Development in and Around Syracuse Discussion

[FrancoPizza]

Exactly! Once you take the Mall out of the equation, there is literally no case for keeping 81 going through the heart of the City. Every business on 7th North Street can be found in almost any other neighborhood of the City.

Well to be fair that's like saying once you take the Dome out of the equation, there's literally no case for going to Marshall Street.

 

[Newhouser]

Report: Destiny USA may default on its mortgage

I'll let others who are more in-the-know comment. Might be a sign of trouble or just another tactic by Pyramid.

It's too big to fail no? The mortgage will just keep getting passed around. I think the mall is a house of cards. Same view on the Hotel Syracuse too. When the bills come due the money to pay will not be there.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Well to be fair that's like saying once you take the Dome out of the equation, there's literally no case for going to Marshall Street.

But that would be inaccurate, because you still have 15,000 students looking for places to go out to eat, shop and drink within walking distance of campus and their dorms.

 

[IthacaMatt]

It's too big to fail no? The mortgage will just keep getting passed around. I think the mall is a house of cards. Same view on the Hotel Syracuse too. When the bills come due the money to pay will not be there.

I'm worried about the Hotel Syracuse, too. I just don't see enough traffic when I drive by.

 

[Jake]

Well to be fair that's like saying once you take the Dome out of the equation, there's literally no case for going to Marshall Street.

Seriously?

You do realize that there are other employers up on the university hill other than the school right?

Upstate, Crouse and VA med center are all top 10 employers in the city.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Seriously?

You do realize that there are other employers up on the university hill other than the school right?

Upstate, Crouse and VA med center are all top 10 employers in the city.

C'mon jake you know what i meant. I don't go up to the hill unless it's for an SU game. I don't count my trips to the ER as a visit.

In other news, might as well shut the city down and pack everyone up. If destiny can't succeed on a tax-free diet and Hotel Syracuse can't succeed with all of the local pols and business leaders rallying behind it, there's not much hope for the future... outside of football season.

 

[KellySyracuse]

I think the hand ringing about the Hotel Syracuse in trouble is a bit speculative unless someone has their occupancy rate they want to post here

 

[shandeezy7]

I think the hand ringing about the Hotel Syracuse in trouble is a bit speculative unless someone has their occupancy rate they want to post here

Yeah I've heard some mixed things on Hotel Syracuse. Perhaps lower revenues/occupancy rates than projected, but I haven't heard that they are anywhere close to panic mode or in jeopardy of defaulting on a loan like Pyramid. That being said, anything that I've heard is third-hand knowledge, at best.

 

[Fly Rodder]

Yeah I've heard some mixed things on Hotel Syracuse. Perhaps lower revenues/occupancy rates than projected, but I haven't heard that they are anywhere close to panic mode or in jeopardy of defaulting on a loan like Pyramid. That being said, anything that I've heard is third-hand knowledge, at best.

Can't order hotel rooms through Amazon. Syracuse has needed more hotel rooms for a while. How much they cost is another. From what I've heard through the event planners, weddings are booked solidly at Hotel Syracuse.

ETA: Also, IIRC the entire Hotel Syracuse hasn't been renovated, there are still floors that are closed and unless there is a siginificant need, I doubt that they spend the money on them anytime soon. Unlike building a giant mall addition just as the economy was in a recession and malls in general were going the way of the dodo. The change in the tenant list at Destiny was telling as highend retail shops started there and were gradually replaced by discounters and then by services and advertising.

 

[shandeezy7]

Can't order hotel rooms through Amazon. Syracuse has needed more hotel rooms for a while. How much they cost is another. From what I've heard through the event planners, weddings are booked solidly at Hotel Syracuse.

As someone who explored having a wedding there within the past year, I could say with pretty high confidence that their wedding/event booking will be no issue at all any time soon. Booked solid and at probably the highest rates in CNY.

 

[TexanMark]

As for Hotel Syracuse...the lack of action on the structure across the street tells me all I need to know. I'd say there is an over supply of rooms in downtown right now. It doesn't mean the Hotel Syracuse is in trouble.

 

[shandeezy7]

As for Hotel Syracuse...the lack of action on the structure across the street tells me all I need to know. I'd say there is an over supply of rooms in downtown right now. It doesn't mean the Hotel Syracuse is in trouble.

