Summer Workouts

[MikeSU02]

A lot to discuss here. To pick one thing, I think Bell is a very interesting player this year. When it comes to putting the ball in the basket, he’s outstanding. It’s not just threes. He can pull up and shoot and he’s solid in transition. I think he can find ways to score in the lane.

The big thing for him, though, is that he’s going to have to find a way to go from a guy who can put the ball in the basket, to being a scorer who can do enough on the other end to not kill your defense.

For example, offensively he needs to go from the guy everyone gets annoyed with in old man pickup games (the guy who just spots up and shoots and doesn’t care about anything else) and become a guy who’s constantly moving off ball like a reddick or Steph. He obviously won’t be those guys but can he try to pattern his movement off some of what they do?

Defensively, I think he worked harder last season. Hopefully that continues. But he’s also got to really want it. There were several times he was attempting to box out for a rebound and just got discarded by the opponent. Some of defense and rebounding is talent and technique and strength… some of it is simply working your tail off and wanting it more than the other guy. Won’t make you a great defender or rebounder, but you’ll be competitive that way.

The interesting thing is both of those things are possible to genuinely improve in an off-season. Not sure he’ll become a truly instinctive two-way player, but I do believe he could genuinely improve on both ends.

I actually will give him a bit of leeway on his D on switches. A lot of the time our guys looked like they had never seen a screen when it came to defense last year.

Not sure if that was the players, the coaches, a mix, whatever. But I definitely think he should be better there.

We really need a defensive quarterback on the floor this year that is vocal. I think it will help lift the whole team.

 

[M2MPrinciples]

I'm all for JJ honing his PG skills, even if it's just in a part-time role. When he hit a shooting slump like he did in Maui he was unplayable because he had nothing else to fall back on. Gotta make yourself valuable to the team.

 

[Orangezoo]

I'm all for JJ honing his PG skills, even if it's just in a part-time role. When he hit a shooting slump like he did in Maui he was unplayable because he had nothing else to fall back on. Gotta make yourself valuable to the team.

I don’t want to see a single player dribbling for 20 seconds trying to find a way to make something happen is my thing. Move the ball and pick your spots. Good screens, good action overall on offense and less focus on the need for a single facilitator.

 

[Hopkins16]

Regarding Bell, because he is such a threat as a shooter, he must move off the ball instead of just setting up in a corner. His movement along with picks made for him will keep the defense busy and on their toes and cause the defense to switch at times which could free up other guys offensively or leave Bell with a smaller defender or big man who he could manipulate. I believe that just that one wrinkle in the offense could help our offense tremendously.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

 

[Ragman2000]

Improve. Color. Photography.

 

[jdubs30]

I don’t want to see a single player dribbling for 20 seconds trying to find a way to make something happen is my thing. Move the ball and pick your spots. Good screens, good action overall on offense and less focus on the need for a single facilitator.

I don’t think we have that guy this year. Carlos will move the ball, Bell typically doesn’t over dribble, I don’t see freeman playing out of control in that aspect.

JJ will clearly be our best penetrator - but I don’t think we have the personnel that will lead to a lot of ISO ball

 

[pearl31]

Improve. Color. Photography.

yeah, what was that an expose for Life magazine?

 

[Cappy3]

I don’t think we have that guy this year. Carlos will move the ball, Bell typically doesn’t over dribble, I don’t see freeman playing out of control in that aspect.

JJ will clearly be our best penetrator - but I don’t think we have the personnel that will lead to a lot of ISO ball

I’d worry about this if Starling is really the point.

 

[GoCuse14]

I’d worry about this if Starling is really the point.

Nah, he will be fine.

 

[Niastri]

I’d worry about this if Starling is really the point.

The breadcrumbs have left me to this belief: the starters have been written in stone in order to fulfill recruiting/retention obligations.

I think Lampkin, Freeman, Bell, Starling and either Lucas Taylor or Westry are starting. I think it's Lucas Taylor. (I was pretty convinced that it was Westry until I saw him gingerly performing shooting drills unguarded and barely getting over the rim on dunk attempts in recent video.) If that's your starting lineup, Starling is the point guard.

I strongly suspect Carlos comes in early and for long stretches unless Westry gets healthier or Starling performs much better at point than he has demonstrated he can perform in the past.

There is a reason the staff tried so many avenues to get a starting transfer point guard this offseason.

 

[Cappy3]

The breadcrumbs have left me to this belief: the starters have been written in stone in order to fulfill recruiting/retention obligations.

