“Most NIL deals are b———-.”

[OttoinGrotto]

Its the most important position in team sports. And they stay put.

Agreed, but that's different from the conversation about if NIL is ruining college sports (it's not) and how much of the NFL's popularity is due to limited player movement (at best it's a small factor).

 

[Bayside44]

Agreed, but that's different from the conversation about if NIL is ruining college sports (it's not) and how much of the NFL's popularity is due to limited player movement (at best it's a small factor).

Yeah its off topic from NIL. The proof will come soon enough on that.

I'll argue that parking a QB in one place for a decade is a big deal but eh, I have my own problems with the NFL.

 

[bnoro]

100% without a doubt. Anyone, who truly believed otherwise, well...here's a good 'ol tune off 'Grand Illusion' (fitting) that comes to mind.

You and JustPherSU are missing my point. The "spirit" of the rule was to let them profit from what I said.

OF COURSE we all knew what it would turn into. No one believed it wouldn't turn into pay for play

 

[Jake]

Its the most important position in team sports. And they stay put.

I don’t think this can be overstated. Tier 1 NFL QBs do not move until they’re no longer tier 1. It’s a huge factor in the sports popularity. No other league has a franchise tag.

College football is the exact opposite in this regard. “Franchise QBs” are moving every year.

 

[Jake]

Agreed, but that's different from the conversation about if NIL is ruining college sports (it's not) and how much of the NFL's popularity is due to limited player movement (at best it's a small factor).

I’ve never said paying players is ruining the sport. But the collateral movement will erode its popularity

It’s no different than the landmark Marvin Miller Andy Messersmith ruling.

Players deserve to get paid, but that carries a price…that is detrimental to fan experience over time.

I appreciate your opinions, but I think you’re wrong. Time will tell.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I’ve never said paying players is ruining the sport.

Yeah, I know. We're good. My initial response on it wasn't to you. Another poster said it and I responded to them.

Now it's gone down a few tangents.

 

[dasher]

I’ve never said paying players is ruining the sport. But the collateral movement will erode its popularity

It’s no different than the landmark Marvin Miller Andy Messersmith ruling.

Players deserve to get paid, but that carries a price…that is detrimental to fan experience over time.

I appreciate your opinions, but I think you’re wrong. Time will tel

Football passed baseball in the late 60's. Before player movement.

 

[djcon57]

NFL passed baseball in the late 80s 90s. My generation ditched it for football. Had nothing to do with pace of play. But when Roger Clemens took the mound for the Yankees, the sport jumped the shark for a lot of us.

Give player movement 5-7 years in college football and it will impact the sport.

Do you think college basketball was better or wirse now compared to the era when going pro early was rare?

College basketball is absolutely worse due to top talent not playing college basketball. If top talent starts playing for the UFL, then college football has a problem

 

[xc84]

Everyone knew players were not really going to be offered cash simply for their name, image or likeness. The reality is, “You come here to play and we will give you cash.”

 

[Scooch]

MLB has a bunch of these 8+ year mega deals now and I can say with authority that won’t increase the game’s overall popularity.

Arguably increased player movement in pro sports over the past 4 decades has *increased* overall interest… because it has brought about more parity. I remember when my early 80s Red Sox and early 90s Pats had a lot of roster stability… and that SUCKED because those players stunk. Teams can literally go from worst to first much more easily today, and that’s great for interest.

Of course, none of that has anything to do with college spots.

College hoops stunk long before the portal and NIL. NBA early entries killed that sport. It’s been borderline unwatchable for years.

College football has always been far more about the name on the front of the jersey than the name on the back. What’ll harm interest in CFB is continued concentrating of the haves vs the have nots.

As in, new QBs every season hasn’t hurt interest in Oklahoma. But whittling down the number of teams that feel part of high level college football from, say, 75 to 35 will do the trick.

 

[anomander]

NFL passed baseball in the late 80s 90s. My generation ditched it for football. Had nothing to do with pace of play. But when Roger Clemens took the mound for the Yankees, the sport jumped the shark for a lot of us.

Give player movement 5-7 years in college football and it will impact the sport.

Do you think college basketball was better or wirse now compared to the era when going pro early was rare?

