Freeman might not

[UpstateSM]

(our coaching staff won twenty games last year)

That is a nice amount of wins. Safe to assume that we got a decent seed in the dance, then?

 

[tbonezone]

Judah was told by NBA scouts he needed to improve his playmking and outside shooting.

this i'll buy. judah knew going into the season exactly what he needed to do better . didn't listen.

 

[Red2003]

He's been awful compared to the other hyped and highly ranked freshmen this draft class looked amazing and 10 deep of really good NBA players. Donnies been a bust compared to them.

He's probably good enough that he doesn't have to drop down a level to be guaranteed 30-35 mpg but if he goes to somewhere like Kentucky he could end up very upset about his role.

Red has been awful developing guys Judah was a sure thing first round pick when he came back that summer.

Pretty extreme, I think he's been solid rebounding and looking around the rest of the league I'm seeing alot more of a supporting cast for the other McD's freshman for why they're doing well.

Right about now when we hoped he'd be making some leaps in his game he's not playing and surrounded by a team of misfits.

 

[PeteCalvin]

I think one problem with NIL, and one of the big reasons old school coaches are leaving the game is the power the agents and players have. College basketball is nothing more than one year deals. How do you motivate a kid that is already raking in more than most people make in a lifetime? If he’s not going 100% each and every practice and game, what do you do? Bench him? Make him run sprints in practice? The kid can just shutdown and plan his exit strategy. It’s a slippery slope. It’s now the NBA without contracts, incentives, and guardrails. Having the right players with the right character to fit your playing style is so much more critical now, and keeping them engaged in the vision and direction is a must. Red’s problem appears to be that he hasn’t quite figured out HIS system, which leads to not knowing which players will thrive, and rolling the dice on who he brings in. It all starts at the top. Red is transitioning from good cop to bad cop and trying to navigate a very difficult environment to succeed in. I see no focus in any facet of our play.

As to NIL, the schools must be given the power to engage in contracts beyond one year and throw in incentive-based performance payments. You stop the tampering by locking a player in for two years, with specifically designed clauses that would allow the player leave after one year if say the coach leaves or is fired, they declare for the draft, etc.

Red is in a very difficult position, and he doesn’t have time to tinker anymore. We’re in the middle of a season and have no set A-team. That’s on the coaches. Yes, losing JJ and Donnie have presented problems and definitely cost us wins, but the issues are deeper. When you lose multiple games by 20 points over two seasons with two different teams, there is a culture problem. SU teams never gave up in the golden JB era. Never. That’s why we’re Cardiac Cuse, for crying out loud. Now we’re flatline Cuse. 20 point losses are inexcusable. Red needs to decide how he wants this team to play. He can’t play wide open and fast with minimal defense if we can’t score. Gotta go back to fundamentals. I’d rather see us play boring, lockdown defensive ball, like UVa did, and win than watch what we have now. Every single game it seems a new team takes the floor, and we play differently than the last game. No structure, no consistency, no continuity. At least with the 2-3 we had an identity. We have no identity, and that’s a problem.

 

[shu 49]

Freeman doesn't deserve a dime more money than he's already getting. He's an ok player right now. Davis has been a far more complete player.

I agree. Love his potential but what we are paying him hasnt made him work hard except on offense. Now this could be a Red thing or may not be. He is really lacking grit and determination on the defensive side. If this is his defensive ceiling then I am ok with him leaving.

 

[Fly Rodder]

If he’s not going 100% each and every practice and game, what do you do? Bench him? Make him run sprints in practice? The kid can just shutdown and plan his exit strategy.

NIL deals can’t be linked to performance or dependence on being a part of a specific team, but there should certainly be creative clauses about quitting.

 

[Scooch]

I agree, especially what you say about the B1G and the SEC. I think those school's fans are still heavily "invested" in their programs. I'd have a hard time believing in Alabama or Mississippi, Ohio and even in Michigan, depending on how the Lions seasons ends up, that they are never not going to be big college fans of State U. that regularly sell out 80, 90, 100,000 seat stadiums. Pro sports will always take 2nd fiddle.

