Where Did It All Go Wrong???

[Crusty]

What a total collapse. After that Clemson win, never would I have expected them to lose out. There have been many disappointments I have experienced with Syracuse Football, but this may take the cake.

I have said it several times and I don't think it's any secret that I am a huge Babers fan. I 110% feel that he is our best chance to get back to respectability, and he should be extended in the offseason, but I have 1 issue. I really feel the way the Clemson win was handled ended up having a negative effect on the team. I think there was far too much back slapping and they some how lost their edge. I have a feeling if he could do it again, he would because they definitely did not capitalize on the win, and now all the momentum that was gained is gone. The win went from Syracuse coming out and beating a great team to now, Clemson only lost becase Bryant was hurt. That narrative is only because of how we imploded after, not anything Clemson has done.

Now instead of focusing on what happened, and how we got here, I want to look at what needs to be improved going forward.

- I think the first thing that needs to be addressed is the quarterback position. I hate to say this about Eric, but you are only as good as your availability. If you are only physically capable of playing half the season then that has to factor into the decision. Sure he wasn't done any favors with the playing calling and continually running him into the ground, but I think they realized that what makes Eric good is his ability to hurt you with his feet. If they took that away he really isn't a great pocket passer. You're best bet is to let him play and hope for the best. Unfortunately, that has led to him being knocked out by week 8 in each of his first 3 seasons. That is starting to be a trend, not the exception. I also think it needs to be factored into the decision that what this offense needs most is a true pocket passer. Now I have no idea if Devito is the answer. If I had to guess I have a feeling he is going to be very very good. From the limited times I have seen him live, and based on what people who know what they're talking about have said about him, then I have little doubt it's not if he will be a starting qb here, it's when. I think Babers is going to have to take a hard look at this position starting as soon as the last game is completed. I think Devito should be given a legit shot to win the job and if they compete and are even close to equal going into Fall camp, then the tough decision will need to be made. Having your starting QB KO'd 3/4 through the season year after year just has too much of a negative effect on the entire team. Plus it's not like Eric doesn't have his issues. He is too loose with the football, is not accurate enough for this high % offensive passing game, and is reckless with his body. I love the kid and his heart, but it's not like bad decisions didn't put us in a whole in each road game this season. Having a true pocket passer that can complete these high % throws , and more importantly not be putting his body at risk, because he needs to run to make up for passing inefficiencies, should be heavily considered.

- Need of a pass rusher. I'm not sure what happened to the DL the past 2 games, but we are seeing what the lack of a pass rush does to a defense. I don't think it's coincidental that the last 2 games has really exposed the secondary because they haven't been able to get to the qb. Even earlier in the seaosn they may not have been racking up the sacks, but they were consistently hitting the qb. I think at one point they had knocked out 3 or 4 straight opposing QB's. The last 2 games they would be lucky if they touched the opposing qb a total of 5 times. Slayton is getting doubled, Robinson hasn't done anything, and Coleman doesn't look to be at 100%. Guthrie should never be seen at DE again. I'm not sure if any of the current redshirts have the capability, of Jonathan will have the ability, but they need to focus on bringing in someone that can get to the QB. imo it's probably the hardest position to recruit, but if you bring in enough DE's you should get lucky with 1. In the long run I think Coleman and Robinson will give you that ability, but it's another position where quality depth is pretty thin.

- I actually feel we will be fine in the back 7 just as long as they keep the current kids committed. We are now seeing why Williams and Ellison were both buried deep on the depth chart. It's been a perfect storm, but the last 2 games with the DL not being able to get any pressure on the qb, and Cordy/Martin out for the year, our safeties have been getting abused. Those 2 are the exact opposite prototype of a player you want in this defense. However, once fully healthy this is going to be an experienced and pretty deep group. You get Cordy back, and I feel some of the best recruits are in the defensive backfield. Help is on the way

- As for LB, it may be blasphemous to say this, but we may improve with the more athletic and long young guys waiting in the wings. Like the defensive backfiled, I think some of the most talented recruits and redshirts are at this position. Kids like Richards and Fagan are going to be studs. Armstrong has already shown he can play. All 3 are bigger and more athletic then the current group that was brought in to fit Shafer's defense. Ward will get this guys and the group could actually improve.

