What if the B1G goes for UMASS?

[bnoro]

The ACC should be concerned going forward about at large bids after this years complete fail. The ACC got thoroughly put down.

Yes, they're going to make enormous conference decisions based on a non-profitable sport like lacrosse having a single down year... Brilliant. Oh Lord

 

[All4SU]

Tim Brown in 1986, had 1164 yards from scrimmage and 673 return yards, a total of 1837. He scored 9 touchdowns. He didn't finish in the top ten in the Heisman vote. Vinnie Testaverde, who led the nation in passing and his team to an 11-0 record, the most a quarterback, the most important position in sports, can do for his team. Vinnie was 175/276 (.634) for 2,557 yards and 26 TDs with 9 interceptions. He was stiuctly a pocket QB and 'rushed for -103 yards, (because the NCAA counts sacks as running plays) but did score 4TDs. He had 2,404 yards of total offense and accounted for 30TDs.

In 1987 Tim Brown had 990 yards from scrimmage and 857 on kick returns, a total of 1847. He scored 7 touchdowns. Don McPherson led the nation in passing and his team to an 11-0 record, just like Testaverde. Donnie was 129/229 (56.3) for 2,341 yards and 22TDs with 11 interceptions. He was a legitimate dual threat quarterback but stayed more in the pocket that year than the previous one, when he ran for 523 yards) but still ran for 230 yards and scored 5TDs. He had 2,571 yards of total offense and accounted for 27TDS.

Tim Brown won the Heisman Trophy over Donnie McPherson. There's no question that brown had the better NFL career. There's also no question that is irrelevant. You could argue about whether Testaverde in 1986 was better than McPherson in 1987 but it was pretty close. Brown not being in the Top Ten in 1986 is absurd but brown finishing ahead of McPherson in 1987 is at least as absurd. He won it because he played for Notre Dame, (which was 8-3 that year), rather than Syracuse and because the media had anointed him as the favorite before the season and covered his every move from the beginning of the season. Also, 25% of the voters didn't wait until the regular season was over to vote and 25% of them didn't bother to vote at all. That made it two Heisman trophies and SU player shoudl have won but a Notre Dame player did win, (the other being Paul Hornung over Jim Brown in 1956).

Tim Brown College Stats | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

Vinny Testaverde College Stats | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

Don McPherson College Stats | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

1986 Heisman Trophy Voting | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

1987 Heisman Trophy Voting | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

I will always maintain that Gordie Lockbaum (Holy Cross) cost Donnie Mac the Heisman. The fence-sitters rallied behind the fluff perpetuated about the throwback two-way player. Even sports illustrated jump on the Gordie wagon. Consequently Donnie didn't dominate voting in the East like he normally would have. The cynic in me says ND was behind some of the Gordie publicity in order to split the vote.

 

[CusefanATL]

UMASS is a top 30 flagship university in a state that has lots of cable boxes. They have D1 lax as well. I don't think it's a crazy idea, ( Though to be fair to my critics, I do come up with some "crazy" ideas). They can schedule games in Foxboro, which would appeal to many alums from the B1G. Oklahoma in the west and UMASS in the east would give them a balanced expansion.

top 30 flagship university? what does that mean?

 

[Hoo's That]

I will always maintain that Gordie Lockbaum (Holy Cross) cost Donnie Mac the Heisman. The fence-sitters rallied behind the fluff perpetuated about the throwback two-way player. Even sports illustrated jump on the Gordie wagon. Consequently Donnie didn't dominate voting in the East like he normally would have. The cynic in me says ND was behind some of the Gordie publicity in order to split the vote.

Oh I doubt that. The Holy Cross Fathers hate the Jesuits.

 

[sutomcat]

top 30 flagship university? what does that mean?

That means UMass is a below average public university. Woo hoo!

 

[Orangello]

The University of Paris is more likely to get a BiG invite than UMass. Think of the tailgating scene. Foie Gras, Champagne and Gittanes. Oo La La. As long as the fans always factor in a railway strike, all will be well.