100% agree. Give it 5 years and i think you will start to see a negative impact. Throw in realignment where there will be some very good programs certainly left out and even then the winner of the poaching war between ACC vs B12 leftovers may still be left out if the B10/SEC breakaway and form a real professional conference.

I’ll be honest. I used to love hoops and football equally, with maybe a small lean to hoops. The best part was learning about these elite recruits coming to Cuse. Billy Owens stands out. Then you were pretty much guaranteed 3, mostly 4 years to watch the kid develop throughout their career. Rony Seikaly and David Johnson are 2 great examples of development. Then the 1 and dones started, which i think will be the equivalent to the transfer portal. I’d be interested to know what percentage of fan bases follow the sport closely outside of their team and maybe conference? For every memorable, iconic players like Melo, there is a Donte Greene, or Chris McCollough, who you know played because they were good enough (Or at least thought so) to leave after a year, but how do those players stack up in your mind in comparison to Pearl, Sherm, Moten, and even guys like Rakeem and Kris Joseph. The 1 and done started en masse about 15 years ago, but have been happening for 20+ years. All you have to do is look at the huge ratings drop for the NCAA championship game from the 80’s-90’s compared to the last 10 years. I think it’s indisputable proof that it’s been a turnoff to fans. I know I have a very hard time watching college basketball outside of Syracuse these days. It’s just impossible to follow with players jumping all over the place and leaving early. CFB doesn’t have the early entry problem, but with the portal, NIL with no cap, and realignment, CFB has its own problems and i really hope it doesn’t go down the same path as CBB.

 

[anomander]

How does a NIL collective structure an “incentive-based” contract with a player if “pay to play” is not allowed? That would seem to expose them to all kinds of violations. I know , only if enforced. But still, seems risky.

That’s the thing with the collectives. How isn’t that pay to play? How does that = name, image, likeness? With the collectives, players aren’t doing advertisements for say a car dealership, that would be separate. Also, I thought the school wasn’t supposed to be directly involved with helping these kids get deals? Then how is the University allowed to set up a collective to pay kids ? What did McCord do to make $350k next year? How wasn’t that an arranged deal with the school and the player….not that i’m complaining! Wasn’t the original intention so kids can get paid for example jersey sales, autograph sessions/memorabilia, advertisement deals made with insert name? You can’t tell me Ole Miss and the rest of the SEC aren’t just buying players right now. Common sense, but if the school isn’t involved with a donor pointing to the kid they want and how much $ they need, then how is it supposed to work out? Were their rule changes that i missed? Right now it’s nothing more than pay for play with no salary cap which isn’t fun for the have nots and forcing conferences with 60+ years of history and rivalries being forced to break up because the flagship programs need the money to compete. My worry is this is the future the ACC will eventually being forced to go down, and where that leaves us?

I’m all for players getting their share, but this is untenable and detrimental to the sport. There needs to be a change and quick. I don’t think the NCAA is the non-profit organization to lead this. They no longer have a leg to stand on due to fear of the inevitable, which is the organization also going down by the waist side, being left behind for a “Professional League”.

I think there needs to be changes made asap. I don’t know by who? Maybe the NCAA, but they need an oversight committee with teeth. Their needs to be a salary cap implemented and i think the players should get a share of the media contracts where they are the main product being sold. Otherwise, the way things are now, it’s like playing a game on an app that has in-game purchases you can make if you want to spend extra money to pay for certain rewards or extras lives. It’s not fair, any sense of parity is gone, and we’ll be watching the same combination of 8-10 programs playing for the title each year, which will continue to further damage the sport long-term.

 

[All4SU]

That’s the thing with the collectives. How isn’t that pay to play? How does that = name, image, likeness? With the collectives, players aren’t doing advertisements for say a car dealership, that would be separate. Also, I thought the school wasn’t supposed to be directly involved with helping these kids get deals? Then how is the University allowed to set up a collective to pay kids ? What did McCord do to make $350k next year? How wasn’t that an arranged deal with the school and the player….not that i’m complaining! Wasn’t the original intention so kids can get paid for example jersey sales, autograph sessions/memorabilia, advertisement deals made with insert name? You can’t tell me Ole Miss and the rest of the SEC aren’t just buying players right now. Common sense, but if the school isn’t involved with a donor pointing to the kid they want and how much $ they need, then how is it supposed to work out? Were their rule changes that i missed? Right now it’s nothing more than pay for play with no salary cap which isn’t fun for the have nots and forcing conferences with 60+ years of history and rivalries being forced to break up because the flagship programs need the money to compete. My worry is this is the future the ACC will eventually being forced to go down, and where that leaves us?