- RB. I'm pretty shocked Babers hasn't been able to recruit a stud RB yet. I like Dixon as an every down back, and Jordan as that 3rd down, change of pace back, but I thought they would be able to attract that stud, sure fire RB to play in this offense? Maybe it will happen next year, but next year it will be more Strickland with a sprinkle of everyone else, as I think Neal gets moved to slot.

- OL just needs time to mature. This group has been average, maybe slightly below as a unit, but they are extremely young. This is another group where I actually feel they have a lot of talent waiting in the wings. I think Servais eventually gets moved to OT, and Sampson will take over at C. You have some nice, big, talented OT's, who will take some development, but can be cornerstones down the road . I like the potential in this group.

- WR. I may be in the minority, but I think Butler can strive as a #2 WR. He hasn't shown the best hands in the world, but he also isn't helped with accurate throws. He either gets hospital throws or passes around the ankles. What he does have is that extra gear the current group is missing. A whole off-season knowing he is going to be the man, I think will help him mentally. I would also like to see Nykiem Johnson be the focal point of the passing game next week vs BC. He's more natural than Erv, and like Butler, has that extra gear. Erv has been very good, but he's also not the most sure handed. WR's in this offense are going to put up numbers. More than any other position, this group will always put up gaudy numbers because of the scheme. We have some established young guys, as well as some nice young talent waiting to take over.

-Kicker - I hate not having a reliable FG kicker. Despite a season changing miss, Cole has been really good this year. He will be tough to be replaced.


As you can see I am pretty positive on the outlook of the program. I believe we have the dream staff in place, it's just time for guys to mature, and develop from role players to players who are relied upon to win games. Obviously, I think a huge decision is going to need to be made in the off-season. I'm going to be interested to see if Babers actually gives Devito a legit shot to win the job to lead this team. Either way the future is bright, and that has been the hardest part about swallowing the beat downs we have received these last 2 weeks.

Thoughts?

I pretty much think you nailed it in every respect. As much as we all love Dungey, he is not the ideal QB type for this offense. #2 has been my Avatar since his freshman year and he may well be the best QB since McNabb, but he is not made of steel and his instincts make it virtually impossible for him to play 12 or 13 games. TD will probably get plenty of playing time next year one way or another.

Jimmy Garappalo and Matt Johnson worked best in Dino's system. In a hypothetical where Dungey and DeVito were both recruits in the same class, I think Dino goes with TD. Thus, I think the next four years we will get better as Dino gets more of his players.

I am not worried about receivers. As we keep racking up these numbers, we will attract and develop as many as we need.

I am not convinced that Neal is better in the slot. I would like to see what he can do with better line play. He has already demonstrated flashes of brilliance. I also like having backs who can catch.

Defensive scheme notwithstanding, I share your confidence.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Injuries are only an issue when the depth built behind those injured players are a glaring weakness.

Without ED, this offense really struggles to move the ball. They have put up exactly 13 points in the last 6 quarters, and 7 of them game in garbage time against the Ville.

I think the offense now has 6 or 7 turnovers in our last 2 games along with god knows how many 3 and outs. That combined with our frantic pace does not bode well for our already stressed defense.

Which leads me to this: we have a few kids currently seeing significant playing time on the defense that are not P5 players.

We are now playing for our past recruiting sins. I do not necessarily judge a class by the best players, but rather the depth of the class. The Shafer years had too many misses for us to be able to overcome injuries - we probably have 10 - 15 kids on this roster that will not see meaningful playing time under Babers ever.

Further compounding the back end of the recruiting classes were kids that never even stepped foot on campus. Kids that should be our upperclassmen aren’t even here.

Go look at the 13, 14,and 15 recruiting classes:

Only kid from 13 still here is Avant.

2014 AJ Long, KJ Williams, Denzel Ward, Jalen Harvey, Colton Moskol, Alin Edourd, Naes Howard, Trevon Praater, Lamar Dawson — all gone

2015 Womack, Ealey, Clark, Sheppard, Fredericks, Cross, Guidice, Dunk, Carter, Blair, Ginnetti — all gone.

Some attribution was due to injuries, etc. That being said, not have potentially 21 upperclassmen is a major problem. Sure they can replaced with JUCOs, but this list doesn’t include non-contributors. These are kids that aren’t even with the program!