 

[Townie72]

New York doesn't have a state flagship university. A lot of major state universities are out in the countryside.

What's a "Flagship" anyway? This seems to be a meaningless modifier people throw into a conversation to try and inflate the the value of particular schools. It's frequently used by supporters of schools that seem to need some additional prestige. Rutgers, reportedly, is NJ's "Flagship" school. What schools in NJ are the satellites or lesser vehicles. Montclair State and that ilk?

Does the Fleet Admiral of all the State colleges and universities sit in the "Flagship" school and issue orders? Whose flag is on the flagship? The Admiral's?

 

[Townie72]

The University of Paris is more likely to get a BiG invite than UMass. Think of the tailgating scene. Foie Gras, Champagne and Gittanes. Oo La La. As long as the fans always factor in a railway strike, all will be well.

I guess you mean the school which most people call The Sorbonne and not the American University of Paris.

One thing for sure is that the French would almost immediately become the masters of the tailgate lunch. Although they would insist it be consumed indoors at a table with a table cloth and between the hours of 12:00pm and 2:00pm.

No Frenchman is going to stand around outside with a chicken wing slathered with commercially-made BBQ sauce in one hand and a can of Miller Lite in the other.

 

[Chip]

No Frenchman is going to stand around outside with a chicken wing slathered with commercially-made BBQ sauce in one hand and a can of Miller Lite in the other.

Pure gold.

 

[FAL]

Can people stop typing out UMASS and UCONN.

How 'bout Holy Cross?

 

[CousCuse]

What's a "Flagship" anyway? This seems to be a meaningless modifier people throw into a conversation to try and inflate the the value of particular schools. It's frequently used by supporters of schools that seem to need some additional prestige. Rutgers, reportedly, is NJ's "Flagship" school. What schools in NJ are the satellites or lesser vehicles. Montclair State and that ilk?

Does the Fleet Admiral of all the State colleges and universities sit in the "Flagship" school and issue orders? Whose flag is on the flagship? The Admiral's?

A flagship school is where most of the crooked politicians in a given state went to school and they in turn appropriate the lions share of that states budget for their alma mater.

 

[CousCuse]

Please. This is the first time since 2004 that there won't be an ACC team in the Final 4. "Not doing well" (which for the ACC meant having 3 teams in the QFs) one year doesn't affect how many bids you get the next. We neither need nor want a team that only gets into the NCAAs about once each decade. We can still beat them up for the easy win OOC and help ruin the RPI of their one-bid conference. Since UMass made it in 2006 and 2012, should we expect to see them again in 2018 or do we have to wait until the 2020s? I apologize to the board for losing my patience on this, but the pretensions of UMass have stuck in my craw for a long time.

The league needs to have 6 teams to get an AQ. You don't like my pick, you pick one.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

The league needs to have 6 teams to get an AQ. You don't like my pick, you pick one.

The league managed for over 50 years without one.

The ACC Tourney champ always gets in without one.

 

[CousCuse]

The league managed for over 50 years without one.

The ACC Tourney champ always gets in without one.

Lacrosse has made a huge leap in the last 10 years. It will be very difficult to justify giving all the at large bids to the ACC/B1G going forward with all the strong teams in the many newly formed conferences.

 

[orange79]

Lacrosse has made a huge leap in the last 10 years. It will be very difficult to justify giving all the at large bids to the ACC/B1G going forward with all the strong teams in the many newly formed conferences.

That really doesn't address anything OX said. No one said anything about all the at-large bids.

That being said, I literally can't envision a circumstance in which the ACC (at least as currently constituted) doesn't get at least 2 teams in. It would be a strange year indeed when it didn't get at least 3.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

Lacrosse has made a huge leap in the last 10 years. It will be very difficult to justify giving all the at large bids to the ACC/B1G going forward with all the strong teams in the many newly formed conferences.

An AQ only accounts for 1 bid.

Had the ACC still had an AQ, it would have gone to ACCT Champ UNC this year, and they were in the tournament anyways.

It would have opened up an at large slot for either Army or Rutgers.

The top 4 ACC teams were in regardless.

