FSU vs The ACC

[kcsu]

I'm sure FSU back Channeled this and has a Florida judge in their pockets. Unfortunately for them the GOR specifically covers via DE law what they are attempting to use. The lawyers saw this potential loophole and the GOR was written to specifically make sure that the individual states for each school wouldn't come into play.

 

[orlandoorange]

Looks like a sound decision to me. Poor FSU, they are upset they can't re-write history.

That's the problem, they will be poor compared to other leagues, which means SU will be poor as well, not UCONN poor, but poor.

All ACC teams are in the same boat, FSU is screaming the loudest right now. They have a sister school 2 hours away that cashes SEC checks. I have a feeling UNC, UVA, and Miami will be yelling just as loudly before long.

 

[WoadBlue]

Syracuse would’ve been in the ACC several years earlier if it hadn’t been for the governor of Virginia. The Virginia state government put pressure on UVA to vote against any expansion that didn’t include VaTech. So SU was left at the altar in round one. Never underestimate the ability of corrupt state governments to cause problems wherever they can.

That was not anything like corruption. That was a Governor realizing that the best interests of his state and its state university system meant getting VT into the ACC. And that move was backed by a very large number of ACC ADs and football coaches and boosters: the ones who finally had realized that in terms of Big Time CFB, the northeast was a dead region.

 

[Cusefan69]

LT, there are a number of schools that want out of the ACC as some schools want to play in the SEC. The only thing potentially holding them back is the GORs, nothing else. They don't see a path to strengthen the conference. And, the additions of Cal, Stanford, and SMU if anything weakened the conference which now stretches from Miami to San Francisco to Boston.

You frame your comment above as if the SEC has interest in adding that "number " of schools. I would wager that they don't.

 

[DuxburyO]

The SEC desperately does not want the BT locating in the South with any major football ewer or with any school like UNC or UVA. The BT knows that it cannot ever really hope to equal SEC football faulty unless it has at least a few sound football program in the South. So, yes, both leagues would bid to get FSU, to prevent the other from doing so.

Any school that is not FSU, Clemson, UNC, UVA, maybe Miami that has resisted the league taking a hunk of the TV money and distributing it based on TV numbers has been stupid. That might have satisfied FSU for years.

Appeasement ? No thanks.

 

[WoadBlue]

I disagree. He was the reason they got there. They could have told him to get a new OC or DC and after that see what they could do. When David Cutcliffe was at Ole Miss he was the SEC Coach of the Year but when they had maybe a 6-5 or 5-7 year they told him to do the same. He stood by his coaches and they fired him! Ole Miss is not FB royalty. Any person in their right mind knows there are fluctuations in FB as in life but try explaining that to a group of idiot fans with whom one cannot reason!

Bowden's offenses his final years ranged form erratic to down right poor. The OC was his son Jeff. Bobby refused to make any changes, until they hired Fisher as HC in Waiting and thus actual OC. Jeff then stepped aside. But real improvements back to a team capable of winning the ACC could not come until Bowden was retired.

Cutcliffe was dead wrong to demand that his staff was above being improved. He hadn't earned any stance that would make it so they could tell an AD that the AD was not going to make changes. He rightly got fired.

 

[JimBoston]

What you are saying is also true of the B10 and to some extent the B12. The addition of SMU does NOT weaken the conference. You have not been keeping up with current events. I understand their NIL pays $36 thousand for FB, BB, and women's BB players and they just won the AAC. Also, Cal flattened UCLA and lost to U$C by just one point.

The Big 10 has Michigan, Ohio St., Penn St., USC, Oregon, Nebraska, Washington, Wisconsin,... The ACC doesn't come close to having that many brands and I left out schools like Michigan St. and Iowa. SMU is a small private school with a limited fan base. Look at their TV viewers during their last 5 regular season games: 76k, 276k, 618k (Friday night with no competition), 29k, 33k. And you don't think SMU dilutes the ACC brand?

 

[WoadBlue]

Let us not forget that UNC held shame classes and got away with it. Who knows how this will unfold

UNC had African and African American Studies Department offer Independent Study classes. AS anybody aware of all matters related to such anywhere, they were going to be sham, because they were all about racial identity politics, hence they were about cheerleading. The dept. executive secretary designed them specifically to help women students (she had been a UNC student and struggled mightily) and non-white male students to help their GPAs a bit. She acknowledged that when the university finally decided it must endure all the racist charges and clean up the mess.

It was never about sports. Debi Crowder actually disliked most sports and especially disliked football. She did admire Dean Smith and so she actively wooed the women's basketball players to the classes. Per capita they were the group that had the highest usage. To Matt Doherty's humor (and he was the only person officially questioned who was brave enough to acknowledge knowing this for the record) the second highest per capita usage was by black fraternities.

