JB's Postgame Presser | Monmouth

[Brooky03]

Rebounding is an effort stat more so than any other stat. Sure, there’s some skill to it, but it’s really just a matter of making it a priority.

I don’t think I’d be going out on a limb to say JB keeps bringing it up because he’s trying to drill it in to Bell’s head. He clearly thinks Bell has the much higher upside, so Bell has gotten opportunities to show JB he’s willing to try. So far, so bad, but we all know conference play is where we’ll get the real answer.

 

[Chip]

What happens with Bell will be interesting. JB has given him a loooooong leash but he’s going to have to get his nose dirty or sit and transfer.

Wait until the ACC workload.

"I can't play a guy who gets zero rebounds".

Bell averages a rebound every 18 minutes. The only other guys who are double digits are the guards, and aren't as bad.

I know JB wants it to work out, because he's really our only other 3 point shooter in the starting lineup, but shaming him into rebounding better just isn't working.

 

[br801]

No. Im saying that personally i dont recall any of our forwards making great improvements in rebounding. Centers usually take the longest to develop.
Im sure we have had centers that have significantly improved as rebounders i just dont remember any.

I just gave you one.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Man these pressers just don’t come off well.

Even at the end Donna tried to throw him a layup about Bennys improved shooting and JB said “it’s just one game he’s shouting 22%”.

Bell can’t rebound, we get it. But he constantly brings it up yet continues to play him. Either don’t bring it up anymore or sit him.

So my thing is, how are we measuring how well Bell rebounds?

We can start with the base assumption that his rebounding is not good, and that a zero rebound game is too common for him and not acceptable.

But there's a lot of recency bias to the zero rebounds criticism, because the previous game against Georgetown he got 3 rebounds in 22 minutes. Is that enough? Is that acceptable? Is that stepping up?

When is the point where Bell crosses the line from doesn't rebound well enough to his rebounding isn't Rodman level but isn't an issue?

 

[Bulldog04]

I Would have a very tough time as a parent watching these press conferences. Your job as a coach is to make the kids better, lift them up, give a jolt of confidence and be honest BEHIND the scenes. I’ve never seen a coach act like this on a consistent basis. YOU’RE THE COACH, it’s your job to improve these things. It’s your job to give them a system that helps them. I’ve had to stop watching these bc it’s just wrong. There’s zero encouragement during the game. There’s zero excitement during the game. It’s just whining and complaining as usual.

 

[Orangezoo]

I Would have a very tough time as a parent watching these press conferences. Your job as a coach is to make the kids better, lift them up, give a jolt of confidence and be honest BEHIND the scenes. I’ve never seen a coach act like this on a consistent basis. YOU’RE THE COACH, it’s your job to improve these things. It’s your job to give them a system that helps them. I’ve had to stop watching these bc it’s just wrong. There’s zero encouragement during the game. There’s zero excitement during the game. It’s just whining and complaining as usual.

I will say I've seen him talking vs yelling at guys on the bench more this year. Not sure why it translates back to all the targeted and aggrivated comments in the presser.

 

[dasher]

That would have been selfish and very poor form. Whatever his warts, it seems that JB has the long term best interests of his players at heart and let’s that guide his advice about turning pro.

JB had no idea that Cole would get signed by the Lakers. Jb didn't want anything to disturb Benny because he wanted Benny here to make sure he got Mintz. Would it have been selfish to go out and recruit a portal forward. Same reason he didn't.

 

[PhatOrange]

"I can't play a guy who gets zero rebounds".

Bell averages a rebound every 18 minutes. The only other guys who are double digits are the guards, and aren't as bad.

I know JB wants it to work out, because he's really our only other 3 point shooter in the starting lineup, but shaming him into rebounding better just isn't working.

He's probably tore him up in practice about it to so I don't think anything is working. But the message is being sent loud and clear. Either rebound or sit.