So while injuries do happen to all programs, I will argue that the depth issues faced by Syracuse are greater than that of a lot of our peers due to abysmal recruiting - not necessarily due to bringing in poor talent, but just to bringing in bodies.

I believe a lot of this gets addressed this offseason BTW.

Thank you for calling out the attrition.

We need classes that stick and more guys filling the 2 deep that are in their 4th and 5th years in the program.

JUCOs and 5th year transfers are a band aid. It needs to come from stringing together strong classes of high school players.

 

[Cuseregular]

Injuries are only an issue when the depth built behind those injured players are a glaring weakness.

Without ED, this offense really struggles to move the ball. They have put up exactly 13 points in the last 6 quarters, and 7 of them game in garbage time against the Ville.

I think the offense now has 6 or 7 turnovers in our last 2 games along with god knows how many 3 and outs. That combined with our frantic pace does not bode well for our already stressed defense.

Which leads me to this: we have a few kids currently seeing significant playing time on the defense that are not P5 players.

We are now playing for our past recruiting sins. I do not necessarily judge a class by the best players, but rather the depth of the class. The Shafer years had too many misses for us to be able to overcome injuries - we probably have 10 - 15 kids on this roster that will not see meaningful playing time under Babers ever.

Further compounding the back end of the recruiting classes were kids that never even stepped foot on campus. Kids that should be our upperclassmen aren’t even here.

Go look at the 13, 14,and 15 recruiting classes:

Only kid from 13 still here is Avant.

2014 AJ Long, KJ Williams, Denzel Ward, Jalen Harvey, Colton Moskol, Alin Edourd, Naes Howard, Trevon Praater, Lamar Dawson — all gone

2015 Womack, Ealey, Clark, Sheppard, Fredericks, Cross, Guidice, Dunk, Carter, Blair, Ginnetti — all gone.

Some attribution was due to injuries, etc. That being said, not have potentially 21 upperclassmen is a major problem. Sure they can replaced with JUCOs, but this list doesn’t include non-contributors. These are kids that aren’t even with the program!

So while injuries do happen to all programs, I will argue that the depth issues faced by Syracuse are greater than that of a lot of our peers due to abysmal recruiting - not necessarily due to bringing in poor talent, but just to bringing in bodies.

I believe a lot of this gets addressed this offseason BTW.

God bless Hamilton. Not only is the content spot on but your posts flow so well with perfect sentence structure, syntax and spacing with the proper use of multiple paragraphs to make it easily readable as well as easy on the eyes and brain. I just skip the 300 sentence paragraphs that people often post.

Why I decided to make note of this now I have absolutely no idea....

 

[Scooch]

About Babers handling of the Clemson win... he sold the ever-loving crap out of that win precisely to boost recruiting.

Can’t have it both ways. This program is not in the place for the HC to act blase about a win like that. He had to do massive PR to capitalize on it.

And as others said, we came out and took Miami and FSU to the last possession immediately following it.

I’m all for critiquing the staff when appropriate but the narratives some people push are too often not based in facts.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

About Babers handling of the Clemson win... he sold the ever-loving crap out of that win precisely to boost recruiting.

Can’t have it both ways. This program is not in the place for the HC to act blase about a win like that. He had to do massive PR to capitalize on it.

And as others said, we came out and took Miami and FSU to the last possession immediately following it.

I’m all for critiquing the staff when appropriate but the narratives some people push are too often not based in facts.

I mean how crappy was our schedule?

Everybody was better than they were supposed to be in conference, with the exception of Florida State, who's still loaded with high star talent and was on the road. Throw in LSU and Scott "Richard Bag" Shafer in all flukes going against us... I mean, this year was horse manure. The year we happen to get Miami on the road just happens to be when they're an NC contender? I mean, are you shizzing me, here?

Even the Dazzler has grunted his way to bowl eligibility before we even play.

We got hosed by the scheduling Gods.

 

[Domedog84]

I pretty much think you nailed it in every respect. As much as we all love Dungey, he is not the ideal QB type for this offense. #2 has been my Avatar since his freshman year and he may well be the best QB since McNabb, but he is not made of steel and his instincts make it virtually impossible for him to play 12 or 13 games. TD will probably get plenty of playing time next year one way or another.

