Does JW have the gravitas and backing

[007]

You missed the point. It's a revenue thing. Our last 3 football hires have been (1) disaster, (2) awful, and (3) one shining moment and the rest so far is crap.

Our fans held up pretty good, attendance-wise, until Year 3 of Gerg, then it dropped.
When Shafer was coach, the attendance was lower than for Gerg. With Dino, it's lower still.

Each time we went in the can in football, fewer fans came back when we hit successive "rock bottoms".

At some point, programs have to make money.

With 20 home games vs. 6 or 7 in football, at our school basketball drives the live event revenue. TV is all about football, but they make way more money off of hoops attendance because of 3 times the number of home games per season.

They really can't afford to screw up this next hire. Our basketball attendance can't afford to take the hit. I do see that it has been a pretty steady 21-22,000 every year since the 1996 Final Four team.

I would hate to see it fall off to only 15,000 a year or less. The Dome is awful with so few fans in it. That's why the next hoops hire is essential to get someone who is an exciting hire, somebody who almost guarantees a return to the non-Bubble, non-cringy press conference "conversation".

Yeah, I probably did "miss" your main point. Maybe this time it's because you moved the goalposts to revenue? I was responding specifically to this statement from your post.

Their game day improvements have been marginal, to be honest. You have to be willilng to spend money before it's too late to get your customers back.

 

[tptcuse]

Well, that and the snow.
And the salt. And the salt potatoes.
And Hoffman's. And Wegman's.
But that's pretty much the list.

Maybe the snow. The other things are what locals or transplants know.

 

[UelSU]

Alabama is a strange place. Its coyote ugly the weather is horrible. Why any black athlete would actually consider going to the University of Alabama is beyond me. Racism is in the chip there and will be for generations to come.
I know this is a strong post but if you spend any real non tourist time in the state you will understand.
Having posted this i dont think there is any chance that Oats is the next SU coach. As to Alabama i find the entire state scary strange.

You have no idea of what you are talking about.

 

[DilemaCuse]

If UCONN Football can get a former NFL and UCLA Head Coach in Jim Mora Jr., SU Bball can do better than 2 underqualified Assistants.

After Oates and Pitino, I got another list for board debate
Buzz Williams-A&M
Eric Musselman-Arkansas
Billy Donovan-After the Bulls and NBA spit him out
Steve Pikel-Rutgers
Ed Cooley-PC
Shaka Smart-Marquette (provided he can rehab career)
Mike Boynton-OK St

 

[OttoMets]

It was a slow process but I converted as well. It does seem when I watch CBB it’s in bunches. Anyone that loves basketball and doesn’t watch the nba is really missing out.

I don't know if it's parity or what, but I just can't get into it. For 20 years the NBA's been a little too "clean" for me.

 

[kcsu]

Yet their black football athletes are treated like gods.

Until they are no longer Athletes.

 

[kcsu]

You have no idea of what you are talking about.

Yes i do.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Yeah, I probably did "miss" your main point. Maybe this time it's because you moved the goalposts to revenue? I was responding specifically to this statement from your post.

You talked about how they are spending money on coaches and football improvements. I talked about the income side of things, and not losing more customers.

Yes, I went to a game this fall. I had Clemson seats 4 rows above the field at the 30 yard line. Hot take: the concessions still suck, the hallways are still too crowded, there still aren't enough bathrooms, and when you get really close down by the field, the aisles are too narrow for people to get up and down.

My point remains that you don't want to lose too many fans with really poor seasons, because you might not get them back with a flashy new lighting system and a sound system that still can't be heard.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Maybe the snow. The other things are what locals or transplants know.

I was kidding, but yes, the snow.

 

[JDubbin]

So to bring this entire thread all together… a buddy of mine was a college roommate of Oats at Maranatha, should I just have him ask Oats directly if he’d take the Syracuse job & end the speculation? I’ll get right on it!

 

[AZOrange]

If UCONN Football can get a former NFL and UCLA Head Coach in Jim Mora Jr., SU Bball can do better than 2 underqualified Assistants.

After Oates and Pitino, I got another list for board debate
Buzz Williams-A&M
Eric Musselman-Arkansas
Billy Donovan-After the Bulls and NBA spit him out
Steve Pikel-Rutgers
Ed Cooley-PC
Shaka Smart-Marquette (provided he can rehab career)
Mike Boynton-OK St

I think there is one maybe two serious candidates on the list

 

[RF2044]

If UCONN Football can get a former NFL and UCLA Head Coach in Jim Mora Jr., SU Bball can do better than 2 underqualified Assistants.

After Oates and Pitino, I got another list for board debate
Buzz Williams-A&M
Eric Musselman-Arkansas
Billy Donovan-After the Bulls and NBA spit him out
Steve Pikel-Rutgers
Ed Cooley-PC
Shaka Smart-Marquette (provided he can rehab career)
Mike Boynton-OK St

I have no idea whether the timing would work out for somebody like Donovan, but given his NYC roots and outstanding success at the collegiate level, that would be a home run.

Or, we could just hire GMac.

 

[bozophobe]

So to bring this entire thread all together… a buddy of mine was a college roommate of Oats at Maranatha, should I just have him ask Oats directly if he’d take the Syracuse job & end the speculation? I’ll get right on it!

Yes, please, if you will.

 

[AZOrange]

I have no idea whether the timing would work out for somebody like Donovan, but given his NYC roots and outstanding success at the collegiate level, that would be a home run.

Or, we could just hire GMac.

See I think this is the issue. Donovan is a pipe dream but the next best option is not GMac. There’s a whole host of inbetween.

I just think the likelihood of a headliner here is small

 

[Cusefan0307]

Donovan is never coming back to college. He’s been quoted as hating recruiting and dealing with alumni/boosters. And if that’s what he believes then we shouldn’t want him anyway.

