Facilities

[SWC75]

I need the cliff notes for SWC post.

Basic timeline:


1962 Manley Field House is built with the intention that it would be an indoor practice facility for the football team, among other things.

1972-74 Current Skytop housing and Administrative Center.

1975 Coyne Field constructed.

1980 The Carrier Dome opens and Mike Woicik gets expanded weight room with new equipment.

1984 The Schine Student Center Opens

1990 Colvin Park Project: new football practice fields, an outdoor track, soccer and field hockey fields; Goldstein Student Center.

1991 Iocoalno Petty Building with new and expanded weight room, training rooms, sports medicine, auditorium, meeting rooms, cafeteria, coach’s offices, player’s lounge and tribute to captains and bowl teams.

1992 Inauguration of Life Skill program.

1993 Coyne Field upgrades to spectator area with press box and concessions.

1994 Stevenson Academic Support Center.

1995 Simmon’s Coaches’ Building.

1996 “Entire substructure” of Cyclone Field redone.

2000 Football locker rooms expanded and custom oak lockers put in.

2003 Video Boards put in Dome

2005 New Strength and Conditioning Wing opens. Dr. Gross fills the Dome with pictures of our athletic stars and other events that have taken place there.

2006 Practice fields redone with field turf.

2010 Manley is converted back to an 80 yard indoor practice facilities.

2001 Sports Medicine Unit is expanded, including an aquatic therapy unti.

2012 A “Hall of Champions” is put into the I-P Building honoring all of our NCAA champions, (one in football). A further locker room upgrade and Larger Video boards are put in the Dome.

 

[Orijinal]

We are a private, northeastern U with a strong academic tradition. Our first priority is not to field a top 20 FB team, but to provide a great faculty and rich academic resources, including top-notch student support services and financial aid.

Yes. Non-facility infrastructure first. But when academics are stressed, quality athletics tends to go to the wayside. Need to have a balance here, and maintain it. Syracuse should gain back some of that academic edge that was lost under Cantor, and use that to continue to attract students and student-athletes.

Is that possible? I don't know. The higher the academic standard, the higher the "holier-than-thou" snobbery of academia towards athletics.

 

[Orijinal]

Was surprised to see Cincinnatti so low. If I recall their on field results certainly didn't seem to be effected. Maybe facilities are just one of many factors that translate to success on the field?

Yes. What are the factors to football success? A while ago I started a thread on another site about this topic. Here's much of what I wrote:

How much success is really attributable to the coaches, and how much to other factors? I wanted to formulate a top 10 list that, IMO, rank the X-Factors in recruiting. And here it is:

10. Girls
9. Undergraduate Population
8. Name Brand
7. Facilities
6. Conference Affiliation
5. Fan Base
4. Coaches
3. Weather
2. Wins
1. Location in Recruiting Hotbed

Of course you can't have wins without good coaches, but coaches don't get a lot of wins without good recruits, especially in a major conference.

Television Exposure was probably an X-Factor a long time ago, but everyone gets that now.

Now let's see how Syracuse stacks up to each one of these variables. Next to each one, I'll rate how well Syracuse is doing, from 10 (being the worst) down to 1 (being the best) and I won't repeat numbers.

10. Girls (4)
9. Undergraduate Population (3)
8. Name Brand (2)
7. Facilities (6)
6. Conference Affiliation (1)
5. Fan Base (8)
4. Coaches (5)
3. Weather (9)
2. Wins (7)
1. Location in Recruiting Hotbed (10)

So Syracuse does rate well in the bottom 3 factors, but rates low in the top 3 factors. I think a .500 season this year could push Syracuse's wins to a 6, and the indoor practice facility could push facilities to a 5. That would change the game somewhat, but that's how I see it stand right now.

 

[SWC75]

Yes. What are the factors to football success? A while ago I started a thread on another site about this topic. Here's much of what I wrote:

How much success is really attributable to the coaches, and how much to other factors? I wanted to formulate a top 10 list that, IMO, rank the X-Factors in recruiting. And here it is:

10. Girls
9. Undergraduate Population
8. Name Brand
7. Facilities
6. Conference Affiliation
5. Fan Base
4. Coaches
3. Weather
2. Wins
1. Location in Recruiting Hotbed

Of course you can't have wins without good coaches, but coaches don't get a lot of wins without good recruits, especially in a major conference.

Television Exposure was probably an X-Factor a long time ago, but everyone gets that now.

Now let's see how Syracuse stacks up to each one of these variables. Next to each one, I'll rate how well Syracuse is doing, from 10 (being the worst) down to 1 (being the best) and I won't repeat numbers.