Jimmy Garappalo and Matt Johnson worked best in Dino's system. In a hypothetical where Dungey and DeVito were both recruits in the same class, I think Dino goes with TD. Thus, I think the next four years we will get better as Dino gets more of his players.

I am not worried about receivers. As we keep racking up these numbers, we will attract and develop as many as we need.

I am not convinced that Neal is better in the slot. I would like to see what he can do with better line play. He has already demonstrated flashes of brilliance. I also like having backs who can catch.

Defensive scheme notwithstanding, I share your confidence.

I was harping all year about moving Neal to the slot but I really like his instincts and home run ability from the backfield. He pushes the pile as well as Strick. Let's see him with next year's line.

 

[orangehomer]

What a total collapse. After that Clemson win, never would I have expected them to lose out. There have been many disappointments I have experienced with Syracuse Football, but this may take the cake.

I have said it several times and I don't think it's any secret that I am a huge Babers fan. I 110% feel that he is our best chance to get back to respectability, and he should be extended in the offseason, but I have 1 issue. I really feel the way the Clemson win was handled ended up having a negative effect on the team. I think there was far too much back slapping and they some how lost their edge. I have a feeling if he could do it again, he would because they definitely did not capitalize on the win, and now all the momentum that was gained is gone. The win went from Syracuse coming out and beating a great team to now, Clemson only lost becase Bryant was hurt. That narrative is only because of how we imploded after, not anything Clemson has done.

Now instead of focusing on what happened, and how we got here, I want to look at what needs to be improved going forward.

- I think the first thing that needs to be addressed is the quarterback position. I hate to say this about Eric, but you are only as good as your availability. If you are only physically capable of playing half the season then that has to factor into the decision. Sure he wasn't done any favors with the playing calling and continually running him into the ground, but I think they realized that what makes Eric good is his ability to hurt you with his feet. If they took that away he really isn't a great pocket passer. You're best bet is to let him play and hope for the best. Unfortunately, that has led to him being knocked out by week 8 in each of his first 3 seasons. That is starting to be a trend, not the exception. I also think it needs to be factored into the decision that what this offense needs most is a true pocket passer. Now I have no idea if Devito is the answer. If I had to guess I have a feeling he is going to be very very good. From the limited times I have seen him live, and based on what people who know what they're talking about have said about him, then I have little doubt it's not if he will be a starting qb here, it's when. I think Babers is going to have to take a hard look at this position starting as soon as the last game is completed. I think Devito should be given a legit shot to win the job and if they compete and are even close to equal going into Fall camp, then the tough decision will need to be made. Having your starting QB KO'd 3/4 through the season year after year just has too much of a negative effect on the entire team. Plus it's not like Eric doesn't have his issues. He is too loose with the football, is not accurate enough for this high % offensive passing game, and is reckless with his body. I love the kid and his heart, but it's not like bad decisions didn't put us in a whole in each road game this season. Having a true pocket passer that can complete these high % throws , and more importantly not be putting his body at risk, because he needs to run to make up for passing inefficiencies, should be heavily considered.

- Need of a pass rusher. I'm not sure what happened to the DL the past 2 games, but we are seeing what the lack of a pass rush does to a defense. I don't think it's coincidental that the last 2 games has really exposed the secondary because they haven't been able to get to the qb. Even earlier in the seaosn they may not have been racking up the sacks, but they were consistently hitting the qb. I think at one point they had knocked out 3 or 4 straight opposing QB's. The last 2 games they would be lucky if they touched the opposing qb a total of 5 times. Slayton is getting doubled, Robinson hasn't done anything, and Coleman doesn't look to be at 100%. Guthrie should never be seen at DE again. I'm not sure if any of the current redshirts have the capability, of Jonathan will have the ability, but they need to focus on bringing in someone that can get to the QB. imo it's probably the hardest position to recruit, but if you bring in enough DE's you should get lucky with 1. In the long run I think Coleman and Robinson will give you that ability, but it's another position where quality depth is pretty thin.

