Lets pump the brakes...

[sdpenny32]

Saturday was awful. We all know it, but lets not panic. We were on the road, hung over from the biggest win in ten years, facing a team we dont match up well with who happened to have the emotional edge with the return of an injured player, and we flat out played poorly. I know it was hard to watch but lets take a step back and look at the big picture. If the program continues trending the way it is, we will soon see a day when we can come out flat and have a bad game like Saturday and still in, but we simply arent there yet. Also, this game hurts our BCS chances but honestly, the team is not ready for that stage. I would rather see them play a beatable opponent than go out and get throttled in front of the entire nation in a BCS game. All I am saying is that as bad as Saturday was, it is not the end of the world. The future is bright.

 

[orange79]

OMG - a voice of reason. Watch out - thoughts like that will get you branded as having a loser mentality.

 

[orange03]

OMG - a voice of reason. Watch out - thoughts like that will get you branded as having a loser mentality.

Having concerns doesn't make you less of a fan. Not everyone lives in Pleasantville. We've improved from where we were, but we still have a long way to go.

 

[RF2044]

Having concerns doesn't make you less of a fan. Not everyone lives in Pleasantville. We've improved from where we were, but we still have a long way to go.

Does anyone dispute that?

Back during the GRob era when we played Iowa a couple of times, there were many, many posts describing how Kirk Ferentz was the type of coach many posters wished we had--and lauding him for taking an awful program and coaching them up to get to a bowl in his third year.

Marrone got to a bowl in year two.

Hell yes, we still have a long way to go--but that's what happens when you've hit rock bottom and are literally the worst BCS program in collegiate football. Does anyone dispute that those were the depths to which we'd sunk?

 

[Cadillac]

Does anyone dispute that?

Back during the GRob era when we played Iowa a couple of times, there were many, many posts describing how Kirk Ferentz was the type of coach many posters wished we had--and lauding him for taking an awful program and coaching them up to get to a bowl in his third year.

Marrone got to a bowl in year two.

Hell yes, we still have a long way to go--but that's what happens when you've hit rock bottom and are literally the worst BCS program in collegiate football. Does anyone dispute that those were the depths to which we'd sunk?

Yeah, you'd think the one thing we would have brought back from our collective trip to the bottom of the ocean and back is a little perspective.

 

[Upstate]

My concern is that we're running into a very similar UConn team this weekend.

 

[GoSU96]

We've improved from where we were, but we still have a long way to go.

Who doesn't know that?

 

[orange79]

Having concerns doesn't make you less of a fan. Not everyone lives in Pleasantville. We've improved from where we were, but we still have a long way to go.

No one disputes that. There are some on this board however, that feel if you do not agree with them, you are a loser, an , or worse. Go back and read some this weekends' posts if you think I am exaggerating. I love discussion. What happened this weekend was syracuse.com-like. Just awful.

 

[RF2044]

No one disputes that. There are some on this board however, that feel if you do not agree with them, you are a loser, an , or worse. Go back and read some this weekends' posts if you think I am exaggerating. I love discussion. What happened this weekend was syracuse.com-like. Just awful.

Very true.

 

[Shenexon]

I just want to win. I had high hopes after WVU but the kids aren't pros and are affected more by emotions on both sides of the ball. Saturday was frustrating to see us so flat and Louisville so pumped, but the emotional swings are what I like in the college game as opposed to the pros. Same thing goes for basketball. To return to my earlier point: I just want to win.

 

[orange03]

Who doesn't know that?

No clue. My point was that some posters attack anyone who isn't 100% sold on the team and/or program. It's ok to have an opinion, whether it's right or not shouldn't matter.

 

[orange79]

No clue. My point was that some posters attack anyone who isn't 100% sold on the team and/or program. It's ok to have an opinion, whether it's right or not shouldn't matter.

Similarly, some posters attack anyone who is not sold on the fact that Marrone is NOT the guy. Works both ways. Agree though - opinions are opinions. You should not necessarily be attacked for having one. Something 'both sides' of this argument need to remember.

 

[GoSU96]

It's ok to have an opinion, whether it's right or not shouldn't matter.

