Why can't we run a real offense?

FreakTalksAboutSU

All Conference
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Messages
2,357
Like
3,052
I am so sick of the hero ball one man offense.

Why can't we pass the ball. Work inside. Drive the lane. Play the post game. Instead, one dribble and a contested 3. Nearly every time.

Are the players incapable? Are the coaches incapable? I feel like this has been a hallmark of the JB offense but it has gotten much much worse in recent years.

34 points? Sigh.
 

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
1,656
Like
3,027
I am so sick of the hero ball one man offense.

Why can't we pass the ball. Work inside. Drive the lane. Play the post game. Instead, one dribble and a contested 3. Nearly every time.

Are the players incapable? Are the coaches incapable? I feel like this has been a hallmark of the JB offense but it has gotten much much worse in recent years.

34 points? Sigh.
Virginia is the best defense in the country. But even Carlos Boozer or Jordan Cornette said on the telecast last night, you have to set obstacles and movement for the defense to overcome. We’re barely moving and not setting any screens, and when we do they’re not good screens. we need to be getting consistent movement and running multiple screening actions every single possession. JB needs to take some responsibility for his poor or non-existent offense. He's still coaching offense for this team like we have a basket attacker like Tyus Battle out there.
 
Last edited:

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
1,656
Like
3,027
You didn’t hear? We just gotta make shots. We can’t get by defenders. So we just gotta make shots.
Pretty simple from our HC.
How does JB not understand that guys can’t get by their defenders because no one is setting any screens or running any plays on offense or barely moving? Guys who aren’t naturally superstar athletes can’t get into the lane if you’re not designing ways to create some space for them to do that.
 
Last edited:

kcsu

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
8,985
Like
12,244
JB keeps running the same O. He hasn't and will not adapt to the fact that his current players are simply not able to create on their own. He used to have a stable of guys that thrived in street ball. Guys that could beat their guy anytime they wanted. Heck Dion was a 6th man. Pearl was unstoppable, DC crushed it, last year we had Battle who in my opinion was the last player SU has recruited in the mold of what was our standard. His leaving marked the end of the line. Carey, Buddy, Marek, Sid, Hughes are not Alpha players. They are never going to take over games. Jim thrived when he had guys that took over games. He is lost trying to scheme wins on O its not his strength never has been.
 

Brooky03

JG3 Truther
Joined
Oct 29, 2012
Messages
6,059
Like
9,444
We don’t have post players. It’s like a spread offense in football that can’t run. If they have first and goal from the 1, they couldn’t punch it in with 4 straight runs up the middle. When you can’t run, it makes it harder to pass.

when you can’t post, it makes it harder to drive or get open 3s
 

OttoinGrotto

Doggy doggy WHAT now?
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
29,542
Like
56,651
Can’t run it if (a) you don’t recruit true point guards, (b) you don’t recruit players who have vision and can pass, and (c) don’t know how to install an offense that creates easier opportunities.
I think if (c) was happening we would feel we are doing fine with (a) and (b).
 

Gabjon

All Conference
Joined
Sep 2, 2011
Messages
3,225
Like
1,556
I am so sick of the hero ball one man offense.

Why can't we pass the ball. Work inside. Drive the lane. Play the post game. Instead, one dribble and a contested 3. Nearly every time.

Are the players incapable? Are the coaches incapable? I feel like this has been a hallmark of the JB offense but it has gotten much much worse in recent years.

34 points? Sigh.
The players are incapable. Our offense requires bigs that can play in the post/mid-post. Without that every defense will load up on the guards/wings, press up on the shooters and force them to help, because the help defender does not have to defend our bigs.

We need bigs who can play both sides of the court. If you have more than one big who is not a scoring threat you are easy to defend. The none scoring threat can be a screener offensive rebounder i.e. Craig Forth but you better have a forward who can score in the post i.e Hakim Warrick.
 

shandeezy7

All American
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
6,976
Like
11,053
Virginia is the best defense in the country. But even Carlos Boozer or Jordan Cornette said on the telecast last night, you have to set obstacles and movement for the defense to overcome. We’re barely moving and not setting any screens, and when we do they’re not good screens. we need to be getting contestant movement and running multiple screening actions every single possession. JB needs to take some responsibility for his poor or non-existent offense. He's still coaching offense for this team like we have a basket attacker like Tyus Battle out there.
Has Marek or Sidibe ever set a screen that they didn't slip before contact was made? It works one out of every 20 times. The rest of the time, the missed screen just bottles up our offense even more.
 

FrancoPizza

2018 Iggy Leading Minutes Per Game Winner
Joined
Jan 27, 2015
Messages
4,482
Like
5,467
JB needs to take some responsibility for his poor or non-existent offense.
How about all responsibility rests with the head coach? It's his system and his players.