- I actually feel we will be fine in the back 7 just as long as they keep the current kids committed. We are now seeing why Williams and Ellison were both buried deep on the depth chart. It's been a perfect storm, but the last 2 games with the DL not being able to get any pressure on the qb, and Cordy/Martin out for the year, our safeties have been getting abused. Those 2 are the exact opposite prototype of a player you want in this defense. However, once fully healthy this is going to be an experienced and pretty deep group. You get Cordy back, and I feel some of the best recruits are in the defensive backfield. Help is on the way

- As for LB, it may be blasphemous to say this, but we may improve with the more athletic and long young guys waiting in the wings. Like the defensive backfiled, I think some of the most talented recruits and redshirts are at this position. Kids like Richards and Fagan are going to be studs. Armstrong has already shown he can play. All 3 are bigger and more athletic then the current group that was brought in to fit Shafer's defense. Ward will get this guys and the group could actually improve.

- RB. I'm pretty shocked Babers hasn't been able to recruit a stud RB yet. I like Dixon as an every down back, and Jordan as that 3rd down, change of pace back, but I thought they would be able to attract that stud, sure fire RB to play in this offense? Maybe it will happen next year, but next year it will be more Strickland with a sprinkle of everyone else, as I think Neal gets moved to slot.

- OL just needs time to mature. This group has been average, maybe slightly below as a unit, but they are extremely young. This is another group where I actually feel they have a lot of talent waiting in the wings. I think Servais eventually gets moved to OT, and Sampson will take over at C. You have some nice, big, talented OT's, who will take some development, but can be cornerstones down the road . I like the potential in this group.

- WR. I may be in the minority, but I think Butler can strive as a #2 WR. He hasn't shown the best hands in the world, but he also isn't helped with accurate throws. He either gets hospital throws or passes around the ankles. What he does have is that extra gear the current group is missing. A whole off-season knowing he is going to be the man, I think will help him mentally. I would also like to see Nykiem Johnson be the focal point of the passing game next week vs BC. He's more natural than Erv, and like Butler, has that extra gear. Erv has been very good, but he's also not the most sure handed. WR's in this offense are going to put up numbers. More than any other position, this group will always put up gaudy numbers because of the scheme. We have some established young guys, as well as some nice young talent waiting to take over.

-Kicker - I hate not having a reliable FG kicker. Despite a season changing miss, Cole has been really good this year. He will be tough to be replaced.


As you can see I am pretty positive on the outlook of the program. I believe we have the dream staff in place, it's just time for guys to mature, and develop from role players to players who are relied upon to win games. Obviously, I think a huge decision is going to need to be made in the off-season. I'm going to be interested to see if Babers actually gives Devito a legit shot to win the job to lead this team. Either way the future is bright, and that has been the hardest part about swallowing the beat downs we have received these last 2 weeks.

Thoughts?

your post is really long. i'm going to start with the easy part. the dungey running thing is not play calling, its dungey making one or two reads and then running. the offense is not meant for the QB to get hit 20 times a game.

 

[Scooch]

I mean how crappy was our schedule?

Everybody was better than they were supposed to be in conference, with the exception of Florida State, who's still loaded with high star talent and was on the road. Throw in LSU and Scott "Richard Bag" Shafer in all flukes going against us... I mean, this year was horse manure. The year we happen to get Miami on the road just happens to be when they're an NC contender? I mean, are you shizzing me, here?

Even the Dazzler has grunted his way to bowl eligibility before we even play.

We got hosed by the scheduling Gods.

Yep, and the schedule was really tough before we found out that NC State and Wake are legit, and Miami has become The U again.

Year 3. It’s always about year three in a new coach’s tenure. That’s when you pretty much know.

Next year winning 3 OOC is a really good bet. We get UNC at home as our Coastal game. 2-5 against the rest gets us a bowl.

 

[Shenexon]

I pretty much think you nailed it in every respect. As much as we all love Dungey, he is not the ideal QB type for this offense. #2 has been my Avatar since his freshman year and he may well be the best QB since McNabb, but he is not made of steel and his instincts make it virtually impossible for him to play 12 or 13 games. TD will probably get plenty of playing time next year one way or another.

Jimmy Garappalo and Matt Johnson worked best in Dino's system. In a hypothetical where Dungey and DeVito were both recruits in the same class, I think Dino goes with TD. Thus, I think the next four years we will get better as Dino gets more of his players.

I am not worried about receivers. As we keep racking up these numbers, we will attract and develop as many as we need.