Go live or work in those states. In Michigan, many people are alums of UM and MSU. In PA, especially western PA, they are likely to be PSU or Pitt alums. Ohio is a no brainer. I've never lived or worked down south, but you know it's a religion.

These people don't care about pro sports, unless their local team goes on a hot streak. NY is a fractured state. We have no big State U to root for. It's Syracuse or Bust and lately it's been bust. And even if Cuse was top ten in football and basketball, the average downstate Joe isn't coming up to Syracuse to watch a game, unless he's an alum and then it might be once a year at the very most.

Syracuse will always be at a huge disadvantage. Smaller, private school. Less alums. Less public funding. The President of the US and the Governor of NYS both went here and the school did nothing to capitalize on that.

I wouldn't go so far as to say folks in Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania don't care about pro sports! Lions, Browns, Steelers and Eagles fans are freakin' diehards. As are Red Wings, Penguins and Flyers fans.

But your broader point about SEC and B1G fans staying invested is true. Those 34 schools have essentially become a major league. I don't blame those fans, they won. The rest of us lost. At some point in the next decade they'll pry the most-attractive schools away from the ACC and B12 and that'll be that.

Cue Bruce Hornsby.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Freeman doesn't deserve a dime more money than he's already getting. He's an ok player right now. Davis has been a far more complete player.

Not a single one of those statements is true. You sound like a child naive to the realities of the world you live in.

 

[shu 49]

Lets throw money out and lets just pretend that Syracuse can pay Freeman the same as any other school in the nation false but whatever.

If you were Freeman and were hoping to win big, play in March, and develop your game to get drafted in the first round. Why would you come back to Syracuse? Serious question. Why? You can't have any confidence that those things will happen.

I say this all the time, if he wants to get drafted or come back and make a ton of money next year on a contender then why is he so lacking and almost lazy on Defense. These young guys now a days kills me with the i will do it if u pay me and we are paying him and he still aint doing it so when does he actually try really hard.

 

[Scooch]

How do you motivate a kid that is already raking in more than most people make in a lifetime?

I get your point but let's reign this in a bit! Most of these guys aren't making millions upon millions. $150K or $300K certainly isn't more than most people make in a lifetime. It's not even life-altering money in a long-term way. It's a nice payday.

 

[Red2003]

He will run away, like anyone else who will offer the most money. That’s the only thing that counts. Playing time, coaches, style of play or conference affiliation, means nothing. It’s only $$$$$! If you think differently, you’re kidding yourself.

This is where it gets really interesting next year though. The $'s as you say. What happens when Kiyan comes in and is worth 30 mil and his parents are worth a quarter of a billion. Kiyan with a few social media posts and endorsements is going to make more than some of our coaches and guys like Petar do in a year.

I don't think any of us really know. Wild West out there.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

This is where it gets really interesting next year though. The $'s as you say. What happens when Kiyan comes in and is worth 30 mil and his parents are worth a quarter of a billion. Kiyan with a few social media posts and endorsements is going to make more than some of our coaches and guys like Petar do in a year.

I don't think any of us really know. Wild West out there.

I think having Kiyan will make everyone else on the roster more valuable.

 

[orangecuse]

College sports is complete chaos with a ludicrously stacked deck against anyone who isn’t in the SEC and B1G.

Pro sports is far more sane and competitively balanced. Like FAR more.

I agree that it’s not worth getting too wrapped up in college sports anymore. People who want to be invested and care should do that with pro sports.

What a world, right?

Completely agree relative to the NFL, which has a true salary cap, et al. It's why smaller, mid-market teams win, and can consistently do so, i.e. the Pittsburgh's of the world, currently KC, Buffalo, etc.

The NBA has a cap, however, it's not a hard cap, as billionaire owner's can pay a luxury tax if they so desire. And, it's why you still predominantly have the large market teams being there in the end. Currently, OKC and Cleveland are top dog (record wise), but both are mid-market, so their successes won't be sustainable due to the aforementioned.

