Future of SU Football | Page 6 | Syracusefan.com

Future of SU Football

Scooch said:
Agree completely. I don't know what's going to happen if we don't scratch-and-claw our way to a bowl. But one thing I won't entertain is some vague notion that "we're improving" because we got 4 or 5 wins and "we looked competitive" in a few losses. Missing a bowl this season is a failure, period, IMHO.
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Completely disagree.

This team is young. Very young. Possibly the youngest team in the conference. Possibly younger than any team on our schedule.

it’s astonishing how many posters want to tally the total wins during Baber’s tenure and use thy number against him. Did we forget all of the issueduring the ugly 1-10 2020 season that were beyond the control of the coaching staff?

- Top two running backs opt out. Sure Tucker was a pleasant surprise, but would we have been able to run the ball more efficiently with the projected too running backs on the field?

- Injuries. Holy Moses… the o-line, the QB, the defensive secondary. Baber’s fault?

- No spring ball and two new coordinators. Oh my.aber’s tries to make some improvements and gets snake biten. Did any other team we played in 2020 have a similar situation?

And now, multiple preseason prognosticators have SU winning 3 or fewer games this year. But somehow people think they know more and would deem 2021 a failure if SU doesn’t exceed the predictions of the experts and win at least 6 games.

I sure hope we can pull out six wins and qualify for a bowl game. But, it’s too early to say 2021 will be a failed season of SU isn’t in a bowl game at the end of the season.

Too many variables to consider to say this team isn’t improving, even if we exceed every preseason prediction and “only” win 4 or 5 games.

I look forward to camp in August.
 
The thing I've been most disappointed with is the lack of outreach from football to the fans this year.

The lack of excitement between my friends and family for this football season is noticeable. It usually isn't this bad as most of us are every game attendees.

We all know covid played a big role, but other programs have worked around it to allow some access.

If they win all is forgiven, but early losses and I can picture my kids climbing empty 300 bleachers while I down nachos with Jalapenos and 2 cheese dips instead of the salsa.
 
Scooch said:
Agree completely. I don't know what's going to happen if we don't scratch-and-claw our way to a bowl. But one thing I won't entertain is some vague notion that "we're improving" because we got 4 or 5 wins and "we looked competitive" in a few losses. Missing a bowl this season is a failure, period, IMHO.
Expand...

It's def going to be an interesting year, I can see us winning 7 games and being competitive in our losses or barely hitting our projected 3 wins. I do agree that Dino needs to get to a bowl to make it to 2022.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Completely disagree.

This team is young. Very young. Possibly the youngest team in the conference. Possibly younger than any team on our schedule.

it’s astonishing how many posters want to tally the total wins during Baber’s tenure and use thy number against him. Did we forget all of the issueduring the ugly 1-10 2020 season that were beyond the control of the coaching staff?

- Top two running backs opt out. Sure Tucker was a pleasant surprise, but would we have been able to run the ball more efficiently with the projected too running backs on the field?

- Injuries. Holy Moses… the o-line, the QB, the defensive secondary. Baber’s fault?

- No spring ball and two new coordinators. Oh my.aber’s tries to make some improvements and gets snake biten. Did any other team we played in 2020 have a similar situation?

And now, multiple preseason prognosticators have SU winning 3 or fewer games this year. But somehow people think they know more and would deem 2021 a failure if SU doesn’t exceed the predictions of the experts and win at least 6 games.

I sure hope we can pull out six wins and qualify for a bowl game. But, it’s too early to say 2021 will be a failed season of SU isn’t in a bowl game at the end of the season.

Too many variables to consider to say this team isn’t improving, even if we exceed every preseason prediction and “only” win 4 or 5 games.

I look forward to camp in August.
Expand...

Absolutely. All those things matter and provide perspective on why things have gone sideways.

The problem I see is the programs that have jumped us like WF. WF should under no circumstances be a better football program than Syracuse yet they have been to like 5-6 straight bowl games.

Boston College which went through a coaching change and suddenly are the darlings of the ACC b/c Hafley has injected some energy into the program and has top shelf talent surrounding their usual depth issues that plague us.

