Coach P Stepping Away from the NFL

[storange]

Ah yes, what a bizarre day of weather that was!

That Rutgers team had wins against Buffalo (1-11), Army (0-13), Navy (a Charmin soft 8-5) and Temple (0-11).

But, 'twas the ill wind that ruined that day for SU.

Was at that game , They kicked off into the wind and the ball balooned and dropped on the 30 and they recovered like a unplanned onside kick. Windiest game I ever saw

 

[GoSU96]

In 2001 we would've beaten Georgia Tech. Week 2 at Tennessee would've been the big hurdle. Then of course Miami and the Zebras in week 11. Had we gotten through the season with only the 1 loss we may have gotten the bid. Nebraska played in the title game with 1 loss that year.

The final BCS standings were Miami 12-0, Nebraska 11-2 (played for the title at 11-1), Colorado #3 at 10-2, Oregon 10-1, Florida 9-2 and Tennessee 10-2. Syracuse finished ranked 14th that year.

With Vick that Miami game would have been at least compelling but that Miami team is an all timer

 

[Chip]

With Vick that Miami game would have been at least compelling but that Miami team is an all timer

Agree. Zero weaknesses. The only unfortunate thing was that there wasn't a very strong 2nd team anywhere.

 

[OttoMets]

Great coach. Cantor was really the worst.

I mean, technically the arm-chair donors who cajoled her into making the decision are the worst.

 

[Chip]

In 2001 we would've beaten Georgia Tech. Week 2 at Tennessee would've been the big hurdle. Then of course Miami and the Zebras in week 11. Had we gotten through the season with only the 1 loss we may have gotten the bid. Nebraska played in the title game with 1 loss that year.

The final BCS standings were Miami 12-0, Nebraska 11-2 (played for the title at 11-1), Colorado #3 at 10-2, Oregon 10-1, Florida 9-2 and Tennessee 10-2. Syracuse finished ranked 14th that year.

I don't think the Tennessee game would have been that big a hurdle. It was a close game, but we couldn't generate any offense (we were still in the Nunes new wave shifts phase). Eventually Tennessee wore us out on the ground in the 2nd half.

Miami, I think was a bridge too far. Granted, McKinnie got away with a lot of holding on Freeney (in my humble opinion), but still, that was an incredible team.

 

[OttoMets]

I don’t disagree. PP also had loyalty to assistants who had had the game pass them by. ...

Exactly. If your scheme only works when you have the best quarterback in the country, it's time to find a new scheme.

 

[OttoMets]

Poor facilities had nothing to do with losing to Rutgers in 2003 and Temple in 2004. Those were historically awful losses, and ultimately are what cost P his job in '04. I mean, beat Rutgers in '03 and we eek into a minor bowl. Beat Temple in '04 and we make the BCS. There is zero chance P is fired if we make the Fiesta Bowl in '04. Less than zero.

Poor facilities played a role in the program's slippage, but you can't give a pass for those losses.

It's funny, for such a disciplined (and self-disciplined) guy, his teams didn't reflect that.

Oklahoma and ECU and Minnesota and Rutgers and Temple piled up. Of course coaches can't get the kids motivated every Saturday, and fluke losses happen. But racking up fewer upsets would have bought him a lot more job security.

 

[kirbivore]

That 10-win, 2001 season was a testament to the most disruptive college defensive player I have ever seen: Dwight Freeney. The entire offensive recipe was to hand the ball to Mungro, don't turn the ball over, and get the hell out of the way of the D. I mean, we threw 10 TD passes all season!

Once McKinney from the U was able to bear hug Freeney with no holding calls that took away any chance SU had in that 59-0 whooping.

 

[Scooch]

It's funny, for such a disciplined (and self-disciplined) guy, his teams didn't reflect that.

Oklahoma and ECU and Minnesota and Rutgers and Temple piled up. Of course coaches can't get the kids motivated every Saturday, and fluke losses happen. But racking up fewer upsets would have bought him a lot more job security.

Agreed.

It's also fair to note that SU wildly overscheduled back in the day. Playing 2, or even 3, power conference teams OOC, while also competing in a pretty strong Big East, was insanity. Granted, some of those teams were mediocre, but there was no reason to wear the team out when we were staring down Miami, VaTech, WVU, etc. in conference. I mean, look at this...

