What I expect at this point…

[RF2044]

Not at all. I mentioned Langel. I just think there's lots of assumptions DD was not done here and I do not believe that to be the case.

Wouldn't be productive to split hairs over how you personally define "due diligence."

But it certainly would be a stretch to suggest that due diligence was performed in any meaningful capacity, if this is the route we go.

 

[Orangezoo]

When we were good we had incredible prime time feature games against Duke on ESPN. The ACC has a vested interest in featuring its best assets - which is why they acquired us. There isn't a smoke-filled backroom where the old southern boys decide how to screw the northerners.

The fact is, we've been bad and haven't given them or our TV partners any reason to feature us any more than anyone else in the league. Our problems from a recruiting, talent, wins perspective are all on us. Blaming the ACC is loser talk.

Random comment-

Having a chuckle hiven we have OrangeFoo and myself chatting then I see Scooch and Scotch throughout... I'm just now realizing I've not recognized yall weren't the same account.

 

[heresjohnny88]

Not at all. I mentioned Langel. I just think there's lots of assumptions DD was not done here and I do not believe that to be the case.

i do not believe that to be the case either.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

If Autry is the next HC, then McNamara needs to get outta dodge.

More than anything, he needs HC experience, assuming his goal is to be a HC.

Also, if Autry doesn't work out here there is precisely zero percent chance that GMac would be hired to replace him.

Yeah, look...

GMAC needs to prove he can get a real job without relying on Syracuse.

I know that sounds harsh. But when you look at his career, after a couple years trying to make pro ball work he came back to Syracuse as a grad assistant. No shame in that. Then he got a battle field promotion. Unusual, also no shame in that. And that's where he's been for a long while now.

But at a certain point someone else has to believe in him. It can't all just be Syracuse giving him shots.

And I get that's funny, because we also have the Jim Boeheim Syracuse context, but Boeheim is the outlier of all outliers. There's no historical equivalent. The odds we see a career like his again are nearly zero.

 

[phil77]

If you suggest JW did his due diligence through all the candidates nationally and still decided Red was the best choice not the EASIEST but the best then JW should be fired now.

JW is hiring Red because it is the easiest decision and it is more likely that JB will not cause waves this way. He will get past player support and donor support. So it makes Red the easiest choice. But I have said many many times if JW does a real national search there is ZERO percent chance that Red would be the BEST choice.

 

[Cusefan0307]

If you suggest JW did his due diligence through all the candidates national and still decided Red was the best choice not the EASIEST but the best then JW should be fired now.

JW is hiring Red because it is the easiest decision and it is more likely that JB will not cause waves this way. He will get past player support and donor support. So it makes Red the easiest choice. But I have said many many times if JW does a real national search there is ZERO percent chance that Red would be the BEST choice.

This is a bit ridiculous.

Former player and donor support is a huge deal. We are in the NIL era. Fundraising is a huge part of the job.

 

[phil77]

This is a bit ridiculous.

Former player and donor support is a huge deal. We are in the NIL era. Fundraising is a huge part of the job.

So is winning, coaching, recruiting, and developing players. If you win at a high level the former players and donors could care less who the coach is.

 

[cusefan88]

I want an outside hire but will give Autry a chance. For me if the team doesn't make the tournament in the first 4 seasons he needs to be gone. That's how simple it is.

 

[RF2044]

I want an outside hire but will give Autry a chance. For me if the team doesn't make the tournament in the first 4 seasons he needs to be gone. That's how simple it is.

Agree 100%.

If he's the guy, hope he succeeds. And if not -- AW needs to "fail fast" and move on quickly.

 

[PhatOrange]

One name (not being a jerk really curious).

I have not done my due diligence and don't follow college hoops (outside of Syracuse) anymore the way I follow college football. This does not take into account trends that I would normally analyze to death - like records and recruiting. So I'm not picking any under the radar guys.

If you believe Syracuse to be the blue blood football equivalent to traditional powers ask yourself what they would do. How would they think and what action would they take to get their guy. Nebraska for example hiring Ruhle and his coordinators. I get it that many schools promote from within (Ohio State football or Duke hoops), but trending downward schools don't do that.

I'd contact these guys and ask them if they're interested then lets talk.

Scott Drew - Baylor
Nate Oats - Alabama
Eric Musselman - Arkansas
Sean Miller - Xavier
Shaka Smart - Marquette

Smart I'm a little shaky on but I've wondered how he would do given an ACC job.

There are a million reasons why and why not but I don't want to get into them because nobody knows anything until that phone call is made. I'm not a 'why not' guy, I'm a tell me how we're going to make it work and get it done guy. and for all the reasons 'why not', I have a pile of reason 'why. I would concede that Syracuse should probably be concerned about hiring guys who break rules.

And one thing I know about coaches, they will listen to opportunities and they have big egos. Some guys like comfort and will stay put. Other guys like new challenges.