 

[RF2044]

See I think this is the issue. Donovan is a pipe dream but the next best option is not GMac. There’s a whole host of inbetween.

I just think the likelihood of a headliner here is small

No issue whatsoever -- I was just reacting to Donovan's name being listed in the post I was responding to, not suggesting that he is viable, that he'd want to return to the college level, etc.

 

[Fly Rodder]

See I think this is the issue. Donovan is a pipe dream but the next best option is not GMac. There’s a whole host of inbetween.

I just think the likelihood of a headliner here is small

Yeah. and honestly, I'd rather find the next Donovan or Jay Wright or Chris Beard. Most colleges don't make home run hires with with coaches who have established or HOF reputations at P5 schools. Roy Williams leaving KU for UNC is the exception not the norm.

 

[Cuse#1]

of SU to force a staff break up for BB like FB? Otherwise, I foresee a prolonged, lingering fall of a once proud program into even further mediocrity.

I am definately afraid of that and extremely frustrated!
I DO NOT WANT A BOBBY BOWDEN FSU SCENARIO to happen here

I know this may offend some but freedom of speech i guess can be a &*&^& sometimes but ill say this.
WE HAVE MONEY, more than we ever had obviously and we find the right coach: young, charasmatic, energetic, etc i believe this bball program could reach heights boeheim did not! He could but the fact is boeheim is probaly the most stubborn person ive seen

 

[AZOrange]

Yeah. and honestly, I'd rather find the next Donovan or Jay Wright or Chris Beard. Most colleges don't make home run hires with with coaches who have established or HOF reputations at P5 schools. Roy Williams leaving KU for UNC is the exception not the norm.

Well most HOF level guys don’t change schools. But Roy did it. Slick Rick too.

 

[DilemaCuse]

I am definately afraid of that and extremely frustrated!
I DO NOT WANT A BOBBY BOWDEN FSU SCENARIO to happen here

I know this may offend some but freedom of speech i guess can be a &*&^& sometimes but ill say this.
WE HAVE MONEY, more than we ever had obviously and we find the right coach: young, charasmatic, energetic, etc i believe this bball program could reach heights boeheim did not! He could but the fact is boeheim is probaly the most stubborn person ive seen

WERE ALREADY in that scenario here, lol

Most just dont realize it or want to admit

FSU at least had a Jimbo Fischer CIW and Bobby wanted 1 more year and they said nope, Gator Bowl is your last game

SU has been stale for years, I really felt they should have broken up that staff after the 18-19 season. They were coming off a Sweet 16 but were disappointing due to Frank Howard inconsistencies and had an 8 seed and 1st rd exit to Baylor

 

[phil77]

I just think the likelihood of a headliner here is small

Why is that?
Do you think we will not pay?
Do you think nobody that is a headliner will want to come here?
Do you think JB will force the school to hire within?

I guess I don't understand why it wouldn't be a headliner? Why are we one of the best programs in the history of college basketball regulated to hiring someone less than a "headliner"?

 

[Shenexon]

I have little doubt we're seeing the final year or years of JB's tenure as HC. I've been a fan and am saddened that the end of his era isn't as graceful as I'd hoped. I believe that SU will do a good job of picking his replacement. It's a good gig and will attract good candidates. SU is a destination. It's painful to watch the end of an era but all good things come to an end. SU will survive and thrive. It will be a painful yet fascinating transition. The end of one journey is the beginning of another...

 

[5OutFred]

If UCONN Football can get a former NFL and UCLA Head Coach in Jim Mora Jr., SU Bball can do better than 2 underqualified Assistants.

After Oates and Pitino, I got another list for board debate
Buzz Williams-A&M
Eric Musselman-Arkansas
Billy Donovan-After the Bulls and NBA spit him out
Steve Pikel-Rutgers
Ed Cooley-PC
Shaka Smart-Marquette (provided he can rehab career)
Mike Boynton-OK St

As the saying goes, you're only as good as your next recruiting class. Next hire has to be someone with recruiting WANT and connections to make the jump or "return" for the program. Only two guys on this list that would consider taking the job as "up and comers" with significant recruiting ability are Boynton and Musselman.

Musselman being largely overlooked here, IMO. Don't think it would happen, but #2 class in the country to ARKANSAS for BASKETBALL is hard to ignore.

 

[DilemaCuse]

As the saying goes, you're only as good as your next recruiting class. Next hire has to be someone with recruiting WANT and connections to make the jump or "return" for the program. Only two guys on this list that would consider taking the job as "up and comers" with significant recruiting ability are Boynton and Musselman.

Musselman being largely overlooked here, IMO. Don't think it would happen, but #2 class in the country to ARKANSAS for BASKETBALL is hard to ignore.

I like Musselman due to his NBA background and winning at Nevada before Arkansas

 

[AZOrange]

Why is that?
Do you think we will not pay?
Do you think nobody that is a headliner will want to come here?
Do you think JB will force the school to hire within?

I guess I don't understand why it wouldn't be a headliner? Why are we one of the best programs in the history of college basketball regulated to hiring someone less than a "headliner"?

Answered in other posts but here you go…

1. I’m not convinced we are willing to enter 7 year, 35mm territory which I think is the starting point for guys like Beard. Not that he is our guy but that was his going rate.

2. Two issues here: first is a relative lack of headliners right now. Hence my harping on lists of candidates…are there any real headliners out there? Second, it’s almost career suicide to follow a legend. Is a true headliner willing to do that? I don’t know.

3. I know (not think) that JB is not going to force anything.

That was my point a few days ago. We are not the same team we were 10-15 years ago and the game completely changed in last 24 months. I’m not saying we can’t get one, I’m just saying with all the issues we are probably betting on a Dino type rather than a Lincoln Riley type.