I am just curious what Davise has to gain from lying

[IthacaBarrel]

About this. I truly don't get that. I don't think he is lying about it but who knows?

 

[orangenirvana]

Settlement money?

And if the part about Bernie demanding the money he was owed in 2001 is true, then maybe that hurt him to the point where he wants some kind of sick revenge.

 

[wallacecuse]

Settlement money?

And if the part about Bernie demanding the money he was owed in 2001 is true, then maybe that hurt him to the point where he wants some kind of sick revenge.

That's the part that really seems odd to me...you've molested me as a child through my adulthood, but thanks for the 5 g's?

 

[cmr27]

I was wondering this too. People keep saying he is after money. That doesn't seem like a practical motive. SU is not going to pay out unless there's a conviction or overwhelming evidence, in which case the threat of a successful civil suit would be very credible. However, Davis has to go all the way -- producing witnesses, evidence, etc, etc - to get to that point. That doesn't seem like a smart plan of action if he's lying. There are easier ways to con people out of money... Then again, maybe he thought Fine would pay personally? That's not gonna happen either. Fine will go all the way in court to try to clear his name. Another angle would be a media payout?Did ESPN pay for the interview? I doubt it.

Who else is going to pay this guy?

Maybe I'm missing something, but money doesn't seem like a practical motive.

Could it be that the guy is too stupid to realize all this? I suppose. Or he could just be telling the truth. I'm skeptical, but we don't really know right now.

 

[memcorsu]

There are a lot of reasons why presumed "victims" who falsely accuse people of a crime do what they do. Some people are just sick and twisted in the head. It could be anything; vengeance for any reason not getting a position, maybe he was turned on by Fine, told his time was over with the program, etc... Some people do it as a con.

When I was in business, I ran across false accusations made about people many times. The primary reason was that the accuser was usually not doing what they were supposed to be doing, realizing that (after many documented warnings) they were going to be asked to move on, and finally threw out false accusations to "gain" something on their way out. The instances were almost always heavily documented and air tight, but the company tended to throw some small compensation at them to make them go away and avoid the cost of legal proceedings.

I learned real fast that you never mix friends and business, never put yourself in a questionable position, and when dealing with anything work related, keep it professional. People are itching to get at other people.

That being said, this is very early to say what is what. I would allow to facts to play out and the University to do its job. I would easily say that Nancy Cantor and I are not cut from the same cloth and I probably disagree with her about many things, but she does seem the type that will firmly push for the truth to come out. I also think she will be very fair in her judgments.

There are many fishy things about this situation. I would tend to lean towards this being a false accusation seeing that it was investigated once already and found to me naught. I believe SU is taking the right steps as I am sure they did in the past. SU is a more liberal progressive school then the "good ole' boy" PSU, I do not see them hiding things for the sake of anyone.

I do think Bernie is done on the Hill, and we will see him retire after this is said and done. His legacy and persona are shot. As we say back South, "the stank is never going to wear of him". Even if he is found innocent, he will always have an asterisk by his name in many people’s minds.

If he is found guilty I think he should be hung high and punished with all severity of the law. I also think if these two young men are lying, they need to pay as severe a punishment as Bernie. To lie about something like this causes life-long and irreversible damage to a person and their family. Worse of all, it cheapens and harms those that are actual victims like those at PSU. People who do this for gain are the worst of the worst.

Let the people in the know do what they need to do, let the chips fall where they may, and let the repercussions be dealt out. It is way to early to say what is going on yet.

 

[HeaterCuse22]

this just happened to justin bieber like this story, it had a short shelflife due to accuser credibility...

 

[FreakTalksAboutSU]

The media often pays for interviews, folks.

 

[OrangeHeel]

About this. I truly don't get that. I don't think he is lying about it but who knows?

Experience tells me a person's motivation to lie is often murky, mixed, and beyond even a semi-rational person's ability to comprehend. I've personally been involved in investigations where serious allegations turn out to be outright lies. The difference being the public never heard about because the allegations were kept confidential do as not to unfairly damage the accused's reputation.

On the other hand, if the allegations are true, then the accusers are being courageous no matter whether mixed motives guide them or not. Even if it can't be prosecuted, abuse shouldnt be ignored.

