poor QB played FSU to a standstill at the Doak. And yet you want to assert ACC superiority?

I'm not saying the ACC is better. But the gap between the SEC and everyone else in the P5 is smaller than you think. And it will be impossible to tell until they schedule OOC better. (Side note: for the second year in a row Alabama didn't play anyone OOC with an above .500 winning %).

The game changed. The built in bias will erode. Who did you beat? Who did you play?

 

[baggerbob]

The SEC East was mediocre this year. Most of the attention given to the SEC was with the SEC West. They went 28-0 out side their conference. Plenty of cupcakes but they did beat Wisc, KSt, Boise State, WVa to name a few.

Other years when the SEC wins the rivalry games its always how great they are, you need to stop defending them , you can't have it both ways. They lost the 4 games this year, you don't get points for winning margin, you only get points for wins, and they lost all 4 games. That is a fact, not supposition, which is all your argument is.

 

[bpo57]

The only other P5 team that Division beat which you neglected was Texas Tech.
The SEC is not that great this year.
Mississippi State played nobody in the OOC and played Kentucky/Vanderbilt From the East and somehow is going to a Big Six bowl. That is garbage
LSU/Auburn lost 4 games.
Ole Miss was legit until injuries but they lost 3 games.
Arkansas is good but finished 6-6.
Texas A&M went 7-5 and couldn't stop anybody.
SEC is not as good as people think.

I would definitely agree that the SEC is not as strong as in previous years. In years past one would have to be a complete fool to not think the SEC was the dominant conference. And that's where the superiority complex comes from as well as the media adoration. Given that dominance it's somewhat understandable.

College football is riddled with parity this year but the SEC is still the deepest conference with the most quality teams and the eventual national champion.

I'm not saying the ACC is better. But the gap between the SEC and everyone else in the P5 is smaller than you think. And it will be impossible to tell until they schedule OOC better. (Side note: for the second year in a row Alabama didn't play anyone OOC with an above .500 winning %).

The game changed. The built in bias will erode. Who did you beat? Who did you play?

I agree with you that the gap is not as large this year. I think the OOC talk is largely irrelevant when it comes to a conference like the SEC. If you're going to play 6 teams in the top 30 then who cares if you schedule a cupcake or two. You're still going to play a schedule better than 90% of the country anyway. Do you think Alabama's schedule is weaker than FSU's this year. Btw let's look a little closer to home if we're going to complain about OOC. Villanova, various MAC teams ain't exactly murderer's row either.

 

[bpo57]

Last year doesn't count, remember? In deciding who makes the playoffs - number of NFL draftees is not considered. Last years bowl wins don't count either.

Onto this year... Tell me what win out of conference is the most impressive for any SEC team? LSU over Wiscy? Bama over WVU?

How do we know how good the SEC is this year?

What is your point? That Alabama doesn't deserve to make the playoffs? We don't know who will win this year but I do know who won 7 of the last 8. But to listen to some here that was all a fluke and a myth. Must have been pure luck that the NFL consistently drafts twice as many guys from the SEC as any other conference in the country. Let's face a very simple fact. There is more football talent in the southeast by a country mile and the SEC keeps most of it.

So which conference do you think is better than the SEC this year?

 

[bpo57]

Other years when the SEC wins the rivalry games its always how great they are, you need to stop defending them , you can't have it both ways. They lost the 4 games this year, you don't get points for winning margin, you only get points for wins, and they lost all 4 games. That is a fact, not supposition, which is all your argument is.

I'll give you another supposition. The SEC West went 28-0 OOC this year. Hard to improve on that.

 

[TheCusian]

I'll give you another supposition. The SEC West went 28-0 OOC this year. Hard to improve on that.

But they played relatively light competetion.

 

[kirbivore]

Am I the only one hoping Georgia Tech beats FSU this weekend?

I know, I know...ACC pride. But I really don't like that program.

Swofford will make sure GT's whole line gets kicked out chop block by chop block.