Not all opinions are equally valid. Arguments and positions devoid of context, grounding in objective facts, and making assessments based on both where the program is relative to its peers and where it is relative to past state and progress from that state are not good arguments.

 

[SU2NASA]

Pump the brakes?

 

[BlueCurtain]

We were... hung over... facing a team...with the emotional edge with the return of an injured player.

This had little to do with emotion. Marrone has not figured out a way to beat physical, attacking teams.

 

[orange03]

Not all opinions are equally valid. Arguments and positions devoid of context, grounding in objective facts, and making assessments based on both where the program is relative to its peers and where it is relative to past state and progress from that state are not good arguments.

While your argument applies to some, I've noticed a lot of people who want to stone you to death if you say anything negative about the program or disagree with their opinion. For instance, I'm not completely sold on Doug just yet. He's done a helluva job to get us respectable, but I'm not sure he can recruit the kids to get us to the next level. I hope I'm wrong. Our schedule is gonna get a tad bit harder the next couple years, I hope we're not stuck in neutral.

 

[OttoinGrotto]

Saturday was awful. We all know it, but lets not panic. We were on the road, hung over from the biggest win in ten years, facing a team we dont match up well with who happened to have the emotional edge with the return of an injured player, and we flat out played poorly.

Not really. I read all kinds of posts on here about how good a matchup this was for us. Stuff about how the defense was going to roll against a freshman QB that had really struggled to move the ball, how the offense we saw against WFVU was what we had going forward, etc.

Louisville became a bad matchup once they kicked the crap out of us.

 

[kingottoiii]

I have no doubt what so ever that Marrone is a decent HC. But I want and expect SU to be a good program. I think an average season at SU should be 8-5 (5-4). Sure we will have some 5-7s in there but we should also have some 10-3s to even it out. So that is my question with Marrone. I have no doubt he will be an over .500 HC. But will he be a .615 or better HC (.500 or better in ACC)? That is what I have been trying to figure out in my posts.

BTW if you take Coach P's record from 1999-2004 (post McNabb), stretch it out over a 12 game season, stretch it out over a 9 game conference season, and add in Bowl games for our Bowl eligible seasons where we were left out because there weren't 7439 Bowl games a year, then SU's average over that time would be 7-5.85 (4.6-4.4). That got P fired!

I have no doubt that Marrone will be able to replicate what P did from 1999-2004 record wise in the ACC. And if that is were he is at for his career he likely will be here until he retires, as he is an SU guy. However I will be a little disappointed that he was never able to get SU from decent to good. I think we could and should be there.

So that IMO is all we should be debating right now. Will Marrone be able to take SU from decent to good? And that is a fair debate.

 

[Avatusstone28]

My concern is that we're running into a very similar UConn team this weekend.

If that's the case, let's hope Marrone and the coaching staff can get the team prepared.

None of the remaining games are going to be easy.

 

[GoSU96]

I have no doubt what so ever that Marrone is a decent HC. But I want and expect SU to be a good program. I think an average season at SU should be 8-5 (5-4). Sure we will have some 5-7s in there but we should also have some 10-3s to even it out. So that is my question with Marrone. I have no doubt he will be an over .500 HC. But will he be a .615 or better HC (.500 or better in ACC)? That is what I have been trying to figure out in my posts.

BTW if you take Coach P's record from 1999-2004 (post McNabb), stretch it out over a 12 game season, stretch it out over a 9 game conference season, and add in Bowl games for our Bowl eligible seasons where we were left out because there weren't 7439 Bowl games a year, then SU's average over that time would be 7-5.85 (4.6-4.4). That got P fired!

I have no doubt that Marrone will be able to replicate what P did from 1999-2004 record wise in the ACC. And if that is were he is at for his career he likely will be here until he retires, as he is an SU guy. However I will be a little disappointed that he was never able to get SU from decent to good. I think we could and should be there.

So that IMO is all we should be debating right now. Will Marrone be able to take SU from decent to good? And that is a fair debate.