All this leads to the ultimate point that we need to let the process play out. IMHO, it's okay to discuss what's out there and to form preliminary opinions do long as one keeps an open mind.

The good news is that so far this seems to be the anti- PSU in that the actions of SU seem to be spot on correct so far.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Rocco]

My question is this: if this supposedly happened until this person is 27, how does one allow this to continue?

 

[texascpa]

You guys don't think this is about money? Really? That's not motivation enough for some people? Get your head's out of the sand. This isn't about a criminal prosecution for these guys, it's about a huge settlement down the road. And whether or not you think SU would capitulate, many companies do without regard to criminality. Many times it's cheaper to settle than to fight. And furthermore, it doesn't even take a criminal prosecution to get a civil prosecution as we've learned from the OJ case. The standard for "beyond a reasonable doubt" is MUCH less in a civil suit than a criminal trial. They just need one small avenue or inconsistency given by the university to attack it civily.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

My question is this: if this supposedly happened until this person is 27, how does one allow this to continue?

I suppose there are any number of reasons, but why do they keep saying he was molested until he was 27?

IF something was still going on, either it was consentual or it was sexual assault. It wasn't molestation after a certain age.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

About this. I truly don't get that. I don't think he is lying about it but who knows?

My feelings currently are very different than when this was first brought to light.

If he had said "it was just me", I think he'd have greater credibility at this point. You could then say it is certainly understandable that SU, the PS, and ESPN couldn't find anyone to confirm the story. You could conclude that the guy was probably telling the truth.

But he said there were other boys, lots of them, and named names. Those people all denied his story, however. So now years later, his step brother has come forward. Is he telling the truth? Was he interviewed previously? Had he ever previously denied anything?

That's where I have to take a step back and ask "what is really going on here?"

 

[Rocco]

I suppose there are any number of reasons, but why do they keep saying he was molested until he was 27?

IF something was still going on, either it was consentual or it was sexual assault. It wasn't molestation after a certain age.

Those are my thoughts. Molestation seems odd to describe actions against a 27 yr old.

With all of the PSU stuff, you don't hear alot about molestation, and his accusations came from kids younger than these 2.

 

[orangenirvana]

I suppose there are any number of reasons, but why do they keep saying he was molested until he was 27?

IF something was still going on, either it was consentual or it was sexual assault. It wasn't molestation after a certain age.

If Fine was a true pedophile, he would have lost interest after the acuser hit puberty.

 

[Dick_in_MI]

If Fine was a true pedophile, he would have lost interest after the acuser hit puberty.

Hard to say. I must admit a total lack of knowledge on the subject as I was never molested nor am I a human services professional.

I keep going back to two things; 1) the guy named names and all those names denied the story, and 2) there were too many eyes around the program. If there is fire behind the smoke, some of those eyes would have come forward during the three investigations or they may yet come out. We'll see.

 

[oldpinepoint]

This case doesn't pass the sniff test, need to see how this plays out. However money, revenge and desperation are powerful motives. Let's see where the evidence takes us. The accuser better be ready to have his dirty laundry aired because this ones going to get nasty IMO. Media was late to the game for PSU. They won't be for this.

 

[cmr27]

You guys don't think this is about money? Really? That's not motivation enough for some people? Get your head's out of the sand. This isn't about a criminal prosecution for these guys, it's about a huge settlement down the road. And whether or not you think SU would capitulate, many companies do without regard to criminality. Many times it's cheaper to settle than to fight. And furthermore, it doesn't even take a criminal prosecution to get a civil prosecution as we've learned from the OJ case. The standard for "beyond a reasonable doubt" is MUCH less in a civil suit than a criminal trial. They just need one small avenue or inconsistency given by the university to attack it civily.

If it's about money, it's been poorly thought out. I agree that companies often are quick to settle (and with almost everything else in your post), but that is not going to happen in this case. The stakes are too high here. A settlement - even if it didn't include an admission of guilt - would be throwing Fine, JB and everyone associated with Syracuse under the bus. SU can not settle unless the guy has a mountain of evidence and is well on his way to winning a civil suit.