 

[TheCusian]

I would definitely agree that the SEC is not as strong as in previous years. In years past one would have to be a complete fool to not think the SEC was the dominant conference. And that's where the superiority complex comes from as well as the media adoration. Given that dominance it's somewhat understandable. College football is riddled with parity this year but the SEC is still the deepest conference with the most quality teams and the eventual national champion. I agree with you that the gap is not as large this year. I think the OOC talk is largely irrelevant when it comes to a conference like the SEC. If you're going to play 6 teams in the top 30 then who cares if you schedule a cupcake or two. You're still going to play a schedule better than 90% of the country anyway. Do you think Alabama's schedule is weaker than FSU's this year. Btw let's look a little closer to home if we're going to complain about OOC. Villanova, various MAC teams ain't exactly murderer's row either.

How do we know that they are playing a schedule better than 90% of the country if there is nothing to compare it to.

The point is this: if the conference plays weak OOC as a whole - the committee is forced to ask "how can we tell how good they are?"

All arguments outside of "who did you play?" and "who did you beat?" are irrelevant.

As for us - we played a top ten team (ND) at a neutral site and another p5 school at home (Maryland). While not murders road, it's still something we can use as a relative measure. If we only played Villanova and CMU's and everyone else scheduled the same way? Same issue as the SEC.

 

[Ottoble]

Please, oh please can Bama and Ohio State lose. Noles, Ducks, Frogs, and Bears in the final 4 would be fantastic for so many reasons.

Now that would be some fun football.

 

[texascpa]

Please, oh please can Bama and Ohio State lose. Noles, Ducks, Frogs, and Bears in the final 4 would be fantastic for so many reasons.

I've heard one or two talking heads on Sirius comment that even if Alabama loses they expect them in the Final Four. Could you believe that? A 2 loss Alabama in ahead of a 1 loss Baylor. there would be quit the uproar.

 

[ImperialOrange]

I've heard one or two talking heads on Sirius comment that even if Alabama loses they expect them in the Final Four. Could you believe that? A 2 loss Alabama in ahead of a 1 loss Baylor. there would be quit the uproar.

I absolutely could see that happening BUT I also want the believe the committe arent brazen enough to do that. Needless to say, I want Bama to lose for the ****storm that would come out from the snubbed side and the 8 game playoff to be expedited as result.

 

[texascpa]

I absolutely could see that happening BUT I also want the believe the committe arent brazen enough to do that. Needless to say, I want Bama to lose for the ****storm that would come out from the snubbed side and the 8 game playoff to be expepited as result.

Agreed. 8 game playoff is the best solution. Always has been. Baby steps, I guess.

 

[CuseOnly]

What is your point? That Alabama doesn't deserve to make the playoffs? We don't know who will win this year but I do know who won 7 of the last 8. But to listen to some here that was all a fluke and a myth. Must have been pure luck that the NFL consistently drafts twice as many guys from the SEC as any other conference in the country. Let's face a very simple fact. There is more football talent in the southeast by a country mile and the SEC keeps most of it.

So which conference do you think is better than the SEC this year?

The point is, when the only competitive P5 teams that you play every year are in your own conference. It is impossible to judge how good the SEC is by how bad you beat OOC cupcakes. We have very few SEC vs. P5 OOC games to go by every year.

SEC OOC P5 Teams for all 14 members: SEC 5-6 for 2014 that doesn't scream Superiority to me, sorry.
Oklahoma - Loss
Texas Tech - Ark. win 49-28
FSU - Loss
K State - Auburn win 20-14
Louisville - Loss
Clemson - Loss
Clemson (GA) - Georgia win 45-21
Ga Tech - Loss
Wisconsin - LSU win 28-24
WVU - Bama win 33-23
Indiana- Loss

This year in Head to Head competition the SEC went 1-4 against the ACC, all your other stats mean nothing. If you want to prove superiority, have the top of the SEC play more OOC P5 teams instead of hiding behind the veil of "but we beat each other up so much".

Beyond the games above, what do we have to judge the SEC against...the other 45 "Rent and Opponent Teams" the SEC plays every year??

If you only play in your own bubble and beat your chest, the only thing we have to judge for actual competition is the above P5 record and quite frankly it's pretty underwhelming even with looking at the wins and their scores.

 

[MaxwellCuse]

I won't be watching the play-offs until either Syracuse gets in or ntil the play-offs expand to 8 teams. However, do think FSU and the ACC is being disrespected by the committee based on very spurious criteria such as the "eye test" and margin of victory. God I hate college football. Why did I have to become a Syracuse fan?