1995: UNC, Minnesota
1996: UNC, Minnesota
1997: Wisconsin, NC State, Oklahoma
1998: Tennessee, Michigan, NC State
2001: GaTech, Tennessee, Auburn
2002: BYU, UNC, Auburn

I don't think Jake, or whomever did the scheduling for SU in the 90s, realized that we had joined a conference that decade.

 

[GoSU96]

Agreed.

It's also fair to note that SU wildly overscheduled back in the day. Playing 2, or even 3, power conference teams OOC, while also competing in a pretty strong Big East, was insanity. Granted, some of those teams were mediocre, but there was no reason to wear the team out when we were staring down Miami, VaTech, WVU, etc. in conference. I mean, look at this...

1995: UNC, Minnesota
1996: UNC, Minnesota
1997: Wisconsin, NC State, Oklahoma
1998: Tennessee, Michigan, NC State
2001: GaTech, Tennessee, Auburn
2002: BYU, UNC, Auburn

I don't think Jake, or whomever did the scheduling for SU in the 90s, realized that we had joined a conference that decade.

by the time they got to vt in 97 they were really beat up

 

[OttoMets]

Agreed.

It's also fair to note that SU wildly overscheduled back in the day. ...

I don't think Jake, or whomever did the scheduling for SU in the 90s, realized that we had joined a conference that decade.

I don't entirely agree with the underlined, because I'm a total scheduling meathead who prefers watching us play good teams, but the bolded is both an LOL-funny line and also possibly entirely true. Jake was definitely old-school and not entirely an innovative thinker in some ways; he really might not have understood the difference in scheduling preferences that would have been optimal once the full Big East was up and running.

 

[two3zone]

they is cantor. She made the decision. There are posters here who were with her when she gave the direction to gross. Her words to gross during the game were something like get rid of him, he’s embarrassing us.

That's horrible

 

[Scooch]

by the time they got to vt in 97 they were really beat up

Yup. Depth always has been, and always will be, our greatest achilles heel.

 

[IthacaMatt]

I don’t disagree. PP also had loyalty to assistants who had had the game pass them by. He won 10 games with Troy Nunes and RJ Anderson! 10!!! Sorry but we can’t overstate the talent at the end either.

Yeah, just look at the box score of the Georgia Tech blowout in his final game. Just terrible players up and down the roser.

 

[lincolncuse]

Agreed.

It's also fair to note that SU wildly overscheduled back in the day. Playing 2, or even 3, power conference teams OOC, while also competing in a pretty strong Big East, was insanity. Granted, some of those teams were mediocre, but there was no reason to wear the team out when we were staring down Miami, VaTech, WVU, etc. in conference. I mean, look at this...

1995: UNC, Minnesota
1996: UNC, Minnesota
1997: Wisconsin, NC State, Oklahoma
1998: Tennessee, Michigan, NC State
2001: GaTech, Tennessee, Auburn
2002: BYU, UNC, Auburn

I don't think Jake, or whomever did the scheduling for SU in the 90s, realized that we had joined a conference that decade.

Would have been nice in 97 to have played a couple of layup home games after Wisconsin.

3-0 rolling into Blacksburg

 

[OttoMets]

Would have been nice in 97 to have played a couple of layup home games after Wisconsin.

3-0 rolling into Blacksburg

True, but North Carolina State was considered to barely have an ACC-level roster that year, and I think the line in our game reflected that. It kind of was a layup.

I assume Oklahoma had been recruiting some talent, and traveling to Norman on a ridiculously hot day in September was no layup in terms of going into VPI as fresh as possible, but it was still not really a game against a peer team. They were pretty bad.

 

[GoSU96]

Yup. Depth always has been, and always will be, our greatest achilles heel.

By that game, Dee Brown was the second TB, FB, and emergency QB. McNabb had seperations in both shoulders, I saw him at practice that week and he was wrapped like a mummy (didn't finish the game), and all three FB's were hurt, Konrad with a non game knee injury (supposedly incurred the morning of the NCSt game getting into it when McNabb rolled in late and on fumes), Sudano, and Lewis.

 

[lincolncuse]

True, but North Carolina State was considered to barely have an ACC-level roster that year, and I think the line in our game reflected that. It kind of was a layup.

I assume Oklahoma had been recruiting some talent, and traveling to Norman on a ridiculously hot day in September was no layup in terms of going into VPI as fresh as possible, but it was still not really a game against a peer team. They were pretty bad.