10. Girls (4)
9. Undergraduate Population (3)
8. Name Brand (2)
7. Facilities (6)
6. Conference Affiliation (1)
5. Fan Base (8)
4. Coaches (5)
3. Weather (9)
2. Wins (7)
1. Location in Recruiting Hotbed (10)

So Syracuse does rate well in the bottom 3 factors, but rates low in the top 3 factors. I think a .500 season this year could push Syracuse's wins to a 6, and the indoor practice facility could push facilities to a 5. That would change the game somewhat, but that's how I see it stand right now.

Girls are only #10?

 

[wfschrec]

You guys can sit and debate about the friggin turf all day ... this is what you are up against before you even look at facilities

http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/2013/08/29/apple-sec-football-georgia-lsu-technology/2482915/

All the heavies are doing it and these perks not only ring well with recruits but make the programs more efficient. We are way way way behind ... I would love to be middle of the pack ... but we aren't there.

 

[SWC75]

I'd like to thank everyone who replied to this post, especially the 25 people for formally "liked" it.

I fully understand the importance of facilities, although I think it's sometimes over-stated, (Connecticut with it's wonderful facilities is 0-7). I agree with the point of view that the University has basically played catch-up rather than leading the pack, (that's was what was really meant by the "band aid" approach), and that as a mid-size private school with no Phil Knight like sugar daddy, that's what we will continue to do. If we get good coaching and win games, that will be enough to obtain our reasonable goals. Posting pictures of Taj Mahals that other schools have foolishly built with money that should have been spent on something else is pointless: do we really want to be like them?

The primary motivation of my post was to get rid of some of the false and over-statements that keep floating around in these discussions:
- Greg Robinson inherited Fran Maloney's Weight Room.
- When Doug Marrone got here he saw the same facilities we had when he was a player.
- We didn't do anything for 8 years before Doug got here.
- The fact that we renovated or replaced something means it was a "mess" or "horrendous" before that.

If you have a valid point to make, you don't need to make up or exaggerate things to support it. I'd just like to see the discussions on this topic continue with facts rather than assertions as their basis.

 

[albanycuse]

Basic timeline:


1962 Manley Field House is built with the intention that it would be an indoor practice facility for the football team, among other things.

1972-74 Current Skytop housing and Administrative Center.

1975 Coyne Field constructed.

1980 The Carrier Dome opens and Mike Woicik gets expanded weight room with new equipment.

1984 The Schine Student Center Opens

1990 Colvin Park Project: new football practice fields, an outdoor track, soccer and field hockey fields; Goldstein Student Center.

1991 Iocoalno Petty Building with new and expanded weight room, training rooms, sports medicine, auditorium, meeting rooms, cafeteria, coach’s offices, player’s lounge and tribute to captains and bowl teams.

1992 Inauguration of Life Skill program.

1993 Coyne Field upgrades to spectator area with press box and concessions.

1994 Stevenson Academic Support Center.

1995 Simmon’s Coaches’ Building.

1996 “Entire substructure” of Cyclone Field redone.

2000 Football locker rooms expanded and custom oak lockers put in.

2003 Video Boards put in Dome

2005 New Strength and Conditioning Wing opens. Dr. Gross fills the Dome with pictures of our athletic stars and other events that have taken place there.

2006 Practice fields redone with field turf.

2010 Manley is converted back to an 80 yard indoor practice facilities.

2001 Sports Medicine Unit is expanded, including an aquatic therapy unti.

2012 A “Hall of Champions” is put into the I-P Building honoring all of our NCAA champions, (one in football). A further locker room upgrade and Larger Video boards are put in the Dome.

Perfect! Thats my type of patience to read right there : ). Thanks!!

 

[cmr27]

I'd like to thank everyone who replied to this post, especially the 25 people for formally "liked" it. I fully understand the importance of facilities, although I think it's sometimes over-stated, (Connecticut with it's wonderful facilities is 0-7)...

You really should be writing for the university itself or the local newspaper. I got better context and perspective from your original post than just about anything else I've read on the topic of facilities. The information and time you put into this effort differentiates the board from a lot of other internet dross.
Thanks from a lurker.

 

[OrangeTown]

They were persuaded to do so section by section and much of the stadium was roped off by the time I was a student there in the early 709’s.

I dare any of you to find another school whose unofficial board historian is over 1300 years old.

This is why Steve rocks.

This is why SU rocks.

But in all seriousness, the amount of information you bring to this board is outrageous. Thanks again for enlightening us.

