Hop getting shredded

[Townie72]

Except I'd argue Syracuse is more of a Disney than Sear's or Macy's...Some cyclical up and down, but long term still has value...

OK. Give me the parallels between Disney’s situation and SU’s.

If you listen to some of the posters on here, SU is a shadow of its former self being slowly driven into the ground by poor an ancient coach that has the wrong strategies and doesn’t have enough energy to recruit well.

We are, according to some, in a 5 or 6 year decline because of mis-management. And it’s unlikely we will ever catch the teams at the top of the ACC.

Does that sound like Disney’s situation to you?

 

[Cusefan0307]

OK. Give me the parallels between Disney’s situation and SU’s.

If you listen to some of the posters on here, SU is a shadow of its former self being slowly driven into the ground by poor an ancient coach that has the wrong strategies and doesn’t have enough energy to recruit well.

We are, according to some, in a 5 or 6 year decline because of mis-management. And it’s unlikely we will ever catch the teams at the top of the ACC.

Does that sound like Disney’s situation to you?

I'm not getting into this with you anymore. We have a difference of opinion and interpret the facts in a different way. The difference is I'm not sure you will ever admit you were or are wrong.

 

[Halfmooncuse]

I wouldn't be sure you have had "a lot more" one and dones than Syracuse.

Carmelo, Donte Greene, Tyler Ennis, Chris McCullough, Malachi Richardson.

How about two and dones?

Fab Melo, Dion Waiters, Michael Carter-Williams, Jerami Grant, Tyler Lydon, Oshae Brissett

We have only one 44 and not done

 

[Ghost]

That’s somewhat different. They do get people to takeover moribund or even failing enterprises like current-day Sears or Macy’s. But everyone understands the difficulty of the task and the probability of success. These guys careers aren’t damaged by these experiences. And they usually get a tremendous compensation package to somewhat offset the risk.

Not so with coaches that come in and things go South from where they were regardless of the reasons. Consider Patrick Ewing at Georgetown, who pined for an NBA head coaching job for many years. If he can’t turn GU around, what do you think his chances are for an NBA job with a failure on his resume. (Georgetown is once again on the bottom of the BE standings and had 4 players quit the team and transfer.)

I'd consider Syracuse more of an IBM. An old, well regarded company that started listening to their customers, went back to their roots and an old model, and came back from the brink of failure. Or perhaps even a Lord & Taylor.

 

[Townie72]

I'd consider Syracuse more of an IBM. An old, well regarded company that started listening to their customers, went back to their roots and an old model, and came back from the brink of failure. Or perhaps even a Lord & Taylor.

Well, you are comparing what you think happened at IBM with what you hope will happen at SU after JB leaves.

But, IBM is nothing like what it once was. (I’m an ex-IBMer whose first job out of college was selling computer systems.)

At its zenith, IBM was the preeminent corporation in the world. The current version, while successful, is a shadow of the IBM of the days of the mainframe in which IBM had a 70% market share.

If SU basketball ends up being like IBM is today, we’ll be in the Patriot league winning titles.

 

[miamicuse]

OK. Give me the parallels between Disney’s situation and SU’s.

Disney World is in Orange County Florida, Disney Land is in Orange County California, we are orange. Otto can easily be a character in Mulan, Lion King, Star Wars or even MCU.

 

[Day2]

Do we want Hop back?

For continuity and recruiting, yes. For coaching...maybe.

 

[Cuseroc]

Fans are just being irrational. That’s how sports are. If you have aspirations of being a sweet 16 team, and it looks like you won’t even make the NIT, then yeah fans are going to be upset. It’s not all on Hop, but UW is one of the most underperforming teams in the country. If Syracuse had our talent and started the conference 1-3 with losses to BC and Wake, you’d probably be upset too.

I don’t think fans are asking for him to be fired, but they are concerned. Especially with zero recruits signed for next year. Will likely be at least a two year drought for Hop.

Reading how you talk about your "superior talent" and greater amount of "one and dones," one would think Washington was the program that is a perennial NCAA contender with 6 Final Fours and a NC, and top 5 in all time wins, instead of Syracuse.

 

[Ghost]

Well, you are comparing what you think happened at IBM with what you hope will happen at SU after JB leaves.

But, IBM is nothing like what it once was. (I’m an ex-IBMer whose first job out of college was selling computer systems.)

At its zenith, IBM was the preeminent corporation in the world. The current version, while successful, is a shadow of the IBM of the days of the mainframe in which IBM had a 70% market share.

If SU basketball ends up being like IBM is today, we’ll be in the Patriot league winning titles.

I was just wanted to keep comparing Syracuse to businesses! Fine, we're Compaq!

 

[Townie72]

I was just wanted to keep comparing Syracuse to businesses! Fine, we're Compaq!