 

[Hoo's That]

The league needs to have 6 teams to get an AQ. You don't like my pick, you pick one.

Georgia Tech or NC State. They're already in the conference and, as engineering schools, have Title IX room. Ga Tech was in the MCLA Final Four this year. NC State had a team in the 70s and gave it up. They have a player, Stan Cockerton, in the Hall of Fame.

 

[Townie72]

A flagship school is where most of the crooked politicians in a given state went to school and they in turn appropriate the lions share of that states budget for their alma mater.

That may or may not be true.

But it does little to explain the "Flagship" descriptor. I think it's a phony term designed to give unearned credit to a school.

 

[shantydaze]

That may or may not be true.

But it does little to explain the "Flagship" descriptor. I think it's a phony term designed to give unearned credit to a school.

I don't this is specifically true for every state, but I think it is more prevalent in the midwest and western states that have large land-grant universities as part of a state university system. The University of Wisconsin-Madison, University of Minnesota-Twin Cities, and University of Illinois-Champaign/Urbana are all the "flagship" schools in those state's public university systems. While athletics play a part, it more about research being conducted by these school and their doctoral programs.

I have always believed the Northeast, especially New York state, lacked "flagship" public universities because the university tradition was different. Rather than being focused on a public land grant university, the university tradition seemed to grow out of smaller private colleges. As a result, Massachusetts and New York are known more for their private universities than any of their public universities.

 

[Hoo's That]

I don't this is specifically true for every state, but I think it is more prevalent in the midwest and western states that have large land-grant universities as part of a state university system. The University of Wisconsin-Madison, University of Minnesota-Twin Cities, and University of Illinois-Champaign/Urbana are all the "flagship" schools in those state's public university systems. While athletics play a part, it more about research being conducted by these school and their doctoral programs.

I have always believed the Northeast, especially New York state, lacked "flagship" public universities because the university tradition was different. Rather than being focused on a public land grant university, the university tradition seemed to grow out of smaller private colleges. As a result, Massachusetts and New York are known more for their private universities than any of their public universities.

And this was primarily driven by the number and quality of colleges and universities in the eastern US that opened before the Morrill Land Grant Act was passed.

 

[All4SU]

Every ACC school should have lacrosse. There are lots of other schools with good LAX programs now, but the ACC could own the sport.

 

[Delmar]

Georgia Tech or NC State. They're already in the conference and, as engineering schools, have Title IX room. Ga Tech was in the MCLA Final Four this year. NC State had a team in the 70s and gave it up. They have a player, Stan Cockerton, in the Hall of Fame.

Two players who wore the NC State uniform are in the LAX Hall of Fame.

 

[Delmar]

The ACC has been very picky about their membership through the years. Just ask wannabe West Virginia. They aren't going to offer membership to another D1 school just for lacrosse. JHU could have happened, but that ship has sailed. The only other one I could imagine the ACC considering is Navy --but very unlikely.

The sixth team will come from inside the ACC.

 

[Hoo's That]

The ACC has been very picky about their membership through the years. Just ask wannabe West Virginia. They aren't going to offer membership to another D1 school just for lacrosse. JHU could have happened, but that ship has sailed. The only other one I could imagine the ACC considering is Navy --but very unlikely.

The sixth team will come from inside the ACC.

I have to disagree; I don't think JHU could have happened because (IIRC) the Twerps asked (actually, begged) them to join the B1G first. JHU couldn't say no to the team they consider their biggest rival.

 

[RandomGuy]

I know this thread was dead...

The real question for UMAss football, is whether it will continue to exist... Even with FCS coach salaries, the program is bleeding $$$. The board voted this year, 26-14 to keep football. Swing 7 votes, and it could be done.

I believe they failed FBS probation, and may have come in under the 15000 attendance qualifications.. One game at Gillette brought in just over 6,000 fans... That's less than some NE high school rivalries, or Championship games. NE loves pro sports, and high school, not much more... Some sports radio stations are not even allowed to talk about College Football... For reals. A few NE schools have shut down football completely(BU, etc..) Umm. yeah. No B1G.