 

[anomander]

I'd like to thank everyone who replied to this post, especially the 25 people for formally "liked" it.

I fully understand the importance of facilities, although I think it's sometimes over-stated, (Connecticut with it's wonderful facilities is 0-7). I agree with the point of view that the University has basically played catch-up rather than leading the pack, (that's was what was really meant by the "band aid" approach), and that as a mid-size private school with no Phil Knight like sugar daddy, that's what we will continue to do. If we get good coaching and win games, that will be enough to obtain our reasonable goals. Posting pictures of Taj Mahals that other schools have foolishly built with money that should have been spent on something else is pointless: do we really want to be like them?

The primary motivation of my post was to get rid of some of the false and over-statements that keep floating around in these discussions:
- Greg Robinson inherited Fran Maloney's Weight Room.
- When Doug Marrone got here he saw the same facilities we had when he was a player.
- We didn't do anything for 8 years before Doug got here.
- The fact that we renovated or replaced something means it was a "mess" or "horrendous" before that.

If you have a valid point to make, you don't need to make up or exaggerate things to support it. I'd just like to see the discussions on this topic continue with facts rather than assertions as their basis.

i still stand by my comment that we had some of the worst facilities of any bcs program in 2008

 

[wfschrec]

I'd like to thank everyone who replied to this post, especially the 25 people for formally "liked" it.

I fully understand the importance of facilities, although I think it's sometimes over-stated, (Connecticut with it's wonderful facilities is 0-7). I agree with the point of view that the University has basically played catch-up rather than leading the pack, (that's was what was really meant by the "band aid" approach), and that as a mid-size private school with no Phil Knight like sugar daddy, that's what we will continue to do. If we get good coaching and win games, that will be enough to obtain our reasonable goals. Posting pictures of Taj Mahals that other schools have foolishly built with money that should have been spent on something else is pointless: do we really want to be like them?

The primary motivation of my post was to get rid of some of the false and over-statements that keep floating around in these discussions:
- Greg Robinson inherited Fran Maloney's Weight Room.
- When Doug Marrone got here he saw the same facilities we had when he was a player.
- We didn't do anything for 8 years before Doug got here.
- The fact that we renovated or replaced something means it was a "mess" or "horrendous" before that.

If you have a valid point to make, you don't need to make up or exaggerate things to support it. I'd just like to see the discussions on this topic continue with facts rather than assertions as their basis.

While UConn was 0-7 they were much more recently in a BCS bowl then we were ... honestly being stuck in the AAC and the coaching situation have ruined that program. Had Edsall stayed it would be a different story IMHO ... While facilities may have improved I think we can all safely say that compared to our peers we were lacking in a few areas for quite a few years. In the end we didn't move like a lot of others did when the arms race started and we are now trying to play catch up. No matter what has been done over the past decade I think we can all agree that we have plenty of room to improve although I will say they are making an effort which is a start.

 

[SWC75]

I dare any of you to find another school whose unofficial board historian is over 1300 years old.

This is why Steve rocks.

This is why SU rocks.

But in all seriousness, the amount of information you bring to this board is outrageous. Thanks again for enlightening us.

I just turned 60. Some days it feels like 1300.

 

[SWC75]

i still stand by my comment that we had some of the worst facilities of any bcs program in 2008

It's a free country. You can stand wherever you want.

 

[GoSU96]

Stripping out the irrelevent notes such as Shine Student Center and Video Boards and cosmetics in the dome here is the timeline.

1. 1962 Manley Field House is built with the intention that it would be an indoor practice facility for the football team, among other things.

1972-74 Current Skytop housing and Administrative Center.

1975 Coyne Field constructed.

1980 The Carrier Dome opens and Mike Woicik gets expanded weight room with new equipment.

1990: new football practice fields,
2. 1991 Iocoalno Petty Building with new and expanded weight room, training rooms, sports medicine, auditorium, meeting rooms, cafeteria, coach’s offices, player’s lounge and tribute to captains and bowl teams.

1994 Stevenson Academic Support Center.

1995 Simmon’s Coaches’ Building.

2000 Football locker rooms expanded and custom oak lockers put in.

2005 New Strength and Conditioning Wing opens.

2006 Practice fields redone with field turf.

2010 Manley is converted back to an 80 yard indoor practice facilities.

2011 Sports Medicine Unit is expanded, including an aquatic therapy unit.

2012 A “Hall of Champions” is put into the I-P Building honoring all of our NCAA champions, (one in football). A further locker room upgrade .