He's not getting rebounds against D3 teams...once ACC play starts it won't be easier.

...somewhere along the line JB decided it was better to have 4 chuckers on the arc. I don't understand it. JB used to play Arinze, Rick Jackson and Paul Harris together as a starting lineup.

The team that went 34-3 started, Fab Melo, Christmas, Jardine, Triche and Kris Joseph.

Brown does so many little things and if he's good for 8/10pts on put backs and dunks and 6/7 rebounds then he's got to be on the court. Those things aren't coming from someone else.

Id go with a mix of Benny, Taylor and Bell at the 3 and stick with whom ever is producing that night. Taylor and Bell can spell some minutes at 2g just the same.

 

[Orangezoo]

I don't think there is a big choice when it comes to who plays at forward. Everyone has been up and down including Quadir when he gets a chance at the 3. Bol last night was back to being unfocused and having weak hands while really doing more roaming than anything else. Benny was soft on D early and over thinking it. Brown got better as he played but was a bit of a roller coaster defensively early. Taylor did little but wasn't out there long enough to do much anyways. Quadir came on too late to get a read. So not one forward really built on previous good games for their entire run despite some having a better second half.

 

[PhatOrange]

So my thing is, how are we measuring how well Bell rebounds?

We can start with the base assumption that his rebounding is not good, and that a zero rebound game is too common for him and not acceptable.

But there's a lot of recency bias to the zero rebounds criticism, because the previous game against Georgetown he got 3 rebounds in 22 minutes. Is that enough? Is that acceptable? Is that stepping up?

When is the point where Bell crosses the line from doesn't rebound well enough to his rebounding isn't Rodman level but isn't an issue?

I'd say the baseline should be 3 but could be what your starting SF's historically average. Sports Reference is a great site. 2013-14 Syracuse Roster and Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

I cherry picked a few players here:

Career
Fair 5.7, Kris Joseph 4.5, Southerland 3.3, GBinije 3.1 (avg 5 & 4 his last two yrs)

 

[OttoinGrotto]

I'd say the baseline should be 3 but could what your starting SF's historically average. Sports Reference is a great site. 2013-14 Syracuse Roster and Stats | College Basketball at Sports-Reference.com

I cherry picked a few players here:

Career
Fair 5.7, Kris Joseph 4.5, Southerland 3.3, GBinije 3.1 (avg 5 & 4 his last two yrs)

I think you made a good crack at it, but isn't it expecting a lot for a true freshman to rebound as well as players did over their whole careers that included their senior years when they were at their best and playing the most?

 

[Orangezoo]

Per team rankings we are 174 in rebound rate. Previous 10 years in order we were 230, 248, 220, 253, 51, 214, 204, 107, 41, 64.

So far we better than recent years but conference play to come still.

 

[PhatOrange]

I think you made a good crack at it, but isn't it expecting a lot for a true freshman to rebound as well as players did over their whole careers that included their senior years when they were at their best and playing the most?

It is a lot to ask and I considered that. Not many SFs have started as freshman under JB so it's hard to gauge what he should be doing. But he is playing a lot of minutes not even getting rebounds by accident.

Bell is averaging 20 mpg game and 1.2 rebounds

DeMetrius Nichols started 15 games as a freshman, averaged 22mpg and averaged 2.2 rpg

Paul Harris averaged 22mpg as a frosh and averaged 7.1 rpg

Kris Joseph aveaged 13 mpg as a frosh and averaged 2.3 rpg

Rebounding is a mindset as much as a technique. At the end of the day just go get the ball.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

It is a lot to ask and I considered that. Not many SFs have started as freshman under JB so it's hard to gauge what he should be doing. But, he is starting and playing a lot of minutes. He's not even getting rebounds by accident.