I’m all for players getting their share, but this is untenable and detrimental to the sport. There needs to be a change and quick. I don’t think the NCAA is the non-profit organization to lead this. They no longer have a leg to stand on due to fear of the inevitable, which is the organization also going down by the waist side, being left behind for a “Professional League”.

I think there needs to be changes made asap. I don’t know by who? Maybe the NCAA, but they need an oversight committee with teeth. Their needs to be a salary cap implemented and i think the players should get a share of the media contracts where they are the main product being sold. Otherwise, the way things are now, it’s like playing a game on an app that has in-game purchases you can make if you want to spend extra money to pay for certain rewards or extras lives. It’s not fair, any sense of parity is gone, and we’ll be watching the same combination of 8-10 programs playing for the title each year, which will continue to further damage the sport long-term.

The other thing is, for years the complaint was “colleges are making so much money, the kids need to make some of it.” But the NIL money is not coming from the colleges. It’s EVEN MORE MONEY being injected into the system from boosters and fans. The colleges aren’t taking a hit. And as always, more money means more corruption, more cheating, and less accountability. Oh, and screw the fans and game.

 

[Arangeman]

The other thing is, for years the complaint was “colleges are making so much money, the kids need to make some of it.” But the NIL money is not coming from the colleges. It’s EVEN MORE MONEY being injected into the system from boosters and fans. The colleges aren’t taking a hit. And as always, more money means more corruption, more cheating, and less accountability. Oh, and screw the fans and game.

Agreed. Make the schools pay the players. This bizarre condition that it’s now passed on to fans to pay up.

 

[Dcuse]

NIL, Portal and B1G/SEC cabal are a perfect storm of craptitude that will destroy college sports and turn it into ProSports Lite.

Colleges will be dropping all kinds of non-revenue generating sports. Corporations will assume even greater control. College administrators will spend all their time rolling around in piles of cash. And players will have money thrown at them and then have the rug pulled out when they’re used up. Rivalries. Continuity. Fan allegiances. Player development. Dust in the wind.

This is the best synopsis of what is happening and how it will progress that I’ve read anywhere. Well done!

 

[Doc5120]

NFL passed baseball in the late 80s 90s. My generation ditched it for football. Had nothing to do with pace of play. But when Roger Clemens took the mound for the Yankees, the sport jumped the shark for a lot of us.

Give player movement 5-7 years in college football and it will impact the sport.

Do you think college basketball was better or wirse now compared to the era when going pro early was rare?

College hoops was amazing until about 15 or so years ago. Couldn't agree more that all the players leaving (typically way too early) has absolutely killed its popularity and lowered my interest. It was by far my favorite sport until 2010 or so, but now I much prefer cfb. Unfortunately the portal and NIL are starting to sour it a bit. Makes it more difficult to feel attached to the team when the names & faces change so drastically.

 

[orangecuse]

You and JustPherSU are missing my point. The "spirit" of the rule was to let them profit from what I said.

OF COURSE we all knew what it would turn into. No one believed it wouldn't turn into pay for play

I’m not missing anything. OF COURSE we all knew that the “spirit” you allude to was always going to be a front/facade of what the reality was always going to be. Clear as day.

 

[Toga]

NFL passed baseball in the late 80s 90s. My generation ditched it for football. Had nothing to do with pace of play. But when Roger Clemens took the mound for the Yankees, the sport jumped the shark for a lot of us.

Give player movement 5-7 years in college football and it will impact the sport.

Do you think college basketball was better or wirse now compared to the era when going pro early was rare?

I hated that Clemens pitched for the Yankees.

 

[orangecuse]

Agreed. Make the schools pay the players. This bizarre condition that it’s now passed on to fans to pay up.

