DO article on Recruiting

[CuseBlock]

What a dumb comment/quote. You could say that about most schools. Has anyone ever been to Storrs (&;$:!ing Connecticut? Now that place is in the middle of nowhere.

The Syracuse campus itself is better than most college towns as a whole

 

[Mareiniss]

I didn't read the article but how did this "Jersey effect" impact Tyus Battle coming to Syracuse? He was after Roberson, was he not?

Battle was indeed after Roberson, as were Malachi Richardson (Trenton) and Bourama Sidibe (St. Benedict's Prep of Newark).

 

[Sherman20]

Battle was indeed after Roberson, as were Malachi Richardson (Trenton) and Bourama Sidibe (St. Benedict's Prep of Newark).

The Jersey pipeline being hurt by JB’s treatment of Roberson is absurd. Come on. You know how many coaches like JB treat their players similarly? I don’t like it, but it would have no effect.

 

[nyucuse]

AND recruiting is a two way street. Just because you offer somebody doesn't mean that they'll come to your school, even when they are prospects from the program's "back yard." We all know that modern recruiting is about players looking for the best path to PT.

I'm sure that Torrence didn't envision Carey [a highly rated recruit] flopping, Goodine not panning out, etc. What he was probably looking at was an extremely crowded backcourt depth chart -- which prompted him to opt for another program.

BTW, not suggesting that Symir is going to step right in and be a good performer -- who knows. He was behind a stud at Marquette, but his statistics [not the entire measure of a player's worth] aren't confidence inspiring. But I wouldn't dismiss him as a poor "get" based only on that -- he's an experienced player coming from a good conference -- let's see how he performs in practice before writing him off.

Agree with all of this. The frustration I have, and I think many have, is that right or wrong, it seems like JB and co have taken the easy way out - the local familiar kid who will potentially be happy in a backup role, rather than finding a true high quality starting caliber PG who would have true upper tier ACC skills, to take a potentially talented lineup to the next level. Essentially Kadary 2.0. But alas...

 

[kcsu]

Hop was SUs recruiting. Gmac Red and Griff are not in his league. JB is what he is which is a guy who isnt at the same energy or effort level as before. Recruiting will remain the same as long as Jim is the head coach which is ok but not like it used to be.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

Not a priority at all...It was at the wayyyy end of the cycle and both Symir and the staff knew it wasnt happening.

You also have to remember that Symir reclassified to 2019. Not sure if Syracuse offered him for 2019 or 2020 but either case we had too-many guards at the time.

 

[jgeorge322]

Hop was SUs recruiting. Gmac Red and Griff are not in his league. JB is what he is which is a guy who isnt at the same energy or effort level as before. Recruiting will remain the same as long as Jim is the head coach which is ok but not like it used to be.

well, you cant say will remain the same. It will always change—go up and down.

 

[OttoMets]

Lot of things to quibble over, but in general the conclusion seems reasonable.

I thought this was really perceptive, not something that gets mentioned too much, if at all:

"“For as much as the zone can hide a bad defender, you need a defensive-minded center to anchor the zone that is the solution for hiding other guys,” one source said."

The writer didn't follow this through to its logical conclusion: in a wing-oriented system whose wings are often the worst defenders on the team, Boeheim really needs a strong defensive center who can hide those weaknesses. But those centers are unicorns now; the good ones don't want to play for Syracuse for a number of reasons, and the less-than-good ones just aren't going to get it done. Not, at least, right away. And that's what matters these days with all the annual personnel turnover.

 

[OttoMets]

"Going to play in the middle of nowhere New York is not what it was 25 years ago."

I take offense to that statement

What has changed?

Were we in the middle of somewhere 25 years ago? Syracuse area is as good now as it has ever been!

Waco, however, is TOTALLY different. Everyone wants to go play in that bustling place.

 

[NKR1978]

I have no problem with that article, in fact I found it very fair and truthful. It stated the facts...our recruiting has not been what it once was and therefore our regular season success is nowhere near what it once was. Don’t get me wrong, I’m pumped for Benny and Lands...but just because we have one 5-star for 2021 and one 4/5 star for 2022 doesn’t mean we are back to being an upper echelon program like we were for many years before 2015. A couple sweet 16 runs are great, but it doesn’t change the fact that we have been a perineal bubble team for 7 straight years.

I agree - but as the article seems to say - recruiting is changing. The transfer market is bigger than ever. Not sure getting a kid first is as important, aside from a 1 and done talent that could put you over the edge, as getting the kid eventually.

And one thing that was evident in the NCAA is that we have a lot of shooters. We finally evolved on that front. The recruiting has to get better because it's obviously the key reason for the mediocrity we've been watching for 7 years; but it seems there are reasons for hope. Also, I recall around 2001 or 02 reading an article that said "Syracuse is still a name, but people don't turn their heads when Syracuse enters a gym" to scout. Things picked up pretty well after that. Or I'm just deluding myself after a fun little run, just like I did after 2016 and 2018.

 

[kidorange]

Anyone get the height on the kid that wrote the article?