Bell is averaging 20 mpg game and 1.2 rebounds

DeMetrius Nichols started 15 games as a freshman, averaged 22pg and averaged 2.2 rpg

Paul Harris average 22mpg as a frosh and average 7.1 rpg

Kris Joseph aveage 13 mpg as a frosh and averaged 2.3 rpg

Rebounding is a mindset as much as a technique. At the end of the day just go get the ball.

I mean it feels like making the jump from one to two rebounds a game isn't a crazy or impossible one.

 

[PhatOrange]

I mean it feels like making the jump from one to two rebounds a game isn't a crazy or impossible one.

If he could rebound he'd play 38 minutes a night. Someone should tell him that.

 

[Chip]

I mean it feels like making the jump from one to two rebounds a game isn't a crazy or impossible one.

Per JB in his presser, there were a couple where he wasn't upset that Bell didn't get the rebound, he was upset that he didn't even try.

If we're to believe that, then it's a huge problem.

 

[Jake]

It’s a surprise to absolutely no one that Chris Bell is driving JB crazy. And to be honest, he’d drive most coaches crazy.

As I’ve said before he plays like he’s at a bar playing Pop -A-Shot.

There’s very little energy and effort in his game at this point.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Per JB in his presser, there were a couple where he wasn't upset that Bell didn't get the rebound, he was upset that he didn't even try.

If we're to believe that, then it's a huge problem.

Which, probably happens, and it's fair to be upset about that.

There are a lot of other times when we have guys that consistently don't try at things, and they continue to get minutes, so...

 

[Orangezoo]

I mean it feels like making the jump from one to two rebounds a game isn't a crazy or impossible one.

Thing about Bell is weak hands and balance at times too. He like Bol gets himself hands on many boards but always struggles to squeeze it. Bol has been better of late but still does it.

 

[Sherman20]

It’s time to try Taylor or Brown at the other forward to see which one plays better. Bell had his chance starting.

He played Benny and Brown at the forwards for a bit last night, but it’s really not ideal, especially once you get into ACC play. You need spacing. You can’t have three guys clogging the lane (Jesse, Brown and Benny) and another trying to drive into the lane (Judah), and no one else besides Joe as a threat to shoot. Jesse has no room to operate and he’s easier to double with a clogged lane. You need another shooter on the floor (though Benny’s mid range game is starting to come along). Bell has to figure out a way to rebound and play better defense. Same with Taylor. As Dasher has said, it was foolish to go into the season hoping to rely on two freshman at small forward. We needed Cole to return or to get a good small forward out of the portal if we wanted to be a tourney level team. I’m hoping things will start to click with Bell and Taylor, at least in terms of defense and rebounding.

 

[Jake]

I Would have a very tough time as a parent watching these press conferences. Your job as a coach is to make the kids better, lift them up, give a jolt of confidence and be honest BEHIND the scenes. I’ve never seen a coach act like this on a consistent basis. YOU’RE THE COACH, it’s your job to improve these things. It’s your job to give them a system that helps them. I’ve had to stop watching these bc it’s just wrong. There’s zero encouragement during the game. There’s zero excitement during the game. It’s just whining and complaining as usual.

I hear ya and I think there’s much truth to what you’re saying.

The problem JB has, and I think he realizes it, is his biggest teaching weapon has been taken away from him.

He uses the bench as a motivator - he’s always felt that that was the greatest motivator. But the portal has taken that away.

“Oh, you don’t like the way I play?….I’m out”.

I don’t think JB is the only coach affected. I think a lot of his generation of coaches (of which he’s nearly the last) feel the same way.

So I am watching Gonzaga play Washington, the other night, and it was terrible basketball.

Both teams were taking terrible shots early in the shot clock. Gonzaga won because they got the ball to Drew Timme inside, and he basically won the game by himself.

But repeatedly, both teams, especially the guards, were taking horrible shots early in the shot clock. Neither Coach sat those players, even though they were clearly exasperated by the shot selection.

I think that’s what you’re starting to see in the game overall. There’s a deterioration because coaches feel they can’t really Coach to get more efficient offensive sets.

