This Tournament Really is an Indictment of our Strategy

[IthacaMatt]

we can still play zone, but we need to adjust it to defend the 3 pt line. dont collapse every time a guard penetrates, or every time its passed to the foul line. the top of the zone needs to extend further out. this needs to happen from the opening tip.

the college game is turning into a 3 pt contest. the 3 pt line needs to be moved back. but jb needs to adjust the zone, the days of sitting back and playing the percentages and hoping teams clang 3s are over

Easier said than done. Shooters are comfortable out to 25 feet now. If you extend so far out, the passing lanes become enormous - too big to defend very well.

 

[Eric15]

I am more concerned about the offense than the defense.

We struggle shooting.
Our bigs can’t do anything offensively.
Our passing is not good.
We don’t finish at the rim well.

Most of our problems are related to offense and not defense.

In my opinion, the way we recruit for defense negatively affects our offensive capabilities. We put a premium on players with pterodactyl wingspans at the expense of genuine basketball fundamentals.

If it was up to me, I would never recruit any player who does not have a demonstrated ability in high school to consistently face up to the basket and make at least an 8 foot jumper, including centers.

 

[Cusefan0307]

In my opinion, the way we recruit for defense negatively affects our offensive capabilities. We put a premium on players with pterodactyl wingspans at the expense of genuine basketball fundamentals.

If it was up to me, I would never recruit any player who does not have a demonstrated ability in high school to consistently face up to the basket and make at least an 8 foot jumper, including centers.

Fortunately I think that’s changing, but about
2-3 years too late. Chukwu should have been like Baye Keita here and been a backup.

 

[ebucklewis]

I think the tournament is an indictment of our players if anything. We need to score more. We are losing both of our starting guards, I suspect they will look much different next year. It’s not a coincidence that our 3 top recruits are major offensive threats.

 

[malpearl31]

College basketball offense is changing. 3 pointers are up. Low post and mid range game is slowly dying. Zone was great at defending the game from 1990 to 2010. It’s not so great at defending today’s game.

I agree with you that the game has changed and there are way more 3s taken from way further behind the line than we saw a generation ago. I'm very much looking forward to having a guy on our team next year (JG3) who bombs away and stretches the opponents' D. Pairing him with Buddy might be awesome.

But having said that, I believe your contention that the zone was great up until 2010, but is not so great at defending today's game to be inaccurate. Here are SU's AdjD rankings from 2010-11 through 2018-19:
2010-11: 17th
2011-12: 16th
2012-13: 6th
2013-14: 13th
2014-15: 20th
2015-16: 18th
2016-17: 119th
2017-18: 5th
2018-19: 30th

The Zone has been and continues to be very effective - year after year. There has been no real measurable downturn since 2010.

 

[hoopsupstate]

I would never recruit anyone who couldn’t dribble,pass and shoot. I want highly skilled offensive players that are good athletes. A prime example is North Carolina. They have good, sound players. They are not loaded with top 20 players, but their system is highly successful.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

I would never recruit anyone who couldn’t dribble,pass and shoot. I want highly skilled offensive players that are good athletes. A prime example is North Carolina. They have good, sound players. They are not loaded with top 20 players, but their system is highly successful.

Little and White were McD All Americans. Having just a couple makes all the difference in the world.

 

[CorduroyG]

Easier said than done. Shooters are comfortable out to 25 feet now. If you extend so far out, the passing lanes become enormous - too big to defend very well.

id rather give up 2s than 3s

 

[SWC75]

Actually, watching the tournament I see more zones than ever before.

I also see teams losing for the same reasons we lose.

 

[Ghost]

id rather give up 2s than 3s

Yeah, someone mentioned that M2M didn't stop Iowa from shooting 50% from three yesterday...but they only got up 20 attempts and they would happily shoot 40 if given a chance. We give up way more attempts to a hot team...Baylor shot about 40?

 

[Ghost]

Actually, watching the tournament I see more zones than ever before.

I also see teams losing for the same reasons we lose.

You see lots of teams losing because they don't have point guards and serviceable centers??????

It's an epidemic!

 

[SWC75]

You see lots of teams losing because they don't have point guards and serviceable centers??????

It's an epidemic!

I see lots of dry spells, lots of players on the other team getting hot, lots of bad fouls and turnovers, lots of great plays by the other team. We act as if these things only happen to us.

 

[Ghost]

I see lost of dry spells, lost of player son the other team getting hot, lost of bad fouls and turnovers, lost of great plays by the other team. We act as if these things only happen to us.

But seriously, do you see lots of teams trying to play without point guards?

 

[SWC75]

But seriously, do you see lots of teams trying to play without point guards?