 

[RF2044]

Hop was SUs recruiting. Gmac Red and Griff are not in his league. JB is what he is which is a guy who isnt at the same energy or effort level as before. Recruiting will remain the same as long as Jim is the head coach which is ok but not like it used to be.

Which is precisely why neither Red nor GMac should get more than cursory consideration as JB's eventual replacement.

 

[Willy75]

Agree with all of this. The frustration I have, and I think many have, is that right or wrong, it seems like JB and co have taken the easy way out - the local familiar kid who will potentially be happy in a backup role, rather than finding a true high quality starting caliber PG who would have true upper tier ACC skills, to take a potentially talented lineup to the next level. Essentially Kadary 2.0. But alas...

Look up Lazarus Sims and Brandon Triche.

 

[adab1217]

Last note on this from me: we decided to call them "scouts" in this story for simplicity

It's people who scout HS talent and/or run recruiting services. All interviewed or quoted for the story have recruiting-based relationships with SU's staff

 

[kidorange]

Last note on this from me: we decided to call them "scouts" in this story for simplicity

It's people who scout HS talent and/or run recruiting services. All interviewed or quoted for the story have recruiting-based relationships with SU's staff

How tall are you?

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

This was a very very well written article. I don't agree with all of the inferences made, and I think that the program has the potential to swing back and quickly (and MAY be starting that now), but from a fact and research perspective, I think this student journalist did an excellent job. [Edit- who i now see is in the thread...kudos then adab1217]

Re: timing...this was a well-researched article that was likely in the works for a while. I don't believe you punt on the article just because of a couple good weeks. Perhaps a bit more context could have been offered, but all told, I am fine with the timing

 

[hoopsupstate]

I think he chose the narrative ahead of time and found “scouts” to justify his writing. He might have just read this forum. Any of us could be his anonymous resources.

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

I think he chose the narrative ahead of time and found “scouts” to justify his writing. He might have just read this forum. Any of us could be his anonymous resources.

Agree to disagree. The research validated he narrative IMO. I suspect if he did the research and the metrics showed that SU's recruiting was better in recent years he would have bailed on a story to determine why the recruiting had declined.

 

[RealMcNeil]

I think he chose the narrative ahead of time and found “scouts” to justify his writing. He might have just read this forum. Any of us could be his anonymous resources.

Speaking of interpreting something to fit a narrative...

I thought it was a pretty objective / fact-based view, albeit with a slight "debbie downer" tilt for the fanbase.

 

[SUOrangeSU]

The way I view our "recruiting" and just seeing what our assistants are dealing/effort they do compared to other programs is where I have the problem.

I have no problem if we swing and miss on recruits...it happens to EVERYONE..Where I have the problem is and it's been like this for awhile is that JB isn't putting in the effort a Head Coach should be doing. Honestly, they should be doing the heavy lifting of recruiting and the assistants basically narrow down the list for them to go after. It's flipped. JB basically narrows the list down for these guys and the assistants have to all but close their kids, especially going up again HCs of other programs. It's not fair. I'm actually surprised we've relatively stayed nabbing top 100 and top 50 kids.

That's really my only beef with our "recruiting" these days. Also, can we get a non project BIG for the life of us? Try a JUCO highly rated big who is "ready"

 

[Mareiniss]

This was a very very well written article. I don't agree with all of the inferences made, and I think that the program has the potential to swing back and quickly (and MAY be starting that now), but from a fact and research perspective, I think this student journalist did an excellent job. [Edit- who i now see is in the thread...kudos then adab1217]

Re: timing...this was a well-researched article that was likely in the works for a while. I don't believe you punt on the article just because of a couple good weeks. Perhaps a bit more context could have been offered, but all told, I am fine with the timing

Kudos to adab1217 for having the guts to post here. The article was well-written, but many on this forum disagree with some of the opinions that you expressed - me included. Of course, opinions can be very subjective, and reasonable people can disagree. Maybe it's not the case, but I have the feeling that some of the DO writers and their media friends have a bias against JB that skews their opinions in an unduly negative direction.

 

[SUFaninNJ]

Geez the pitchforks are out. JB should go radio silent like another prominent SU septuagenarian

Yeah, so glad Marv Albert finally shut his pie hole.

 

[DBCooper]

We need to get back to the days when we were bringing in guys like Bennie Williams and Kamari Lands. Because recruiting has been down, and we don't bring guys like that in. And we probably won't get any other highly rated kids in 2022 either.

 

[OrangeDW]

Look up Lazarus Sims and Brandon Triche.

Triche was a day 1 starter as a freshman on one of the best teams we ever had.

Sims didn’t get on the court much until his 4th year, and then he fully blossomed as a 5th senior.

Those guys respective career paths were not alike, so I’m not sure what you’re going for here with that comparison?

 

[Willy75]

Triche was a day 1 starter as a freshman on one of the best teams we ever had.

Sims didn’t get on the court much until his 4th year, and then he fully blossomed as a 5th senior.

Those guys respective career paths were not alike, so I’m not sure what you’re going for here with that comparison?

Local kid can make good.