It could be a sign of that or it could be a totally separate issue that has nothing to do with hotel supply in downtown Syracuse or with the well-being of Hotel Syracuse. In January, a Syracuse.com article painted it as a financing issue with Hayner-Hoyt. Not sure of the reasoning for those issues, though.

Developer: Downtown Syracuse hotel project still a go

 

[kingtidge]

Malls we're cool in the 1980's.

It's no surprise it's a dying footprint.

Congel's business model is now a distressed property business model...

Pull out and wash as much equity as you can, then flip over the table and walk away and let the mortgage holders and local community deal with the husk.

 

[bevosu]

Malls we're cool in the 1980's.

It's no surprise it's a dying footprint.

Congel's business model is now a distressed property business model...

Pull out and wash as much equity as you can, then flip over the table and walk away and let the mortgage holders and local community deal with the husk.

Pyramid Management Group , LLC

A limited liability company (LLC) is a corporate structure in the United States whereby the owners are not personally liable for the company's debts or liabilities. Limited liability companies are hybrid entities that combine the characteristics of a corporation with those of a partnership or sole proprietorship

 

[KellySyracuse]

The Brine Well Eatery opening on 4/20, specializing in garbage plates. Located on Jefferson St. between S. Salina and S. Warren

The Brine Well Eatery

 

[IthacaMatt]

Pyramid Management Group , LLC

A limited liability company (LLC) is a corporate structure in the United States whereby the owners are not personally liable for the company's debts or liabilities. Limited liability companies are hybrid entities that combine the characteristics of a corporation with those of a partnership or sole proprietorship

I used to work there. The management structure is very complex, and is different for each of their 20 or so malls. There are empty shell entities and insurance-funded entities in the background, but the money is sucked out of the malls and distributed to the members without very much recourse to creditors or litigants. The architect of all of this was a really brilliant insurance guy named George Young. Very smart man, very genial in person, unlike some of the Congel team.

 

[oldpinepoint]

Pyramid Management Group , LLC

A limited liability company (LLC) is a corporate structure in the United States whereby the owners are not personally liable for the company's debts or liabilities. Limited liability companies are hybrid entities that combine the characteristics of a corporation with those of a partnership or sole proprietorship

Good definition, however this doesn’t mean squat. It all depends if the mortgage company made the loan recourse or not. They might have wanted Bobs personal guaranty or a trust guaranty at closing. I would seriously doubt that it was given but you never know.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Good definition, however this doesn’t mean squat. It all depends if the mortgage company made the loan recourse or not. They might have wanted Bobs personal guaranty or a trust guaranty at closing. I would seriously doubt that it was given but you never know.

Bob's been out of the mall ownership for several years. It's his son now who is the principal.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Bob's been out of the mall ownership for several years. It's his son now who is the principal.

Heard some rumors that Bob has dementia.

Crazy thing about the whole destiny saga - all the handwringing that they didn't deliver on phases 2 and 3. It would take them 500 years to pay off the mortgage if they built anything more than what they currently have.

 

[oldpinepoint]

Bob's been out of the mall ownership for several years. It's his son now who is the principal.

Figured at much.

 

[Cusefan0307]

C'mon jake you know what i meant. I don't go up to the hill unless it's for an SU game. I don't count my trips to the ER as a visit.

In other news, might as well shut the city down and pack everyone up. If destiny can't succeed on a tax-free diet and Hotel Syracuse can't succeed with all of the local pols and business leaders rallying behind it, there's not much hope for the future... outside of football season.

Just because Destiny isn’t doing well doesn’t mean other businesses aren’t. Malls are dying everywhere. Not sure why this is a surprise to you.

 

[FrancoPizza]

Just because Destiny isn’t doing well doesn’t mean other businesses aren’t. Malls are dying everywhere. Not sure why this is a surprise to you.

Where did I say I was surprised?

What I don't understand is why they don't lower the rents there since so many spaces still sit empty. Low rent > no rent.

 

[IthacaMatt]

Where did I say I was surprised?

What I don't understand is why they don't lower the rents there since so many spaces still sit empty. Low rent > no rent.

"Why are they so stubborn?"
"We're not stubborn!"

 

[Orijinal]

Where did I say I was surprised?

What I don't understand is why they don't lower the rents there since so many spaces still sit empty. Low rent > no rent.

The rent's too high!

 

[shandeezy7]

Syracuse "Spark" art space closing its doors, looking for a new home

Headed toward the bulldozer in favor of another over-sized student housing project, OttoMets?