They are 2 2/3 seasons removed from being one of the ten worst programs in D-1. The team is 13-8 the last 21 games, and has 53 (including four Juco) scholarship players in their 1st or 2nd years in the program.

This program is on a obvious trend of improvement. Why assume they have topped out?

 

[matcuse]

Saturday was awful. We all know it, but lets not panic. We were on the road, hung over from the biggest win in ten years, facing a team we dont match up well with who happened to have the emotional edge with the return of an injured player, and we flat out played poorly. I know it was hard to watch but lets take a step back and look at the big picture. If the program continues trending the way it is, we will soon see a day when we can come out flat and have a bad game like Saturday and still in, but we simply arent there yet. Also, this game hurts our BCS chances but honestly, the team is not ready for that stage. I would rather see them play a beatable opponent than go out and get throttled in front of the entire nation in a BCS game. All I am saying is that as bad as Saturday was, it is not the end of the world. The future is bright.

agree 1000% im happy where we are and i think the next 3 yrs are going to be alot of fun!!

 

[tep624]

facing a team we dont match up well with

I think the team really ran into the perfect storm on Saturday. The playing on the road thing I really don't think is as much a factor - the team showed last year that they were better on the road than at home. I think the biggest factors were that the team came in complacent and over confident after the WVU thrashing, ran into a team, specifically on defense, that they don't match up with well at all (Nassib looked like the ball was a hand grenade about to go off everytime it was snapped due to the pressure), and we don't have a defense this year that is going to shut opponents down. You put all those factors together and it's not a shock the team was crushed. Getting down early led to frustration penalties which made the situation worse.

Just a bad effort all the way around and I truly believe we'll see a stark contrast this week vs. UCONN.

 

[tep624]

While your argument applies to some, I've noticed a lot of people who want to stone you to death if you say anything negative about the program or disagree with their opinion. For instance, I'm not completely sold on Doug just yet. He's done a helluva job to get us respectable, but I'm not sure he can recruit the kids to get us to the next level. I hope I'm wrong. Our schedule is gonna get a tad bit harder the next couple years, I hope we're not stuck in neutral.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. If people want to be more skeptical of Marrone than I am or downright pessimistic about the team's outlook, that's their perogative and they're entitled to it. I'll debate with people but I'm not going to tell them how they should think - that's up to them. I have faith in Marrone but seeing how inconsistent the team is this year, I think to have doubts is perfectly reasonable.

What I draw issue is with people who are adults that act like they're ten years old after a loss (or in some cases this year a win) and have to result to posting nasty comments towards the players or the team as a whole because they have a temper tantrum everytime the team loses or doesn't perform to their expectations. It just amazes me that because of the anonymity of the internet, people feel it's acceptable to act like that. And it's the same people every time.

 

[orange79]

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. If people want to be more skeptical of Marrone than I am or downright pessimistic about the team's outlook, that's their perogative and they're entitled to it. I'll debate with people but I'm not going to tell them how they should think - that's up to them. I have faith in Marrone but seeing how inconsistent the team is this year, I think to have doubts is perfectly reasonable.

What I draw issue is with people who are adults that act like they're ten years old after a loss (or in some cases this year a win) and have to result to posting nasty comments towards the players or the team as a whole because they have a temper tantrum everytime the team loses or doesn't perform to their expectations. It just amazes me that because of the anonymity of the internet, people feel it's acceptable to act like that. And it's the same people every time.

Amen

 

[orangecuse]

Not all opinions are equally valid. Arguments and positions devoid of context, grounding in objective facts, and making assessments based on both where the program is relative to its peers and where it is relative to past state and progress from that state are not good arguments.

Interesting argument you're attempting to make about your opinion that all opinions are not equally valid. It is your opinion, not a matter of fact. Who's to say one's opinion is more valid than another's. Opinions dervive from one's own life experiences, circumstances and thinking. There can be the same set of facts, where one, or many, can draw several different conclusions because of the this, it happens all the time, especially in this global environment we live in today. Conflicts arise when people insist that their opinion is right and neglect to appreciate an alternative perspective...thus, instead of politely disagreeing, they're disagreeable.