OT: Jamesville-DeWitt benches basketball star after third felony charge

[EastCoast2]

1975?

2007

 

[EastCoast2]

Beating and robbing a man for $60? This kid is one thrown punch from spending 10+ years behind bars. People can get punched, fall over, hit their head, and die. He'd be looking at manslaughter if he's lucky, or even robbery with a deadly weapon. An inch this way or that way and his life is over. JD admin should be ashamed. Enabling a kid because he scores 17 ppg in high school basketball.

 

[cusefan88]

My school sucks now

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

I must have missed the part about the constitutional right to play high school basketball when I was in law school.

Were you present when they taught about the 14th Amendment? Because that is more likely the way this would get mucked up (note i intentionally did not say "a favorable outcome").

 

[kirbivore]

My school, they took the same bus to away games

same here

 

[kirbivore]

so was this worse than whatever they fired their former coach for, who's now prospering at Grimes

 

[EastCoast2]

A very senior high school teacher and coach told me a number of years ago, "The world has changed. I'm afraid to tell a kid to sit down and shut up because the next day I'll be in front of the principal, the parents and a lawyer. So I say nothing. I'm not going to risk my position and pension."

This is why when people blame millennials for everything, I say, look at their parents. Its the parents, teachers, lawyers, politicians of the generation above who are soft, and enabling kids to do things like this and get away with it. Remember the former SU football player who stabbed two other players at a party? I bet there were dozens of warning signs in high school that were ignored because he was good at a sport.

 

[EastCoast2]

so was this worse than whatever they fired their former coach for, whose now prospering at Grimes

Funny thing is, a few "powerful" parents at JD basically forced the JD AD and admin to fire BM at JD. And now, where are those parents? No longer involved with the school because their kids are grown.

 

[Horn88]

This is why when people blame millennials for everything, I say, look at their parents. Its the parents, teachers, lawyers, politicians of the generation above who are soft, and enabling kids to do things like this and get away with it. Remember the former SU football player who stabbed two other players at a party? I bet there were dozens of warning signs in high school that were ignored because he was good at a sport.

Frank Martin said it best:

“You know what makes me sick to my stomach? When I hear grown people say that kids have changed. Kids haven’t changed. Kids don’t know anything about anything. We’ve changed as adults. We demand less of kids. We expect less of kids. We make their lives easier instead of preparing them for what life is truly about. We’re the ones that have changed. To blame kids is a cop-out.”

 

[AlaskaSU]

Legally a school has no right to suspend a student/ “throw him out” for something they do outside of school that has no connection to school.

BS. Suppose a kid is a mass murder terrorist, but not yet convicted and you think the school has to keep him enrolled?

 

[JOC44]

Were you present when they taught about the 14th Amendment? Because that is more likely the way this would get mucked up (note i intentionally did not say "a favorable outcome").

Yes, I seem to remember that. But as you intimate, good luck getting a judge to tell a school that it has to put a kid back on the high school basketball team because of his constitutional right to play basketball until convicted of a felony. That brings to mind the question "if I do x, can I get sued?" The answer is always yes because somebody can sue you for anything. The right question is whether they'd have a valid claim.

Love your avatar by the way.

 

[AZOrange]

Were you present when they taught about the 14th Amendment? Because that is more likely the way this would get mucked up (note i intentionally did not say "a favorable outcome").

I mean if you go to law school it’s basically all they teach you in Con Law. I still have the nightmares...

 

[AZOrange]

Yes, I seem to remember that. But as you intimate, good luck getting a judge to tell a school that it has to put a kid back on the high school basketball team because of his constitutional right to play basketball until convicted of a felony. That brings to mind the question "if I do x, can I get sued?" The answer is always yes because somebody can sue you for anything. The right question is whether they'd have a valid claim.

Love your avatar by the way.

It’s actually my favorite legal question followed by “what are their damages”?

 

[Shrmdougluvr]

Yes, I seem to remember that. But as you intimate, good luck getting a judge to tell a school that it has to put a kid back on the high school basketball team because of his constitutional right to play basketball until convicted of a felony. That brings to mind the question "if I do x, can I get sued?" The answer is always yes because somebody can sue you for anything. The right question is whether they'd have a valid claim.

Love your avatar by the way.

I don't disagree. Also, what you are discussing has been litigating. Students have taken the position that by kicking me off team x, you have deprived me the opportunity to go to school x on scholly. That arguments been shut down.

I am looking more at it from the "equal protection" standpoint. Again, not saying there is merit, but African-American student notes [insert white student] got a UPM over the summer, and he wasn't kicked off the team, and you are now facing a discrimination claim.

 

[PhatOrange]

How is this loser still on the team? Benched? You'd think after the first felony something would happen, second, sure, third and he's benched?

Jamesville-DeWitt benches basketball star after third felony charge

serious question. But how would the school know if he was arrested for a felony during the summer. heck how would they know anytime? it's not like he has to self report.

He robbed someone of $60 at the Price Chopper in Western Lights???? This kid is a thug repeat offender and should go to jail. I can't tell you how many times I've walked over to that Price Chopper late at night from my inlaws house up by westhill.

 

[PhatOrange]

I'm way out of this, especially in the Public schools. Private schools are different. This kid would have been long gone.

But public School administrators, teachers and coaches are poorly prepared and very nervous about this sort of thing. It's a legal and political minefield for them.