All fair points.

John Blake was at OU and was one of those great recruiter bad coach guys. He made it 3 years then Stoops comes in and wins a NC in year 2.

 

[Scooch]

By that game, Dee Brown was the second TB, FB, and emergency QB. McNabb had seperations in both shoulders, I saw him at practice that week and he was wrapped like a mummy (didn't finish the game), and all three FB's were hurt, Konrad with a non game knee injury (supposedly incurred the morning of the NCSt game getting into it when McNabb rolled in late and on fumes), Sudano, and Lewis.

We should have spent a scholarship on having someone dedicated to making sure McNabb was in bed by 11pm every night.

 

[sufandu]

In 2001 we would've beaten Georgia Tech. Week 2 at Tennessee would've been the big hurdle. Then of course Miami and the Zebras in week 11. Had we gotten through the season with only the 1 loss we may have gotten the bid. Nebraska played in the title game with 1 loss that year.

The final BCS standings were Miami 12-0, Nebraska 11-2 (played for the title at 11-1), Colorado #3 at 10-2, Oregon 10-1, Florida 9-2 and Tennessee 10-2. Syracuse finished ranked 14th that year.

Assuming Miami was the one loss, it would've hard for the pollsters to keep us ranked high enough to allow for a rematch with 11-1 Nebraska sitting there. Would've been a fun ride though.

 

[sufandu]

Agreed.

It's also fair to note that SU wildly overscheduled back in the day. Playing 2, or even 3, power conference teams OOC, while also competing in a pretty strong Big East, was insanity. Granted, some of those teams were mediocre, but there was no reason to wear the team out when we were staring down Miami, VaTech, WVU, etc. in conference. I mean, look at this...

1995: UNC, Minnesota
1996: UNC, Minnesota
1997: Wisconsin, NC State, Oklahoma
1998: Tennessee, Michigan, NC State
2001: GaTech, Tennessee, Auburn
2002: BYU, UNC, Auburn

I don't think Jake, or whomever did the scheduling for SU in the 90s, realized that we had joined a conference that decade.

I think a lot of established rannked schools scheduled like that, though. It was one of the things that made the early college football season more fun than it is now.

 

[All4SU]

I think a lot of established rannked schools scheduled like that, though. It was one of the things that made the early college football season more fun than it is now.

The thing is, that era of the old big East - mid to late 90s - the BE was better than the ACC then, and better than the ACC now. Miami, SU, VT, WVU, BC... what could have been.

 

[sufandu]

The thing is, that era of the old big East - mid to late 90s - the BE was better than the ACC then, and better than the ACC now. Miami, SU, VT, WVU, BC... what could have been.

I'm not comparing then to now. I'm comparing our scheduling then to other teams' scheduling then. Scheduling has changed for just about everyone when looking at different eras.

 

[tipphill]

Poor facilities had nothing to do with losing to Rutgers in 2003 and Temple in 2004. Those were historically awful losses, and ultimately are what cost P his job in '04. I mean, beat Rutgers in '03 and we eek into a minor bowl. Beat Temple in '04 and we make the BCS. There is zero chance P is fired if we make the Fiesta Bowl in '04. Less than zero.

Poor facilities played a role in the program's slippage, but you can't give a pass for those losses.

so 2-3 losses define his career ? seriously, you do see a bigger picture don't you?? or maybe not

 

[Scooch]

I think a lot of established rannked schools scheduled like that, though. It was one of the things that made the early college football season more fun than it is now.

Fair point. Just for kicks, and totally random, here are the OOC opponents of some of our Big East brethren in the mid 90s, with power conference opponents in bold..

BOSTON COLLEGE
1996: Hawaii, Michigan, Navy, Cincy, Notre Dame
1997: Cincy, GaTech, Notre Dame, Army
1998: GaTech, Louisville, Navy, Notre Dame

PITTSBURGH
1996: Kent St, Houston, Ohio St, Notre Dame
1997: Louisiana, Penn State, Houston, Notre Dame
1998: Villanova, Penn State, Akron, UNC

WEST VIRGINIA
1996: Western Michigan, ECU, Purdue, Maryland
1997: Marshall, ECU, Maryland, Notre Dame
1998: Ohio St, Maryland, Tulsa, Navy