It’s a complete crock!

Imagine, being a business entity and steadfastly pitching to you customers to anti up and basically directly pay its employees its raises, etc.

 

[mscanlo]

It’s a complete crock!

Imagine, being a business entity and steadfastly pitching to you customers to anti up and basically directly pay its employees its raises, etc.

Agreed. Make the schools pay the players. This bizarre condition that it’s now passed on to fans to pay up.

Title IX is likely a big hurdle (not saying it won’t be solved for, just hear it’s a big hurdle to clear))

 

[sutomcat]

Football passed baseball in the late 60's. Before player movement.

The Mets get blamed for everything...

 

[shandeezy7]

The other thing is, for years the complaint was “colleges are making so much money, the kids need to make some of it.” But the NIL money is not coming from the colleges. It’s EVEN MORE MONEY being injected into the system from boosters and fans. The colleges aren’t taking a hit. And as always, more money means more corruption, more cheating, and less accountability. Oh, and screw the fans and game.

The colleges aren't taking a hit now, and are probably happy that other people's money is being used for this. But when donations to athletic departments start drying up because everyone is now donating to NIL collectives instead, they will start to sweat (and it's probably already starting to happen).

 

[All4SU]

The colleges aren't taking a hit now, and are probably happy that other people's money is being used for this. But when donations to athletic departments start drying up because everyone is now donating to NIL collectives instead, they will start to sweat (and it's probably already starting to happen).

You may be right. I’m not convinced that donations to athletic departments will decrease. It’s not a closed system. More money means the beast gets bigger.

 

[tep624]

100% agree. Give it 5 years and i think you will start to see a negative impact. Throw in realignment where there will be some very good programs certainly left out and even then the winner of the poaching war between ACC vs B12 leftovers may still be left out if the B10/SEC breakaway and form a real professional conference.

I’ll be honest. I used to love hoops and football equally, with maybe a small lean to hoops. The best part was learning about these elite recruits coming to Cuse. Billy Owens stands out. Then you were pretty much guaranteed 3, mostly 4 years to watch the kid develop throughout their career. Rony Seikaly and David Johnson are 2 great examples of development. Then the 1 and dones started, which i think will be the equivalent to the transfer portal. I’d be interested to know what percentage of fan bases follow the sport closely outside of their team and maybe conference? For every memorable, iconic players like Melo, there is a Donte Greene, or Chris McCollough, who you know played because they were good enough (Or at least thought so) to leave after a year, but how do those players stack up in your mind in comparison to Pearl, Sherm, Moten, and even guys like Rakeem and Kris Joseph. The 1 and done started en masse about 15 years ago, but have been happening for 20+ years. All you have to do is look at the huge ratings drop for the NCAA championship game from the 80’s-90’s compared to the last 10 years. I think it’s indisputable proof that it’s been a turnoff to fans. I know I have a very hard time watching college basketball outside of Syracuse these days. It’s just impossible to follow with players jumping all over the place and leaving early. CFB doesn’t have the early entry problem, but with the portal, NIL with no cap, and realignment, CFB has its own problems and i really hope it doesn’t go down the same path as CBB.

My interest in CBB has declined dramatically since that era. I catch maybe 5 Cuse games a year and I rarely watch a NCAA tourney game anymore. The one and dones had a lot to do with it for sure.

The straw that broke my back was the NCAA coming down so hard on Boeheim for what was in my opinion pretty minor stuff overall that was self reported. It just proves that it's better to develop a system where you're obviously cheating but it's hard to detect. AKA Calipari.

 

[shandeezy7]

You may be right. I’m not convinced that donations to athletic departments will decrease. It’s not a closed system. More money means the beast gets bigger.

It's not a closed system, but people do have finite resources. The bags being handed out pre-NIL didn't have as many funders, due to the shady nature of it. So most folks that wanted to be involved in helping out their favorite program financially were doing it by being boosters to the university. Now that it's all out in the open, it's inevitable that a not insignificant amount of folks are going to shift their dollars from athletic departments to NIL collectives, especially as long as 501(c)(3) collectives maintain tax-exempt status (which probably won't be long, but I don't think that changes a ton).