Actually, I was serious. I see teams that could have had better point guards. Different teams have different sets of problems but they aren't the only teams that have those problems.

 

[SWC75]

The LSU coach was just bragging that his winning play "works against man or zone".

 

[ebucklewis]

I would never recruit anyone who couldn’t dribble,pass and shoot. I want highly skilled offensive players that are good athletes. A prime example is North Carolina. They have good, sound players. They are not loaded with top 20 players, but their system is highly successful.

I think this is the kind of system that JB would prefer to employ - have a team full of good 4 year players spread out evenly between classes and then get 1 or maybe 2 special players - however this is easier said than done.
re: UNC - it doesn't always go as planned - they went to NIT as recently as 2010

 

[jgeorge322]

In my opinion, the way we recruit for defense negatively affects our offensive capabilities. We put a premium on players with pterodactyl wingspans at the expense of genuine basketball fundamentals.

If it was up to me, I would never recruit any player who does not have a demonstrated ability in high school to consistently face up to the basket and make at least an 8 foot jumper, including centers.

Your recruiting pool would be quite small and miss a guy like Jerami Grant.

 

[81South]

I really appreciate JB thinking outside the box on defense but I think there is a very good reason that the best college coaches of all time have utilized man 2 man defense as their go to defense.

 

[Ghost]

I really appreciate JB thinking outside the box on defense but I think there is a very good reason that the best college coaches of all time have utilized man 2 man defense as their go to defense.

JB is one of the greats - we've gone off-track when it comes to recruiting. Perhaps a bit too stubborn on the zone, but that's not our primary concern.

 

[cusefan88]

the zone is also an element off the court too. If it's true a lot of high-level recruits cross off Syracuse because of the defense then that is a huge issue.

 

[samspann1]

In my opinion, the way we recruit for defense negatively affects our offensive capabilities. We put a premium on players with pterodactyl wingspans at the expense of genuine basketball fundamentals.

If it was up to me, I would never recruit any player who does not have a demonstrated ability in high school to consistently face up to the basket and make at least an 8 foot jumper, including centers.

Totally agree.

 

[OrlandoCuse]

I see lots of dry spells, lots of player son the other team getting hot, lots of bad fouls and turnovers, lots of great plays by the other team. We act as if these things only happen to us.

They happen to average teams that don’t advance in the tourney. I’d rather be the team that wins.

 

[sufandu]

I'm fine with us sticking with our defense forever as long as we start recruiting kids with some offensive aptitude, and a PG!

My only concern with the zone, and it's been this way forever, is that we don't do things like what's listed above. We used to trap...we haven't trapped a player in like 7 years.

We don't apply pressure, we don't force pace on teams that suck and that we could beat by 30 points on talent alone if we forced some tempo on them.

We can easily lose a tournament game, or any game to a crap team like Vermont because the zone will allow them to minimize possessions and just hope they get hot enough to keep it close - and sometimes that's enough to pull it out in the end. Our defensive efficiency will still look great though!

We've become so offensively stupid though that we're relying upon the reverse - that we can keep games close because of the zone, and then pull them out. It's meant a couple deep runs in recent years - but I can't say it's enjoyable basketball.

Get me a POINT GUARD!

We still trap in the corners and did it this year, but there are a number of things we do that are passive. I hate seeing teams roll the ball to half court because they want to maximize the shot clock and seeing us just stand there while it happens. Can't one guy move up a little until they pick the ball up and then back pedal into position? We've had guys hang around in the back court during the inbounds in the past but it seems like it's left up to the players to decide whether they want to do it. Maybe throw a token 3/4 court pressure loke Duke used last year to make teams burn a little clock before getting into their offense. You play it soft so you don't get burned but make teams take more than 3 seconds to cross halfcourt. And it doesn't have to be all the time. It just seems like there are options out there that we're not using. And yes, I want to see some players with offensive skill that have basketball intelligence.

You're absolutely right. It isn't enjoyable basketball. And I think it lets bad teams hang around just as much as it allows us to keep it close against good teams. What I don't like about that is that's mid major strategy. We shouldn't be the team that tries to keep it close with good teams hoping they have a bad shooting night so we can pull off a win. JB established a program that has spent a lot of it's time as one of those good teams that others felt fortunate to beat. I want us to be that again.

 

[cto]

Yeah. Great strategy to have our point guard declared ineligible for the game. After we struggled without him early in the season. Great strategy. Doomed to failure.

 

[Bayside44]

I would never recruit anyone who couldn’t dribble,pass and shoot. I want highly skilled offensive players that are good athletes. A prime example is North Carolina. They have good, sound players. They are not loaded with top 20 players, but their system is highly successful.

They have 2 top 10 picks in their starting 5.