MLB...no cap whatsoever...so forgetabouit! Major market teams typically dominate. Moreover, especially with big time players in the free agency sweepstakes.

At least in pro sports, there isn't this vast farce & fascade relative to pay for play. Players sign contracts, etc. and are paid to its terms accordingly. Their NIL (which is actually NIL in the true sense of the word) is paid by those entities that sponser them to promote its products, etc.

Everyone knows that it's 100% pay for play relative to these college (minor league) players nowadays. However, folks continue to voluntarily anti up, therefore contributing and enabling the existent crooked farce system, that is unsustainable nonsense. Consequently, IMO, it's all of these fans that share the brunt of the blame, and not the one's who don't, playing a more significant role in the chit show that exists today.

 

[Cusefan0307]

Can’t win no NIL.

Cant compete with SEC and Big 10.

Forget Big East schools have been successful they are lucky.

Can barely Beat Youngstown state no NIL.

Cant beat Wake, the Hoyas and ND without the second coming of the Pearl, JJ Starling.

Red won 20 games last year he’s doing great.

Long live ISO ball and screw good shooting.

Blah Blah Blah.

 

[Scooch]

Completely agree relative to the NFL, which has a true salary cap, et al. It's why smaller, mid-market teams win, and can consistently do so, i.e. the Pittsburgh's of the world, currently KC, Buffalo, etc.

The NBA has a cap, however, it's not a hard cap, as billionaire owner's can pay a luxury tax if they so desire. And, it's why you still predominantly have the large market teams being there in the end. Currently, OKC and Cleveland are top dog (record wise), but both are mid-market, so their successes won't be sustainable due to the aforementioned.

MLB...no cap whatsoever...so forgetabouit! Major market teams typically dominate. Moreover, especially with big time players in the free agency sweepstakes.

At least in pro sports, there isn't this vast farce & fascade relative to pay for play. Players sign contracts, etc. and are paid to its terms accordingly. Their NIL (which is actually NIL in the true sense of the word) is paid by those entities that sponser them to promote its products, etc.

Everyone knows that it's 100% pay for play relative to these college (minor league) players nowadays. However, folks continue to voluntarily anti up, therefore contributing and enabling the existent crooked farce system, that is unsustainable nonsense. Consequently, IMO, it's all of these fans that share the brunt of the blame, and not the one's who don't, playing a more significant role in the chit show that exists today.

The NBA has moved to it's new apron system and that will greatly help the mid and small market franchises. Teams like my Celtics can run over the cap for a couple seasons but then the apron penalties will crush them. That'll help the OKCs of the league.

For all the grief MLB gets about the advantage large market teams have, it's really only been the Dodgers that's converted that advantage into pennants and titles in the past decade. It sure hasn't helped the Mets, Cubs, Angels, etc. Baseball is still built so that lower spending teams can compete at the highest levels if they're smart. The money mostly lets big market teams buy their way out of mistakes. And let's not forget that MLB does have substantial taxes and penalties for consistent high spending that most teams, save for the Mets and Dodgers, greatly prefer to avoid.

 

[Trueblue25]

Chicken or the egg?

No.

I work for a living and have priorities above a bad syracuse basketball program for a school that has how big of an endowment? The only act in town can turn to no act in town before I accept blame for professionals paid millions a year to do a bad job.

Harsh but its the truth. I believe in Fran’s plan and message, and have happily contributed to football since the month he was hired.

 

[phreddie]

I wouldn't go so far as to say folks in Michigan, Ohio and Pennsylvania don't care about pro sports! Lions, Browns, Steelers and Eagles fans are freakin' diehards. As are Red Wings, Penguins and Flyers fans.

But your broader point about SEC and B1G fans staying invested is true. Those 34 schools have essentially become a major league. I don't blame those fans, they won. The rest of us lost. At some point in the next decade they'll pry the most-attractive schools away from the ACC and B12 and that'll be that.

Cue Bruce Hornsby.

Just watched ESPN's College Gameday (for basketball). Not a single mention of any ACC team.

