Im glad that TC is such a good D player | Page 3 | Syracusefan.com

Im glad that TC is such a good D player

longislandcuse said:
He's not a D-2 player, you're right, that's too far but "unable to shoot" depends.

He's had games where he's unconscious so clearly he can shoot but if you term "being able to shoot" as being a reliable, consistent shooter, then no he can't shoot (yet).
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There are objective benchmarks that suggest Cooney can shoot. Saying that he can't shoot [yet] is not objective--its garbage analysis.

What he is is inconsistent. What he is is a role player. Which is something that many on this board seem to look down their nose upon.

We all want Cooney to be more consistent. Consistency could be the key to this team making a deep run, but team shooting it isn't entirely upon his shoulders this year, whereas it was last year. The best thing for Trevor Cooney will be for Gbinije, Patterson, and Joseph to all emerge as complimentary shooting threats to space the floor. If that happens, then Cooney is going to have a lot more open looks this year. The rest is up to him.
 
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RF2044 said:
There are objective benchmarks that suggest Cooney can shoot. Saying that he can't shoot ][yet] is not objective--its garbage analysis.

What he is is inconsistent. What he is is a role player. Which is something that many on this board seem to look down their nose upon.

We all want Cooney to be more consistent. Consistency could be the key to this team making a deep run, but team shooting it isn't entirely upon his shoulders this year, whereas it was last year. The best thing for Trevor Cooney will be for Gbinije, Patterson, and Joseph to all emerge as complimentary shooting threats to space the floor. If that happens, then Cooney is going to have a lot more open looks this year. The rest is up to him.
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You hit the nail on the head, other shooters should take pressure off his shoulders. Too much pressure on him last yr as he was the only shooter. We really didnt even have a true backup 2 guard last yr. to me Ron is the key, if he can come in , hit some shots, takes the pressure off Trevor and now he can just relax and play...and knock down shots. Lot easier to do that when theres not a ton of pressure
 
RF2044 said:
You know what else is annoying? Anti-player agendas, and rhetoric that starts after the second exhibition game.

If you're an SU fan, then root for everyone on the team instead of rooting for some to fail, and feel free to critique players on the basis of performance instead of throwing them under the bus over BS.
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Ah, an ever so subtle (perhaps even subliminal) message: you prefer bus(s) over TC.

The agenda is revealed! Only now is it clear that RF employs a policy of misdirection and half truths, spurring his minions to foment further discord and... um... I was headed somewhere with this.
 
MCC said:
Ah, an ever so subtle (perhaps even subliminal) message: you prefer bus(s) over TC.

The agenda is revealed! Only now is it clear that RF employs a policy of misdirection and half truths, spurring his minions to foment further discord and... um... I was headed somewhere with this.
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Everyone seems to like to call him the "shooting guard." Seems a little arbitrary, preconceived and thus problematic that way. I know that term fits into fan or announcer jargon, but has anyone like Boeheim ever used that term to describe him? Or is he really just one of the 2 starting guards?
 
I think the other problem with Cooney is that most players get the short leash treatment. TRob was on the bench after 10 seconds tonight. Eventually JB may have to play the bad guy with Cooney, but he does not seem to. Although much of the short leash is for being out of position, and not cold shooting. I know the best thing for cold shooting is to keep going at it. But eventually JB has to give some other guys a shot at this. The problem also is that the defense is still the cream of JBs teams, and Cooney plays it well, and the other potential 3 shooters do not.
 
Who's this guy saying TC is a D2 player... I play in one of the better D2 leagues, outstanding basketball, but TC is absolutely a HM D1 player... Has the speed and athleticism... Shoots it, defends real well... Just comes down to making shots... But if you are honestly questioning if he's a D1 player, I can tell you first hand you are so wrong., relax... It's an exhibition game against a Crappy team(no offense Adrian)... He probably just came out flat and lost confidence.. It happens.
 
So far he's a combined 4-19 from the field.
Why knock him?
He's already in mid-season form.

But it's still early and a number of guys didn't shoot well.
Still plenty of time to panic.
 
Tony DeFranco said:
I'm imagining Cooney is gonna see I'm not gonna lie - I'm a being die hard fanover hoops and football - but Troy Nunes changed my love for the football team - I'm praying Cooney doesnt do that to me regarding hoops - though I know Cooney is done once Malachi gets here
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Yes, because JB has a history of benching 3 year starting 5th year seniors in favor of true freshmen.
 
longislandcuse said:
I hate to be so negative in this thread as I really want Cooney to get it together but I'm so sick of hearing about 25-0.