By the way I did find a guy who's killing it in his first job. Tom Landry Arizona, but maybe that's a product of the team he inherited from Miller.

Fortune favors the bold.

 

[NKR1978]

BG was about the same age Jay Wright is now.

And Doherty did. He also almost beat up Chris Collins in a game.

I thought BG was in his 70s. You just blew my mind.

 

[phil77]

I want an outside hire but will give Autry a chance. For me if the team doesn't make the tournament in the first 4 seasons he needs to be gone. That's how simple it is.

If it is a continuity higher and has the support of donors and player who are dumping money in the program for NIL purposes like suggested about it BETTER NOT TAKE HIM FOR YEARS to make the tournament. We better be in the tournament year 2 year 3 at worst. If he doesn't have the program on the right track by year 2 with the internal support and push to hire him then I have serious doubts he can turn it around.

 

[Cusefan0307]

So is winning, coaching, recruiting, and developing players. If you win at a high level the former players and donors could care less who the coach is.

And Red could win here. There's lots of assumptions that he is going to fall flat on his face it appears.

 

[NKR1978]

I have not done my due diligence and don't follow college hoops (outside of Syracuse) anymore the way I follow college football. This does not take into account trends that I would normally analyze to death - like records and recruiting. So I'm not picking any under the radar guys.

If you believe Syracuse to be the blue blood football equivalent to traditional powers ask yourself what they would do. How would they think and what action would they take to get their guy. Nebraska for example hiring Ruhle and his coordinators. I get it that many schools promote from within (Ohio State football or Duke hoops), but trending downward schools don't do that.

I'd contact these guys and ask them if they're interested then lets talk.

Scott Drew - Baylor
Nate Oats - Alabama
Eric Musselman - Arkansas
Sean Miller - Xavier
Shaka Smart - Marquette

Smart I'm a little shaky on but I've wondered how he would do given an ACC job.

There are a million reasons why and why not but I don't want to get into them because nobody knows anything until that head hunting phone call is made. I'm not a 'why not' guy, I'm a tell me how we're going to make it work and get it done guy. and for all the reasons 'why not', I have a pile of reason 'why. I would concede that Syracuse probably should be concerned about hiring potential guys who break rules.

And one thing I know about coaches, they will listen to opportunities and they have big egos. Some guys like comfort and will stay put. Other guys like new challenges.

By the way I did find a guy who's killing it in his first job. Tom Landry Arizona, but maybe that's a product of the team he inherited from Miller.

Fortune favors the bold.

I think Smart would kill it in the ACC. Texas wasn't a great fit for him culturally. He seems like an east coast/city guy.

 

[Orangezoo]

I have not done my due diligence and don't follow college hoops (outside of Syracuse) anymore the way I follow college football. This does not take into account trends that I would normally analyze to death - like records and recruiting. So I'm not picking any under the radar guys.

If you believe Syracuse to be the blue blood football equivalent to traditional powers ask yourself what they would do. How would they think and what action would they take to get their guy. Nebraska for example hiring Ruhle and his coordinators. I get it that many schools promote from within (Ohio State football or Duke hoops), but trending downward schools don't do that.

I'd contact these guys and ask them if they're interested then lets talk.

Scott Drew - Baylor
Nate Oats - Alabama
Eric Musselman - Arkansas
Sean Miller - Xavier
Shaka Smart - Marquette

Smart I'm a little shaky on but I've wondered how he would do given an ACC job.

There are a million reasons why and why not but I don't want to get into them because nobody knows anything until that head hunting phone call is made. I'm not a 'why not' guy, I'm a tell me how we're going to make it work and get it done guy. and for all the reasons 'why not', I have a pile of reason 'why. I would concede that Syracuse probably should be concerned about hiring potential guys who break rules.

And one thing I know about coaches, they will listen to opportunities and they have big egos. Some guys like comfort and will stay put. Other guys like new challenges.

By the way I did find a guy who's killing it in his first job. Tom Landry Arizona, but maybe that's a product of the team he inherited from Miller.

Fortune favors the bold.

Couple things-

I know firsthand Shaka is very happy where he is- mentioned it separately.

Drew has a title and a program that is above SU and clearly right now. Zero reason for him to consider leaving.

$EC on the other two- that means stability and a place in future mega conferences is rock solid.

Miller - I'd love to see it- I'm just not sold the university has the appetite.

 

[phil77]

And Red could win here. There's lots of assumptions that he is going to fall flat on his face it appears.

Because there is no evidence to support he will be a good coach at all. No recruiting evidence, no in game coaching evidence, no practice coaching evidence, no player development evidence just nothing that says Red will be a good head coach. Will he be who knows that is a major gamble our program shouldn't be taking after a 9 year decline and that is the point of people wanting to do a national search and hire a person with experience.