-----------------------

What we have is a desperation refurb of a 50 yr old building as a stop gap in the Manley upgrade. Players living n 40 yd old apartments, upgrades of practice fields every 15 yrs, 20 yrs between upgrades in the sports medicine facilities, refurbs of the locker rooms twice in 20 years, updates to the strenght and conditioning facilities twice in the last 30 years, 20 years between updates to the meeting rooms, lounges, cafeteria.

Your time line supports what most people know, SU has done the minimal just to be functional.

 

[Millhouse]

Stripping out the irrelevent notes such as Shine Student Center and Video Boards and cosmetics in the dome here is the timeline.

1. 1962 Manley Field House is built with the intention that it would be an indoor practice facility for the football team, among other things.

1972-74 Current Skytop housing and Administrative Center.

1975 Coyne Field constructed.

1980 The Carrier Dome opens and Mike Woicik gets expanded weight room with new equipment.

1990: new football practice fields,
2. 1991 Iocoalno Petty Building with new and expanded weight room, training rooms, sports medicine, auditorium, meeting rooms, cafeteria, coach’s offices, player’s lounge and tribute to captains and bowl teams.

1994 Stevenson Academic Support Center.

1995 Simmon’s Coaches’ Building.

2000 Football locker rooms expanded and custom oak lockers put in.

2005 New Strength and Conditioning Wing opens.

2006 Practice fields redone with field turf.

2010 Manley is converted back to an 80 yard indoor practice facilities.

2011 Sports Medicine Unit is expanded, including an aquatic therapy unit.

2012 A “Hall of Champions” is put into the I-P Building honoring all of our NCAA champions, (one in football). A further locker room upgrade .

-----------------------

What we have is a desperation refurb of a 50 yr old building as a stop gap in the Manley upgrade. Players living n 40 yd old apartments, upgrades of practice fields every 15 yrs, 20 yrs between upgrades in the sports medicine facilities, refurbs of the locker rooms twice in 20 years, updates to the strenght and conditioning facilities twice in the last 30 years, 20 years between updates to the meeting rooms, lounges, cafeteria.

Your time line supports what most people know, SU has done the minimal just to be functional.

we only see pictures of the crazy lounges and weight rooms but you make a good point to bring up south campus housing, which was terrible when i was there gulp 20 years ago

the school spends all kinds of money on silly stuff but their upperclassmen campus housing looks like something out of The Wire. The couches were like something made in a terrible shop class project.

that might be low hanging fruit there.

 

[SWC75]

Stripping out the irrelevent notes such as Shine Student Center and Video Boards and cosmetics in the dome here is the timeline.

1. 1962 Manley Field House is built with the intention that it would be an indoor practice facility for the football team, among other things.

1972-74 Current Skytop housing and Administrative Center.

1975 Coyne Field constructed.

1980 The Carrier Dome opens and Mike Woicik gets expanded weight room with new equipment.

1990: new football practice fields,
2. 1991 Iocoalno Petty Building with new and expanded weight room, training rooms, sports medicine, auditorium, meeting rooms, cafeteria, coach’s offices, player’s lounge and tribute to captains and bowl teams.

1994 Stevenson Academic Support Center.

1995 Simmon’s Coaches’ Building.

2000 Football locker rooms expanded and custom oak lockers put in.

2005 New Strength and Conditioning Wing opens.

2006 Practice fields redone with field turf.

2010 Manley is converted back to an 80 yard indoor practice facilities.

2011 Sports Medicine Unit is expanded, including an aquatic therapy unit.

2012 A “Hall of Champions” is put into the I-P Building honoring all of our NCAA champions, (one in football). A further locker room upgrade .

-----------------------

What we have is a desperation refurb of a 50 yr old building as a stop gap in the Manley upgrade. Players living n 40 yd old apartments, upgrades of practice fields every 15 yrs, 20 yrs between upgrades in the sports medicine facilities, refurbs of the locker rooms twice in 20 years, updates to the strenght and conditioning facilities twice in the last 30 years, 20 years between updates to the meeting rooms, lounges, cafeteria.

Your time line supports what most people know, SU has done the minimal just to be functional.

Which is what I said above (in the "I'd like to thank everyone" post), and which is not likely to change.

So, how do you think we are going to do in the ACC? Will we be bottom feeders because of our facilities? What do we need to do now to prevent that? After the IPF, what's next on the ongoing menu?

 

[GoSU96]

So, how do you think we are going to do in the ACC? Will we be bottom feeders because of our facilities? What do we need to do now to prevent that? After the IPF, what's next on the ongoing menu?