In one respect, we are Apple because we have a differentiated product strategy that is difficult for competitors to follow (Zone, Dome, All SU grad staff, private school, etc)

 

[PhatOrange]

Are you planning to apply too?

We’ll see how this plays out.

But the SU job after JB will be a lot less attractive than some fans think it is. Think about it. All you have to do is do as well or better than Boeheim did.

Why take the risk? There will be jobs with less daunting challenges than this one that become available.

I don't think it'll be less attractive. The only apprehension I can see is following JB. So you likely wouldn't get the established veterans to take our job, but any fast riser would be all over it.

Again, Syracuse is a tier 1 job. tier 1 support, tier 1 facilites, tier 1 conference, tier 1 national exposure, tier 1 money etc etc. We may not be a blue blood, but we're a tier 1 job.

There will not be a shortage of high level candidates.

(and if JB bottom's the program out there is no where to go but up so following him becomes easier. and basketball only takes a couple of recruits to change a program.)

 

[manleyzoo]

Well, you are comparing what you think happened at IBM with what you hope will happen at SU after JB leaves.

But, IBM is nothing like what it once was. (I’m an ex-IBMer whose first job out of college was selling computer systems.)

At its zenith, IBM was the preeminent corporation in the world. The current version, while successful, is a shadow of the IBM of the days of the mainframe in which IBM had a 70% market share.

If SU basketball ends up being like IBM is today, we’ll be in the Patriot league winning titles.

Well, let's see...the technology changed dramatically and IBM was late to the party, erroneously banking on its mainframe history and getting beat to a pulp in the PC and operating system markets. Other than a few competitors (perhaps you remember IBM and the seven dwarfs?) IBM's glory days were in a leader's market. What you say about market share is woefully out of date...in a reconstituted market it's not the company that's king but the technology. Who can top the market in cloud computing and software-as-a-service is very different than who can top the market with hardware. Considering that IBM posted a losing streak of 22 straight quarters of losing revenue that ended in 2018, it has done a remarkable, albeit painfully slow, job of retooling the company to compete in today's market, not dissimilar from turning a battleship in another direction.

 

[manleyzoo]

In one respect, we are Apple because we have a differentiated product strategy that is difficult for competitors to follow (Zone, Dome, All SU grad staff, private school, etc)

Apple has not differentiated its product strategy...the overwhelming majority of its revenue come from iPhone, tablet and other hardware sales. Apple TV is its only real departure from mobile hardware. Its cloud revenue is confined to a captive audience and its internal app development is nowhere. Yes, the App Store has billions of apps but that's not much different than any other mobile vendor's app stores. It's not that Apple's proprietary technology strategy is difficult for competitors to duplicate, it's that it sells to an enthusiastic, devoted customer base that isn't growing. No one wants to follow Apple's blueprint because it cuts their market potential. It would be great if you had even one clue about what you're talking about here.

 

[manleyzoo]

I'd consider Syracuse more of an IBM. An old, well regarded company that started listening to their customers, went back to their roots and an old model, and came back from the brink of failure. Or perhaps even a Lord & Taylor.

Sorry, but that's not what has happened with IBM.

 

[FrancoPizza]

In one respect, we are Apple because we have a differentiated product strategy that is difficult for competitors to follow (Zone, Dome, All SU grad staff, private school, etc)

You mean the Apple IIGS right? Great in its heyday, antiquated by modern standards.

 

[Ghost]

Sorry, but that's not what has happened with IBM.

Eh, tell that to Wikipedia, my friend. (or whatever site I pulled it from). You think I know anything about IBM?

I do not. Are they Lenovo?

What'd they make, instant cameras? iPhones? Who knows!!!

 

[manleyzoo]

Eh, tell that to Wikipedia, my friend. (or whatever site I pulled it from). You think I know anything about IBM?

I do not. Are they Lenovo?

What'd they make, instant cameras? iPhones? Who knows!!!

Sorry dude but I don't rely on Wikipedia and neither should you. Maybe take a clue from someone who knows what they're talking about? I've been following IBM as a technology journalist for 40 years and have interviewed every top IBM executive many times. As for Lenovo, it bought IBM's PC business in 2004. My point is don't write about what you don't know, don't make comparisons that are inaccurate and ill-informed because you might run up against someone who does.

 

[Ghost]

Sorry dude but I don't rely on Wikipedia and neither should you. Maybe take a clue from someone who knows what they're talking about? I've been following IBM as a technology journalist for 40 years and have interviewed every top IBM executive many times. As for Lenovo, it bought IBM's PC business in 2004. My point is don't write about what you don't know, don't make comparisons that are inaccurate and ill-informed because you might run up against someone who does.

Okay, dude, you take life really seriously. And IBM. And apparently yourself. I applaud your fandom - you should start writing fan fiction about yourself! It sounds like it would be a very intriguing read.