I think Lampkin, Freeman, Bell, Starling and either Lucas Taylor or Westry are starting. I think it's Lucas Taylor. (I was pretty convinced that it was Westry until I saw him gingerly performing shooting drills unguarded and barely getting over the rim on dunk attempts in recent video.) If that's your starting lineup, Starling is the point guard.

I strongly suspect Carlos comes in early and for long stretches unless Westry gets healthier or Starling performs much better at point than he has demonstrated he can perform in the past.

There is a reason the staff tried so many avenues to get a starting transfer point guard this offseason.

Just don’t see the enthusiasm for Taylor. He looked somewhere between bad and terrible vs p5 teams. If he starts, I really think we’re in trouble.

 

[Niastri]

Just don’t see the enthusiasm for Taylor. He looked somewhere between bad and terrible vs p5 teams. If he starts, I really think we’re in trouble.

Looking at our personnel, I can't figure out who the fifth starter is... There certainly isn't an obvious choice with Westry still being questionable. Why would a senior like Lucas Taylor come to Syracuse if he didn't have a strong idea he'd be starting, especially so late in the process?

 

[Cappy3]

Looking at our personnel, I can't figure out who the fifth starter is... There certainly isn't an obvious choice with Westry still being questionable. Why would a senior like Lucas Taylor come to Syracuse if he didn't have a strong idea he'd be starting, especially so late in the process?

Basically didn’t have many other options. As for a senior transfer starting, same could be said for Carlos and Davis. I highly doubt all four senior transfers start. As for me, I would prefer starting a true point in Carlos and leaving Starling at the 2.

 

[MSOrange]

Basically didn’t have many other options. As for a senior transfer starting, same could be said for Carlos and Davis. I highly doubt all four senior transfers start. As for me, I would prefer starting a true point in Carlos and leaving Starling at the 2.

I'm concerned if Carlos game will be good enough for the Power 5 level, but of the alternatives, I'd prefer Carlos- Starling like you.

 

[billsin01]

I actually will give him a bit of leeway on his D on switches. A lot of the time our guys looked like they had never seen a screen when it came to defense last year.

Not sure if that was the players, the coaches, a mix, whatever. But I definitely think he should be better there.

We really need a defensive quarterback on the floor this year that is vocal. I think it will help lift the whole team.

Yeah I’m pretty sure the defensive philosophy did nothing to help any of our guys early (thought it was a bit better late even though we gave up more points and our underlying numbers were worse).

But it seemed like early we were playing five guys on five islands and almost intentionally trying not to help, I’m assuming to limit threes on drive and kick.

Limiting threes is a good thing but it can’t be at the expense of all help. Have to feel like they’re going to have some significant adjustments this year. At least hopefully since this group won’t even be as individually good as last years squad

 

[AZOrange]

I’ve watched Chance a lot. He moves similar to how he did. I’m not sure what people thought he was. He’s a big dude

 

[cuseincincy]

I’ve watched Chance a lot. He moves similar to how he did. I’m not sure what people thought he was. He’s a big dude

Agreed. I'm not so sure he was "gingerly" performing shooting drills but more "deliberately." Chance is not a run and gun high flyer. If he's healthy he's more of a Paul Pressey type. That would certainly help our PG situation and our defense.

 

[721Comstock]

Agreed. I'm not so sure he was "gingerly" performing shooting drills but more "deliberately." Chance is not a run and gun high flyer. If he's healthy he's more of a Paul Pressey type. That would certainly help our PG situation and our defense.

OK, so - Chance has been billed as a "lock-down defender".

How does that square with a guy who's not a run and gun high flyer?
Normally the best defenders are also plus athletes.
(and of course, there's smarts, skill and 'want to' involved in playing good D too)

 

[MikeSU02]

Agreed. I'm not so sure he was "gingerly" performing shooting drills but more "deliberately." Chance is not a run and gun high flyer. If he's healthy he's more of a Paul Pressey type. That would certainly help our PG situation and our defense.

In terms of handling lead guard duties, especially as it pertains to dribbling and initiating action early in the shot clock, where do you think Chance ranks on the roster?

Legitimate question for anyone.

I was stoked when we were originally involved with Chance and he’s one of the two wild cards for us (with Donnie) that I think drastically changes our outlook depending on how they come in.

 

[CuseFaninVT]

OK, so - Chance has been billed as a "lock-down defender".

