Wildhack is on the Clock

[charleston]

I don't think people realize how impactful Juda Mintz was on this team...he could drive us cazy but he could penetrate and score which made guys like Bell, Starling and others much more effective and helped us win 20 games ...maybe we should have paid him big bucks to stay

 

[Fly Rodder]

So I was just thinking similar about being in charge. Remember when we beat UNC last year and Q jumped into the press conference. At first I was high on the win and was like this is awesome.

Now knowing what we know I think back to how little discipline there must be in the program that he had the balls to do that and wasn’t scared of Autry at all.

Yeah, I thought at the time that they had a great relationship.

 

[littlereg]

Yeah, people can take a stroll through this thread for fun:

Are we done with adding players for 2024-25?

I am out of town and have to listen to Infanti and Scibilia to get my Orange fix. They are of the opinion that: 1) We won’t add another starting caliber player from the portal. 2) The team will be fine with what we have. I think this take is incorrect, and if it is correct, we are in trouble...

syracusefan.com

Hey speak for yourself if I hit the right strain I may start feeling a lil flat but no weed is making me believe this team is final four bound

Update: THERES NO WAY IN HELL ANY WEED IS MAKING THIS TEAM LOOK FINAL FOUR BOUND

 

[Orangezoo]

I think you missed the point. How fast can a turnaround happen in the current state of the league, this is a semi-pro paid league now?

And second can a solid coach be attracted to a floundering program that fires a coach midway through a season?

I go back and forth but given what I’ve seen from Fran. I don’t see the harm in gambling and finding someone with his qualities.

It’s not the speed of the turnaround we are dealing with here it’s the fact it won’t be happening under Red hands down. The competence factor paired with the fact he’s not a new coach he’s a continuity hire after 40 years under JB. Why would a new coach with outside ideas be worried about the fact the program decided to break ties with a continuation of what wasn’t working? I would think an outside hire can differentiate- they are smart folks while being excited that the program is looking for fresh ideas and simply wants someone to get results in this new era commensurate with the brand before it began to fade.

Also with a truly new staff then the turnaround timeline is a different thing vs a continuity hire. They get to bring their own culture and style of play to bring a new era of success to the program. That again is a much different scenario. Yes it will take time and patience but Red has not been a change at all. It’s been a much worse version of the end of Boeheim’s tenure which was not what was being sold when he got the job.

 

[Red2003]

It’s not the speed of the turnaround we are dealing with here it’s the fact it won’t be happening under Red hands down. The competence factor paired with the fact he’s not a new coach he’s a continuity hire after 40 years under JB. Why would a new coach with outside ideas be worried about the fact the program decided to break ties with a continuation of what wasn’t working? I would think an outside hire can differentiate- they are smart folks while being excited that the program is looking for fresh ideas and simply wants someone to get results in this new era commensurate with the brand before it began to fade.

Also with a truly new staff then the turnaround timeline is a different thing vs a continuity hire. They get to bring their own culture and style of play to bring a new era of success to the program. That again is a much different scenario. Yes it will take time and patience but Red has not been a change at all. It’s been a much worse version of the end of Boeheim’s tenure which was not what was being sold when he got the job.

Agree fully. I’m only speaking to the different thoughts of terminating mid season, end of 2nd season or end of 3rd season.

 

[Orangezoo]

Agree fully. I’m only speaking to the different thoughts of terminating mid season, end of 2nd season or end of 3rd season.

That’s fair. I think you can quietly make the decision mid season or make it clear that it’s likely unless we get a mid season miracle then move on end of year for better optics than mid season as an argument for sure. I don’t think you can afford a disaster this year to garner a third year just on the grounds of a recruiting class though. To me there needs to be evidence there is a reason to stick with for a third year and that is all but gone at the moment.

 

[ar inj]

You cannot fire the coach mid-season.

Red is a Syracuse guy; we all want him to be successful. That said, and putting NIL aside, like the announcers said in the first half, "This looks like an AAU game," and for the Orange it stayed that way and got even more so in the second half. I am admittedly old anf the guys I play with are old but we play defense and the game with more passion and pride than I see on the court for SU. I am starting to think it was Mintz, and others on some occasions, that won 20 last year not because of the coach but in spite of the coach

Let's talk February 28 or March, 2025. That may need to be another story.

 

[Cusefan95]

The reality is that as an organization the University simply cannot fire a coach after one relatively decent year and eleven games into the second year of a contract.

It costs money. It sends a bad message to the coaching industry. It presents to the basketball world an unstable program that will not attract talent. It is just not the way to do business - no matter how emotional the fans or the members of this board may get about the situation.

Organizations that quickly fire coaches are generally not successful ones. Organizations that show patience and help the coach attract and develop talent over time are generally successful ones.

If Autry is violating rules or mistreating players or engaging in activity that might embarrass the University, then make a change.