It’s not just here, I think it’s all over the country. And I think it’s a great challenge for this generation of coaches to try and affect discipline on the court, while not upsetting this newly empowered generation of players.

 

[upperdeck]

Rebounding is positioning and effort and timing.. You can easily work harder to go after balls. Timing is something some have and some dont. But positioning is something you can work on and all it takes is practice with live shots

 

[CuseFaninVT]

He played Benny and Brown at the forwards for a bit last night, but it’s really not ideal, especially once you get into ACC play. You need spacing. You can’t have three guys clogging the lane (Jesse, Brown and Benny) and another trying to drive into the lane (Judah), and no one else besides Joe as a threat to shoot. Jesse has no room to operate and he’s easier to double with a clogged lane. You need another shooter on the floor (though Benny’s mid range game is starting to come along). Bell has to figure out a way to rebound and play better defense. Same with Taylor. As Dasher has said, it was foolish to go into the season hoping to rely on two freshman at small forward. We needed Cole to return or to get a good small forward out of the portal if we wanted to be a tourney level team. I’m hoping things will start to click with Bell and Taylor, at least in terms of defense and rebounding.

Man, I see a different Taylor than many of you. His activity on defense is pretty good. Id prefer him up top, but his positioning on the wings has been better than I expected.

 

[Orangezoo]

I hear ya and I think there’s much truth to what you’re saying.

The problem JB has, and I think he realizes it, is his biggest teaching weapon has been taken away from him.

He uses the bench as a motivator - he’s always felt that that was the greatest motivator. But the portal has taken that away.

“Oh, you don’t like the way I play?….I’m out”.

I don’t think JB is the only coach affected. I think a lot of his generation of coaches (of which he’s nearly the last) feel the same way.

So I am watching Gonzaga play Washington, the other night, and it was terrible basketball.

Both teams were taking terrible shots early in the shot clock. Gonzaga won because they got the ball to Drew Timme inside, and he basically won the game by himself.

But repeatedly, both teams, especially the guards, were taking horrible shots early in the shot clock. Neither Coach sat those players, even though they were clearly exasperated by the shot selection.

I think that’s what you’re starting to see in the game overall. There’s a deterioration because coaches feel they can’t really Coach to get more efficient offensive sets.

It’s not just here, I think it’s all over the country. And I think it’s a great challenge for this generation of coaches to try and affect discipline on the court, while not upsetting this newly empowered generation of players.

Sadly you see where it comes from too. Watching the Sierra Canyon vs CTK (Bronny vs Kiyan) last night captured all the same. Lots of poor decisions all around.

Also- perfectly epitomized the state of the sport when Kiyan set a really nice screen in the paint for the big kid going to UCLA who as a result had a lane to the hoop and finished. Not a single ounce of respect given to the screener after the play just that kid celebrating. It's killing the team aspect of Hoops a little more every year.

 

[Newhouser]

He played Benny and Brown at the forwards for a bit last night, but it’s really not ideal, especially once you get into ACC play. You need spacing. You can’t have three guys clogging the lane (Jesse, Brown and Benny) and another trying to drive into the lane (Judah), and no one else besides Joe as a threat to shoot. Jesse has no room to operate and he’s easier to double with a clogged lane. You need another shooter on the floor (though Benny’s mid range game is starting to come along). Bell has to figure out a way to rebound and play better defense. Same with Taylor. As Dasher has said, it was foolish to go into the season hoping to rely on two freshman at small forward. We needed Cole to return or to get a good small forward out of the portal if we wanted to be a tourney level team. I’m hoping things will start to click with Bell and Taylor, at least in terms of defense and rebounding.

I agree but putting a shooter on the floor who hasn't made shots and does nothing else to contribute is not sustainable. Nobody is going to guard Bell until he makes a few in a row consistently and it takes so long to get a shot off, I think ACC coaches will say - don't sweat him.