Anyway, as I told Townie, I just wanted to keep comparing Syracuse to businesses...no more, or less, than that!

Can you tell me about Compaq now as well? Thanks in advance!

 

[manleyzoo]

Okay, dude, you take life really seriously. And IBM. And apparently yourself. I applaud your fandom - you should start writing fan fiction about yourself! It sounds like it would be a very intriguing read.

Anyway, as I told Townie, I just wanted to keep comparing Syracuse to businesses...no more, or less, than that!

Can you tell me about Compaq now as well? Thanks in advance!

Yea, actually I can. I knew Rod Canion, who started Compaq, really well. And his first lieutenant Mike Swavely was one of my best contacts in those days in the 80s. And I was one of their consultants when HP bought them. Is that enough for you? They're the company that actually launched the clone market but I guess you don't know what that is so I'll tell you. (I used their first design system, a "portable" that weighed about 40 lbs.) They opened up the market for gazillions of computer companies to enter with PCs, ultimately killing IBM's PC business. So our basketball isn't like Compaq or IBM or Lenovo. Keep looking dude for a business comparison. Or just admit you've no clue and start over. Or better yet, amuse me and write your own book on how to use Wikipedia.

 

[50YRsofCuse]

Quick question: with Quade academically ineligible, does that mean he is back to red-shirting this year or did/does he lose a year of eligibility? In either case, how many years of eligibility does he have left?

 

[Ghost]

Yea, actually I can. I knew Rod Canion, who started Compaq, really well. And his first lieutenant Mike Swavely was one of my best contacts in those days in the 80s. And I was one of their consultants when HP bought them. Is that enough for you? They're the company that actually launched the clone market but I guess you don't know what that is so I'll tell you. (I used their first design system, a "portable" that weighed about 40 lbs.) They opened up the market for gazillions of computer companies to enter with PCs, ultimately killing IBM's PC business. So our basketball isn't like Compaq or IBM or Lenovo. Keep looking dude for a business comparison. Or just admit you've no clue and start over. Or better yet, amuse me and write your own book on how to use Wikipedia.

It was enough, but you didn't really give me time to answer. It just gets even better though, so you're lack of self-control was a really, really, really big win for me today!

Although, admittedly at times it reads a bit like a Wikipedia entry so I'm a tad distrustful thus far. I mean, you don't even have references.

Anyway, I've seen better fan-(non)fiction although rarely by authors so enamored with themselves! I'm not sure what your angle is yet, but I think this is going places! On some level you must realize I never intended to have a clue...I think at one point I may have even credited IBM with the iPhone. Regardless, I remain intrigued!!!

Dude, can I get some more info on the clone stuff?

What about my Lord & Taylor comparison? Was that one on point?

 

[Trueblue25]

What is happening in this thread

 

[manleyzoo]

It was enough, but you didn't really give me time to answer. It just gets even better though, so you're lack of self-control was a really, really, really big win for me today!

Although, admittedly at times it reads a bit like a Wikipedia entry so I'm a tad distrustful thus far. I mean, you don't even have references.

Anyway, I've seen better fan-(non)fiction although rarely by authors so enamored with themselves! I'm not sure what your angle is yet, but I think this is going places! On some level you must realize I never intended to have a clue...I think at one point I may have even credited IBM with the iPhone. Regardless, I remain intrigued!!!

Dude, can I get some more info on the clone stuff?

What about my Lord & Taylor comparison? Was that one on point?

Dude, I have no idea about Lord & Taylor. Do they sell cars? Exactly what would you like for references and what would you like for more clone info? Be specific please. I know precision isn't your thing but try anyway. Being out of control and enamored with myself I need some guidance from you. Please advise.

 

[Consigliere]

not dissimilar from turning a battleship in another direction.

Or as the title of Lou Gerstner's book states "Who says elephants can;t dance?"

 

[Townie72]

Well, let's see...the technology changed dramatically and IBM was late to the party, erroneously banking on its mainframe history and getting beat to a pulp in the PC and operating system markets. Other than a few competitors (perhaps you remember IBM and the seven dwarfs?) IBM's glory days were in a leader's market. What you say about market share is woefully out of date...in a reconstituted market it's not the company that's king but the technology. Who can top the market in cloud computing and software-as-a-service is very different than who can top the market with hardware. Considering that IBM posted a losing streak of 22 straight quarters of losing revenue that ended in 2018, it has done a remarkable, albeit painfully slow, job of retooling the company to compete in today's market, not dissimilar from turning a battleship in another direction.

But it’s not even a fraction of what it was when mainframe computing dominated the world and IBM had a 70% market share.

I don’t need a lot of help understanding the computer market over the past 40+ years. I lived it. When technological changes cause markets to disappear, few companies survive it. (IBM, Burroughs, Univac, Data General, Eastman Kodak, Xerox were once the Google, Apples and Facebooks of the day.