To do that, he needs to lawyer up, hire a PR team, win the court case AND be on his way to winning the civil suit. The easy way out, which is discreetly throwing money at the guy, is closed to SU (as it should be). As I mentioned in an earlier post, there are easier ways to con people out of money. Money may be a motive but it's not a well-planned one.

 

[SkanSU]

There are "other" reasons then financial gain that an individual might ... and I say might ... make false accusations. We really know very little of the alledged victim in this case. We know nothing of his personal background and, more importantly of his psychological make-up. We do know that, apparently, he came from a single-family home and that, according to the story he perceived Bernie as, almost, an adopted father. But otherwise we know little more or nothing.

There are people who crave attention and notoriety ... there is no thought to monetary gain. At the same time they may possess a need to "strike out" at authority or the well known in order to gain that notoriety. Celebs are confronted with such individuals frequently. These are individuals who gain significant gratification of not only seeing their story (notice I did not say name) in the paper; on the news; on national broadcasting but also derive a sense of personal power by bringing "down" an individual with a significant name and standing. Obviously these individuals are typically quite intelligent and can sense the mood of the public ... and, in turn, the media ... and will choose allegations that "fit" that mood... knowing the media will follow. It is not atypical for these individuals to find others of the same psychological bent and then "feed" off each other's need for personal power and attention ... and thus power. These are usually indivduals, obviously, who have been "powerless" throughout their lives. One can see the effects and impact that such individuals possess and how they choose events that can feed their needs. For example, we have PSU and now Bernie Fine; we had the Catholic Church allegations and a sudden epidemic of accusations and allegations; and, worst we have the day care witch hunts ... many initiated by such individuals (in the case of the witch hunts a Social Worker with excessive psychological needs)

I am only answering the question as to why an individual would make such an accusation if it wasn't true. I am not saying that the allegations are true or false. If false, though, the true victim becomes the accused ... and once again I return to the day care witch hunts... because those accusations never, ever go away. There is no such thing as exoneration in the minds of the public psyche.

 

[JOC44]

But he said there were other boys, lots of them, and named names. Those people all denied his story, however. So now years later, his step brother has come forward. Is he telling the truth? Was he interviewed previously? Had he ever previously denied anything?

That's where I have to take a step back and ask "what is really going on here?"

According to Schwarz, they interviewed the stepbrother in 2003 and he denied. But according to Schwarz, that just proves it's all true because all the deniers were obviously too embarrassed to tell the trruth. At least that's what he said this morning.

 

[SkanSU]

So ... according to him there is guilt if others admit it and guilt if everybody denies it ... wow, system of justice (not criminal justice but moral justice) is overwhelming. Unfortunately the masses are psychologically open to such suggestion... they love to see the "big" guys brought down. On the one hand they are saying "poor, poor kids" (and they may be) but their conscious (I didn't say unconscious b/c their thoughts are more conscious) thoughts are relishing the fact that someone is being brought down ... how else can they escape from their pitiful, mundane lives. What is worse is that the media understands this mass psyche and exploits it!!

 

[Bayside44]

About this. I truly don't get that. I don't think he is lying about it but who knows?

Not everyone is as, um, rational and clear headed as you.

Either the guy is telling the truth and we are screwed, or the guy is either delusional which is more common than you think, desperate or a liar.

I really don't like Schwartz's language in his reports, he better be able to back it up.

 

[longislandcuse]

If the stepbrother denied this in 03 then hes done. End of story. Game over.

"I didnt think anyone would believe me." You went to the newspaper then ESPN in 05 and youre right, noone believed you. This whole story is built on the stepbrothers word. Unbelievable that this is what is fueling this story.

 

[Cusefan95]

Not everyone is as, um, rational and clear headed as you.

The craziest thing in this whole story is someone saying Barrel is rational and clear headed.

 

[senorpalmer]

Just watched the OTL interviews (or at least parts of them). Davis looked like a nervous wreck, and seems like maybe he's mentally challenged? That or a fantastic actor. I have no idea who's telling the truth right now, but I couldn't help but feel bad for the guy while watching that.

 

[Syracusian]

The craziest thing in this whole story is someone saying Barrel is rational and clear headed.

Lol. I think he was being sarcastic. Hence the "um".