But, if it is simply a matter of building a program, patience - rather than changing coaches after less than a year an a half - is the better way to go.

Okay, now really let me have it!

The 49ers fired Mike Singletary with one game left in his second season as head coach, in large part because of the total lack of discipline in the team. The following year, Jim Harbaugh took many of those same guys to the NFC Championship game. There’s plenty of similar examples.

Good organizations identify quickly when they made a mistake and change course. And the most important difference between good organizations and bad ones is that they have a decision-making system and processes which minimize the mistakes being made.

Handing the head coaching job on to a subordinate with no national search due to internal political reasons, and then holding on to that coach after it’s clear he can’t succeed on any reasonable timeline would demonstrate that Syracuse University both had no good decision making process, and doesn’t correct mistakes quickly when they are made. In other words - it’s a textbook example of a bad organization.

We don’t need to fire Red today, but he must be relieved of his duties on March 9th (or immediately after an ACC tourney loss). It’s what a good organization would do.

 

[HyattsCuse]

Get Bryan Hodgson before someone else does. Seems like a Fran Brown clone only he is actually getting some head coach experience.

From western NY. Ace recruiter. Team is winning. They beat Memphis. You want DART? They were down 25 at half in their last game and came back and won in OT! Ever since someone mentioned him, I’ve been checking in to see Arkansas St is doing. Guy seems like he has it to succeed.

 

[Sbucketball]

This is a big fear of mine as well. After watching this how does Red sell give me money and I will make it work. If we think our NIL is bad now wait for what it looks like next year when Red sticks his hand out.

The only thing that will get the donors back is cleaning house and getting in a coach that will inspire them again like Fran did. That is what I am waiting for to start giving to basketball NIL again. Red doesn't inspire confidence so I stopped giving and am now giving more to football.

Retweet. This is why he’s a dead man walking. It’s over.

 

[HyattsCuse]

This is a big fear of mine as well. After watching this how does Red sell give me money and I will make it work. If we think our NIL is bad now wait for what it looks like next year when Red sticks his hand out.

The only thing that will get the donors back is cleaning house and getting in a coach that will inspire them again like Fran did. That is what I am waiting for to start giving to basketball NIL again. Red doesn't inspire confidence so I stopped giving and am now giving more to football.

Only other play I can think of is the JJ injury card. IF JJ comes back and the team can start to look revived and competitive again (I don’t see Maryland much better than Texas or Texas Tech) and finish around .500 playing better basketball, Red can use that to show donors he‘s correcting course given what is looking like a disastrous season after this blowout.

Wishful thinking anyway.

 

[phil77]

Only other play I can think of is the JJ injury card. IF JJ comes back and the team can start to look revived and competitive again (I don’t see Maryland much better than Texas or Texas Tech) and finish around .500 playing better basketball, Red can use that to show donors he‘s correcting course given what is looking like a disastrous season after this blowout.

Wishful thinking anyway.

We were terrible with JJ as well.

 

[Brian Orange]

I want the Dan Mullen of college basketball. A hired gun, proven head coach, plug and play.

 

[Orangezoo]

I want the Dan Mullen of college basketball. A hired gun, proven head coach, plug and play.

Those guys have been already plucked and arent moving jobs.

 

[JeremyCuse]

You wanted to keep Dino too. Just sayin

Forget Dino, Coach P would still be the coach if he was in charge.

 

[kingtidge]

You cannot fire the coach mid-season.

Red is a Syracuse guy; we all want him to be successful. That said, and putting NIL aside, like the announcers said in the first half, "This looks like an AAU game," and for the Orange it stayed that way and got even more so in the second half. I am admittedly old anf the guys I play with are old but we play defense and the game with more passion and pride than I see on the court for SU. I am starting to think it was Mintz, and others on some occasions, that won 20 last year not because of the coach but in spite of the coach

Let's talk February 28 or March, 2025. That may need to be another story.

Agreed but hopefully Wildhack has a search already underway or is starting it now and can move fast at the end of the season.

We may lose next year's class, as it's looking like Red has lost the team and we're heading for single digits wins... No good players (or their parents) will want to stay signed up for that. No one should blame them either.

I will also say that if the school (chancellor) won't approve the buyout and new coach hire, I wouldn't be surprised to see Wildhack walk. I wouldn't stick around and sit on my hands with the dome empty and not be able to do anything about it.

 

[Newhouser]

Get Bryan Hodgson before someone else does. Seems like a Fran Brown clone only he is actually getting some head coach experience.

From western NY. Ace recruiter. Team is winning. They beat Memphis. You want DART? They were down 25 at half in their last game and came back and won in OT! Ever since someone mentioned him, I’ve been checking in to see Arkansas St is doing. Guy seems like he has it to succeed.

Yeah but who couldn't win with all the assets Arkansas State has? Seriously I'd be putting the feelers out ASAP.

 

[Cusefan78]

Red really thought Lampkin was the answer over a PG.

