USA East Coast Basketball trip with Benny Williams | Page 10 | Syracusefan.com

USA East Coast Basketball trip with Benny Williams

Maybe it's just me expecting a lot from perhaps the highest rated player currently in the program. That being said, the way he played against Duke, looking like he belonged out there and could compete with Duke's 5 star starters, showed me has the potential to be our leading scorer.

I think that is plausible if he comes back for a third year. This year is about making the jump to being a big contributor. He needs to start there. If the light bulb really goes off and he goes crazy end of the year great. For now it's baby steps.
 
Maybe it's just me expecting a lot from perhaps the highest rated player currently in the program. That being said, the way he played against Duke, looking like he belonged out there and could compete with Duke's 5 star starters, showed me has the potential to be our leading scorer.

It's just you. Sorry. Not gonna happen.

I dunno, maybe Benny putting up 14 & 6 against Duke, when we were down by 14 before anybody could blink (or score) - doesn't actually mean all that much.
He was our 3rd leading scorer in that game, FWIW.
CDB was only 3 pts behind at 4th

We were down 41-13 with about 8 left in the first half.
Its understandable that they weren't giving their defensive effort full attn after that.

So, until Benny does good things against a good team that's fully engaged, I'm gonna remain in "wait and see" mode.
 
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I think that is plausible if he comes back for a third year. This year is about making the jump to being a big contributor. He needs to start there. If the light bulb really goes off and he goes crazy end of the year great. For now it's baby steps.
Yeah. I don’t care about ratings. In terms of guys who did nothing as freshmen and became decent staters as sophs, Damone Brown is the blueprint. He was also behind Burgan and Blackwell as a freshman though.

But in terms of an athlete with no skills shown as a frosh - that eventually showed major skills, I think Damone is the blueprint we can realistically hope for?

I’d be thrilled with a 9 and 5 this year, culminating with being solid on a really good team as a Junior and being a 16 and 8 type stud on a good team that he largely carries as a senior.
 
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Yeah. I don’t care about ratings. In terms of guys who did nothing as freshmen and became decent staters as sophs, Damone Brown is the blueprint. He was also behind Burgan and Blackwell as a freshman though.

But in terms of an athlete with no skills shown as a frosh - that eventually showed major skills, I think Damone is the blueprint we can realistically hope for?

I’d be thrilled with a 9 and 5 this year, culminating with being solid on a really good team as a Junior and being a 16 and 8 type stud on a good team that he largely carries as a senior.
Demetris Nichols was another guy who started slowly and turned out to be great.

Nichols was billed as a good to great shooter out of high school, but didn't really show that skill as a freshman. Some people thought it was a confidence issue which he just needed to shake off.

Sounds familiar.
 
I think that is plausible if he comes back for a third year. This year is about making the jump to being a big contributor. He needs to start there. If the light bulb really goes off and he goes crazy end of the year great. For now it's baby steps.
 
Demetris Nichols was another guy who started slowly and turned out to be great.

Nichols was billed as a good to great shooter out of high school, but didn't really show that skill as a freshman. Some people thought it was a confidence issue which he just needed to shake off.

Sounds familiar.
True on Nichols In terms of confidence. That very well may be part of Williams’s issue.

Nichols was at least playing a lot on a good team as a freshman and playing good defense and having a few games late where he showed that 3 point prowess.

Benny unfortunately didn’t earn any kind of role even on a bad team. But like Nichols, he very well break out eventually. I doubt he’ll be a 3 point shooter like DNic, but like DNic he could be a guy who Contributes on both end and who really makes a big jump when the confidence helps him grab the role he’s built for.
 
Odd thing about Benny is that we don't know what he is. He's a guy that was touted to be 'versatile,' but he hasn't demonstrated upper level skill at any one feature characteristic. So, he may have games where something's working, but what's his go-to? What are his setup mates looking for him to do? What will he do when we need points from him? This all seems like a 'discovery period' for him, and i hope our staff will be good at identifying where he needs to focus, and let the versatility thing come in later years.
 
Odd thing about Benny is that we don't know what he is. He's a guy that was touted to be 'versatile,' but he hasn't demonstrated upper level skill at any one feature characteristic. So, he may have games where something's working, but what's his go-to? What are his setup mates looking for him to do? What will he do when we need points from him? This all seems like a 'discovery period' for him, and i hope our staff will be good at identifying where he needs to focus, and let the versatility thing come in later years.

Tentatively hopeful the things that emerged a little this weekend help with that. It gives the staff a chance to observe him in a different setting to compare with what they have seen this summer. Fingers crossed he is turning that corner.
 
Yeah. I don’t care about ratings. In terms of guys who did nothing as freshmen and became decent staters as sophs, Damone Brown is the blueprint. He was also behind Burgan and Blackwell as a freshman though.

But in terms of an athlete with no skills shown as a frosh - that eventually showed major skills, I think Damone is the blueprint we can realistically hope for?