I am not convinced that Neal is better in the slot. I would like to see what he can do with better line play. He has already demonstrated flashes of brilliance. I also like having backs who can catch.

Defensive scheme notwithstanding, I share your confidence.

Dungey is my favorite QB ever I think. His passion for the game makes every game exciting. I've really enjoyed this season largely because of him. However, his history makes a full season for him unlikely. He's not had a full season at SU and think TD is going to be our starter at some point next year. It'll be very interesting to see how Babers will handle the QB position in the fall.

Should he save Dungey for the last six games rather than use him up the first six? It's a silly thought, but I do think that injuries can be cumulative and do we need him more for Western Michigan, UConn, and Wagner or the ACC part of our schedule? Would it help TD to prepare if he got some experience early as opposed to having him come in green against the tougher part of our schedule? I'd love to see Dungey have a heisman quality senior year, but think it's unwise to assume he's going to play a full season. He plays too hard and/or recklessly to survive our full schedule, at least that's what he's shown so far in his career.

 

[bothsocksup]

Injuries are only an issue when the depth built behind those injured players are a glaring weakness.

Without ED, this offense really struggles to move the ball. They have put up exactly 13 points in the last 6 quarters, and 7 of them game in garbage time against the Ville.

I think the offense now has 6 or 7 turnovers in our last 2 games along with god knows how many 3 and outs. That combined with our frantic pace does not bode well for our already stressed defense.

Which leads me to this: we have a few kids currently seeing significant playing time on the defense that are not P5 players.

We are now playing for our past recruiting sins. I do not necessarily judge a class by the best players, but rather the depth of the class. The Shafer years had too many misses for us to be able to overcome injuries - we probably have 10 - 15 kids on this roster that will not see meaningful playing time under Babers ever.

Further compounding the back end of the recruiting classes were kids that never even stepped foot on campus. Kids that should be our upperclassmen aren’t even here.

Go look at the 13, 14,and 15 recruiting classes:

Only kid from 13 still here is Avant.

2014 AJ Long, KJ Williams, Denzel Ward, Jalen Harvey, Colton Moskol, Alin Edourd, Naes Howard, Trevon Praater, Lamar Dawson — all gone

2015 Womack, Ealey, Clark, Sheppard, Fredericks, Cross, Guidice, Dunk, Carter, Blair, Ginnetti — all gone.

Some attribution was due to injuries, etc. That being said, not have potentially 21 upperclassmen is a major problem. Sure they can replaced with JUCOs, but this list doesn’t include non-contributors. These are kids that aren’t even with the program!

So while injuries do happen to all programs, I will argue that the depth issues faced by Syracuse are greater than that of a lot of our peers due to abysmal recruiting - not necessarily due to bringing in poor talent, but just to bringing in bodies.

I believe a lot of this gets addressed this offseason BTW.

Cil you mention that many of these issues will get addressed. How would you go about fixing some of our problems?

 

[TheCusian]

I like how the thought process is Erics not the answer because hes been dinged up. Hes by far our best offensive player and will be next year as well. He may be the most important player to his team in the ACC

He can be both that and not a perfect fit for the system. Hard truth: If Babers was our coach when he popped up on our recruiting radar, I’d bet he’d have passed on him due to accuracy.

And I think Babers truly admires the kind of kid he is.

 

[CanadianSU]

Shafer dealed with a lot of injuries here to guys... keep that in mind.

 

[SmilinBob]

A lot of great points like the schedule, injuries and depth and I'd like to add the DL has to put pressure on the qb and actually sack him without any blitizing. LB's that can cover the field for passes...yes blitzing took that away at times so they were never in play to cover but they were vacant on passes as the season progressed.

You could see the biggest problem offensively was running the ball. When SU ran ED in the first game vs CC you knew there were going have a rough year and I changed my and many others did as well the final win totals to 4 or 5. The OL and Strickland/Neal got better but while that developed, ED got too beat up trying to do too much and we see how that developed.

The DB's looked slow to me...gliding and poor angles as the season progressed. Slow reactions and poor reads. Nice to have Cordy back next year but he's been hurt more than ED the last 2 years and played very few snaps in that time frame.

There is absolutely no doubt that Babers and staff again, as many have said, will build up the depth with quality players that are bigger, faster and more talented. Nothing against the young men playing hard right now for SU but you can't give up 60 and 50 points like that and expect a pat on the back. Get out and get better and make it harder for those new guys to beat you out.