 

[Quazzum69]

How do we know that they are playing a schedule better than 90% of the country if there is nothing to compare it to.

The point is this: if the conference plays weak OOC as a whole - the committee is forced to ask "how can we tell how good they are?"

All arguments outside of "who did you play?" and "who did you beat?" are irrelevant.

As for us - we played a top ten team (ND) at a neutral site and another p5 school at home (Maryland). While not murders road, it's still something we can use as a relative measure. If we only played Villanova and CMU's and everyone else scheduled the same way? Same issue as the SEC.

If the SEC was "gaming the system," why aren't other conferences doing the same? If they have found some magical scheduling loophole, credit to them for exploiting it to their advantage.

Some people will never be satisfied. They hate human polls because of SEC bias, yet they hate objective systems because they all the SEC is the best.

Either trust the human polls (which pretty much are the same as computers anyways) or trust the rating systems that are established before any games are played. The CFP is pretty much the same as these two.

If anyone objects to both of these methods, they are obviously not interested in a serious debate on how to determine the best teams - they just want to complain.

 

[Alsacs]

The SEC West while a good division is not as great as you imply.

Bama is the real deal offensively and a legit top 4 team.

Mississippi State beat Auburn, LSU, Arkansas and nobody in the non-conference. This team is such a fraud we don't know if they are any good.

Auburn and Texas A&M suck monkey b@lls defensively and are nothing more than just decent teams.

LSU is a young team that lost a lot to the NFL and lost 4 games during conference play.

Ole Miss was probably the 2nd best team in the SEC until they lost two defenders and their stud WR, but they aren't great now and I would only call them a top 20 team.

Arkansas has a lot of talent but only went 6-6. They played UGA and Mizzou the only decent East teams and if they had an easier schedule would likely be better, but then one of the other West teams would have eaten those losses.

The Pac-12 South is a better division IMO.
Arizona, Arizona State, UCLA, USC, Utah could definitely win 3 of 5 matchups with Alabama, Mississippi State, Ole Miss, Auburn, LSU the top 5 SEC West teams in the standings.

 

[CuseOnly]

If the SEC was "gaming the system," why aren't other conferences doing the same? If they have found some magical scheduling loophole, credit to them for exploiting it to their advantage.

Some people will never be satisfied. They hate human polls because of SEC bias, yet they hate objective systems because they all the SEC is the best.

Either trust the human polls (which pretty much are the same as computers anyways) or trust the rating systems that are established before any games are played. The CFP is pretty much the same as these two.

If anyone objects to both of these methods, they are obviously not interested in a serious debate on how to determine the best teams - they just want to complain.

Computer polls are based upon humans determining SOS and inputting them into a system. Humans are flawed and biased.

Rankings and ratings shouldn't even come out until more than halfway through the season when the majority of the OOC schedule is played through. The problem with that is the SEC racks up wins over nobodies and beats their chests about it but other conferences get penalized for doing the same. Total Bias.

 

[CuseOnly]

The SEC West while a good division is not as great as you imply.

Bama is the real deal offensively and a legit top 4 team.

Mississippi State beat Auburn, LSU, Arkansas and nobody in the non-conference. This team is such a fraud we don't know if they are any good.

Auburn and Texas A&M suck monkey b@lls defensively and are nothing more than just decent teams.

LSU is a young team that lost a lot to the NFL and lost 4 games during conference play.

Ole Miss was probably the 2nd best team in the SEC until they lost two defenders and their stud WR, but they aren't great now and I would only call them a top 20 team.

Arkansas has a lot of talent but only went 6-6. They played UGA and Mizzou the only decent East teams and if they had an easier schedule would likely be better, but then one of the other West teams would have eaten those losses.

The Pac-12 South is a better division IMO.
Arizona, Arizona State, UCLA, USC, Utah could definitely win 3 of 5 matchups with Alabama, Mississippi State, Ole Miss, Auburn, LSU the top 5 SEC West teams in the standings.

The top of the SEC would never agree to play those games...so we will never know unfortunately. They also wouldn't do it at neutral site or away games.