 

[Scooch]

Just watched ESPN's College Gameday (for basketball). Not a single mention of any ACC team.

Well, the conference is now basically Duke and the 17 dwarfs.

 

[SWC75]

Which is why the best player from last year’s team who stayed in college is on Duke’s bench now. Autry built his team around a transfer combo guard and a very 1-dimensional SF. And they’ve been predictably underwhelming on one of the worst SU teams in 50 years.

Plus two talented freshmen, one of whom has been productive but is injured and another who's in a month long funk.

 

[CuseCPT]

I agree, especially what you say about the B1G and the SEC. I think those school's fans are still heavily "invested" in their programs. I'd have a hard time believing in Alabama or Mississippi, Ohio and even in Michigan, depending on how the Lions seasons ends up, that they are never not going to be big college fans of State U. that regularly sell out 80, 90, 100,000 seat stadiums. Pro sports will always take 2nd fiddle.

Go live or work in those states. In Michigan, many people are alums of UM and MSU. In PA, especially western PA, they are likely to be PSU or Pitt alums. Ohio is a no brainer. I've never lived or worked down south, but you know it's a religion.

These people don't care about pro sports, unless their local team goes on a hot streak. NY is a fractured state. We have no big State U to root for. It's Syracuse or Bust and lately it's been bust. And even if Cuse was top ten in football and basketball, the average downstate Joe isn't coming up to Syracuse to watch a game, unless he's an alum and then it might be once a year at the very most.

Syracuse will always be at a huge disadvantage. Smaller, private school. Less alums. Less public funding. The President of the US and the Governor of NYS both went here and the school did nothing to capitalize on that.

I lived in Savannah, GA for a few years. There were TWO stores at the mall that sold absolutely nothing but SEC gear and the closest SEC campus was 2 hours away.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I lived in Savannah, GA for a few years. There were TWO stores at the mall that sold absolutely nothing but SEC gear and the closest SEC campus was 2 hours away.

Fun town otherwise.

 

[Ghost]

I get your point but let's reign this in a bit! Most of these guys aren't making millions upon millions. $150K or $300K certainly isn't more than most people make in a lifetime. It's not even life-altering money in a long-term way. It's a nice payday.

Okay, money bags. SMH. Maybe if you're living on Park Avenue eating out every night at Applebee's and ordering the full entree instead of the the 2 for $20 Really Big Meal Deal it ain't!

 

[OrangeCrush22]

This is completely backwards.

The portal is an extremely risky proposition. You need the talent you want to be there and it has to want you back, and this all happens on a very, very compressed timeline that lends itself well to NIL valuations inflating.

The issue is that Cuse is a feeder program now. Any talented freshman is leaving the next season after we gave them the best deal out of high school. Why waste time and money on them when those resources can be moved to someone proven at this level that can help you win now. Even upperclassmen with success like Maliq leave. Gotta break the cycle somehow.

Syracuse doesn’t have the luxury of building for the future anymore.

 

[IthacaMatt]

donnie freeman was a colossal land for Red . but he has missed a few games now with his foot injury and frankly his SU basketball "foot"age to date has been somewhat sub par . and most likely he ain't gonna see no NCAA tourney games this year (ACC EVEN ?) for added national exposure. thus IMO he's not getting drafted . so i would expect he''ll be playing college for pay next year or D league. and with good players now getting paid plenty at the collegiate level now , to me D league seems like a surrender and a pay cut . if he truly wants to play on the national stage and improve his draft stock next year my logic says move on and take the $$$bag$$$ elsewhere at a top 10 program . btw he's probably my favorite player in the program . he's the one should be wearing #44. sadly it just ain't playing out well for him here. and he quite literally can't afford to wait for things to improve . could be wrong. again.

Who says if he goes to a Top 10 program that he's actually going to play?
He's weak and soft and in love with shooting 3 pointers.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

The issue is that Cuse is a feeder program now. Any talented freshman is leaving the next season after we gave them the best deal out of high school.

Oh.

How many times has that happened?