Pitter pat football. 3 yards here, 6 yards there and each time a lot of plays to march down the field. Somebody has to catch a ball and score. How many times did Ish trip over his own feet in the past couple of years when it looked like he was going to break one? At least 3 to 4 times. Phillips had to catch a pass up the middle once in a while and take it to the zone but usually fell avoiding contact.

ED just took off way too early in the beginning of the season and he got so much better staying behind the LOS and looking for his receivers. That said, the slow starts hurt this team and the turnovers got them behind the 8 ball right from the get go for 3 games in close losses...just can't do that and win big games away from home.

These problems have to be addressed.

 

[NineOneSeven]

I consider Eric's injury this year to be more fluky than most. Sure, it keeps the trend going for his injury history but it's not what I would have guessed would be the injury that sidelined him.

I don't know a single thing about Devito other than he's redshirting this year. From what I read here, he's got some potential... Then again every player here seems to get talked up like crazy. Will Dino give him a fair shot to make the starting lineup? Sure, I think so. Does he have a chance in hell imo? No way. A senior year Dungey who has single handedly/footedly won games for us vs a freshman who allegedly is a better pocket passer? I don't see it at all. If everything stays the same, Devito's time will come.

Yeah it sucks Dungey gets hurt (for his own personal health first, and syracuse as a team second) but imagine every game this year without him?

I just hope next year we can get to six wins, regardless of who is playing QB. We failed this year.

 

[Newhouser]

I think ED is obviously the MIP on this team. I too however think he isn't HCDB's ideal fit for his system. In watching the games this season - how many teams do you think would have swapped their QB for ED? Clemson, Wake, Lou-ville, the U no. MTSU, NC State, FSU maybe. LSU, Pitt probably.

 

[Millhouse]

Injuries are only an issue when the depth built behind those injured players are a glaring weakness.

Without ED, this offense really struggles to move the ball. They have put up exactly 13 points in the last 6 quarters, and 7 of them game in garbage time against the Ville.

I think the offense now has 6 or 7 turnovers in our last 2 games along with god knows how many 3 and outs. That combined with our frantic pace does not bode well for our already stressed defense.

Which leads me to this: we have a few kids currently seeing significant playing time on the defense that are not P5 players.

We are now playing for our past recruiting sins. I do not necessarily judge a class by the best players, but rather the depth of the class. The Shafer years had too many misses for us to be able to overcome injuries - we probably have 10 - 15 kids on this roster that will not see meaningful playing time under Babers ever.

Further compounding the back end of the recruiting classes were kids that never even stepped foot on campus. Kids that should be our upperclassmen aren’t even here.

Go look at the 13, 14,and 15 recruiting classes:

Only kid from 13 still here is Avant.

2014 AJ Long, KJ Williams, Denzel Ward, Jalen Harvey, Colton Moskol, Alin Edourd, Naes Howard, Trevon Praater, Lamar Dawson — all gone

2015 Womack, Ealey, Clark, Sheppard, Fredericks, Cross, Guidice, Dunk, Carter, Blair, Ginnetti — all gone.

Some attribution was due to injuries, etc. That being said, not have potentially 21 upperclassmen is a major problem. Sure they can replaced with JUCOs, but this list doesn’t include non-contributors. These are kids that aren’t even with the program!

So while injuries do happen to all programs, I will argue that the depth issues faced by Syracuse are greater than that of a lot of our peers due to abysmal recruiting - not necessarily due to bringing in poor talent, but just to bringing in bodies.

I believe a lot of this gets addressed this offseason BTW.

i don't know enough about how babers offense practices but part of the reason i always loved the air raid was because it prepares so many qbs at once - everyone's throwing and catching every rep.

i'm astonished at how fundamentally inept our backup non-redshirted qbs are.