Yeah he saw the run nc state had with their center and tried to replicate it

 

[Cusefan78]

Forget Dino, Coach P would still be the coach if he was in charge.

In hindsight that recruiting class he had would have saved his job for a few more years.

 

[baggerbob]

The reality is that as an organization the University simply cannot fire a coach after one relatively decent year and eleven games into the second year of a contract.

It costs money. It sends a bad message to the coaching industry. It presents to the basketball world an unstable program that will not attract talent. It is just not the way to do business - no matter how emotional the fans or the members of this board may get about the situation.

Organizations that quickly fire coaches are generally not successful ones. Organizations that show patience and help the coach attract and develop talent over time are generally successful ones.

If Autry is violating rules or mistreating players or engaging in activity that might embarrass the University, then make a change.

But, if it is simply a matter of building a program, patience - rather than changing coaches after less than a year an a half - is the better way to go.

Okay, now really let me have it!

Can't fire in th we middle of the year. I agree with that, but if this gets any worse you have to m a ke a change at the end of the year

Agreed but hopefully Wildhack has a search already underway or is starting it now and can move fast at the end of the season.

We may lose next year's class, as it's looking like Red has lost the team and we're heading for single digits wins... No good players (or their parents) will want to stay signed up for that. No one should blame them either.

I will also say that if the school (chancellor) won't approve the buyout and new coach hire, I wouldn't be surprised to see Wildhack walk. I wouldn't stick around and sit on my hands with the dome empty and not be able to do anything about it.

The Chancellor along with JB overstaying his time here have a lot of blame in this.

 

[JeremyCuse]

In hindsight that recruiting class he had would have saved his job for a few more years.

It would have just postponed the inevitable. It had some real nice pieces obvioulsy in Rice, McCourty and others but we still didn't have a QB and the WR position was still a hot mess. Leonard wasn't coming here regardless because SU wouldn't offer his brother (which they were spot on about). The bigger problem was that Gross should have waited until next year to pull the trigger as it was simply to late in the cycle to move on. Instead he pulled the trigger and we settled for Robinson which as we all know was an epic disaster.

 

[OrangeXtreme]

It would have just postponed the inevitable. It had some real nice pieces obvioulsy in Rice, McCourty and others but we still didn't have a QB and the WR position was still a hot mess. Leonard wasn't coming here regardless because SU wouldn't offer his brother (which they were spot on about). The bigger problem was that Gross should have waited until next year to pull the trigger as it was simply to late in the cycle to move on. Instead he pulled the trigger and we settled for Robinson which as we all know was an epic disaster.

Gross hadn't even been on the job for a week. It wasn't his call.

BoT fired Coach P at halftime, right after Megatron's 3rd or 4th TD.

Gross just botched the GRob hire.

I'm sure Wildhack will find a worthy replacement for Red, who doesn't mind working with a shoestring NIL budget.

Took us 20 years to rebuild after Coach P was let go. Maybe the next BB coach can do it in half the time.

He better get the buyout in writing.

 

[JeremyCuse]

Gross hadn't even been on the job for a week. It wasn't his call.

BoT fired Coach P at halftime, right after Megatron's 3rd or 4th TD.

Gross just botched the GRob hire.

I'm sure Wildhack will find a worthy replacement for Red, who doesn't mind working with a shoestring NIL budget.

Took us 20 years to rebuild after Coach P was let go. Maybe the next BB coach can do it in half the time.

He better get the buyout in writing.

Gross pushed for the change to be made and the BOT agreed, if he's not the AD coach P is probably there another few years. Gross absolutely botched the hire and then unfortunately SU wouldn't pony up the money to bail out when it was clear it wasn't gonna work.

NIL is a bit overblown. Does SU have Kentucky or Duke or Kansas $, no they don't. That said your starting center is making nearly a million dollars, Starling is making several hundred thousand and Freeman isn't exactly playing for peanuts. The NIL war chest does need more money but were not BC level broke either.

 

[JustPherU]

The reality is that as an organization the University simply cannot fire a coach after one relatively decent year and eleven games into the second year of a contract.

It costs money. It sends a bad message to the coaching industry. It presents to the basketball world an unstable program that will not attract talent. It is just not the way to do business - no matter how emotional the fans or the members of this board may get about the situation.

Organizations that quickly fire coaches are generally not successful ones. Organizations that show patience and help the coach attract and develop talent over time are generally successful ones.

If Autry is violating rules or mistreating players or engaging in activity that might embarrass the University, then make a change.

But, if it is simply a matter of building a program, patience - rather than changing coaches after less than a year an a half - is the better way to go.

Okay, now really let me have it!

It sends a bad message to the coaching industry? What in the world does that mean?

 

[BillSU]

Jim Boeheim with the '25 roster and the 2-3 zone would be a great fit. Bring him back!

what will be the '25 roster? I'd like to see JB coach again