 

[Bayside44]

I think Smart would kill it in the ACC. Texas wasn't a great fit for him culturally. He seems like an east coast/city guy.

He's from Wisconsin.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Because there is no evidence to support he will be a good coach at all. No recruiting evidence, no in game coaching evidence, no practice coaching evidence, no player development evidence just nothing that says Red will be a good head coach. Will he be who knows that is a major gamble our program shouldn't be taking after a 9 year decline and that is the point of people wanting to do a national search and hire a person with experience.

Shaka Smart as some are suggesting would be a huge gamble too. He had the same record as JB has the past 6 or 7 seasons at Texas.

Nobody is saying Red is guaranteed to succeed here, but there are people assuming he would fail.

 

[OrangePA]

I don't think the skepticism is disrespectful of our assistant coaches. We have struggled as a program in a relative sense to the benchmark established on really all fronts. We've known them as players and people when they've been in the public eye. As coaches we don't know them that well other than the fact they haven't ran their own program yet. Given we are at a point of transition in the game itself let alone as a program adds more mystery and drama to the whole thing. So, yeah I think the concern is fair. I also think the perception of who can and would want to make a national short list is inflated an unrealistic to an extent but still some folks should get a look hands down.

Given the above here is where I'm at with Red after reading everything so far.

If he can bring back and bring in the talent, including being 100 pct committed to the portal and if he is also extremely well liked by the kids, then he has a huge part of being successful in today's environment checked off. The portal is key and being a players centric coach, given the preferences of today's youth is also key.

The next part is X's and O's. This is where others mentioning a bench coach is key. Deploy a modern defensive strategy, use what has been learned offensively with a player based approach. Finally, look at what works in terms of the modern lineup and position less hoops. This paragraph of needs is the part that likely takes the longest but if Red has the former paragraph down- he has a great foundation.

The rest is just like the weather- going to have to see what the sky looks like when it gets here.

I'm not challenging your assessment.

I want to know what is a modern defensive strategy?

How would you describe that?

 

[Bayside44]

Couple things-

I know firsthand Shaka is very happy where he is- mentioned it separately.

Drew has a title and a program that is above SU and clearly right now. Zero reason for him to consider leaving.

$EC on the other two- that means stability and a place in future mega conferences is rock solid.

Miller - I'd love to see it- I'm just not sold the university has the appetite.

This.

Hoops isn't football - a good gym and weight / recovery which just about everyone has plus money and a nice quality of life.

Miller is the only one on this list because we could blow Xavier out of the water.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I want an outside hire but will give Autry a chance. For me if the team doesn't make the tournament in the first 4 seasons he needs to be gone. That's how simple it is.

Oh I think 4 years is very generous.

The first two years unless it's a complete dumpster fire can only help him.

By year three we need to be off the bubble, safely in the tournament, and trending back up.

If we're not, we should move on.

 

[721Comstock]

Oh I think 4 years is very generous.

The first two years unless it's a complete dumpster fire can only help him.

By year three we need to be off the bubble, safely in the tournament, and trending back up.

If we're not, we should move on.

I agree 144%.

The "continuity hire" doesn't get 4 years to make things happen.
They need to hit the ground running, and show tangible improvement by year 2, or 3 at the latest.

IF it is Red, I hope he is successful.

And IF he's not, I hope that then gets the "but, it's gotta be a Cuse alum!" crowd to go kick rocks, and we then do a full, proper NATIONAL SEARCH for whomever his replacement is.

 

[phil77]

Shaka Smart as some are suggesting would be a huge gamble too. He had the same record as JB has the past 6 or 7 seasons at Texas.

Nobody is saying Red is guaranteed to succeed here, but there are people assuming he would fail.

I am not assuming Red will fail I just think he isn't worth the gamble right now with current state of the program. If it was 10 years ago and we were rolling along Red would make sense but the current state of the program suggests and internal hire will more than likely not succeed. Once he is announced he will get my support but in the meantime I will still argue against it.

 

[Scooch]

It's important to remember that you only have one opportunity to truly hire from within in a scenario like this, and it is imperative not to catastrophically damage the alumni, ex-player and booster support of the program.

I 100% understand the desire to hire from outside. One can make a very compelling case why that's the route we should take.

On the other hand, it is highly likely a hire like that will alienate a large portion of the folks I mentioned. And if that guy doesn't succeed immediately, there's no stuffing the genie of discontent back in the bottle.

If Autry fails then you can tell those folks that we tried, it didn't work, and now we gotta go outside the family. I don't worry at all about the program becoming unsalvageable. A couple bad years won't erase all of the advantages this program has.

Like I said, you can find fault with an internal hire. But you can't ignore the ramifications of going outside either. Both have downsides.

 

[kcsu]

Red will get 3 years. If he fails JW goes outside.