What was done with the sports medicine area was bare minimum. That really needs to be attacked. We talked to Adkins about it during a golf outing and he said that kids noticed how behind SU was in relation to other places they visited and that the lack of capability and space hindered getting players healed up as fast as they could have otherwise.

The recent renovations helped, but more needs to be done in that area.

If you want to know what is on the shopping list, note what is NOT shown on the SU website. You don't see the locker rooms and training/rehab area like you do with the Melo center photos.

I think I read or heard that the Melo center would be top of the line in the NBA. What SU has now is definitely sub BCS. With the IPF it will be closer to equal footing.

 

[rrlbees]

What was done with the sports medicine area was bare minimum. That really needs to be attacked. We talked to Adkins about it during a golf outing and he said that kids noticed how behind SU was in relation to other places they visited and that the lack of capability and space hindered getting players healed up as fast as they could have otherwise.

The recent renovations helped, but more needs to be done in that area.

If you want to know what is on the shopping list, note what is NOT shown on the SU website. You don't see the locker rooms and training/rehab area like you do with the Melo center photos.

I think I read or heard that the Melo center would be top of the line in the NBA. What SU has now is definitely sub BCS. With the IPF it will be closer to equal footing.

The Melo Center is what it is because of JB and donors, both big and small. Not because of SU.


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[Bayside44]

What was done with the sports medicine area was bare minimum. That really needs to be attacked. We talked to Adkins about it during a golf outing and he said that kids noticed how behind SU was in relation to other places they visited and that the lack of capability and space hindered getting players healed up as fast as they could have otherwise.

The recent renovations helped, but more needs to be done in that area.

If you want to know what is on the shopping list, note what is NOT shown on the SU website. You don't see the locker rooms and training/rehab area like you do with the Melo center photos.

I think I read or heard that the Melo center would be top of the line in the NBA. What SU has now is definitely sub BCS. With the IPF it will be closer to equal footing.

It was a few years ago but I saw both on a tour. The Melo Center looked like what the Knicks would have and the football side looked and smelled like summer camp.

 

[SWC75]

What was done with the sports medicine area was bare minimum. That really needs to be attacked. We talked to Adkins about it during a golf outing and he said that kids noticed how behind SU was in relation to other places they visited and that the lack of capability and space hindered getting players healed up as fast as they could have otherwise.

The recent renovations helped, but more needs to be done in that area.

If you want to know what is on the shopping list, note what is NOT shown on the SU website. You don't see the locker rooms and training/rehab area like you do with the Melo center photos.

I think I read or heard that the Melo center would be top of the line in the NBA. What SU has now is definitely sub BCS. With the IPF it will be closer to equal footing.

The locker room and sports medicine facility are both pictured in the 2013 Media Guide, pages 10-11. The lockers look nice and the sports medicine tables are in one side of a large room.

 

[IthacaBarrel]

It was a few years ago but I saw both on a tour. The Melo Center looked like what the Knicks would have and the football side looked and smelled like summer camp.

Yes, but nobody wants to hear that!! Good recruiters can still recruit, it's all rob moores fault


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[anomander]

The locker room and sports medicine facility are both pictured in the 2013 Media Guide, pages 10-11. The lockers look nice and the sports medicine tables are in one side of a large room.

Sorry, but the Dome lockers if they are the same as they were 2 years ago are bottom of the barrel, and medical facility isn't much better.

While I accept that you can't build facilities without private donors, I do believe medical facilities should be footed by the University. What they have now is OK, but you can do a lot more, that could go a long way, for a lot less money then it would take to do other major renovations. With the nature of the sport, and the extent to which some players are injured, it's only fair they are taken care of at an elite level. This is a major money maker, it's not division 3

 

[rrlbees]

Sorry, but the Dome lockers if they are the same as they were 2 years ago are bottom of the barrel, and medical facility isn't much better.

While I accept that you can't build facilities without private donors, I do believe medical facilities should be footed by the University. What they have now is OK, but you can do a lot more, that could go a long way, for a lot less money then it would take to do other major renovations. With the nature of the sport, and the extent to which some players are injured, it's only fair they are taken care of at an elite level. This is a major money maker, it's not division 3

Are you talking before or after the recent $4m upgrade?


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[anomander]

Are you talking before or after the recent $4m upgrade?


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of the $5m renovations $4m of it was spent on the medical facilities? not a chance

 

[rrlbees]

of the $5m renovations $4m of it was spent on the medical facilities? not a chance

I didn't say just the med facility. You mentioned the locker room too. I meant in general the $4m upgrade. Which included training room/med facility, lockers, offices, lounge etc.


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