The department chair had all the Independent Study students each semester registered to him. It is possible that other professors knew little of what was happening. However, there had been a Daily Tar Heel article about very high grade inflation in the AFAM department that appeared about 2 years before the whole mess was exposed. AFAM grades were far and way the highest of any depatrment at UNC for more than a decade straight - again, obvious racial political stuff, which made it tough for most academics to want to even suggest it perhaps could happen.

 

[WoadBlue]

The Big 10 has Michigan, Ohio St., Penn St., USC, Oregon, Nebraska, Washington, Wisconsin,... The ACC doesn't come close to having that many brands and I left out schools like Michigan St. and Iowa. SMU is a small private school with a limited fan base. Look at their TV viewers during their last 5 regular season games: 76k, 276k, 618k (Friday night with no competition), 29k, 33k. And you don't think SMU dilutes the ACC brand?

It does, but it has things that also matter: 1) a bunch of alums willing to donate multiple millions of dollars to have big time football; 2) the DFW TV market annually produces more talent than all northeastern states combined.

 

[atlanticuse]

Burn it all down

 

[WoadBlue]

Appeasement ? No thanks.

Realism. No thanks, is actually what you are asserting. TV pays for TV viewers drawn. FSU always, even at 6-6, is going to outdraw BC.

The ACC minus FSU will be worth less, plain and simple. Minus FSU and Clemson, the ACC is going to be much less valuable than the current Big 12.

Sop which is perfeerabl to BC and Wake and Syracuse: making a hunk of the TV money be distributed on TV numbers, or all three watching the ACC get gutted and become a non-Major conference?

UNC is not going to get left behind. But all 3 of you will be, for certain.

 

[DuxburyO]

UNC had African and African American Studies Department offer Independent Study classes. AS anybody aware of all matters related to such anywhere, they were going to be sham, because they were all about racial identity politics, hence they were about cheerleading. The dept. executive secretary designed them specifically to help women students (she had been a UNC student and struggled mightily) and non-white male students to help their GPAs a bit. She acknowledged that when the university finally decided it must endure all the racist charges and clean up the mess.

It was never about sports. Debi Crowder actually disliked most sports and especially disliked football. She did admire Dean Smith and so she actively wooed the women's basketball players to the classes. Per capita they were the group that had the highest usage. To Matt Doherty's humor (and he was the only person officially questioned who was brave enough to acknowledge knowing this for the record) the second highest per capita usage was by black fraternities.

The department chair had all the Independent Study students each semester registered to him. It is possible that other professors knew little of what was happening. However, there had been a Daily Tar Heel article about very high grade inflation in the AFAM department that appeared about 2 years before the whole mess was exposed. AFAM grades were far and way the highest of any depatrment at UNC for more than a decade straight - again, obvious racial political stuff, which made it tough for most academics to want to even suggest it perhaps could happen.

Bulldinky.

 

[Consigliere]

Their argument amounts to “oops we don’t like the deal we were part of and signed.” Seems like a terrible precedent for contract law that would make all the other GORs useless. I don’t see them getting anywhere a reduced penalty that makes this pencil out.

Furthermore they need a home. The Big Ten doesn’t want them.

Seems strange that a non-profit, educational institution would cite restraint of trade as part of their argument.

And how does a Florida Court hold jurisdiction over a contract filed in North Carolina with signatories from 13 different states?

 

[orange79]

Anyone here who thinks FSU hasn't had back-channel discussions and/or assurances from the B1G/SEC that they will be invited IF they can find a reasonable ($$$) exit from the ACC, is living in a fantasy world.

 

[Hoo's That]

I hope that FSU pays the exit fee, and then are voted down by the B10 and SEC. I know that this isn't realistic, but a guy can dream.

When the B10 and SEC were both recently expanding, why did they not invite FSU then? If the move was viable, why did they not do it a few years back?

It's not just the exit fee, they forfeit all their TV money until 2036 to the ACC as well.

 

[Hoo's That]

I have to think that they've had conversations with the B10/SEC at this point and gotten interest? However, if you're one of these conferences and you see FSU suing their current conference, doesn't this make them even less attractive to join?

Yes, it does. If FSU wins, then everyone's GoR is in jeopardy. That wouldn't affect the Michigans and Bamas like it would affect the Indianas, Iowas, Vandys, and Mississippi States of the conferences when the Michigans and Bamas leave for some sort of superconference. SEC and B1G TV money looks great until a greener pasture comes along.

 

[Hoo's That]

Florida St board of trustees. One member notes that she was appointed as a trustee by the governor, DeSantis. Do governors in public universities appoint trustees? Just never knew that.

Trustees | Board of Trustees

Florida State University Board of Trustees is the public body corporate of the university that sets policy for the institution and serves as the institution's legal owner and governing board.

trustees.fsu.edu

Yes, they do. Most all of them have a term of X years (and usually can be reappointed once). After their term is over, they rotate off the board and someone else is appointed to take their place. Terms are staggered so that there isn't a tidal wave of old people leaving and new people coming in at the same time.