He's still coaching offense for this team like we have a basket attacker like Tyus Battle out there.
I don't get this statement. The offense was non-existent even with Battle. He's still coaching like we have 3 future NBA draft picks who can create their own shot without the need for team concepts.
 

IthacaBarrel

Shaky Potatoes
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
8,616
Like
10,215
Who would you suggest do the following on this team RIGHT NOW

1. Beat somebody on the dribble?
2. Finish down low with a few big guy type moves. ( like Christmas, rick or arinze)
3. Distribute the basketball like a playmaker or PG?

Only alternative is to chuck 3's I guess. very very limited talent out there. Your point is valid but this has to be the least talented group that I can ever remember. Mid major type team right now. Recruiting misses that play here and recruiting misses that went elsewhere.
 

Cusefan0307

A very millennial millennial
Joined
Dec 21, 2011
Messages
21,912
Like
41,577
Who would you suggest do the following on this team RIGHT NOW

1. Beat somebody on the dribble?
2. Finish down low with a few big guy type moves. ( like Christmas, rick or arinze)
3. Distribute the basketball like a playmaker or PG?

Only alternative is to chuck 3's I guess. very very limited talent out there. Your point is valid but this has to be the least talented group that I can ever remember. Mid major type team right now. Recruiting misses that play here and recruiting misses that went elsewhere.
Bennett would win 25 games with this group.
 

OttoMets

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
15,304
Like
20,521
Has Marek or Sidibe ever set a screen that they didn't slip before contact was made? It works one out of every 20 times. The rest of the time, the missed screen just bottles up our offense even more.
Marek had a good one in the first half of the Carleton game.

That must have been the one in 20.

But yes, just like every Syracuse big for the last decade, screening fundamentals are poor. There's a common denominator there.
 

Scooch

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
10,054
Like
20,749
I think if (c) was happening we would feel we are doing fine with (a) and (b).
Yeah, this has become a chicken-or-egg type situation to me. It seems impossible that we are in year 6 of not having a point guard who can adequately run an offense. If it's that we've had an extraordinarily bad run of recruiting misses, then that's on the staff for constantly failing at talent projection. If it's that the talent isn't as bad as it looks, but we can't scheme anything remotely viable to foster motion and passing, then that's on the staff for constantly failing at instruction. Either way, it sucks, and watching SU hoops has become a chore.
 

kcsu

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
8,985
Like
12,244
When Marek is Chucking 3s from the top of the key on O and playing the 5 on D you know something is wrong. When 4 guys are literally STANDING IMMOBILE outside the 3 point line who know something is wrong. JB doesn't know how to fix this and we dont have the talent to bail him out anymore.
 

FreakTalksAboutSU

All Conference
Joined
Sep 17, 2011
Messages
2,357
Like
3,052
How about all responsibility rests with the head coach? It's his system and his players.


I don't get this statement. The offense was non-existent even with Battle. He's still coaching like we have 3 future NBA draft picks who can create their own shot without the need for team concepts.
Correct. Even with Battle it was too much one man iso.
 

Sherman20

2018 Iggy Leading Scorer Winner
Joined
Apr 25, 2017
Messages
1,656
Like
3,027
Yeah, this has become a chicken-or-egg type situation to me. It seems impossible that we are in year 6 of not having a point guard who can adequately run an offense. If it's that we've had an extraordinarily bad run of recruiting misses, then that's on the staff for constantly failing at talent projection. If it's that the talent isn't as bad as it looks, but we can't scheme anything remotely viable to foster motion and passing, then that's on the staff for constantly failing at instruction. Either way, it sucks, and watching SU hoops has become a chore.
I don’t think the talent is as bad as some people are making it out to be.
 

OrangeFoo

All Conference
Joined
Aug 25, 2011
Messages
3,276
Like
4,282
Yep, virtually every guard recruited by big programs can pass. When their coach doesn't scheme to move a defense, it gets harder.
My favorite play was Girard driving to the hoop and doing a wrap around back to the perimeter. Great play but Girard assumed the perimeter player would read his drive and slide to a place in anticipation where he would have the best passing angle... our guy just stood there. Not sure why Girard did a my bad there... that’s on the perimeter guy for not moving.
 

supp

All American
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
5,902
Like
8,279
This isn’t changing. We’ll be talking about this until JB’s final game.
Yep, people talk on here like Boeheim has an answer and plan to address the problems. What evidence is there for that over the past half decade? The rest is wishful thinking.
 

NKR1978

Living Legend
Joined
Aug 21, 2011
Messages
14,885
Like
24,315
Can’t run it if (a) you don’t recruit true point guards, (b) you don’t recruit players who have vision and can pass, and (c) don’t know how to install an offense that creates easier opportunities.
Bennett turns a top 300 recruit into a PG on a national championship team. We take top 50 kids and ruin them.
 

Online statistics

Members online
302
Guests online
1,406
Total visitors
1,708

Top Bottom