A very senior high school teacher and coach told me a number of years ago, "The world has changed. I'm afraid to tell a kid to sit down and shut up because the next day I'll be in front of the principal, the parents and a lawyer. So I say nothing. I'm not going to risk my position and pension."

sad but true

 

[creatorsgam]

BS. Suppose a kid is a mass murder terrorist, but not yet convicted and you think the school has to keep him enrolled?

If not convicted then they wouldn’t be a mass murder terrorist.

If they were still being held in district, they would place the student on homebound services more than likely.

But to call BS and follow it up with such a ridiculous scenario is, ironically, BS.

 

[SUbear]

Charges are charges, convictions are convictions. The original charge occurred before school started, so I can see a school overlooking that and letting the kid participate. After the second one, we're in grayer territory.

I highly doubt he is innocent of all (hell, any) of the charges, but innocence is supposed to be the presumption.

Btw, keeping a kid who is obviously hanging with the wrong crowd, involved in productive after school activities is not the worst thing the school could do.

Participating in interscholastic athletics is a priviledge not a right, first charge okay maybe you can let it slide after the second he should have been gone. Coach, AD and Principal should be canned.
Is this not the same bunch that forced out their long time winning head coach a couple years ago?

 

[SUbear]

The severity of the crime is inconsequential when the facts aren't known. The school said they didn't have the information needed to take action; which is likely, given how police investigations work when minors are involved.

Punishment is supposed to come after a conviction. At the very least, you wait for facts that push guilt into 'more than likely' territory. 3 separate felony charges is enough to take action. 2 was maybe/probably enough. 1, outside of school during the summer, is not, imo.

Yes and that is why he does not go to jail until convicted. Being on his HS team is not guaranteed by the constitution.

 

[SUbear]

Legally a school has no right to suspend a student/ “throw him out” for something they do outside of school that has no connection to school.

You are wrong, the school has a right to establish an acceptable code of conduct for its athletic teams and can suspend or terminate violators of the code.
Whether JD has a code can be questioned, but but they could and should.

 

[creatorsgam]

You are wrong, the school has a right to establish an acceptable code of conduct for its athletic teams and can suspend or terminate violators of the code.

A simpleton take.

As a high school coach in the fall/spring, I have an athlete pledge for both sports covering conduct at school. It can go no further per my school’s administration and lawyers.

If you think I’m going to be a part of the inevitable litigation that would occur if I try to apply conduct to include behavior off campus/school hours, you are insane.

I’m not going to be sued for overstepping my boundary. This isn’t the late 90’s when my lacrosse coach would call to make sure we were adhering to a curfew if we had a game the next morning.

 

[SUbear]

A simpleton take.

As a high school coach in the fall/spring, I have an athlete pledge for both sports covering conduct at school. It can go no further per my school’s administration and lawyers.

If you think I’m going to be a part of the inevitable litigation that would occur if I try to apply conduct to include behavior off campus/school hours, you are insane.

I’m not going to be sued for overstepping my boundary. This isn’t the late 90’s when my lacrosse coach would call to make sure we were adhering to a curfew if we had a game the next morning.

Where did I say the coach would have that authority? The school administration would have that authority, the coaches job would be to inform the admin of any violations he had knowledge of. The performance code you are talking about has nothing to do with a school administration code of conduct to be eligible to represent said school in interscholastic athletics. If your school does not have one you should ask your administration why they do not.
If a school does not have a public code of conduct that is clearly stated to the athletes and the public, you would be correct in your accessment. That does not mean one can not exist or be enforced, whether an administration and their lawyers wants to do so is a separate issue.

 

[creatorsgam]

Where did I say the coach would have that authority? The school administration would have that authority, the coaches job would be to inform the admin of any violations he had knowledge of. The performance code you are talking about has nothing to do with a school administration code of conduct to be eligible to represent said school in interscholastic athletics. If your school does not have one you should ask your administration why they do not.

I won’t ask my administration because I actually like my job.

That is their area. I know my role.

Kid gets pulled over for smoking a joint while driving. What good would it do to suspend them from school?

Wouldn’t even be their jurisdiction.

Edit: for an anecdote, two years ago I had a couple students involved in an armed robbery. Guess what? Can’t be suspended, because it didn’t occur at school.

The school doesn’t want anything to do with the courts. Can you blame them? That is exactly where it would end up. And they wouldn’t win.

And for the “mind blown” moment: they were exemplary students. Almost unbelievable to read in the paper.

 

[SUbear]

Where did I say the coach would have that authority? The school administration would have that authority, the coaches job would be to inform the admin of any violations he had knowledge of. The performance code you are talking about has nothing to do with a school administration code of conduct to be eligible to represent said school in interscholastic athletics. If your school does not have one you should ask your administration why they do not.

I won’t ask my administration because I actually like my job.

That is their area. I know my role.

Kid gets pulled over for smoking a joint while driving. What good would it do to suspend them from school?

Wouldn’t even be their jurisdiction.

I hope your school never has a situation such as this, good luck in your future and you are right it is not really up to you. You are not an admin.

 

[Col. Bleep]

As mentioned earlier, it would seem that the real risk is taken on by the administration by keeping this kid IN school.
If he happens to commit a crime or tort against a student or employee the victim is rightly going to go after the deep pocket.
The school and the administrators would deserve being held liable.