 

[Sherman20]

LT, there are a number of schools that want out of the ACC as some schools want to play in the SEC. The only thing potentially holding them back is the GORs, nothing else. They don't see a path to strengthen the conference. And, the additions of Cal, Stanford, and SMU if anything weakened the conference which now stretches from Miami to San Francisco to Boston.

This is all wrong. But enjoy your blissful ignorance. The other schools don’t want to go be also-rans in the SEC or Big 10–unless they have no choice. UNC, UVA and others are founding members of the ACC. Just like Washington, Oregon and Arizona State etc were trying to save the PAC 12 up until the last minute, even though their conference GOR had expired. They only left for the Big 10 when the crappy Apple deal (no broadcast network) came back and it wasn’t at all what they expected, and they felt that their hand was forced. The longterm ACC GOR—and the money associated to get out of it—is a whole other ball of wax. The schools gave up their home TV rights to the conference til 2036. It’s not going to be easy to get out of by any stretch. Probably impossible. And the SEC and Big 10 aren’t going to want to touch them until all litigation is resolved which could be years away. The other desirable schools like UNC, Virginia and Miami want to make this work and are likely angry at FSU for making this move and potentially destabilizing the conference. They have no reason to make a move right now. They’ll always have a safe landing spot. FSU has been the petulant child agitating against the ACC for years now. Honestly the ACC should sue FSU for damages and destabilizing the conference behind the scenes.

 

[Hoo's That]

At a certain point I'd think that the SEC/B10 are done adding teams and the B12/ACC or 3rd conference is "safe". Heck, maybe at some point they'd want to boot smaller market schools such as Maryland etc... ?

If FSU wins and GoRs are killed, the B1G and SEC won't throw out their Marylands and Vandys, the Michigans and Bamas will leave and form their own conference.

 

[Finwad32]

Realism. No thanks, is actually what you are asserting. TV pays for TV viewers drawn. FSU always, even at 6-6, is going to outdraw BC.

The ACC minus FSU will be worth less, plain and simple. Minus FSU and Clemson, the ACC is going to be much less valuable than the current Big 12.

Sop which is perfeerabl to BC and Wake and Syracuse: making a hunk of the TV money be distributed on TV numbers, or all three watching the ACC get gutted and become a non-Major conference?

UNC is not going to get left behind. But all 3 of you will be, for certain.

For certain? You know what college sports look like in 5 years? 10?

Oh, why thank you sir for letting us peasants suckle from your teet, may we have some more?

G.t..o. Merry Christmas.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

It's not just the exit fee, they forfeit all their TV money until 2036 to the ACC as well.

Is that stated anywhere? That they forfeit money?

They forfeit their TV rights to the ACC. So should FSU leave, the ACC owns their TV rights.

However, is there language anywhere that they forfeit compensation too? If the ACC is making money off of FSU's TV rights, isn't FSU due compensation even if they left the ACC? I would think FSU has a pretty good legal argument that the ACC owes FSU $30M+/year for the TV rights.

 

[HRE Otto IV]

Yes, it does. If FSU wins, then everyone's GoR is in jeopardy. That wouldn't affect the Michigans and Bamas like it would affect the Indianas, Iowas, Vandys, and Mississippi States of the conferences when the Michigans and Bamas leave for some sort of superconference. SEC and B1G TV money looks great until a greener pasture comes along.

Do the B1G or SEC even have a GoR? I thought they didn't.

 

[orange79]

Is that stated anywhere? That they forfeit money?

They forfeit their TV rights to the ACC. So should FSU leave, the ACC owns their TV rights.

What exactly do you think Grant Of Rights means? You need to do some reading.

Cliff Notes version: GOR means you give up your rights to compensation if you decide to leave. Each team granted their rights to the conference in exchange for being compensated by the league for their product/content. That is in addition to paying the exit fee.

 

[Sherman20]

.

FSU is citing it's "fundamental right to realign with another conference."

Right up there with the rights to freedom of speech, religion and the press. Wonder what Madison and Jefferson would think of that line.

This whole letter is such petulant nonsense. I really wish the national media would call out the utter banality of their argument and the self-obsessed mewling. Good grief. But instead, so many media members are obsessed with the realignment carousel and get all giddy at the prospect of it starting up again. How about having some perspective and calling out FSU’s pathetic actions against the other conference members? College sports are alienating their fan bases more and more and degrading the product and the competition.

 

[Hoo's That]

Gov. Ann Richards did the same for Baylor getting into the Big 12, though she sacrifices the in-state public university (U of Houston) when doing so. Corruption is corruption.

I've heard it was TCU that got pushed aside for Baylor. In addition to Richards, a super bigwig in the legislature was a Baylor grad and they combined forces to require the Big XII to take Baylor to get UT and ATM.