 

[Alsacs]

Pac-12 vs. SEC
1. Oregon v. Alabama even
2. Arizona v. Mississippi State adv. Pac-12
3. UCLA v. Ole Miss adv. Pac-12
4. USC v. Georgia adv. SEC
5. Arizona State v. Missouri adv. Pac-12
6. Utah v. Auburn adv. SEC
7. Stanford v. LSU adv. SEC
8. Washington v. Arkansas adv. SEC
9. Cal v. Texas A&M adv. SEC
10. Oregon State v. Florida adv. Pac-12

This debate is a lot closer than SEC zealots want to admit. The Pac-12 could easily be called the best conference this year.

 

[Alsacs]

If the SEC was "gaming the system," why aren't other conferences doing the same? If they have found some magical scheduling loophole, credit to them for exploiting it to their advantage.

Some people will never be satisfied. They hate human polls because of SEC bias, yet they hate objective systems because they all the SEC is the best.

Either trust the human polls (which pretty much are the same as computers anyways) or trust the rating systems that are established before any games are played. The CFP is pretty much the same as these two.

If anyone objects to both of these methods, they are obviously not interested in a serious debate on how to determine the best teams - they just want to complain.

The SEC game the system because of 4 teams winning Championships and making the bottom teams look inflated. Florida, Alabama, LSU all won multiple NCs, but they shouldn't mean Ole Miss, Mississippi State, Kentucky, Tennessee are good.

The fact Mississippi State shot up to #1 beating tomato cans and Texas A&M, Auburn, LSU all of whom were mediocre is a joke. The SEC has gamed the people's minds which is wrong. Mississippi State should not be #10 but because of the SEC hype machine they are pumped up.

 

[ImperialOrange]

If the SEC was "gaming the system," why aren't other conferences doing the same? If they have found some magical scheduling loophole, credit to them for exploiting it to their advantage.

Some people will never be satisfied. They hate human polls because of SEC bias, yet they hate objective systems because they all the SEC is the best.

Either trust the human polls (which pretty much are the same as computers anyways) or trust the rating systems that are established before any games are played. The CFP is pretty much the same as these two.

If anyone objects to both of these methods, they are obviously not interested in a serious debate on how to determine the best teams - they just want to complain.

Honestly, they should. It would create absolute e OOC games but all the conferences should follow suit. SEC is blessed with so many surrounding cupcakes and can't really fault them for taking advantage BUT don't trumpet having the toughest league without playing anyone to prove it.

Here's the loophole:

1. Principles. The committee will select the teams using a process that distinguishes among otherwise comparable teams by considering:
   • Conference championships won,
   • Strength of schedule,
   • Head-to-head competition,
   • Comparative outcomes of common opponents (without incenting margin of victory), and,
   • Other relevant factors such as key injuries that may have affected a team’s performance during the season or likely will affect its postseason performance.

http://www.collegefootballplayoff.com/selection-committee-protocol

The NCAA method uses winning percentage of opponents, but now excludes records of FCS teams, FBS Transitional teams, and bowl games. The data below includes these three items.

http://www.fbschedules.com/2014/04/2014-college-football-strength-of-schedule-ncaa-method/

So the trick is to find low level teams with gaudy records. The Sunbelt, ConUSA, and AAC offer up a bevvy of Southern options where the SEC can outbid and buy the games they want. FSU's SOS would be better had they played 8-3 Georgia Southern last week rather than 6-4 Florida. Does anyone actually believe Ga Southern are better than Florida? The SOS metric does. In lieu of head to head, that metric carries a lot of weight.

 

[Alsacs]

BTW the SEC already mandated that every team starting in 2016 must play 1 non-conference game against a P5 team from another conference.

That sucks for the Mississippi State and Ole Miss of the world who can't play 4 tomato cans and inflate their records.

 

[TheCusian]

If the SEC was "gaming the system," why aren't other conferences doing the same? If they have found some magical scheduling loophole, credit to them for exploiting it to their advantage. Some people will never be satisfied. They hate human polls because of SEC bias, yet they hate objective systems because they all the SEC is the best. Either trust the human polls (which pretty much are the same as computers anyways) or trust the rating systems that are established before any games are played. The CFP is pretty much the same as these two. If anyone objects to both of these methods, they are obviously not interested in a serious debate on how to determine the best teams - they just want to complain.

That's my point. They can do what they want - but eventually people are going to figure out that they don't play anyone OOC. They are riding the bias for now.

Better hope Alabama doesn't lay an egg in its next two games. Like the Oklahoma bowl game last year...