 

[Millhouse]

That's always been the crux of the problem. When you're referencing injuries, you're also referencing quality depth. Without quality depth you are not playing with P5 talent anymore. When a kid at NC state, or Miami, or Va Tech goes down, they replace them with another P5 quality athlete. That hasn't been the case under Robinson, Marrone for the most part, or Shafer. The second string guys had offers from Mac Schools, and beyond that they were players with 1AA offers and a couple mid major offers. Dino will build depth by bringing in better athletes. He already is. None of the coaches I mentioned lasted longer than 4 years. It's impossible to build quality depth when you replace your head coach every 3-4 years at a school like Syracuse.

hopefully the tempo leads to recruiting more depth

we're going to have a zillion plays on both sides and more guys will play as a result

 

[orangepassion]

I think ED is obviously the MIP on this team. I too however think he isn't HCDB's ideal fit for his system. In watching the games this season - how many teams do you think would have swapped their QB for ED? Clemson, Wake, Lou-ville, the U no. MTSU, NC State, FSU maybe. LSU, Pitt probably.

The only team that would definitely be no would be Louisville. You have to remember Dungey had no credible running game most of the year. Imagine Clemson with him. IMO they'd be even better.

 

[hungrychuck]

The only team that would definitely be no would be Louisville. You have to remember Dungey had no credible running game most of the year. Imagine Clemson with him. IMO they'd be even better.

IMO, Clemson would have whupped us if we traded QBs.

 

[Doc5120]

I consider Eric's injury this year to be more fluky than most. Sure, it keeps the trend going for his injury history but it's not what I would have guessed would be the injury that sidelined him.

I don't know a single thing about Devito other than he's redshirting this year. From what I read here, he's got some potential... Then again every player here seems to get talked up like crazy. Will Dino give him a fair shot to make the starting lineup? Sure, I think so. Does he have a chance in hell imo? No way. A senior year Dungey who has single handedly/footedly won games for us vs a freshman who allegedly is a better pocket passer? I don't see it at all. If everything stays the same, Devito's time will come.

Yeah it sucks Dungey gets hurt (for his own personal health first, and syracuse as a team second) but imagine every game this year without him?

I just hope next year we can get to six wins, regardless of who is playing QB. We failed this year.

Could not agree more with the bolded part of your statement. There's a thread on here somewhere about new impact contributors next year, and there are literally 10-20 names on the list. It blows me away. People on here tend to overestimate our talent because it's the team we follow closest. Sure, 10-20 new guys may see more time on the field, but very few of them are going to make a major impact.

I, for one, think Devito can be an impact guy next season, should God forbid, Dungey get hurt again. But some people seem to think we're going to have 6 new impact guys on each side of the ball. I'll settle for 3-4 total - a disruptive pass rusher, a deep threat WR, someone to step up in the defensive backfield & a LB that can tackle and cover ground sideline to sideline.

 

[CIL]

i don't know enough about how babers offense practices but part of the reason i always loved the air raid was because it prepares so many qbs at once - everyone's throwing and catching every rep.

i'm astonished at how fundamentally inept our backup non-redshirted qbs are.

I can give my 6 year old more reps on the driving range, doesn’t mean she’s breaking par...

We just pissed away scholarships with Austin Wilson, AJ Long, and Alin Edouard.

 

[SUFan44]

hopefully the tempo leads to recruiting more depth

we're going to have a zillion plays on both sides and more guys will play as a result

Mahoney was offered as many scholarships as I was out of high school, and then again was offered that same number after two years at a JUCO.

Culpepper... I have no idea. UF offered him, but that coach couldn't scout offensive talent any better than our ol' ball coach could.

Hoping Devito is the answer.

 

[tbonezone]

where did it all go wrong ?


Did you crack it
Did you grab it
Did you reel it
Like a rabbit ...

 

[Louie and Bouie]

I mean how crappy was our schedule?

Everybody was better than they were supposed to be in conference, with the exception of Florida State, who's still loaded with high star talent and was on the road. Throw in LSU and Scott "Richard Bag" Shafer in all flukes going against us... I mean, this year was horse manure. The year we happen to get Miami on the road just happens to be when they're an NC contender? I mean, are you shizzing me, here?

Even the Dazzler has grunted his way to bowl eligibility before we even play.

We got hosed by the scheduling Gods.

Poker saying in relation to our schedule: If you're looking around the table for the fish and can't find them chances are that you're the fish.

Unfortunately, that applies to SU in most years when looking at our schedule preseason.

 

[tbonezone]

can't handle the ACC schedule ? seemed rather silly to jump no ? as fish we're carp.

aka bottom feeders.