How does that square with a guy who's not a run and gun high flyer?
Normally the best defenders are also plus athletes.
(and of course, there's smarts, skill and 'want to' involved in playing good D too)

Was wondering the same. Perhaps he’s just a really smart (high IQ) guy and positions himself perfectly all the time.

 

[Orangezoo]

Was wondering the same. Perhaps he’s just a really smart (high IQ) guy and positions himself perfectly all the time.

Chance moves with longer strides too and thus it can be deceiving. Between that and wingspan he can cover ground and stay in front really well. Good athlete just not explosive. Also being a strong dude helps just as well given he’s not being bullied into the lane.

I’d say that IQ and physicality play the biggest role if you watch his tape from HS while being a solid athlete to go with. Even on offense he uses the bounce to beat his man and create space vs just being super athletic. Reminds a bit of Kadary how he is crafty and physical when on the ball with that wingspan to go with.

 

[Zelda Zonk]

Two specific things that concern me in the recent Chance video:

Running to the corner, the way he “gingerly” came to a stop—was so completely unathletic. That’s not just a ‘big guy’ slowing momentum like a big guy. It was someone who didn’t want to/was unable to put significant stress on the knee(s).

The high, sloppy dribble. On the move to the right block. Clumsy. I think I saw the same thing in a previous video.

This is not the Chance we saw in his HS recruiting videos where he looked like Magic or Penny, just toying with overmatched defenders and having fun with his advantages.

I really hope I’m just looking to far into a small sample size, and overreacting to a grand total of less than three seconds of footage, but when someone seems to be suggesting that they’re choosing/selecting the best to present to the world, I have to imagine this is either representative or even misleading because the rest is worse. Really REALLY hope I’m wrong, as I really wanted him pre-Auburn and still hope he’s going to eventually be a difference maker for us,

 

[Orangezoo]

Two specific things that concern me in the recent Chance video:

Running to the corner, the way he “gingerly” came to a stop—was so completely unathletic. That’s not just a ‘big guy’ slowing momentum like a big guy. It was someone who didn’t want to/was unable to put significant stress on the knee(s).

The high, sloppy dribble. On the move to the right block. Clumsy. I think I saw the same thing in a previous video.

This is not the Chance we saw in his HS recruiting videos where he looked like Magic or Penny, just toying with overmatched defenders and having fun with his advantages.

I really hope I’m just looking to far into a small sample size, and overreacting to a grand total of less than three seconds of footage, but when someone seems to be suggesting that they’re choosing/selecting the best to present to the world, I have to imagine this is either representative or even misleading because the rest is worse. Really REALLY hope I’m wrong, as I really wanted him pre-Auburn and still hope he’s going to eventually be a difference maker for us,

Chance has always had a higher dribble going back to HS that I have seen. There is no doubt a measure of trusting the knee at play here and there is no getting around that. With that said the longer he works on it without re aggravating it, the more he will trust it. Other than that there isn’t a ton of differences that stand out with this video. Plus we saw him in the orange madness look really solid too last year. I never saw him look like Magic or Penny in HS. He was really good but his game wasn’t jaw dropping either. I expect it will take another couple months, working with the team fully healthy for things to really click back into place. Maybe even all the way through October and November.

 

[Niastri]

Chance has always had a higher dribble going back to HS that I have seen. There is no doubt a measure of trusting the knee at play here and there is no getting around that. With that said the longer he works on it without re aggravating it, the more he will trust it. Other than that there isn’t a ton of differences that stand out with this video. Plus we saw him in the orange madness look really solid too last year. I never saw him look like Magic or Penny in HS. He was really good but his game wasn’t jaw dropping either. I expect it will take another couple months, working with the team fully healthy for things to really click back into place. Maybe even all the way through October and November.

I remember watching Westry high school footage back when it looked like we were going to get him as a senior.

He was a plus athlete and dominated the poor kids playing against him.

I helped an old lady at the Wegmans coffee bar today... She was having trouble pouring cream into her coffee.

It was amazing how much she looked like Westry walking away after we were done. You could see she was afraid with each step she was going to get hurt.

Hyperbole, for sure.

But Westry isn't close to the same guy he was in high school based on the little video we have seen this summer. He looks like he is still injured or he is very early in his recovery. We watched Sidibe and Hima struggle with effectively career ending injuries the last few seasons. I have mentally moved Westry into their category for my own mental well being. I'll be surprised if he's a contributor.