The onus is on Dino to get us to a bowl. The excuses at this point will be judged how we do against our peer schools and if we can scratch and claw to a 6 win season. If not, we'll be looking for a coach w a financial hand tied behind our back b/c the money spent to keep Dino didn't pay off at all.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Completely disagree.

This team is young. Very young. Possibly the youngest team in the conference. Possibly younger than any team on our schedule.

it’s astonishing how many posters want to tally the total wins during Baber’s tenure and use thy number against him. Did we forget all of the issueduring the ugly 1-10 2020 season that were beyond the control of the coaching staff?

- Top two running backs opt out. Sure Tucker was a pleasant surprise, but would we have been able to run the ball more efficiently with the projected too running backs on the field?

- Injuries. Holy Moses… the o-line, the QB, the defensive secondary. Baber’s fault?

- No spring ball and two new coordinators. Oh my.aber’s tries to make some improvements and gets snake biten. Did any other team we played in 2020 have a similar situation?

And now, multiple preseason prognosticators have SU winning 3 or fewer games this year. But somehow people think they know more and would deem 2021 a failure if SU doesn’t exceed the predictions of the experts and win at least 6 games.

I sure hope we can pull out six wins and qualify for a bowl game. But, it’s too early to say 2021 will be a failed season of SU isn’t in a bowl game at the end of the season.

Too many variables to consider to say this team isn’t improving, even if we exceed every preseason prediction and “only” win 4 or 5 games.

I look forward to camp in August.
Expand...
year 6.

depth shouldnt be this much of an issue.

injuries happen, and when they do...

dino pulls a FB out of his arse and puts him on the OL.

RBs go down and the next best option is Tomcat.

QB goes down and the next best option is Bees.

thats ALL on Dino.
 
KaiserUEO said:
year 6.

depth shouldnt be this much of an issue.

injuries happen, and when they do...

dino pulls a FB out of his arse and puts him on the OL.

RBs go down and the next best option is Tomcat.

QB goes down and the next best option is Bees.

thats ALL on Dino.
Expand...
Look at the youth on the roster. The future could be bright.

How many seniors are on the 2021 roster? 7. That’s right. This team only has 7 seniors on the roster. Every other player could be back in 2022. They won’t, but they could.

Juniors? I think there are only 11 juniors.

So this is a team with a grand total of 18 upper class men. And, people think anything less than 6 wins is unacceptable.

Try to keep your expectations reasonable, or you will will most certainly be disappointed.

Isn’t Coach Babers under contract thru 2023? He’s not going anywhere unless this team completes implodes.

Be patient. Let’s see where this season takes us. Enjoy the ride.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Look at the youth on the roster. The future could be bright.

How many seniors are on the 2021 roster? 7. That’s right. This team only has 7 seniors on the roster. Every other player could be back in 2022. They won’t, but they could.

Juniors? I think there are only 11 juniors.

So this is a team with a grand total of 18 upper class men. And, people think anything less than 6 wins is unacceptable.

Try to keep your expectations reasonable, or you will will most certainly be disappointed.

Isn’t Coach Babers under contract thru 2023? He’s not going anywhere unless this team completes implodes.

Be patient. Let’s see where this season takes us. Enjoy the ride.
Expand...
18 upperclassmen???!!!

holy crap did Dino do a horrible job recruiting!!!

have no choice but to try to enjoy the ride.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Look at the youth on the roster. The future could be bright.

How many seniors are on the 2021 roster? 7. That’s right. This team only has 7 seniors on the roster. Every other player could be back in 2022. They won’t, but they could.

Juniors? I think there are only 11 juniors.

So this is a team with a grand total of 18 upper class men. And, people think anything less than 6 wins is unacceptable.

Try to keep your expectations reasonable, or you will will most certainly be disappointed.

Isn’t Coach Babers under contract thru 2023? He’s not going anywhere unless this team completes implodes.

Be patient. Let’s see where this season takes us. Enjoy the ride.
Expand...

The youth excuse is very skewed by the extra year. Every player (minus the true frosh) would really be a class ahead, in a non pandemic world. Just because G. Williams is listed as a redshirt frosh, does not mean he is. Someone on this board dug deeper into what we really have as far as players actual years in the program. The notion we're a super young team is a little far fetched.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Completely disagree.