I’d be thrilled with a 9 and 5 this year, culminating with being solid on a really good team as a Junior and being a 16 and 8 type stud on a good team that he largely carries as a senior.

If I could be guaranteed Damone's progression for Benny, I'd take it in a heart beat. Totally agree with your post.

I keep stating the same thing, but all these guys that try to be KD vs trying to be Scottie Barnes have to realize what will get you them in the league.
 
I just think he needs to focus on rebounding, defense and transition. As someone posted earlier in this thread, I haven’t seen enough skill from him as of yet to function in a half court setting offensively.

He is going to have to be high energy every night out.
 
Yeah, it’s 2022 and we were promised flying cars by now but they can’t even get a video feed to work well.
We've had the propulsion tech for awhile. The gov't and private defense contractors are keeping it under wraps because it would be too disruptive to the global economy. Think upheaval with oil industry.
 
Yeah. I don’t care about ratings. In terms of guys who did nothing as freshmen and became decent staters as sophs, Damone Brown is the blueprint. He was also behind Burgan and Blackwell as a freshman though.

But in terms of an athlete with no skills shown as a frosh - that eventually showed major skills, I think Damone is the blueprint we can realistically hope for?

I’d be thrilled with a 9 and 5 this year, culminating with being solid on a really good team as a Junior and being a 16 and 8 type stud on a good team that he largely carries as a senior.


Good post.

I think a lot of the trepidation is based upon whether or not he can be a significant contributor, and what he'll be able to provide.

Coming out of HS, Benny was touted as a wing. And maybe a 'tweener, but with some ability to shoot the ball, handle, and pass. What made him such a good system fit on paper was his size -- guys who are 6-7 or 6-8 and have some versatility tend to thrive in our system. Plus, he'd have the requisite size of the zone. He was also the highest rated recruit we had in awhile, and the most explosive athlete we'd recruited in awhile. So expectations were high. And then during the preseason, Mike Waters [who is no slouch when it comes to evaluating players] indicated that he was playing really, really well in preseason practices, which fueled some of the higher expectations.

Then, the season starts, and Benny looks lost. Game seems like it was moving too fast, he wasn't producing, he made a lot of mistakes when he DID play, and then seemed to get the yips a bit which undermined his productivity. And then -- and this has nothing to do with Benny per se -- we started losing games in the preseason at an alarming rate. When that happened, there was less margin for giving developmental PT to a young player -- JB had to find a way to try to claw out wins against teams we might normally win against easily. So Benny got benched, and he lost confidence, and didn't have the opportunity to play his way out of the funk. And said funk carried over for the majority of the season. Outside of a few highlight reel blocks and the Duke game, there wasn't much encouraging with the kid's frosh season performance.

Fast forward to the off-season. Benny doesn't bail -- that's a good sign. And he helped reel in Mintz. Even better. And now we're looking at where he is on the developmental curve, and we re-baseline expectations and hope that he can produce as an undersized but uber-athletic 4. Rebound a little, score on put backs, score in transition, maybe knock down on occasional J. But focus on those things. And playing next to a proven shot blocker like Jesse would -- again, on paper -- help mitigate him being a smaller 4.

And that would also "work," because we brought in two recruits in Taylor / Bunch who are natural 3's, who might be able to play alongside him. Brown is a natural 4, but it remains to be seen whether he's ready for prime time, so the hope was that Benny can be good enough at 4, and that will allow one of those frosh to slot in next to him, and give us a balanced frontcourt. Because heading into the season, inexperience at forward is a major, major issue for this squad. So Benny being able to step up would help alleviate some of those concerns / issues / problems.

This summer team was a good opportunity for him. Quality of competition has to be taken into consideration, but it looks like he had one stinker and then a couple of decent performances. But is he a 4? Is he a 3? Can he rebound well enough [11 rebounds suggest yes, but he also had a couple of 2 rebound type performances, I believe -- or at least one].

So a lot of the question marks remain -- how ready is Benny to produce at a high level this year? And what role will he perform on this team? And perhaps most importantly, is he a million dollar athlete with a poor feel for the game, or does he just need to get some game experience to settle down?

Disconcerting question marks for a former 5-star recruit entering their second year.
 
Good post.

I think a lot of the trepidation is based upon whether or not he can be a significant contributor, and what he'll be able to provide.

Coming out of HS, Benny was touted as a wing. And maybe a 'tweener, but with some ability to shoot the ball, handle, and pass. What made him such a good system fit on paper was his size -- guys who are 6-7 or 6-8 and have some versatility tend to thrive in our system. Plus, he'd have the requisite size of the zone. He was also the highest rated recruit we had in awhile, and the most explosive athlete we'd recruited in awhile. So expectations were high. And then during the preseason, Mike Waters [who is no slouch when it comes to evaluating players] indicated that he was playing really, really well in preseason practices, which fueled some of the higher expectations.