Nobody outside of Syracuse cares about 25-0. All they remember from last years team is a squad that fell apart down the stretch and underachieved, yet again, in the tournament. Why did that happen? Because no one could shoot. We need people to be able to shoot, especially our shooting guard.
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25-0 didn't happen by accident. TC was a big part and a big part of some good wins against good teams.

He was also part of the collapse...along with Rak disappearing, Ennis's refusal or inability to get the ball inside or start a fast break, and CJ and Jerami's generally disinterested play. The collapse was a team effort including some bad coaching.

Worse than Trevor is our inability to develop a big man since Bernie left. Look at Brimah at UConn or whoever is next at Louisville. They come in as raw freshmen and are dominating by the end of the season. That will never happen here with the staff we have. This worries me much more than whether Trevor Cooney isn't as consistent as he needs to be.

And agree that TC needs to shoot better. He has to be a reliable scorer to keep the defense honest. Everyone knows that. People just get so over the top in their criticism of him that it drives nearly equally over the top defenses. The notion that he's a D2 or D3 (which has been argued here) talent is moronic. That stupidity is going to bring passionate defenses and will likely force people who like TC to dig in their heels in defense.

I'm at the point where I'd like a more reliable shooter to get minutes over him because our issue is offense, not defense. A slightly worse defense might actually speed up the game a little, which is also something I'd like to see.

We're at game two of a long season with the regular season beginning in three days. We have at least 10 more 50+ reply threads to go on this topic until our season ends. And unless we're banned from the tournament, it will likely end with TC going 2-10 whether that's in the Round of 64 or the Final Four, so there will probably be a few more after that. And then we get all of next year and I'm sure there will be even more debates about him after he graduates.
 
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Why do we care what our guys did against a division 3 team? Man Trevor didn't shoot well, but I watched the game, really nobody did for us. Cmac was about 0-11 at one point. Patterson was about 2-8 from three. People have their proverbial panties in a bunch over nothing.
 
"Stevie Thompson was unable to shoot. Trevor Cooney, streaky as he might be, can shoot."

heyheyhey ! mr. stevie t shot over 30% from trey town. and 56% from the floor!
 
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RF2044 said:
Just so I'm clear on the magnitude of perspective you lack, the ENTIRE ACC season?

Just stop.
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Cooney was 44 for 141 during the entire ACC season last year. But 9 of the 44 came in one game (9 for 12 vs. ND). Take the ND game out and he shot 27% on 129 attempts.

Other performances included:
0-5 vs WF
0-3 vs Duke
1-8 vs GT
2-12 vs Miami
2-12 vs UNC
1-6 vs BC
1-6 vs NCSU
2-10 vs MD

Will he be better in 2014-15? Who knows?
 
Tony DeFranco said:
I'd pay for Malachi's scholarship if he could play this year - Cooney may be a nice kid but he was the reason we blew up a special season last year - he's simply not capable of starting on a team that wants to be in the mix for a title
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Come on, man. I'm as concerned about this level of play as the next guy, but Cooney wasn't the reason for that horrible finish last year. How about the point guard who couldn't start a break or get us into a halfcourt set? The star who could only use one hand? The coaching staff that couldn't find an adequate backup among all those top-50 recruits on the bench?

This team needs a shooting guard who can shoot and score consistently, that's all.
 
RF2044 said:
No I'm not. Calling him a D2 player isn't being objective. Bitching about him being unable to shoot is not being objective.

I'm not blindly defending anyone. I'm sick of the dogma. If he continues to struggle, well--we've got other options. But I think people are being hyper critical because he's the designated lightning rod.
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Seems like that comes with the position. Been fairly consistent ripping on our two guard for a bunch of years here. Tough group.
 
Jack Hall said:
You hit the nail on the head, other shooters should take pressure off his shoulders. Too much pressure on him last yr as he was the only shooter. We really didnt even have a true backup 2 guard last yr. to me Ron is the key, if he can come in , hit some shots, takes the pressure off Trevor and now he can just relax and play...and knock down shots. Lot easier to do that when theres not a ton of pressure
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I think the better option would be for other players on the starting 5 to start making some shots, especially 3s, as well. Having him look over his shoulder at the bench isn't going to take the pressure off, having the PG and others be second and third threats from outside will really help Trevor a lot more. Just my opinion.
 
OttoinGrotto said:
I haven't been able to watch these games and have been basing my thoughts on posts on here - how is he looking as a passer this season?
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He isn't.

He'll find Christmas now and again, but for the most part he's just skipping the ball back to the point guard if an open shot isn't available. I'm very surprised by this; I really thought Cooney would demonstrate some more well-rounded skills by this point. It's like he's a guard in name only. Reminiscent of Jason Cipolla and some of those designated shooters/defenders we played years ago.
 
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