This team is young. Very young. Possibly the youngest team in the conference. Possibly younger than any team on our schedule.

it’s astonishing how many posters want to tally the total wins during Baber’s tenure and use thy number against him. Did we forget all of the issueduring the ugly 1-10 2020 season that were beyond the control of the coaching staff?

- Top two running backs opt out. Sure Tucker was a pleasant surprise, but would we have been able to run the ball more efficiently with the projected too running backs on the field?

- Injuries. Holy Moses… the o-line, the QB, the defensive secondary. Baber’s fault?

- No spring ball and two new coordinators. Oh my.aber’s tries to make some improvements and gets snake biten. Did any other team we played in 2020 have a similar situation?

And now, multiple preseason prognosticators have SU winning 3 or fewer games this year. But somehow people think they know more and would deem 2021 a failure if SU doesn’t exceed the predictions of the experts and win at least 6 games.

I sure hope we can pull out six wins and qualify for a bowl game. But, it’s too early to say 2021 will be a failed season of SU isn’t in a bowl game at the end of the season.

Too many variables to consider to say this team isn’t improving, even if we exceed every preseason prediction and “only” win 4 or 5 games.

I look forward to camp in August.
Expand...
Explain to me, quantitatively, how we're dramatically and uniquely "young"? We've gone through this exercise before -- don't look at the class listed on the roster, look at the number of years players have been in the program. When we did the math a month ago, a large percentage of the team have been in the program for 3+ years. If your definition of "young" includes those who have been in the program 3 years that's fine, but then we disagree on the definition.

And I was very clear in saying that last season was an acceptable mulligan. My contention, however, is that it wasn't a reset. We had 10 wins in 2018, and 5 wins in 2019. Improvement in 2021 is not going from 1 win to 4, rather that is a sign of a program in continued trouble, IMHO.
 
SUDadx2 said:
Look at the youth on the roster. The future could be bright.

How many seniors are on the 2021 roster? 7. That’s right. This team only has 7 seniors on the roster. Every other player could be back in 2022. They won’t, but they could.

Juniors? I think there are only 11 juniors.

So this is a team with a grand total of 18 upper class men. And, people think anything less than 6 wins is unacceptable.

Try to keep your expectations reasonable, or you will will most certainly be disappointed.

Isn’t Coach Babers under contract thru 2023? He’s not going anywhere unless this team completes implodes.

Be patient. Let’s see where this season takes us. Enjoy the ride.
Expand...
11 and 18 aren't real numbers, don't look at the class designation, look at years in the program.
 
KaiserUEO said:
18 upperclassmen???!!!

holy crap did Dino do a horrible job recruiting!!!

have no choice but to try to enjoy the ride.
Expand...
It's also a nonsense number.
 
Doc5120 said:
The youth excuse is very skewed by the extra year. Every player (minus the true frosh) would really be a class ahead, in a non pandemic world. Just because G. Williams is listed as a redshirt frosh, does not mean he is. Someone on this board dug deeper into what we really have as far as players actual years in the program. The notion we're a super young team is a little far fetched.
Expand...
That was me. I'll just post this weekly until the season starts, I guess...

syracusefan.com

Roster breakdown

the best thing about bodies on the oline is you have enough to actually practice and run a scout team this yr.
syracusefan.com syracusefan.com
 
I have 7 G Seniors. 8 RS Sr. 8 RJr.

Thank goodness for super Sr's. 23 going into their 4th year plus.. (Or opt out). We'd only have 16, without the supers.

Defense- other than DLine, is super young.

I believe our RS Sr, RS Jr are still technically classified as R Jr and R So.( not in the forum roster)
 
orangepassion said:
I feel like we say we're young almost every year
Expand...

I think our 2018 and 2019 teams had a lot of experience, the 2019 team just didn't have the right experience/depth at the most important positions.
 
My take, for what it's worth...

Marrone gets too much credit around here if you ask me. He did some fine things initially but who knows what would have happened beyond. Dino, I think has been given a bit more rope than most coming in but he also set the stage and delivered on a vision that got the fan base excited. Greg was terrible. Coach P should get a ton of respect. He was clearly the best of the group - just no question at all about that.

Okay, back to my Lagunitas IPA.
 