Then, the season starts, and Benny looks lost. Game seems like it was moving too fast, he wasn't producing, he made a lot of mistakes when he DID play, and then seemed to get the yips a bit which undermined his productivity. And then -- and this has nothing to do with Benny per se -- we started losing games in the preseason at an alarming rate. When that happened, there was less margin for giving developmental PT to a young player -- JB had to find a way to try to claw out wins against teams we might normally win against easily. So Benny got benched, and he lost confidence, and didn't have the opportunity to play his way out of the funk. And said funk carried over for the majority of the season. Outside of a few highlight reel blocks and the Duke game, there wasn't much encouraging with the kid's frosh season performance.

Fast forward to the off-season. Benny doesn't bail -- that's a good sign. And he helped reel in Mintz. Even better. And now we're looking at where he is on the developmental curve, and we re-baseline expectations and hope that he can produce as an undersized but uber-athletic 4. Rebound a little, score on put backs, score in transition, maybe knock down on occasional J. But focus on those things. And playing next to a proven shot blocker like Jesse would -- again, on paper -- help mitigate him being a smaller 4.

And that would also "work," because we brought in two recruits in Taylor / Bunch who are natural 3's, who might be able to play alongside him. Brown is a natural 4, but it remains to be seen whether he's ready for prime time, so the hope was that Benny can be good enough at 4, and that will allow one of those frosh to slot in next to him, and give us a balanced frontcourt. Because heading into the season, inexperience at forward is a major, major issue for this squad. So Benny being able to step up would help alleviate some of those concerns / issues / problems.

This summer team was a good opportunity for him. Quality of competition has to be taken into consideration, but it looks like he had one stinker and then a couple of decent performances. But is he a 4? Is he a 3? Can he rebound well enough [11 rebounds suggest yes, but he also had a couple of 2 rebound type performances, I believe -- or at least one].

So a lot of the question marks remain -- how ready is Benny to produce at a high level this year? And what role will he perform on this team? And perhaps most importantly, is he a million dollar athlete with a poor feel for the game, or does he just need to get some game experience to settle down?

Disconcerting question marks for a former 5-star recruit entering their second year.

Also needs to be that the coaches position him in the right role. Benny has to do the work, bring the energy, know what he can/can't do and understand what he is supposed to do.

Coaches have to be clear with him about he is supposed to do and tee him up for success.

We need a lot of pieces to fall into place to be really competitive and get to where we all want to be, if Benny is out there taking 17 foot jumpers off the dribble from game 1 at the end of a shot clock, he may as well just take a seat.
 
The biggest problem we will have with wanting Benny to be our leading scorer is his inability to shoot. But, some scorers can work around their lack of a shooting touch by utilizing athleticism to get to the basket and also by developing a go to close range pull up jumper and/or floater. Just being smart and playing within himself will go a long way, and also having a smart floor general who is aware of the clock and will not put the kid in a position to put up jump shots with the clock winding down.
Yeah I think this season Benny at best projects as our 4th scorer.
 
Yeah I think this season Benny at best projects as our 4th scorer.
Since we can reasonably expect the trio of Mintz, Edwards and Girard to average 45-50, having Williams as a 4th option scoring 10 means we only need everybody else to average 10-15 combined to net our long term average of 70-75... Then the defense determines how much we win.

The nightmare comes from having only 65 points a night because nobody but Girard and Edwards can score.

EDIT: The example that comes to mind is '17-'18 when Battle scored 19, backed up by Brissett and Howard at 14 each, but our next best was Dolezaj and Chukwu at 5, with Matt Moyer coming in at 3. That team was our poster child for good defense trying to make up for terrible offense. Also, they invented the unique Syracuse triple team, where Chukwu essentially became another defender to get in Howard's way out past the three point line.
 
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I think Mintz is going to do wonders for Benny. If Benny cuts aggressively and sees the lanes properly, Judah will get his buddy the ball. Once Benny starts building his confidence, his game will expand.
 
Since we can reasonably expect the trio of Mintz, Edwards and Girard to average 45-50, having Williams as a 4th option scoring 10 means we only need everybody else to average 10-15 combined to net our long term average of 70-75... Then the defense determines how much we win.

The nightmare comes from having only 65 points a night because nobody but Girard and Edwards can score.

EDIT: The example that comes to mind is '17-'18 when Battle scored 19, backed up by Brissett and Howard at 14 each, but our next best was Dolezaj and Chukwu at 5, with Matt Moyer coming in at 3. That team was our poster child for good defense trying to make up for terrible offense. Also, they invented the unique Syracuse triple team, where Chukwu essentially became another defender to get in Howard's way out past the three point line.
My prediction - Taylor is our 4th leading scorer this season.
I think not being the focal point of opposing defenses; Justin regains his 3-point shooting stroke, for about 8-9/game.
 
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