Scooch said:
Explain to me, quantitatively, how we're dramatically and uniquely "young"? We've gone through this exercise before -- don't look at the class listed on the roster, look at the number of years players have been in the program. When we did the math a month ago, a large percentage of the team have been in the program for 3+ years. If your definition of "young" includes those who have been in the program 3 years that's fine, but then we disagree on the definition.

And I was very clear in saying that last season was an acceptable mulligan. My contention, however, is that it wasn't a reset. We had 10 wins in 2018, and 5 wins in 2019. Improvement in 2021 is not going from 1 win to 4, rather that is a sign of a program in continued trouble, IMHO.
Expand...

I don't disagree that a number of players have been in the program for a few years despite what may appear to be a deceptive "class" listed next to their name.

But just as we have a player like G. Williams who is listed as a RS-Fr, but this will be his third season on the hill. Other teams also have those players; looking young in eligibility, but with multiple years "in the program". The difference is those guys make up the vast majority of the current SU roster while every single opponent in 2021 has more older guys (Jrs, Srs and Grad) also on their roster. The absence of these older players is what makes Syracuse young in comparison.

School; Seniors (inc Grads)/Juniors

Syracuse; 7/11
Ohio; 26/20
Rutgers; 31/22
Albany; 19/15 (it shouldn't matter here)
Liberty: 24/23
Fla St; 12/11
Wake; 10/19
Clemson; 22/25
Va Tech; 9/24
BC; 27*/27 *18 graduate students
Louisville; 21/21
NC St; 9/16
Pitt; 24/27

All of the "freshman" on the SU roster may not be fresh out of high school, but they have not been in the program for as long as many players on our opponents rosters either.

Advantage = opponent.

Being the younger team on the field is not an advantage and needs to be considered when looking ahead to the 2021 season.

how did we get here? honestly, I don't know. I haven't looked back at the recruiting classes and the related attrition.

Is Coach Babers responsible for this ? Sure he is. So do you condemn him now and let another coach benefit from the youthful talent on the roster? Or do you take a deep breath and give him the remainder of his contract to work thru this? IMO, we sit back and watch these players develop and play their hearts out.
 
Scooch said:
Agree completely. I don't know what's going to happen if we don't scratch-and-claw our way to a bowl. But one thing I won't entertain is some vague notion that "we're improving" because we got 4 or 5 wins and "we looked competitive" in a few losses. Missing a bowl this season is a failure, period, IMHO.
Expand...


I think everybody understands this. But from a "splash of cold water" perspective, how many teams improve by 5 or more wins in a season, especially when they won only 1 game?

I wonder how many teams in college football history went from 1 win to a bowl game the next year. I'll bet you can count them on 1 hand in over 100 years.

I think the likelihood is that we wind up in this gray area of around 4-5 wins. If it's any less than that, no question he has to go. But he's got a lot of money left on his buy out. If he wins 4-5 games after winning only 1 last year, I think they're going to find it hard to fire him.
 
kcsu said:
I'll mix it up with a little La Familia
Expand...


God no! La Famiglia turned us into Jersey Shore. Cut our wins in half from the year before.
 
syrBossHogg said:
I think our 2018 and 2019 teams had a lot of experience, the 2019 team just didn't have the right experience/depth at the most important positions.
Expand...


If you look back at that roster, that was a damn good roster. There were a couple AA's and at least 3 guys who were drafted.
 
IthacaMatt said:
I think everybody understands this. But from a "splash of cold water" perspective, how many teams improve by 5 or more wins in a season, especially when they won only 1 game?

I wonder how many teams in college football history went from 1 win to a bowl game the next year. I'll bet you can count them on 1 hand in over 100 years.

I think the likelihood is that we wind up in this gray area of around 4-5 wins. If it's any less than that, no question he has to go. But he's got a lot of money left on his buy out. If he wins 4-5 games after winning only 1 last year, I think they're going to find it hard to fire him.
Expand...

how often does a a 1 win team go on the qualify for a bowl game the next season?

It sure doesn't happen very often, but it does happen.

Baylor went 1-11 in 2017 and 7-6 in 2018. and beat Vanderbilt in a Bowl game.

In 2018 Central Michigan went 1-11 and then went 8-6 in 2019. Then lost to San Diego state in a bowl game.


Although we were 1-10 last season, I think most would agree that record was not reflective of the talent on the team.
 
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